Would you leave? Help!

[PaddyMonty]

OP - in 51 years in the saddle I have never had an issue with a YO and trust me I've been at a lot of yards.
The trick is to talk to YO and to think about what impact your actions might have.
For instance, if I had not seen anyone riding in the yard then I would ask the YO first. If I had a horse that kicks I wouldn't take it in an already occupied school. I certainly wouldn't bring a potential new rider (non family member) to the yard without informing YO first.
It's always better to give more info / checking something is OK than just assuming it is. Costs nothing but saves a fortune.

 

[applecart14]

OP - in 51 years in the saddle I have never had an issue with a YO and trust me I've been at a lot of yards.
The trick is to talk to YO and to think about what impact your actions might have.
For instance, if I had not seen anyone riding in the yard then I would ask the YO first. If I had a horse that kicks I wouldn't take it in an already occupied school. I certainly wouldn't bring a potential new rider (non family member) to the yard without informing YO first.
It's always better to give more info / checking something is OK than just assuming it is. Costs nothing but saves a fortune.

Agree it is courtesy to inform YO if friend coming to ride/going in school if horse kicks but in my eyes there is no justification for shouting at a livery or being rude to one, no matter what the situation.

If I spoke to a client like that I would lose my job.

 

[Louby-Jay]

I don't think that you should have told her about the other rider if she was there with you. On her own yes but not with you. I have never done this and I have been on some really strange yards with some insane rules (I once had to get on my hands and knees to get every piece of shaving off the floor and under my rubber matting every day!)

In relation to the flies- not her job. Courteous yes.

Riding in the school whilst the horse is being bought back into work- I wouldn't have even contemplated this especially as you stated, the horse can become a little narky when enclosed. I would have waited.

BUT- I don't agree with how she is speaking to you. We are adults and all she has to do is ask. I also don't agree with her telling you to put "IT" on a lunge. This is disrespectful, I go nuts when people refer to my dog as an IT, I always reply "HE" lol. It is also disrespectful that she thinks she knows best about your horses rehab. Again, been in a similar situation where my horse was on field rest and the YO was telling me that he needs riding because he weaved....

If I was you, I would be looking elsewhere. As other people have mentioned, this is your YOU time. You are meant to be enjoying it and if that's not the case anymore then you need to look at why.

 

[FabioandFreddy]

Personally, i don't really see the need to have told the YO about the 'potential' new rider initially as she was on the yard with you and nothing may have come of it! You may not have liked her style of riding/she may not have liked the horse. She wasn't left to her own devices on the yard so if it was me then i would only have said to the YO once you knew she would actually be coming to ride for you.

However - with people already in the school, especially knowing yours can kick in that situation, it would have been courteous to have just waited until they had finished as they were in there first. But still no need for them to have been so rude speaking to you after.

I'd be looking for somewhere else with less hassle though! Makes me feel very lucky i don't have to deal with yard politics! x

 

[Deltic Blue]

However - with people already in the school, especially knowing yours can kick in that situation, it would have been courteous to have just waited until they had finished as they were in there first. But still no need for them to have been so rude speaking to you after.

In my defence as a lot of people have mentioned this, she isn't a serial kicker, but could kick if a horse got too close, she hasn't yet done it, but she will pull faces, so to cover myself, I just say she could kick.
I did ask the son beforehand and was prepared to wait if he said now. I also told him she could kick, so please don't get too close.

I couldn't have done much more, other than wait obviously, which in hindsight we should have done.

 

[SusieT]

Personally I think there is a lot of fault on your side
-fair enough not to ride round the yard, riding in the yard maynot be safe or ideal for other horses and yo can stipulate this easily - not her fault you're not confident.
ditto with the grass tracks and a track having a lot of flies on it isn't really a big issue - this time of year there are flies so use fly repellant?

going in school - if your horse is difficult and kicks you should wait until the school is empty - they were in there first.. you can't expect them tow alk because you're horse is being a diva.
I think you sound very unconfident and wonder should you send horse away for schooling as your yo sounds like she doesn't want to support your confidence needs (which in all fairness is not her job..)

 

[Casey76]

However - with people already in the school, especially knowing yours can kick in that situation, it would have been courteous to have just waited until they had finished as they were in there first. But still no need for them to have been so rude speaking to you after.

Depends on how big the school is surely? Even a standard 20x40 is enough space for 2 people to keep out of the way of each other

OP: I would move asap (though I know this is often easier said than done), I'd hate to be on a yard where I didn't feel welcome, and I certainly wouldn't put up with a YO who told me what I should be doing with my horse.

All of the stories about livery yards in the UK, I'm not sure I could cope on one. Makes all of my little issues seem quite petty really lol!

 

[Crackerz]

Oh OP, if i ever have to move yards, i think i would sell up and give up. I would hate to be on a yard where anything you have done detailed here is classed as a fault. Sigh.

I grew up with a rule that you assume all horses you ride with are kickers. Therefore you never get yourself in to a position to be kicked by someone else's horse whilst riding in a school, out on a hack or at a fun ride etc. Just stay out the way of others & get on with it even as a kid.

 

[Amye]

Oh OP, if i ever have to move yards, i think i would sell up and give up. I would hate to be on a yard where anything you have done detailed here is classed as a fault. Sigh.

I grew up with a rule that you assume all horses you ride with are kickers. Therefore you never get yourself in to a position to be kicked by someone else's horse whilst riding in a school, out on a hack or at a fun ride etc. Just stay out the way of others & get on with it even as a kid.

Have to agree with the above really. I don't think you have done much wrong tbh, yes maybe you could have waited until they had left but if you had asked their permission to enter the school and they had agreed, and you'd asked them to keep their distance, then this isn't really your fault.

If I am riding in the school with anyone I always give them plenty of space, whether I know the horse is a 'kicker' or not. Any horse is capable of kicking and you shouldn't ride up the backside of it, especially if you have let them ride with you and they have already warned you. I normally don't mind sharing but occasionally, if I am doing something specific I have asked people to hang on 5 minutes while I finish up, which the YO could have done in this case. I do not think that it is acceptable for the YO to shout at you or be rude. If there was a problem they should take you to the side and quietly explain in a polite manner. Unless you are completely ignoring them time and after time, then maybe they have a right to be annoyed.

The others are right, it is not their place to tell you about the flies, it is courteous but they don't HAVE to.

My yard allow you to ride round on the horse. Especially for horses coming back into work. I understand maybe some yards might have this rule, but as said, the YO should be polite about it (especially if you did not know). And so long as the new person is with you when they visit the yard I don't think you needed to tell the YO. My family and friends like to come and visit my horse and I can't imagine having to tell them everytime a family member wanted to come up and see him! They are always with me and supervised.

If you're uncomfortable move. I know i couldn't stay somewhere where I thought the YO had a problem with me or my horse.

 

[PaddyMonty]

Oh OP, if i ever have to move yards, i think i would sell up and give up. I would hate to be on a yard where anything you have done detailed here is classed as a fault. Sigh.

The fault as I see it is lack of consideration for the YO. Most issues on yards start through lack of simple communication.
Given how difficult is is to find a new yard due to supply and demand keeping on the good side of a YO is a wise move and cost nothing.
Agree some YO are not great when it comes to dealing with liveries but if a battle starts it is normally the YO who will win.

 

[saddlesore]

I would leave, ime YOs fall under 2 categories: normal or nightmare. Find a yard run by the former!

 

[Deltic Blue]

Thanks everyone, if all goes well we are going back to my old yard.
Even though it has the indoor school, we are going to work on this with the rider and see if we can get her a bit more relaxed in there. I know I'll be happier as I know the yard, I was there for almost 3 years, and the YO is more than happy to have me back

 

[saddlesore]

You sound happier already DB 😊 Good luck.

 

[rhylis]

She certainly sounds like she has an issue with you and is behaving in a rude and unprofessional way. I'd say its fair enough to ask you not to ride in the yard if that's a yard rule but its her treatment of you regarding the school that I find hard to understand. I hope to offer livery in the future and if I had a client who was having the issues you are dealing with I'd want to be helpful being as you are a paying customer. Therefore, I'd have waited quietly while your rider worked the horse in the school or vacated it if that made things easier. Perhaps that's the wrong attitude and it should be a case of "my yard, my school so I have priority" but I'm not sure that's the way to run a successful business. Obviously, I wouldn't want to find I owned a yard with facilities I never got to use myself but there needs to be consideration for clients especially in difficult circumstances. It sounds like you are being given no consideration at all for the situation you are in, in fact the opposite seems to be happening. I'd be inclined to move in your position.

 

[Kezzabell2]

I'd move if I were you!

My horse was off for 4 months and bringing him back into work was very scary, there would have been nothing worse than my YM not being there to support me!! in fact my YM was a massive help, she helped me on the ground; lunging; hacking out with me; her daughter then started schooling him when he was ready! without either of them I don't think it would have been as easy! There is no way I'd have wanted someone cantering up behind him in the school!! if they knew the son was going to be upping his speed they could have told you, so you could have made a decision about going in the school or not!

 

[Deltic Blue]

I'd move if I were you!

My horse was off for 4 months and bringing him back into work was very scary, there would have been nothing worse than my YM not being there to support me!! in fact my YM was a massive help, she helped me on the ground; lunging; hacking out with me; her daughter then started schooling him when he was ready! without either of them I don't think it would have been as easy! There is no way I'd have wanted someone cantering up behind him in the school!! if they knew the son was going to be upping his speed they could have told you, so you could have made a decision about going in the school or not!

He started cantering as soon as we got in there. When I asked he was walking so I didn't know if he was cooling down or warming up, I probably should have asked. But he went right into canter and the rider said to me after that it was like he was following her and getting too close.

 

[skint1]

Thanks everyone, if all goes well we are going back to my old yard.
Even though it has the indoor school, we are going to work on this with the rider and see if we can get her a bit more relaxed in there. I know I'll be happier as I know the yard, I was there for almost 3 years, and the YO is more than happy to have me back

Ecellent news! I think you'll be much calmer and happier there and that will help your mare a lot

 

[paddi22]

Therefore, I'd have waited quietly while your rider worked the horse in the school or vacated it if that made things easier. Perhaps that's the wrong attitude and it should be a case of "my yard, my school so I have priority"

playing devils advocate - that would annoy me if that was what i was expected to do what you suggested on a yard. some people have limited time, or else are concentrating on schooling a particular move or working a horse towards learning a particular thing. It is annoying and can ruin a good schooling session if you have to sit and wait for someone who comes in with a horse they are having issues with. If you have to stop you break the flow of work or interupt the horses mindset and often you can't get it back. If i was in the school already I also wouldn't appreciate being told to leave while another horse came in. They can wait till the arena is free.

i've been on the other end where i've had tricky horses and I would always wait till the arena was free. I think if you know you might disrupt someone arena work then it's politeness to wait.

 

[rhylis]

playing devils advocate - that would annoy me if that was what i was expected to do what you suggested on a yard. some people have limited time, or else are concentrating on schooling a particular move or working a horse towards learning a particular thing. It is annoying and can ruin a good schooling session if you have to sit and wait for someone who comes in with a horse they are having issues with. If you have to stop you break the flow of work or interupt the horses mindset and often you can't get it back. If i was in the school already I also wouldn't appreciate being told to leave while another horse came in. They can wait till the arena is free.

i've been on the other end where i've had tricky horses and I would always wait till the arena was free. I think if you know you might disrupt someone arena work then it's politeness to wait.

Yes, fair point and I wouldn't expect a fellow livery to do this unless they chose to. I was just speaking from the stand point of a yard owner being considerate to a livery. Its true though that it would be awkward to interrupt a schooling session.

 

[Nativelover]

Leave, if you've got an alternative yard to go to definately leave. A nasty YO can destroy the enjoyment of your horse and reverse any progress you make with your horse.
Take it from me who has and is still enduring a particularly pernicious YO whom quite frankly has destroyed me enjoying my horse. As soon as I can find something else, I'm off!
You are paying her for a service, i.e livery for your precious horse. It's not a privilige nor a favour, you are paying!
Get out ASAP!

 

[mytwofriends]

Leave, if you've got an alternative yard to go to definately leave. A nasty YO can destroy the enjoyment of your horse and reverse any progress you make with your horse.
Take it from me who has and is still enduring a particularly pernicious YO whom quite frankly has destroyed me enjoying my horse. As soon as I can find something else, I'm off!
You are paying her for a service, i.e livery for your precious horse. It's not a privilige nor a favour, you are paying!
Get out ASAP!

This ^^^

I typed a reply and deleted the lot. Really don't have the will to type it again, but basically I referred to bully type YO's and how I'd experienced one, so now I have zero tolerance.

Don't go pussy footing round the miserable so-and-so either. If you like your old yard and YO, go and never look back!

 

[eggs]

I agree that the YO hasn't done much wrong except for be rather rude in her handling of the situation. However as you sound very stressed by it the best thing would be for you to move before things escalate.

 

[Rowreach]

I've been thinking about this while I was in the bath and, speaking as a YO of many years, it sounds to me like yours is looking at a tricky horse which is being brought back into work by an owner who is not confident in handling and riding it, and then seeing the owner bringing another rider onto the yard to ride the horse which by your own admission is likely to kick another and has shown itself to be dangerous (sorry, but any horse which rears is dangerous, however unflappable the rider may be) and to be perfectly honest I'm not surprised she doesn't want you riding around the yard or putting another rider at risk, and I'm not surprised she is wanting to check your insurance because if something goes wrong she doesn't want to find herself liable for it. And as for her calling your mare "it", do a search on here because at one time it was a hot topic and seriously, a lot of the best horse people I have ever met refer to horses as "it", so don't take it personally

 

[paddi22]

And as for her calling your mare "it", do a search on here because at one time it was a hot topic and seriously, a lot of the best horse people I have ever met refer to horses as "it", so don't take it personally

Ha!! that was me, I got jumped on for calling my pony 'it'! Technically if it's an animal that has been refered to previously in conversation then it is correct to call it 'it'!

 

[paddi22]

I've been thinking about this while I was in the bath and, speaking as a YO of many years, it sounds to me like yours is looking at a tricky horse which is being brought back into work by an owner who is not confident in handling and riding it, and then seeing the owner bringing another rider onto the yard to ride the horse which by your own admission is likely to kick another and has shown itself to be dangerous (sorry, but any horse which rears is dangerous, however unflappable the rider may be) and to be perfectly honest I'm not surprised she doesn't want you riding around the yard or putting another rider at risk, and I'm not surprised she is wanting to check your insurance because if something goes wrong she doesn't want to find herself liable for it. And as for her calling your mare "it", do a search on here because at one time it was a hot topic and seriously, a lot of the best horse people I have ever met refer to horses as "it", so don't take it personally

completely agree with this, was thinking the same. especially since the YO started out being supportive but now seems more safety conscious. I'd imagine she might be seeing the situation deteriorate and is concerned. If I was a YO i'd be wary as well when you hear how much difficulty the owner is having walking and handling the horse. I'd say the YO's heart was in her mouth watching the horse rear on a stranger. For all she knows the rider could bring a case for the yard owner not telling her horse was dangerous, or a claim against the son upsetting the horse. If the yo is getting stroppier then it might be her concern is building.

 

[Rowreach]

If the yo is getting stroppier then it might be her concern is building.

In a nutshell.

 

[popsdosh]

For what its worth every livery is usually only worried about their own situation and a YO has to think of many owners!
From years of experience the most difficult to integrate into a yard are DIY or horses with minimal yard input as you are forever having to second guess what will happen next and then multiply that by 20 or thirty maybe. I wish some of those criticising would try and take over the management sometime and then they may understand more why things have to be a certain way.
The most satisfaction we ever got from running a livery yard was when the last one left we actually got our lives back.

 

[YorksG]

With regard just to the YO not being happy with a "stranger" coming on the yard, I can quite understand this, having had a friend livery with us in the past, who then felt it acceptable to bring both people we knew and those we didn't, onto our yard. I was not happy about people I don't know coming onto the yard (possibly "casing" the joint) and the person I did know, I didn't want poking around my yard, I certainly didn't want her "cleaning" the shavings fork by hitting on the door top of a stable the livery did not use, marking the door and breaking the fork! I wasn't rude to the livery about it, but was very glad when the arrangement came to an end and we will never have another livery here!

 

[mytwofriends]

I totally understand those who say that the YO is only thinking of safety and is concerned etc etc. However, this is absolutely no excuse for rudeness.

As someone way earlier up the thread said, trouble at most livery yards stems from lack of communication.

OP is the client. The client is not always right, but she shouldn't be treated like this by the YO.

 

[paddi22]

yeah at the end of the day you are paying for a service, and if you're not happy with the service/attitude then you are better leaving, it's too expensive a hobby to be miserable!