Why do you need to count strides?

[{140846}]

Hi, could someone explain to me why you need to count + adjust strides in showjumping? People have told me before that its so you can adjust and decide whether you need to collect and get more in or push and get less, but i still don't understand WHY you need to do this? someone please explain ahaha. Thanks

 

[SEL]

Here's the completely non professional, haven't jumped properly for years answer

Its basically to make sure you leave the jumps up by getting to them on the best stride possible for the horse to make the height / width of the fence. You'll often see people really sit a horse back and collect for an upright, but push on into a longer stride for a spread - watch the water jump for instance and they will often gallop to it. They don't need height for that jump, but they need a really long stride length.

Sometimes distances aren't straightforward - on purpose - so you need to decide whether you are going to go for 3 short strides or 2 long ones (for instance)

Horses have different stride lengths. I rode a jumping pony when I was a teen who had the stride length of a horse, but I also did quite a bit of jumping on a very short striding horse where life was a lot easier if I planned putting extra strides in rather than leaving it to him.

**someone who knows what they are talking about will be along shortly**

 

[Mule]

I'm also not a show jumper but my understanding is that most horses can sort things out for themselves until the courses start becoming more difficult. My experience is in eventing, where both the xc and sj are free flowing so counting strides below international levels isn't necessary. Picking for a stride and risking losing impulsion can be disastrous on xc.

Pure sj courses are much more technical and tighter so afaik that's where you need the accuracy of influencing strides.

 

[exracehorse]

I was watching a professional give a talk at a clinic. He said he never counts strides. And you let the jump approach you.

 

[little_critter]

I was watching a professional give a talk at a clinic. He said he never counts strides. And you let the jump approach you.

Just as well, I can't see a stride for toffee!
I'll be (trying to keep the rhythm) "Monday, Tuesday, Wed..Oh s**t sorry Neddy"

 

[greenbean10]

To make sure you get to the best place in front of the fence to jump from - to give your horse the best chance of clearing it and, if they're bigger, to make sure you get over it safely! You would do this by counting and adjusting.

For example if you are jumping into a related distance and it's meant to ride 6 strides, but either your horse jumped in awkwardly or doesn't have a good enough canter, you might find the distance too long. Doing nothing could mean that you'll meet the next fence on 6 and a half strides which would be uncomfortable for both you and the horse. Then the horse needs to decide whether to go for a long one (e.g take off half a stride further away than he should) or chip in. Both can be quite unpleasant! So as a rider you'll need to adjust the canter - either ride forward and get 6 strides, or sit up and hold to add an extra one for 7. Doing either of these should mean that you meet the fence in the right place (or as close to the right place as you can).

Hope that makes sense.

 

[maya2008]

When I was having SJ lessons and riding schoolmasters, the lady who taught me never said to count the strides. I think we teach kids that so they know when to lean forward! She focused on a bouncy, balanced canter and used to shout ‘keep the canter, let the horse worry about the jump!’ She got me jumping 1m30 spreads on a schoolmaster, and taking my own over 1m20. After a jump, leg on, rebalance horse, keep the canter. And I am an absolute wimp jumping who cannot see a stride for toffee (legitimate visual issues there - my binocular vision is crap!). All about the canter, it was. And it worked! Never had a pole down, or a refusal using that method.

 

[oldie48]

Counting strides is only useful if you are able to lengthen and shorten the canter stride without destroying the quality of it. I guess most pros do it instinctively but they are also looking at where they can take out a stride if they are against the clock and to ensure they meet the next fence well. IME Eventers do count the strides at technical fences so they can pick a route through that is easiest for their horse. I should think it's essential if you are jumping big tracks but much less so if popping round anything up to a metre.

 

[Hollychops]

I was taught to quietly sing the teddy bears picnic when cantering, but that bears no relation to your question.

My non professional understanding is so that you can adjust to meet the fence in a place to jump it cleanly and it all depends on the length of your horses stride. But hey, i never measured her stride, just went for the teddy bears approach (but then i never jumped above 90cm unless it was a xc fence)!

 

[greenbean10]

When I was having SJ lessons and riding schoolmasters, the lady who taught me never said to count the strides. I think we teach kids that so they know when to lean forward! She focused on a bouncy, balanced canter and used to shout ‘keep the canter, let the horse worry about the jump!’ She got me jumping 1m30 spreads on a schoolmaster, and taking my own over 1m20. After a jump, leg on, rebalance horse, keep the canter. And I am an absolute wimp jumping who cannot see a stride for toffee (legitimate visual issues there - my binocular vision is crap!). All about the canter, it was. And it worked! Never had a pole down, or a refusal using that method.

This makes me feel so much better as I'm jumping up to 1.10 in the ring and have a meltdown if I have a bad day for seeing strides!

 

[Sasana Skye]

I was watching a professional give a talk at a clinic. He said he never counts strides. And you let the jump approach you.

Pretty sure Lucinda Green follows this philosophy - to ride by feel but I know that WFP wholeheartedly disagrees (because I heard him say it in a clinic, not because I know him personally!).

I think it's horses for courses I'm more of a Lucinda type I tend to have a rough idea in my head of how many strides are between a fence but at the level I compete (100/110) and because I'm not entirely organised I don't find it THAT important and I just ride what's infront of me at that time. Definitely a 'less is more' type person me.

XC i just hold on and half halt and hope for the best and let the horse sort herself out. If you watch horses free jumping in racing or team chasing after they've booted their rider off, free jumping in the arena or even jumping out of the field at home, they very, very rarely get it wrong.

 

[ihatework]

The fewer strides there are between fences, the less room for error there is.

So if you are just jumping single fences on long sweeping lines then it’s all about rhythm and quality of canter.

As you get into related distances then it’s very useful to be able to walk the distance correctly. When you can do that, from your training at home, you will know if the particular horse you are riding will find it long - short - just right or you might need to find another stride.

To showjump successfully you need to have a super canter but also an adjustable canter, and you need to be able to do that by understanding the question the course designer has built.

The higher up the levels you go, the more important it becomes.

 

[Annagain]

Just as well, I can't see a stride for toffee!
I'll be (trying to keep the rhythm) "Monday, Tuesday, Wed..Oh s**t sorry Neddy"

Haha, can spot a Sophie pupil a mile off from the days of the week!

OP - A good exercise to help with strides is to set two uprights (they don't need to be big) up five standard strides apart. Ride through them aiming to get the five strides at first and then, when you've got that comfortably, alter the length of stride so you can get 4 or 6 in. You should be able to assess whether lengthening and going for 4 or shortening and going for 6 would be best for your horse, some work better off a longer stride as they run out of impulsion on a shorter one but some prefer a shorter, bouncier stride and flatten too much if they lengthen. We had a competition in a riding club lesson once to see who could get the most strides into the 5 stride distance without breaking to trot and without knocking a fence down. My 17hh TB x Welsh x Shire who wears 7' rugs (so a very big boy!) and I won with 8, beating a 14.2hh pony amongst others! It helps that he's quite lazy but finds jumping easy so is happy to toddle very slowly to a fence and just pop it! No prize though.

 

[SEL]

I was watching a professional give a talk at a clinic. He said he never counts strides. And you let the jump approach you.

A showjumping professional? The ones I used to know were very good at working out how many strides there were, they could take out etc. I had a jumping lesson last year where the instructor was adamant that I leave it to the horse - which meant we went into a grid like a flippin freight train. It all improved when I decided what stride we were going to hit jump 1 on, but that's my preference I guess.

The main reason I don't jump any more is 2 rather impressive horse & rider falls when the horse decided to take a different stride to what we should have been taking. Lost my nerve and that doesn't help the horse. Plus both my current horses only have 3 legs.

 

[Trinket12]

What does 'chip in' mean?

 

[greenbean10]

What does 'chip in' mean?

I'd describe it as taking a teeny tiny canter stride to get a bit closer to the fence. It doesn't sound too bad but it can be unseating for the rider especially if you're new to jumping as it totally disrupts the rhythm and gives an awkward stop/start feeling.

 

[Trinket12]

Thanks @greenbean10 my coach said this to me the other day and I had no idea what she meant!

 

[greenbean10]

Thanks @greenbean10 my coach said this to me the other day and I had no idea what she meant!

You're welcome!

 

[MissTyc]

I have one horse who does it for me. I back himself and no one else has ever ridden him, but he's always adjusted himself to arrive perfectly at any fence. So when I backed my homebread mare, I was very confused to find she needed some help in this area ...

 

[SEL]

I do wonder whether the pros who are doing it 'by feel' are those that are so talented that actually they are subconsciously counting strides. Or maybe not counting so much as instinctively knowing they are going to have to shortern to fence X but fence Y can take a long one.

Then there are the rest of us.....

 

[milliepops]

I do wonder whether the pros who are doing it 'by feel' are those that are so talented that actually they are subconsciously counting strides. Or maybe not counting so much as instinctively knowing they are going to have to shortern to fence X but fence Y can take a long one.

Then there are the rest of us.....

I think this is probably the case, and then less experienced people are told not to get hung up on seeing a stride/counting strides in training because it depends on other things being in place as discussed above already (adjustable canter etc) and there are higher priorities for less established combinations.

 

[greenbean10]

I do wonder whether the pros who are doing it 'by feel' are those that are so talented that actually they are subconsciously counting strides. Or maybe not counting so much as instinctively knowing they are going to have to shortern to fence X but fence Y can take a long one.

Then there are the rest of us.....

Agree I definitely wouldn't want to come face to face with a square 1.10+ oxer with no idea of the stride. I've seen some seriously nasty accidents from people missing completely at big fences. I just try to remember that if I see a stride, ride for it and use my leg. If I don't see a stride, still leg!

 

[Littlebear]

When I used to sj to a decent level the courses become more technical ie often there will be a combination with a large spread and then an upright of planks to follow and so you land and need often need to choose whether you carry on in the same rhythm and risk taking the top down or shorten up and have more room for take off either way you would need to know what your horse can do comfortably to help put them in the right place.
If you watch any top levels you will see all riders strategically taking out strides for jump offs and lengthen for say a water jump and having to shorten them again for an upright.
At lower levels they are generally designed to be able to ride in a nice rhythm without worrying too much x

 

[Ambers Echo]

This came up at the Tik Maynard clinic. He said that whether you need to count strides in order to place a horse depends on how good the horses line, speed rhythm and balance is. If those are good then you can leave the horse to find the stride. But it they are not great -eg a young, green horse - then you need to compensate for that by placing the horse. So if you are very good at finding a stride then you can get away with jumping a less experienced horse who is not particularly well balanced or rhythmic. Eg pro riders on young horse classes will probably be placing those horses. Other riders on more experienced horses will focus more on the quality of the canter. But counting strides is a bit different to adjustability. You need an adjustible canter either way as you ride different styles of jump differently,

 

[maya2008]

This came up at the Tik Maynard clinic. He said that whether you need to count strides in order to place a horse depends on how good the horses line, speed rhythm and balance is. If those are good then you can leave the horse to find the stride. But it they are not great -eg a young, green horse - then you need to compensate for that by placing the horse. So if you are very good at finding a stride then you can get away with jumping a less experienced horse who is not particularly well balanced or rhythmic. Eg pro riders on young horse classes will probably be placing those horses. Other riders on more experienced horses will focus more on the quality of the canter. But counting strides is a bit different to adjustability. You need an adjustible canter either way as you ride different styles of jump differently,

Makes sense to me - my SJ mare is stupidly talented (not that she'll ever realise that talent with me!) and can (and will) take herself over HUGE jumps without a pilot, flying effortlessly through the air as if it is the easiest thing in the world. All I ever need to do on her, is keep the canter. She does the rest, and in fact if you so much as TRY to place her to a fence, she kicks it down in disgust. My old TB mare did need telling when to take off (or she wouldn't!) but we just kept a short, bouncy canter so she was less likely to come in wrong.

 

[be positive]

The key is to really work on the canter so the 'wrong' stride is never too far away from the correct one, I do not encourage riders to place a horse or interfere too much because unless they are good enough to adjust early enough most end up killing the canter and get the horse into a worse place with less power to get out of trouble than leaving them alone would have done.
In related distances and combinations they can develop a feel for needing to push or wait for another stride over time and this will transfer to single fences as they become more established.

I have just given a lesson doing exactly this, the horse tends to shorten and pop, the rider if allowed will wait and wait so the horse gets in deeper and deeper with not enough power to get through a double without an extra stride risking not getting out over an oxer, we finished going through a 2 stride double on two level strides and a single fence off a really good stride with the horse looking far more comfortable and confident than she used to.

 

[Ambers Echo]

I do not encourage riders to place a horse or interfere too much because unless they are good enough to adjust early enough most end up killing the canter and get the horse into a worse place with less power to get out of trouble than leaving them alone would have done.

I was taught this too - I was told that if I do see that I am coming in on a dodgy stride it is better to push forward onto a better one that to hang back for one. A mistake I constantly make with Amber is holding her for an extra stride so forcing her to chip in and killing the canter when she is much much better when I ride on.

 

[milliepops]

I naturally see long strides when SJing so the hardest thing I ever learnt was how to ride forward to a deeper spot. Letting the horse go off a long one is other side of the coin to holding for a stride, but has a similar effect on the canter

 

[EventingMum]

It very much depends on the horse and rider. If you have a good quality 12' canter you technically should only ever be half a stride off the perfect take off spot (assuming you are not jumping tiny fences) and a lot off horses will naturally adjust their stride to compensate.

The problem arises when the rider fiddles on the approach hoping to find a stride and doesn't as this stops the canter being regular and makes it hard for either horse or rider to judge the correct take off spot. A regular, even canter will make it much easier to judge a distance and in turn decide if an adjustment is required. The better your judgement is the further away you can make any adjustment and then leave the horse to do his job ie clear the fence!

Most people have to develop an eye to judge correctly although a lucky few do it naturally. As said, having a feel for the correct canter is key and working over poles on set distances is a good way to help. Then making slight adjustments to the stride length over poles is next before introducing jumps. This way, when walking a combination or related distance you will know if it is set on a distance that you may have to adjust your horse's canter for. Obviously if the first element is not jumped correctly you may have to make a split second decision to lengthen or shorten the stride as you land.

Sorry for a long waffle, there's so much more to this including taking into consideration the style of fence, terrain, straight or bending lines etc but the foundation for it all is a good baseline canter.

 

[criso]

But it they are not great -eg a young, green horse - then you need to compensate for that by placing the horse. So if you are very good at finding a stride then you can get away with jumping a less experienced horse who is not particularly well balanced or rhythmic. Eg pro riders on young horse classes will probably be placing those horses.,

Up to a point but the other side to this told to me by another eventer is that is if you place a young horse too much they never learn to think for themselves and sort themselves out and cross country you need a horse be able to do this. I suppose it's a case of letting them learn at home but helping when it comes to a competition.

I've had to learn not to do this as while not being that good, I have always had an eye for a stride and can come round a corner and see whether I am going to end up in the right place or not. Doesn't mean I do anything useful with this information I've had to learn to shorten without fiddling and losing energy and lengthen without getting flat. Plus with an ex racer, getting him in deeper was what he needed to learn for his technique.

Even at unaffiliated, knowing strides really helps as you get some quite creative striding in combinations.