Winter turnout

[scats]

Thanks TP, I was feeling quite sorry for myself, taking into account what I originally moved from. But it turns out there is more than one upside, because there's absolutely no doubt how much more freely he is moving now he's not working on waxed surfaces.

Hats off to you for making that decision to move him. I can imagine a lot of people would be swayed by the facilities to stay.
I don’t know much about Somerford, does each barn have a set number of fields?

 

[palo1]

We need to change our thinking and language around it

Count the number of hours stood in, not the number of hours out. 1/2 day of turnout realistically means 19- 20 hours stood in a small box.

Horses don’t need to be 'snug' or 'cosy'. They don’t like to be 'wrapped up' or 'tucked up'. They don’t appreciate a 'duvet day'. These are human terms, never going to be applicable to a herd animal designed to roam and graze all day and all night. No, I don’t think the alternative is standing in a small, bleak paddock with no grass and no shelter, but it needn’t be one or the other.

There are viable alternatives that involve putting in turnout pens, using areas of hard standing, putting in more draininage, using barn/ group housing systems, adding small pens to stables to give some element of choice for in/out. We cannot have row upon row of 12x12 stables that allow for zero interaction and expect our horses to be happy and healthy when shut in for 10+ hours

Yes, and often the 'compromise' of group turnout/pens/housing is cheaper and can be done 'better' and maintained more easily than cheaply constructed stabling. At least that has been my experience; I have been able to create a herd hard standing/turnout pen for 3 horses that is a reasonable size, where they can roll, eat, mooch, move around at a trot and possibly a canter, mutual groom and sleep as they like etc MUCH more cheaply than if I had tried to create a traditional stable block. I have tried to be realistic about what I can manage, about what turnout is possible in our high up Welsh winter weather and what is the very best I can do for my horses. It is still a compromise and I am not thrilled not to be able to offer 24/7 turnout but I also know in previous winters where that has been a choice, often my 3 over wintered horses will have stood in their barn by choice ALL DAY!! But then the 'turnout' was pretty uninspiring - weeds and churned mud by December/January. Mud fever and injuries were an element in this too. Ideally I would have plenty of acres of free draining old turf that could stand up to 3 healthy horses winter antics. But I don't.

 

[Zoeypxo]

Currently have 20 hrs turnout, can keep out 24hrs if i want too but like to bring in for feed and dry rug change/legs to dry. Then excersize then go back out!
In a mixed herd. Gets muddy but by spring they go on different grazing anyway

 

[chaps89]

Mine is currently in from 4pm-8am and turnout is an all weather surfaced pen, a touch smaller than a 20 x 40 school.
I am desperately looking to move - he’s retired, getting stiff and lost a lot of muscle since coming off a hilly acre and a half out 24/7.
Ive discovered turnout is a difficult thing to find around here and will either relocate to be in a better area of the country when I can next afford to move, or simply won’t replace him when the time comes if I want/need to stay out (assuming I can find something for in between times)

In your shoes OP I’m not really sure what the pros are to your yard? Limited turnout, not great hacking, a school with a bad surface, I’d at least be looking for somewhere else and hoping very much I could find somewhere or with a different compromise at least.

 

[Tiddlypom]

Horses don’t need to be 'snug' or 'cosy'. They don’t like to be 'wrapped up' or 'tucked up'. They don’t appreciate a 'duvet day'. These are human terms, never going to be applicable to a herd animal designed to roam and graze all day and all night.

Erm, my 3 all love their infrequent duvet days in indoor rugs with a nice deep shavings bed and freshly steamed hay on tap ?.

They would happily come in each and every night, too.

Poor things have to live out on well drained land with a choice of field shelters, which they use a lot. Darlings.

 

[scats]

I think, like most things with horses, they get accustomed to the way they are kept. A horse brought in everyday to a warm stable and a big haynet is going to get used to that routine and hang around at the gate to wait for it. If it was left and not brought in, it would probably kick up a big fuss and people would be fooled into thinking how much it needs it’s creature comforts. The reality is, in most cases (most, not all), a bit of gradual re-introduction to a different way of life or to living out more, most horses adjust just fine.

 

[WelshD]

Ideally 8 hours plus but pony would stay quite sane as long as he got 5 hours. I do think its easier for ponies though as at least they can move around a stable a bit. Some people I know keep horses in stables where they are almost touching the walls at either end.

Last winter he was in a total of about 10 days (not in a row) so we made an effort to exercise him more and we were allowed to turnout in the school, it was not something I'd like to happen very often - I could have pushed my luck and put him out regardless I suppose but being in for those days probably bought us longer turnout much earlier in the year due to preserving the fields on those days of horrendous weather. I made an effort to find a yard where the YO and fellow liveries strived to find a happy medium to keep their horses happy and with everyone cooperating we had plenty of nice grazing the other 355 days of the year.

I am shocked by the number of yards that have a blanket no turnout from Oct-March

 

[chaps89]

I do also agree with the point upthread about quality of turnout too - a mud pit is no fun, and I simply don’t understand putting big rounds of hay out, they just encourage the horses to stand still and invariably turn into mud pits around them as well.
But how do you compromise if the area you’re in just doesn’t have a choice of yards? Just don’t have horses? What if you already have a horse/horses but they’re not sellable and so they have to stay?
it’s about finding a balance I suppose, there will always be compromises so what’s most palatable/acceptable/feasible.

 

[palo1]

I do also agree with the point upthread about quality of turnout too - a mud pit is no fun, and I simply don’t understand putting big rounds of hay out, they just encourage the horses to stand still and invariably turn into mud pits around them as well.
But how do you compromise if the area you’re in just doesn’t have a choice of yards? Just don’t have horses? What if you already have a horse/horses but they’re not sellable and so they have to stay?
it’s about finding a balance I suppose, there will always be compromises so what’s most palatable/acceptable/feasible.

Yes. I have had horses at livery standing miserably around a round bale in the mud. That isn't great, nor is 24/7 turnout in a completely bleak, unsheltered place. Turnout in large groups in huge fields tends to be difficult for owners - sometimes so much so that it becomes a real issue. UK winters (in fact severe weather in any country) results in compromise, as does finding yourself having to relocate or adjust arrangements for other reasons. It's good news that the culture is changing more toward better quality winters thankfully but it isn't always easy to find a balance.

 

[ycbm]

I wonder will more yards have to do versions of this sort of set up? I'd imagine it's too cost prohibitive for most yards?
https://www.annaharveyfarm.ie/aktiv...UdiZ-L6Q1u9XuohOaRy1oqc2pSFHXsxsYWJvojgc8W9xo

The concept is good but I'm afraid I shudder at any feeding system in group turnout that requires a horse to put its head inside the feeder or out between bars. I think it's asking for a group scuffle and a broken neck ?
.

 

[AntiPuck]

I think that lack of turnout in the UK is the biggest horse welfare issue in this country. It is normalised that huge mammals are kept standing in small boxes, often for the majority of the day, especially during the winter.

I totally agree.

Obviously all horses are individuals, we don't all have access to perfect set-ups, you have to do what you can blah blah but I cringe at "duvet days" and the idea that this is something the horse enjoys putting up with. Is it the horse that enjoys them, or the owner? A lot of the people I see going on about them, at least on social media (which I accept is a certain subset of people), don't seem to believe in any sort of stable enrichment activity either.

Similarly, seeing a livery ad that goes on about arenas, XC courses, "lovely" barn stabling, etc but no mention of turnout whatsoever. I get it, they're marketing to the humans and not the horses, and humans care about human-friendly facilities, but it does make me a bit sad. We are only actually with the horse for a fraction of their day (unless we're very lucky).

 

[ameeyal]

I feel so blessed listening to people talk about non turnout in winter, I couldn’t keep horses if they were kept like that. Mine live at home , with the option to go outside in acres and free to wonder in the barn with separate sleeping area as well as stables .

 

[Tiddlypom]

I cringe at "duvet days" and the idea that this is something the horse enjoys putting up with

But my horses genuinely enjoy their duvet days ?‍. They don't get many of them, and it's usually only if the hunt is about, but they love them.

If horses don't enjoy being in their stables, within reason, then the owner needs to work out what is wrong with the stabling.

 

[AntiPuck]

If horses don't enjoy being in their stables, within reason, then the owner needs to work out what is wrong with the stabling.

I did; the stabling was what was wrong with the stabling!

 

[Fools Motto]

My mare is happy as long as she has something to eat! The mare herd field was getting a bit sparse, so she came in from overnight turnout, waiting by the gate every morning and hoovered up her haynet in nano seconds (so had more hay). She now has a field which has more grass, but I changed her to being out in the day, and in at night. If I include the time I ride, she is only out for a few hours, but has had her fill and is waiting to come in again. I'd like to think she is very happy with this arrangement!!

 

[spotty_pony]

I’m lucky that mine are at home so it’s completely my call. They have been in at night quite a bit lately due to the weather but I can have them in or out, whatever I please. I’m lucky I have lots of grazing to rotate them around though. My spotty pony enjoys being in though - and seems less stiff when in rather than out with his arthritis?! Wonder if it’s because he’s out of the damp? ?