YO adding surcharge

[Deltofe2493]

Is it normal for a yard owner to add a surcharge to their liveries if they can’t get hold of hay and will cost extra to get?

I’m part livery so pay enough as it is without random extra charges...

Don’t want them to start taking the piss, but also don’t want them to get funny if I refuse to pay?

 

[Deltofe2493]

Ps cost is £550 and surcharge is £50

 

[ester]

Given the current hay situation in some areas I'd be pleased they had found any at all and wouldn't expect them to provide it at a loss to themselves so would pay extra.

 

[ihatework]

It’s not unreasonable, especially given the difficulty sourcing decent hay at the moment

 

[Nicnac]

Completely reasonable. Hay is like unicorn teeth to source and prices are through the roof.

 

[SussexbytheXmasTree]

I think it’s fair to charge extra in exceptional times and hay prices here have risen dramatically. Locally small bales have been around £7 a bale normally nearer £4.50 so I guess you could work out if the charge is overall reasonable if you know roughly what your horse eats. Given what I use for a large horse even in winter it sounds excessive but you’d need to base it on your particular circumstances. Maybe they normally have a much cheaper supply if they buy in bulk.

 

[Rowreach]

Is it fair that a YO should subsidise their clients' horses when hay is scarce and prices have risen accordingly?

 

[dogatemysalad]

Yes. I would not expect my YO to subsidise my horse.

 

[1523679]

It’s completely reasonable to add a surcharge to reflect an unusual/exceptional increase in the cost of providing your livery service.

The only thing I’d be inclined to query is how the surcharge was calculated ... £50 is a very round number.

Is that £50 extra per month? Is it the same for all liveries/part-liveries, regardless of horse size/appetite/work level?

It’s reasonable to have a surcharge, but the surcharge should be ... reasonable. Goes both ways.

 

[MidChristmasCrisis]

Sadly yes.

 

[Deltofe2493]

It’s completely reasonable to add a surcharge to reflect an unusual/exceptional increase in the cost of providing your livery service.

The only thing I’d be inclined to query is how the surcharge was calculated ... £50 is a very round number.

Is that £50 extra per month? Is it the same for all liveries/part-liveries, regardless of horse size/appetite/work level?

It’s reasonable to have a surcharge, but the surcharge should be ... reasonable. Goes both ways.

yes exactly the same for all liveries! I have asked the question so will wait an answer ?

 

[SussexbytheXmasTree]

yes exactly the same for all liveries! I have asked the question so will wait an answer ?

I think it’s fair to charge one rate as otherwise it’s too complicated. I was paying £500 pcm for part-livery 10 years ago so really you’re YO is probably not making a lot per livery.

 

[ester]

Yes if they charge different rates already for pony v horses etc I'd expect them still to do so. If they don't do that I'd expect them to keep it the same.
DIY is the solution if you only want to pay for the hay you use

 

[TGM]

I suppose the YO's alternative is to just put the livery price up by £50 a month. The disadvantage to you then would be you wouldn't get a decrease when hay prices return to normal. So a surcharge would be preferable in my books! I wouldn't be expecting the surcharge to be personalised to the individual horse either. Presumably the livery price is calculated on what the average horse eats.

 

[sunleychops]

Seems excessive to me.

 

[1523679]

£50 per month is a lot, though. Have hay prices more than doubled?

I can understand that a YO might not want to do individual calculations per livery, to avoid making life too hard.


But, the very round number suggests that the charge has not been “calculated”, but plucked out of the air. On the basis of actual price increases or what the yard thinks is the maximum liveries will tolerate, who can tell.

If a yard isn’t charging enough to cover its cost base, then it absolutely should increase the livery tariffs. That way everyone knows what they’re paying for and why they’re paying it.

Charging a round-number amount apparently without really explaining it lacks transparency and creates mistrust. As this thread demonstrates.

 

[The Jokers Girl]

What is in your contract about pricing and price increases, surcharges. If yard owner has nothing in contract regarding price increases whether perm or temp then they can't charge this. They are breaching their own contract which would make it null and void if they wanted to use it against you. Yard owners are business owners and if they want to make changes to charging structure and their own T&Cs then they should follow appropriate laws of B to C trading

 

[9tails]

I think it's a bit high. I'm making assumptions that your horse is out grazing during the day, so I would expect a good sized horse with a decent appetite to get through 3 bales a week if in overnight. You have already paid for hay in your monthly livery so it should only be the extra cost of hay at the moment. It can be found at £7 a small bale whereas DIYs usually pay approximately £4.50, though buying in bulk would have made the price per bale a bit cheaper in normal circumstances.

Unfortunately, many livery yards will say if you don't like it find somewhere else so I would suck it up for now and make sure that surcharge is removed once hay prices have gone back to normal levels. You only have to look at the first half a dozen posts on local facebook sites to see people searching for hay at the moment.

I have seen quite a few fields that would normally grow rape or peas resown as grass this year so hopefully this is a temporary blip.

 

[ester]

Cost varies wildly by area even in times where hay is more plentiful. I was spoilt growing up in a grass growing area!

 

[SEL]

I've had it twice in bad hay years. The first time it went up £5 pw per horse and the second time the owner fortunately managed to get in about 8 bales which got us through to harvest time - so he didn't charge. If they are having to bring in extra now though when we are some way off taking a crop then I can see why they need to charge.

A friend has just bought some extra round bales for £60 each so it is pricey

 

[The Xmas Furry]

Hay is being rationed by my 2 biggest local merchants and that's to accountholders only with one of them, it's currently more than double the cost for small bale hay at around £7 a bale.

I buy mine in off the field once a year, so buying in at more than double is a big hit.
Many have had horses stabled longer this spring, or hay feeding longer as the grass just wasn't coming through enough till about a week ago or the weather had turned vile.

 

[The Jokers Girl]

I have reported chunmin78 as has sbloom on another thread

 

[catkin]

50 pounds a month is less than 2 pounds per day.
If the prices quoted in a post further up are indicative of the increase in price due to scarcity (7.00 from 4.50 per bale) then the surcharge is the extra cost for less than a bale per horse per day. Based on the amounts I feed/have fed then that doesn't seem far from an average amount.

 

[AdorableAlice]

Is it normal for a yard owner to add a surcharge to their liveries if they can’t get hold of hay and will cost extra to get?

I’m part livery so pay enough as it is without random extra charges...

Don’t want them to start taking the piss, but also don’t want them to get funny if I refuse to pay?

Look at it differently. Hay is scarce, where I am it is non existent. My contractor who has supplied me for 40 years has empty barns for the first time ever. He has managed to get me a few rounds and has paid a huge amount for it. If my horses are to eat I have no choice but to pay the cost.

You may be on livery but if mother nature has not supplied the weather for a plentiful crop of hay last year there is simply no hay. Your yard owner isn't taking the piss, they are having to source and pay whatever is required IF they can find any hay.

Hay does not not come from a supermarket. This winter has been long with a non existent spring. Stock are still in barns, farmers are still feeding hay to their cattle which is costing a fortune. Quite simply horses come second, so unless you make your own hay, you are stuffed as are many of us presently.

 

[Griffin]

I would ask how it is calculated and I would also seek clarification that when the price of hay comes down, the surcharge will come off. I would also have a look at your contract.

The other option I guess would be to ask that hay be removed from your bill and you buy your own. At my yard, there are a couple of livery owners who because they have multiple horses, buy in their own hay. However, there is enough storage space to enable this to happen.

We have paid a surcharge where I am occasionally but it has always been just while prices are high, as soon as they come down, the surcharge stops.

 

[Chianti]

What is in your contract about pricing and price increases, surcharges. If yard owner has nothing in contract regarding price increases whether perm or temp then they can't charge this. They are breaching their own contract which would make it null and void if they wanted to use it against you. Yard owners are business owners and if they want to make changes to charging structure and their own T&Cs then they should follow appropriate laws of B to C trading

That's really interesting. Thanks. My yard has just sent out a new contract and I don't think there's anything in it about increasing the price of livery either because of hay shortages or a general review over time.

 

[Rowreach]

Who’d be a YO ....

 

[FestiveG]

People often complain, on here that yards are too full, or too expensive, or are closing altogether, threads like this explain why imo

 

[Rowreach]

People often complain, on here that yards are too full, or too expensive, or are closing altogether, threads like this explain why imo

Im not the only ex-YO on HHO who eventually said f*** it and is happily now doing my own thing without liveries.

 

[AdorableAlice]

What is in your contract about pricing and price increases, surcharges. If yard owner has nothing in contract regarding price increases whether perm or temp then they can't charge this. They are breaching their own contract which would make it null and void if they wanted to use it against you. Yard owners are business owners and if they want to make changes to charging structure and their own T&Cs then they should follow appropriate laws of B to C trading

You do understand where hay comes from and what is involved in growing/making hay don’t you ? There are no terms and conditions in seasonal weather and demand. Reading through this thread is convincing me that pony owners on livery are under the impression that hay arrives in the barn via Amazon Prime.