Yard move ....

[Deltofe2493]

A long one... opinions please!

So my horse is sound as a pound and back in action (yay!) and I'm back to having lessons. My friend / trainer charges a very reasonable rate of £20 and we go for an hour. My friend isn't ofiicially insured she's not allowed to teach at my yard which is a riding school, so at the moment I'm hacking down to my friend's place and paying for arena hire making the session £45.

Riding school lessons are £37 per half hour. I've written out my costings, and I could have 6 lessons (instead of 4) if I was to move to her yard for the same cost per month if I didn't use the walker.

The downside of her yard is having to pay for the walker (£1 per 10 mins) and the arena lights in winter (£1 per 10 mins again). My yard has an indoor school, and walker is included.

Her yard has a hot wash and solarium (again pay for the solarium but would only be used once / twice a month).

My yard has a shop on site which is handy for buying bedding incl. 10% discount on everything (and a vet clinic)! And my yard has auto water drinkers, whereas hers is standard water buckets.

Her yard is all outside, so freezing in winter whereas mine is american barn style stables.

You can lunge in the school at her yard, at my yard you have to find a key for the round pen and rake it afterwards. Her yard has a round pen and don't have to find key / rake.

Hay not incl. in her yard, so have to manage that which could be a faff whereas it's included in my livery.

Her YO also has a box which she hires out, I hire from 30 mins away. They also have a xc course with baby jumps which could be fun once she's ready to start jumping again.

 

[Arzada]

What's in this for the horse at both yards? As in turnout. And anything else that a horse would appreciate ...

 

[dorsetladette]

What's the turn out like?

How does your friend deal with the hay situation, can you add your order onto hers so not really a faff at all.

is a bucket rather than a drinker that much of a down side? at least you can see what the horse is drinking and a bucket is easier to clean.

Personally I prefer outside stables as the horses get better ventilation. If your worried you'll be cold invest in better clothes/gloves

 

[Deltofe2493]

Both individual turnout (which i prefer due to accident prone tb). current yard has a field for horse and a half, but would be a smaller paddock at the new yard.

The new YO said she keeps the horses in for a couple days to let the fields recoup after particularly wet days and puts the walker on 'free'.

Yesterday I kept mine in anyway cause it was an awful day!

 

[dorsetladette]

Both individual turnout (which i prefer due to accident prone tb). current yard has a field for horse and a half, but would be a smaller paddock at the new yard.

Is it all year turn out? do you get more or less at new yard?

Do you use the horse walker? with adequate turn out time would you need too?

 

[Deltofe2493]

Is it all year turn out? do you get more or less at new yard?

Do you use the horse walker? with adequate turn out time would you need too?

yes pretty much exact same turnout - except slightly stricter on wet days.

Tbf I actually don't - the walker was out of action over summer. I just find it handy as my current yard has quite a narrow walkway and YO is quite strict about making sure horses don't block the way so I pop her on the walker (or try to if I wake up early enough lol) whilst I'm mucking out so I don't get moaned at. New yard has ample space so can tie up and give her breakfast whilst I'm mucking out.

 

[Starzaan]

I’m afraid I wouldn’t touch either yard if they only offered individual turnout, and kept horses in because it was raining.

 

[Afon_34]

As your horse is already on individual turnout, that wouldn't be a problem at new yard & again, your horse is used to being kept in on the odd day, but I would question how much they really would be in ie. is it likely to turn into them being in weeks rather than just days.
Presumably you would be happier at new yard as with your friend etc

 

[Deltofe2493]

I personally prefer individual turnout as she is accident prone and when she was in pairs last winter she had multiple accidents resulting in a year of rehab! Hasn't been lame since.

I just don't know!

 

[Starzaan]

There are definitely a very very few horses who do better on individual turnout. However, I’ve been running rehab yards for a very long time. I see more injuries and surgeries caused by individual turnout than almost anything else.
Turnout in a balanced herd is almost always the best thing for them.

 

[Gallop_Away]

I’m afraid I wouldn’t touch either yard if they only offered individual turnout, and kept horses in because it was raining.

Ditto this!

Sorry OP not very helpful I know. It's just my own personal preference is to have mine on mixed daily turnout so neither of these yards would appeal to me.

 

[dorsetladette]

I suppose it comes down to services, local vet call out (as you currently have one on site), worming program, etc, and cost.

Would you make use of the cross country course? is the hacking OK?

what is the reason you are looking at moving? is it purely because of the lessons?

 

[Deltofe2493]

I suppose it comes down to services, local vet call out (as you currently have one on site), worming program, etc, and cost.

Would you make use of the cross country course? is the hacking OK?

what is the reason you are looking at moving? is it purely because of the lessons?

Eventually - we're just bringing our flatwork back at the moment as bringing her back into work but would like to say at some point have a little play with the xc next spring / summer pending on the ground.

My vet has a few clinics and I have a preferred vet from another clinic, so end up paying call out anyway! I also pay for a healthcare package yearly so get as many worm counts as I need.

Literally moving for the lessons and trying to be cost effective. Hot wash and solarium a bonus. Hacking would be the same as where I am now.

 

[Deltofe2493]

Ditto this!

Sorry OP not very helpful I know. It's just my own personal preference is to have mine on mixed daily turnout so neither of these yards would appeal to me.

Fair enough on personal preference!

Every horse is different. I've had about £5k in vet bills (uninsured) due to field accidents this year which I am currently paying off so for her sanity (extensive box rest can't be fun) me and my finances, it is better to keep her on individual.

She can still see other horses in the field next door, behind and across the path so she's not completely alone!

 

[Sossigpoker]

If hay isnt included in the livery at the new place, that can seriously ramp up the cost. A big horse could eat up to a small bale a day if they don't have any grass .

 

[Deltofe2493]

If hay isnt included in the livery at the new place, that can seriously ramp up the cost. A big horse could eat up to a small bale a day if they don't have any grass .

oooh I didn't think of that! I'm only basing if she is out every day. Currently has 2 big nets a night!

 

[TheMule]

The red flag for me is ‘in for a couple of days after rain’
It rains a lot in the winter. Your horse could end up being in more days than it is out

 

[Zoeypxo]

How much money will you be saving?
How often will you use the walker and how often will you use the arena lights at £1 per 10 mins?

in for a few days after rain would be an absolute no no for me. Been on a yard like that before which then turns into weeks/months with the fields closed by YO.

 

[Fred66]

The red flag for me is ‘in for a couple of days after rain’
It rains a lot in the winter. Your horse could end up being in more days than it is out

if it’s really wet then horses are frequently stood in one place, churning up the gate area and on hay. So quite a few are happier in than out anyway.

 

[Sossigpoker]

oooh I didn't think of that! I'm only basing if she is out every day. Currently has 2 big nets a night!

Those big nets could hold over half a bale so at 5 quid per small bale , you'd need 3.5, let's say 4 bales a week. That's £20 a week on top of your livery. And once the grass goes or there's no turn out , you'll possibly double that.
If you can buy big bales ,.you'll get better value for money.

 

[chocolategirl]

OP, if you’re really struggling to choose, the only thing maybe is to list each yards plus’s and minuses? Add up each column at the end then use the one with the most pluses!?‍I’m a dreadful decision maker so I feel your pain?

 

[Winters100]

How much money will you be saving?
How often will you use the walker and how often will you use the arena lights at £1 per 10 mins?

in for a few days after rain would be an absolute no no for me. Been on a yard like that before which then turns into weeks/months with the fields closed by YO.

For me too. What happens if it rains every day for a week - do they then spend 10 days in boxes? I would simply not have the time to manage them properly without turnout. Hand walking and hand grazing add such a lot of time to the routine, for me it would be a definite no. If it is truly awful weather fair enough, but at our stable we have had only 1 day in last 2 years where this was the case (exceptionally high winds so YO was worried about trees coming down). Rugs are so good now it is easy to keep a horse dry, and I would far rather deal with a bit of mud around the gate than having to go up 3 times a day to move them.

 

[Birker2020]

Both individual turnout (which i prefer due to accident prone tb). current yard has a field for horse and a half, but would be a smaller paddock at the new yard.

The new YO said she keeps the horses in for a couple days to let the fields recoup after particularly wet days and puts the walker on 'free'.

Yesterday I kept mine in anyway cause it was an awful day!

I think you need to work out costings for the horse walker and arena lights. I think you might end up using the walker more than you think, my horse goes on in at least twice a week, sometimes more for probably 40 mins a time and this would be more if I wanted to use as a warm up/cool down after riding (if I could ride him). It's so convenient, I can't believe you have to pay to use a walker. Ours is free.

And the arena lights would bother me. I know people who have had issues with this kind of meter system where people have come in to the arena after they have put money in the slot and used the lights they have paid for. How you would negotiate this issue with other liveries would be up to you, but it could end up being a costly way to keep a horse.

 

[TheMule]

if it’s really wet then horses are frequently stood in one place, churning up the gate area and on hay. So quite a few are happier in than out anyway.

I'm sorry, but this is so narrow minded! It's not one or the other, you find solutions to give them valuable time out. Life spent inside a stable 22-23hours a day, unless absolutely necessary for veterinary reasons, is not going to make for a happy and healthy horse

 

[Annagain]

I think you need to find out exactly how long the horses are in for in an average winter and prepare for (and account for hay costs) that +20%. Once you've found that out and if you've decided you're happy with it, you then need to work out all your costs over a year.

Questions you need to ask yourself:
- How often will you use the walker and the lights and for how long? I'm guessing if you're hacking there for lessons it's in daylight so those 6 lessons won't cost for the lights?
- How about your other sessions? 1/2 an hour 3 times a week is an extra £9, does that sound about right / still make things cheaper (when you even it out over the year as you obviously won't need lights in the summer)?
- Is the indoor school you currently have a benefit or would you be ok with an outdoor?
- How much will hay cost you if she's in for the amount you've calculated?
- How often do you hire a lorry and how much is this one going to cost you / save you? If there's an extra cost, is it worth it for the convenience of being onsite?
- Assuming you still use the shop at your old yard, how much is losing the 10% going to cost?
- Does the XC course cost? Could you hire it when you need to? If so, add this to your costs for current yard.

The other solution might be suggesting to your friend that she gets herself properly insured - even if that means she ups her price, it won't up it by £25 a time and it would mean more opportunities for her.

 

[throwawayaccount]

mmm, tbh i'd stay where you are.

 

[Deltofe2493]

st. A big horse could eat up to a small bale a d

I think you need to find out exactly how long the horses are in for in an average winter and prepare for (and account for hay costs) that +20%. Once you've found that out and if you've decided you're happy with it, you then need to work out all your costs over a year.

Questions you need to ask yourself:
- How often will you use the walker and the lights and for how long? I'm guessing if you're hacking there for lessons it's in daylight so those 6 lessons won't cost for the lights?
- How about your other sessions? 1/2 an hour 3 times a week is an extra £9, does that sound about right / still make things cheaper (when you even it out over the year as you obviously won't need lights in the summer)?
- Is the indoor school you currently have a benefit or would you be ok with an outdoor?
- How much will hay cost you if she's in for the amount you've calculated?
- How often do you hire a lorry and how much is this one going to cost you / save you? If there's an extra cost, is it worth it for the convenience of being onsite?
- Assuming you still use the shop at your old yard, how much is losing the 10% going to cost?
- Does the XC course cost? Could you hire it when you need to? If so, add this to your costs for current yard.

The other solution might be suggesting to your friend that she gets herself properly insured - even if that means she ups her price, it won't up it by £25 a time and it would mean more opportunities for her.

Thanks for the food for thought. The costs would be the same if I didn't use the walker. But obviously like others have mentioned hay will increase over winter if kept in more.

The only annoying think is hacking an unconfident horse on their own! I hacked on the weekend and she got nappy about half way down so I had to get off and lead. Fine on the way back as she was tired.

The only other thing I'm thinking is I offer to pay her insurance - I saw one for £215 a year - so over the course of 2.5 months I would have made my money back from having lessons at home. Would I be insane for doing that?

 

[throwawayaccount]

its a kind offer, but IMO that's a lot to fork out for someone who should already have their own insurance. :|

 

[Deltofe2493]

OP, if you’re really struggling to choose, the only thing maybe is to list each yards plus’s and minuses? Add up each column at the end then use the one with the most pluses!?‍I’m a dreadful decision maker so I feel your pain?

theres good and bad to each of them it just depends what I am looking for in a yard. Also current yard has auto water drinkers which makes life soooo much easier!

I think for me the important thing is hay included, and a real negative in new yard is the meter system for the walker / lights as I do ride at least 3 times in the week and she needs a good 30-45 mins to get the best out of her. Weekends are obvs easier with daylight but as I am on a riding school it's difficult to get in any of the arenas.

My yard you still have to pay £10 arena hire if I want to book a lesson that isn't with their instructors. - is this normal???

 

[Annagain]

If it's only £215 a year, she could add £5 on to her hourly rate (which would still be pretty cheap) and make it back easily. She'd only have to teach 43 hours to achieve that. You shouldn't have to pay for something other clients would benefit from, even if you save money in the long run.