Why does everyone seem to have a flash bridle?

TYSSANDI said:
Suppose only the against are posting but I love them and have about 5 and just bought a new one

I personally loath the Grackle
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Why? 'Because I do' is no reason to strap a horse's mouth shut or hate a grackle.

Do you just do it because you like the look, or does it serve a purpose?. And if so, why not a grackle?
 
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There are loads of bridles with no flash. Yes, I also see rows and rows of flash bridles but there's always a good selection in the stores near me and lots online.

Maybe a flash has a place - the thing is, I think people are not being taught how a plain snaffle works. From what I have seen with my own eyes, they pull back hard, saw at the mouth, hands low and elbows straight. At this angle, of course the joint is going to be poking a hole in the horse's palate. Of course it will open its mouth - you would if there was something poking your palate. So therefore, the flash is needed so bad hands can jab away without the horse being able to do anything about it. Incredibly clever.

Now, if people were taught how a snaffle is actually supposed to work, a flash wouldn't be needed. This bit needs to be used on the corners of the mouth only - to get bend, you raise the hand, not pull back. It's very very simple, but seems that there are no teachers.

I used a flash many years ago, because no-one told me about the above. I hated the flash, so switched to a pelham. This worked for a while but not good for competition. I'm lucky I found someone who could teach me how to "use" a snaffle properly.
 
ycbm said:
Why? 'Because I do' is no reason to strap a horse's mouth shut or hate a grackle.

Do you just do it because you like the look, or does it serve a purpose?. And if so, why not a grackle?
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* Because I do* is every reason to use them as

1. I do not have to justify why or explain
2. I know the reason why my horse wears one and needs it

My horse my choice my reasoning.

I know this forum too well and I am not going to divulge any more detail.


Many nosebands are designed to keep the mouth closed including drop nosebands. Unless you are totally naive and use it for the wrong reason, I see more incidents with people using the wrong bits or bits being in the wrong hands doing far more damage to a horse than a flash noseband.


Maybe there are so many flash bridles is because they are popular bridle to purchase, I mean they would hardly put so many flash-bridles on sale if they don't sell now would they!!!!!
 
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TYSSANDI said:
* Because I do* is every reason to use them as

1. I do not have to justify why or explain
2. I know the reason why my horse wears one and needs it

My horse my choice my reasoning.

I know this forum too well and I am not going to divulge any more detail.


Many nosebands are designed to keep the mouth closed including drop nosebands. Unless you are totally naive and use it for the wrong reason, I see more incidents with people using the wrong bits or bits being in the wrong hands doing far more damage to a horse than a flash noseband.


Maybe there are so many flash bridles is because they are popular bridle to purchase, I mean they would hardly put so many flash-bridles on sale if they don't sell now would they!!!!!
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You're very defensive for someone who's trying to convey how happy they are with a choice they've made.
 
tallyho! said:
There are loads of bridles with no flash. Yes, I also see rows and rows of flash bridles but there's always a good selection in the stores near me and lots online.

Maybe a flash has a place - the thing is, I think people are not being taught how a plain snaffle works. From what I have seen with my own eyes, they pull back hard, saw at the mouth, hands low and elbows straight. At this angle, of course the joint is going to be poking a hole in the horse's palate. Of course it will open its mouth - you would if there was something poking your palate. So therefore, the flash is needed so bad hands can jab away without the horse being able to do anything about it. Incredibly clever.

Now, if people were taught how a snaffle is actually supposed to work, a flash wouldn't be needed. This bit needs to be used on the corners of the mouth only - to get bend, you raise the hand, not pull back. It's very very simple, but seems that there are no teachers.

I used a flash many years ago, because no-one told me about the above. I hated the flash, so switched to a pelham. This worked for a while but not good for competition. I'm lucky I found someone who could teach me how to "use" a snaffle properly.
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Exactly this! I have a very quiet horse for sale who is ridden in a simple loose ring snaffle and a plain cavesson. Someone came to see her and the lady was sawing on the reins to try to get her to "work in an outline" so my horse went around in a hollow outline and no rhythm. The rider asked me if I tried her in a flash noseband to help her accept the bit more to which I replied " She doesn't need one. If she's ridden forward from the leg into a still, consistent light contact she'll work in an outline very easily". The rider thought this was how she was riding and had no idea how much her hands were moving!
 
SpringArising said:
You're very defensive for someone who's trying to convey how happy they are with a choice they've made.
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No not really, just I do not feel I have to e explain why I use something on my horse. Since this is a forum and I have know how these threads can turn round. You see Op ask the question and I said because I do and that is because i do not choose to explain why I do, that should have been the end of it but to keep asking after I said I do not want to explain why. Now if someone was generally interested to see if it would help their horse that is different but judging on the comments here, there would be more comments like

you should do this
or do that or
try this etc.


I am not in the market for a new noseband as I am happy with the one I have and so is my horse and so is my trainer and that is all that matters to me. :)
 
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tallyho! said:
There are loads of bridles with no flash. Yes, I also see rows and rows of flash bridles but there's always a good selection in the stores near me and lots online.

Maybe a flash has a place - the thing is, I think people are not being taught how a plain snaffle works. From what I have seen with my own eyes, they pull back hard, saw at the mouth, hands low and elbows straight. At this angle, of course the joint is going to be poking a hole in the horse's palate. Of course it will open its mouth - you would if there was something poking your palate. So therefore, the flash is needed so bad hands can jab away without the horse being able to do anything about it. Incredibly clever.

Now, if people were taught how a snaffle is actually supposed to work, a flash wouldn't be needed. This bit needs to be used on the corners of the mouth only - to get bend, you raise the hand, not pull back. It's very very simple, but seems that there are no teachers.

I used a flash many years ago, because no-one told me about the above. I hated the flash, so switched to a pelham. This worked for a while but not good for competition. I'm lucky I found someone who could teach me how to "use" a snaffle properly.
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This is me too, when I improved my understanding and mechanical ability (as in how the mechanics work, not that i ride mechanically) I have found I do not want to use one now. If the horse opens his mouth than I know I am making a hash of it, and I will re-think.

Having said that, if I had a new horse that found it to be of benefit then I would consider using one again, but only after I had tried training, made sure I was being clear etc, and even then it would just be to stabilise the bit rather than pin the mouth shut.
 
I have not found it hard to find a bridle without a flash for one of mine. It can be harder to find one without a crank and I do dislike those. I usually buy hunter bridles for him with the plain flat cavesson noseband as it suits his face. The other one I quite like a flash. She will go happily in a cavesson but when she has her moments will throw up her head and at times cross her jaw too. A martingale and a flash noseband means I keep much better control during her moments. I fasten it loose she can still just about eat hay whilst wearing the flash. The martingale is fairly tight because I see no point in having it so loose the horse can raise her head affecting the contact. I like it so she cannot raise her head beyond the normal position unless she pulls the reins out of my hands. The martingale and flash means I can send her forward into a steady light contact without her constantly waving her head around looking for things to spook at. I am equally happy with a grackle or a drop but the flash has the versatility of being able to be used as a cavesson if necessary and I like how a flash can be found to suit every face like a cavesson can but not all faces suit a drop or a grackle aesthetically. The versatility is I think why so many bridles are sold with a flash.
 
TYSSANDI said:
* Because I do* is every reason to use them as

1. I do not have to justify why or explain
2. I know the reason why my horse wears one and needs it

My horse my choice my reasoning.

I know this forum too well and I am not going to divulge any more detail.
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So why did you bother posting?
 
I have one BUT I will only use it when jumping as my mare gets very strong and excitable jumping. For hacking and normal schooling I take the flash strap off. I certainly don't crank it so tight its digging into my mare's skin.
As with any equipment its only as harsh as the hands that are using it.
 
I think they're not such a part of the basic bridle you buy that people don't seem to question or even think that a bridle might come without one. I think they have their place, but there are plenty of horses who just don't need them.

Mine hates the flash, it affects his breathing, but goes beautifully in a grackle if I need a bit more control. He also hates most 'strong' bits so is ridden in a Myler snaffle with either a loose flat cavesson, or a loose grackle if we're doing fast work/jumping as he can get strong. So many people think I'm crazy changing nosebands, as they seem to think the cavesson and flash are the only options and if your horse is strong it can only be the bit that's wrong.

I think it's ignorance, and from a dealer's point of view a really tight flash will help mask problems they don't have the time/money/expertise to work through.
 
Cortez said:
It is the fashion of the age, especially for dressage; 25-30 years ago it was the drop noseband. Much like running martingales over here (Ireland), flash nosebands are just automatically put on as standard without much knowledge of what they're actually supposed to be doing. They have their uses, I suppose, but most horses don't need them and those that do should be properly trained or otherwise helped to overcome what is causing the discomfort in their mouths, but since this is usually the rider there doesn't seem to be much hope of this happening.......
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This.
When I trained 28 years ago like you say, it was dropped nosebands that were the in thing which we were taught to make as well as running martingles. Then in the 90's the dropped nosebands seem to disappear. Flashes were around when I trained but usually as an add on after thought to the bridles we were making. I always recommend that you can get one finger (man's finger) under any noseband that acts to close the mouth and that includes under the flash lower strap.
It's sad to see so many with nosebands so tight it almost cuts off the blood supply, I don't like flash or crank nosebands for this reason and even more I don't like comfort headpieces as I think they are a bad design.
Sadly we have come so far away from the tradtional saddlery of my era and in to the cheap massed (often incorrectly made) produced saddlery by manufacturers with machines rather than traditional craftsmen/women who have the necessary skills to make things properly that we are going to see more and more horses with saddlery related problems.
Just look at the amount of "remedial" pads for saddles and other bridle related ideas there are now to sort things out
As with all saddlery or lorinery related problems some people need to try fixing the cause rather than the symptoms with gadgets.


Oz
 
Paint Me Proud said:
I know but I shouldnt need to go to extra effort just to have a nice simple cavesson to use on my horse.
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Wholeheartedly agree. You go out spend your hard earned spondoolies on a lovely new bridle only to chop bits off . It's not right. I've looked for ages for a nice bridle with no flash , and not too wide ( hunter style) , can I find one , can I buggery. So still using the ole girls one that's about 15years old.

Mine are ridden without flash, apart from the jumper. He has one when he's competing , otherwise he crosses his jaw as he believes he knows the course. He'd much prefer to jump them in his own order.
 
ycbm said:
So why did you bother posting?
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Why did you bother replying???

It is call freedom of speech

Because Op asked a question, as to why everyone seems to have a flash noseband, no one actually responded who does use them and buy them, maybe because they know this is what happens.

Most likely the reason why so many flash bridles are sold should be asked to the individual tack shop or manufacturer or do a survey and ask people to say why. Hazzard a guess the reason why so many are on sale is maybe:

1. They are cheaper
2. Popular and they need to keep up with demand.
3. Exactly what the rider or horse needs to control,school etc the individuals circumstances or horse in the activity they are doing.

This is certainly the the case in a recent purchased bridle with flash and chosen flash was £ 10 cheaper than a cavason noseband exactly the same bridle but when option on cavason nose band on choice the total increased by £ 10.
 
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TYSSANDI said:
Why did you bother replying???

It is call freedom of speech

Because Op asked a question, as to why everyone seems to have a flash noseband, no one actually responded who does use them and buy them, maybe because they know this is what happens.

Most likely the reason why so many flash bridles are sold should be asked to the individual tack shop or manufacturer or do a survey and ask people to say why. Hazzard a guess the reason why so many are on sale is maybe:

they are cheaper
or popular and they need to keep up with demand.


This is certainly the the case in a recent purchased bridle with flash and chosen flash was £ 10 cheaper than a cavason noseband exactly the same bridle but when option on cavason nose band on choice the total increase by £ 10.
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The last sentence explains why they are commonly seen, they are cheaper so rather than spend more to buy what they want they buy something they don't need to save some cash, we have probably all done it but it does not prove they are more popular just cheaper and more available.

I tried to buy a new bridle a couple of years ago, it had to be brown, plain cavesson noseband or adjustable drop with a comfort headpiece, it proved almost impossible to source online, I ended up buying Micklem from my local tack shop.
 
I generally find that there are far more flash bridles for sale than without. I don't mind having the strap thingy, it means you have some choice. I prefer not to use the strap but occasionally I do. My trainer has suggested I use it at the moment as he was crossing his jaw and she didn't want him to learn that as a habit. TBH I'd prefer to work him through it wouthout one as I think he's telling me there is something not quite right that I need to work on. I do feel it tends to cover up a training issue which can be unhelpful.
 
Why did you bother replying???

It is call freedom of speech
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Because I'm intrigued that anyone would use their time and effort making a post to say that they aren't going to comment on what the OP was asking for comments on, and then compound it by explaining that they aren't going to comment because they don't like the way the forum answers.

I just thought it would have been a lot more simple for you not to open the thread in the first place :D
 
TYSSANDI said:
Many nosebands are designed to keep the mouth closed including drop nosebands.
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No sorry, they are designed to prevent the horse from opening it's mouth beyond the point where the rider can control it. They should never be used to "keep the mouth closed" although that is often what people do, including some very well know event riders whose horses' faces literally bulge out either side of the noseband.

But ime if a horse is comfortable with whatever bit you use, it is less likely to want to open it's mouth. Some will learn to open their mouths to evade the rider's control, yes, and in these instances a flash or drop can be useful, and I do use them when I need to, but in an ideal world I'd rather not.
 
Used to ride my boy in a flash, however I changed a few years ago to a Mexican grackle and honestly I think he prefers the grackle.

I was always taught to only use something if you need it, and that different horses will go better with different tack and it's not as simple as one size fits all. B can be strong and he knows he is strong, and he also seemed to get a very itchy/sweaty face and where the cavesson part of the noseband sat would always try and itch/scratch himself once he started to sweat. In a grackle, he doesn't seem to itch as much so I do believe it is more comfortable for him in that respect. I also find he is much more relaxed in the grackle, but I don't know if that's because he finds it more comfortable or not.

With B, he is in a loose ring brass snaffle with a lozenge. He seems to really like this bit, and it's a soft bit. He can school in a cavesson and he can do dressage in a cavesson, but when it's something exciting like jumping or fast work he gets too keen and will just go for it. As nice as it is that he's enthusiastic, it isn't always 'safe' and under control. This set up works for him, but it might not for another horse and when/if I ever get another horse, I'll work with them to see what they are most comfortable in rather than just using tack that's in fashion (or out of fashion, for whatever reason)

I think it comes down to supply and demand. If more people are buying bridles with flashes, then they'll be in stock more. I actually think I've seen more horses in grackles, rather than in flashes. I know when B was kept at the RS, about 5 horses had a flash, and they were the more 'difficult' RS horses, and B was the only one with a grackle. Maybe it's because I now see a much wider range of horses, but grackles do seem to be becoming as much of a trend as flashes are.
 
I use one on mine.

He's in a French link hanging cheek with a flash.

He's ridden perhaps 2-3 times a week. Normally hacked twice and schooled once.

For the vast majority of the time he is easy and willing. The flash is not done up particularly tight. There are occasions however where he will throw his toys out of the pram and decides he doesn't want to play ball anymore. This could be that he can't be bothered to go hacking today so will open his mouth and try and take himself home, it can be that he's bored of schooling and wants to just open his mouth and use his strength against me to take me back to the gate or it could be that he sees something out hacking an uses it as an excuse to try and bog off.

We rarely have an argument however when we do it's nice to have the flash in place to help me regain control.

I honestly do not believe that any amount of schooling would stop his occasional tantrums. Nor do I believe that wearing a flash 2-3 hours a week will do him any harm.
 
Peter7917 said:
I use one on mine.

He's in a French link hanging cheek with a flash.

He's ridden perhaps 2-3 times a week. Normally hacked twice and schooled once.

For the vast majority of the time he is easy and willing. The flash is not done up particularly tight. There are occasions however where he will throw his toys out of the pram and decides he doesn't want to play ball anymore. This could be that he can't be bothered to go hacking today so will open his mouth and try and take himself home, it can be that he's bored of schooling and wants to just open his mouth and use his strength against me to take me back to the gate or it could be that he sees something out hacking an uses it as an excuse to try and bog off.

We rarely have an argument however when we do it's nice to have the flash in place to help me regain control.

I honestly do not believe that any amount of schooling would stop his occasional tantrums. Nor do I believe that wearing a flash 2-3 hours a week will do him any harm.
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This is similar to us. I don't tend to use one on the flat in the school but he goes markedly better in one. He wears one for jumping as he's learning not to rush, it will come off eventually.

It's not done up at all tight, he can still munch hay with it on. I would take him to all competitions with it on in case of an argument, we rarely have one but I like the security in unfamiliar surroundings.
 
Personally I would class a simple snaffle and a cavasson as the ideal (cavesson for aesthetic reasons only) anything extra would be a temporary training aid, but unfortunately they can be used for the wrong reasons. For example my old girl appeared to be a stubborn, very opinionated draft horse who would use her strength against me, as in if we were down the scary end of the school she would open her mouth, raise her head and sod off. And upon leaving the yard she would stand on her back legs and do a 180 to head back. The issue was really my low confidence, once I realised this and worked to improve it I was able to ensure I was there to reassure her and she was a completely different horse. I gradually removed the flash, running martingale and stronger bit and we schooled in the most vile weather and were fine and we hacked out every weekend no issue. So though yes I do think additional tack does have its place sometimes, some horses even seem to prefer it, but ideally it should be used as a short term solution to over coming a long term issue
 
i will join in and say i am using one at the moment...shock horror!!!!!!! i have a new loan horse who has been ridden in a vulcanite pelham for years and i have changed her to a vulcanite snaffle so its not too much of a change and have put the strap on loosely as a temporary measure to help if she gets too strong . once i am confident she is not going to be uncontrollable i will just ride in a cavesson. all tack can be abused and many people have cavessons done up too tight without the flash attachment. i used to use a flash on my old horse in the summer to hold the nose net in place but again the strap was done up loosely......as long as these nosebands are fitted correctly i dont see a problem with them...
 
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