Why the hell do people breed foals from sub standard mares?

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stargate

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I work at a leading welfare organisation and im fed up with hearing from people who have bred from their mare (just for the sake of it) and now cant keep the foal. This seems common place with this new breed of so called horsey people who actually dont have a clue about horses and in all honesty shouldnt actually have them.

It seems common place now that any idiot on a whim goes out and buys a horse, cant ride it for whatever reason, usually because they havent got a clue, and then breed from it, irrespective of temperment or conformational defects.

Ive had enough of the ignorance and selfishness of these people who believe a horse is a status symbol.

I dont care if this winds anyone up as something has to be done, any ideas?
 
For the same reason there are thousands of dogs being bred while others are dying everyday in the pounds. GREED.
 
Not sure what the solution is, but I know where you're coming from. When my (already quirky, spooky and not particularly talented) mare was diagnosed with bone spavin, the stock answer I got from a lot of people was 'oh well, why don't you turn her away and breed from her?'
Um, let's think - because I don't particularly want to bring another quirky, spooky, not particularly talented and potentially genetically defective horse into the world thanks.
 
I agree! I suppose we need some sort of breeding license... Mares must be graded before breeding or something, though this would be difficult, as top competition mares, although good horses, are often a completely different stamp to what is needed for a RC type horse... Which is in fact more in demand!
 
I agree with you here but TBH I think its a problem across the board not just with those without a clue breeding from a mare they can say no longer be riden. I think generally in breeding and lookin for a horse to buy ect far too much emphasis is put on the stallion of a horse forgetting that the mare plays a part too. In many ways my horses dam was far better bred and has a better compitition record than her stallion, but together bred a very talented horse.
 
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jsr said:
For the same reason there are thousands of dogs being bred while others are dying everyday in the pounds. GREED.
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Not quite the same. The worth of a low end colt is in most cases less than what he costs to passport and chip.....thats before you think about gelding him.
Most cases its ignorance, and in a few cases, stupidity, and in the worst possible case, the owner just doesnt care.
 
I wish they'd stop breeding TB's for racing far too many end up being sold to novices to re-train them and have not got a clue. Not that many make it so they should be limited to about a fifth of what they breed and even less if the problem persists. :rolleyes:
 
flowerlady said:
I wish they'd stop breeding TB's for racing far too many end up being sold to novices to re-train them and have not got a clue. Not that many make it so they should be limited to about a fifth of what they breed and even less if the problem persists. :rolleyes:
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Agreed. It is heartbreaking when you think of the waste of so many of these horses.
 
I have a mare with a hereditary problem. Due to that hereditary problem causing the mare pain I can no longer ride her. I don't want to put her to sleep, so I think I might breed from her. I won't consider the fact that her offspring may too carry the same hereditary defect, may too end up in pain etc. etc......

(PS: "I" is NOT me. Please replace "I" where appropriate with "numbskull" and amend grammar accordingly).
 
i want to breed from my unknown mare eventually - to keep the foal... however, i will only breed to a decent stallion (like sir donnerhall lines) as dressage is what i want to do with her and want a foal for me....

however - i coudl be seen as 'wrong' but as long as shes happy and healthy and has no genetic conditions (and i have vets approval) then i will go ahead and breed.

even if the foal is a throwback - i still wont sell - same as if its was worth a lot of money - i sill wouldnt sell... :)

just a POV from a potential private breeders...
 
flowerlady said:
I wish they'd stop breeding TB's for racing far too many end up being sold to novices to re-train them and have not got a clue. Not that many make it so they should be limited to about a fifth of what they breed and even less if the problem persists. :rolleyes:
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I'm a novice and I'm retraining mine. With an awful lot of outside help thanks very much but I do very much agree with the overbreeding of horses... it's just gone over the top totally...
 
I noticed this recently, several people have asked me if I'd breed from my mare when I can't ride her.................... and I just think, what! have you not SEEN her?!?!?!?
 
I bought my mare in September 09 and on vetting found out that she was in foal. I went ahead with the purchase because I really like her but swore to myself then that a foal was certainly not on my agenda and would sell it asap.

Story was that her breeder had sold her to this guy who had a very nice stallion who wanted her as a brood mare. She was, however, scanned not in foal by his vet so he sold her on to a dealer, who sold her off the back of his lorry immediately to another dealer and then on to me.

Anyway, I tried to get a covering certificate off this guy but was told that he did not have any more - he had run out....

Anyway, I only wanted the certificate to prove filly's parentage but in the end she just had to have a blank passport. I though this was pretty irresponsible - I have found a buyer for her (well hopefuly they will turn up on the 30th after giving me a deposit....) but her future could have been pretty bleak or certainly a lot bleaker than if he had done things properly.
 
jack9 said:
i want to breed from my unknown mare eventually - to keep the foal... however, i will only breed to a decent stallion (like sir donnerhall lines) as dressage is what i want to do with her and want a foal for me....

however - i coudl be seen as 'wrong' but as long as shes happy and healthy and has no genetic conditions (and i have vets approval) then i will go ahead and breed.

even if the foal is a throwback - i still wont sell - same as if its was worth a lot of money - i sill wouldnt sell... :)

just a POV from a potential private breeders...
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Similarly, I would like to breed for my mare again. I didn't breed from her intentionally in the first place, she came to me pregnant & I had no clue.
She bred a rather wonderful little foal, who is now in a home for life with a family friend. If she was going to make anywhere near big enough/chunky enough for me, I would have kept her & to give her away was heartbreaking.
I'd like to be able to do it all again, but on my terms... and the end result being something that I can keep for myself.

If the world only bred top & talented competition horses - What would people like me ride? I like my nice safe cob & would rather not break my neck on a dizzy WB...

I understand conformation/healh/temprement issues etc and I do not in anyway condone breeding s*** but there are people out there who would like offspring from their much loved family pets, who are able to give these horses security.
 
I don't think the overbreeding issue here is a patch on the problem in America - one quick look at the Fugly blog will tell you that (even breeding from some of our less talented unregistered mares doesn't seem to produce conformational car crashes like they do!) but agree the backyard breeding mentality needs to be stamped on before it does get out of control - good on our national horse governing body for their campaign but it needs more publicity than the occasional one page in the BHS mag!
 
I bred a foal from my unknown, unproven, slightly quirky mare - yes maybe I was mad - but there it is.

I bred with the intention of keeping the foal for myself.

Since having the foal, the mare has gone on to outdo herself, and prove herself as a good dressage horse, and is now jumping clear rounds consistently.

The foal is now a 3yo, still with me, and is a cracking type - well built, intelligent, good confo, and one of the (if not the most) easiest horses I have ever had to handle. It may be, in comparison to my 4yo arab (who had a rubbish start in life), that my 3yo seems to assume a little that she will always be well looked after, and so doesn't always appreciate my pampering of her (!!) - but she has a trainable attitude, and I am looking forward to starting her ridden work next year.

I know this isn't quite what the OP was talking about, but at the same time, the unknown, unproven slightly quirky mare has produced a filly with a cracking temperament, that I wouldn't change for the world. It's not impossible for a quirky mare to produce really good foals - just the same as a brilliant, proven mare, with excellent conformation, can produce bad tempered foals, with poor conformation. Ultimately breeding is lottery IMO
 
In my experience, people breed because they want to keep a permanent momento of their mare, who like other people have said, must be perfect because it is theirs. Unfortunately, to further compound the problem they often use the stallion of a "friend", probably because it is cheap and readily to hand. I used to hear the 15/16 year old kids at my old yard boasting how they were going to breed from their mares. I always asked them what they planning to do with a horse they couldn't then ride for most of 12 months, were they prepared for it all to go horribly wrong and they could end up with a dead mare, or an orphan/rejected foal which they would have to get up to every 4 hours to bottle feed - a bit tricky when you are at school, and then finally have to sell the foal because they couldn't afford to keep it or didn't have the time to deal with it after all because of work commitments or whatever. I'm sure they hated me for pricking their bubble, but there we go!

Incidentally, I read the salutory tale of a girl who decided to breed from her finely built mare and used a much chunkier stallion in the hope of getting a decent amount of bone in the foal. The result was a chunky bodied foal with legs like pins and the poor owner had to accept that it would never be anything other than a decoration in the field.
 
We really need a "like" button on here - I have been roaring with laughter reading some of these posts because it is sooo good to hear common sense at last!

The sad fact is people cannot bear to have their horses put down when they are no longer healthy/sound/sane/wanted - no they send them to a sale, or breed another lame/unhealthy/insane and unwanted youngster and send that to the sale instead....

I wish I had the answer too - but in the meantime best to keep on the rants - at least it helps our sanity if only temporarily! :eek:
 
I wanted a youngster and I could have bred a very nice one from my mare. She has good breeding and conformation but her temperament could be better... so I bought a weanling instead. :)
 
Do you mean substandard in the sense of dangerous? Conformation fault?

I look at it this way..........not everyone has enough money to purchase a perfect mare,but they may just be perfect enough for them and be their lifelong friend. People then think that they would like to keep a piece of the mare's legacy by breeding from her. I have absolutely no problem with this at all.
 
Cazza525 said:
Do you mean substandard in the sense of dangerous? Conformation fault?

I look at it this way..........not everyone has enough money to purchase a perfect mare,but they may just be perfect enough for them and be their lifelong friend. People then think that they would like to keep a piece of the mare's legacy by breeding from her. I have absolutely no problem with this at all.
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Niether do I, unfortunately that doesnt happen often, that is the perfect world. Mostly people put their mare to a substandard stallion, their only consideration is cost of the fee and the near location of the stallion. Then the offspring is unhandled and more often than not sent to a low grade sale. That is the case more often than not. Responsible breeders have the knowledge and facilities and a market for their prodgeny. In my opinion breeding should never be a hobby in this day and age. I dont breed dogs I rescue them, I dont any longer breed horses, I buy what nobody else really wants. I have the experience to be able to cope with, to most people, nutty TBs. They then stay with me till old age gets the better of them. My last TB went to stud to be a companion to youngsters and died at 28.
 
FINALLY!
Someone with the same pet peeve as me :)

I don't have a problem with breeding from mares who's lines are unknown. Conformation, temperament and presence/movement are the most important things. Not having recognized bloodlines but having a good competition record opens up a doorway for new blood.
I want to breed sport ponies professionally when I'm older and more experienced, (on top of everything else I want to do :rolleyes:) and I'll always look at the main and important points before even considering breeding, stallion or mare.

This is the kind of time I praise people for gelding their horses. Shame they can't get their mares spade too.
 
I was having this discussion with a girl at lunch who was raving about some foals bred from the most awfully put together horse in the world, front end is about a whole hand higher than the back end and legs bed in all the wrong places. I told her that to breed from a horse like that was idiotic, the mare is not going to stay sound, the foals have terrible genes.
 
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