YO doesn't like our youngster..

milesjess

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Perhaps you should show your mother this thread?

As others have said sounds like a set up by a devious person. If she dislikes him and classes him as dangerous why suggests selling to her friend. Also, I think she is baking you into a corner and trying to turn you against him :(

She is a yard owner, regardless if she likes a horse or not she has absolutely no right at all to suggest selling/ pass on her opinion of a horse and even more so if she was a dressage rider I assume she has many years in the trade so the whole 'I worry before turning him out', sounds absolutely ridiculous.

If it was me, I'd honestly speak to her, tell her he is your horse and he is not for sale end of and she is to no longer express her unwanted opinion on him.

Sorry bit forceful but I feel so pee'd off for you! And your poor horse... He is a baby so of course he will be pushy etc, but I'm sure he's by no means 'slow', how dare she say that?!

I don't condone violence but if my boy was still alive and a comment like that was made the person would certainly no about it... Cheek of her!

Hope you sort it but please please don't sell him because she is pretty much bullying you and your mum and turning you against your own horse... All for her own gain, people in this world cannot be trusted regardless how friendly and helpful they may seem.
 

sarahann1

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That statement offends me to no end.

Yep, very unprofessional along with being offensive.

If the YO does not want the horse on her yard then your mum must sell or move .
A YO should never have to keep a horse she's uncomfortable with on her property.

absolutely, in which case the yo should be asking you to leave.

Interfering YOs is a subject the riles me a fair amount, there are a few instances on a DIY yard where I think it's fine, welfare issues of the horse etc. However OP you are on DIY livery, therefore you are renting a space, not your YOs opinions which just sound awful, it's sounds like she's crossed a line to be honest, if the horse is or isn't right for you, that's your business, not hers. Unless she thinks it is very very dangerous, which it doesn't sound like that, many horses at 2 will fire out at a farrier, especially if they have a bad experience, chalk it up and move on from that. Edit, I'm sure lots don't either, but most come right in the end with time and education.

Honestly, maybe I'm reading too much into it, but your YO sounds very controlling and manipulative, if you say something long enough people will start to believe it. Move to a yard where you are respected as an owner and it'll do wonders for your mums confidence in herself as a capable owner.

If you can't move, can you find someone else to put the horse out for you so no one directly involved with the hard has anything to do with it?
 
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wildflower

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That statement offends me to no end.

it offends me too.........my 17 yr old son has autism and is highly intelligent and a fabulous lad to boot.

............rant over, your youngster is better off out of there, sell him privately to a more knowledgeable home, be honest when selling .TBH does,nt sound like hes done much anyhow , the kick was bad for sure ,
it sounds like your mum wants rid of him too, just convince your mum to find the right home for him.How does your YO know if hes forward or not anyhow.....hes not broken yet ...........is this opinion formed from loose schooling...........stupid bint !
 

WestCoast

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Frankly if the YO can't handle a stroppy two year old, why is she running a yard? It's what they do, push boundaries - she should be able to set them, and stick to them, and so should any other staff handling him.

Paula
 

I See Clover

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Doh You actually admit that she does not handle him, "Her Groom" does. Who is responsible for her grooms safety. YO of course! The YO has to do a risk assesment on every single task her employees undertake. If the groom gets hurt will you pay her wages & do her work for the YO.
No I didn't think so.

That's the whole point though - he is of no risk! Groom puts him out to the field a couple of mornings (which I could easily take over doing). He stands in the stable like a gent while I put his rug on, he donders out to the field no problem. He doesn't pull, bolt, barge or anything of the sort. He is like any average 2 year old!
 

Goldenstar

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Frankly if the YO can't handle a stroppy two year old, why is she running a yard? It's what they do, push boundaries - she should be able to set them, and stick to them, and so should any other staff handling him.

Paula

This a small private yard it is the YOers yard no one should ever have to keep a horse on THEIR yard that they feel they don't want there period.
It's not about whether she can handle or not handle the horse its about what the YOer wants.
The YO employs staff if she is unhappy about this horse she canot have it on the yard she is responsible for them.
From what op 's said this is a small yard with the owners own horses and a few liverys there's no way I would have my enjoyment of my yard and my horses ruined by having a horse I did not want on the yard on the yard.
Just as liverys can leave for arbitrary reasons yard owners have every right to ask a livery to remove a horse they don't care for.
It's not to do with the YOers competence it's about her wishes.
 

natalia

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I can see it from both sides! Having to deal with someone else's ill mannered youngster is NO FUN. I think more what yard owner is fearing is that your mother lets horse get away with things that she shouldn't, she's not tough enough on him and hey presto, at 4yrs, big and strong you will have problems. He then def won't be what your mum wanted and its prob better for the horse to se sold. It's difficult as it is a reality check, but if she can see alarm bells ringing then I can understand why. I have a very difficult horse and a few years ago was asked for similar reasons to either get rid of it or go from one yard I was on. Not because it did anything awful with me, but because it was a health and safety risk to others when it was in the field. No yard owner wants to be subject to a court case, instead I found a yard where he could be on his own in the field and only handled by myself when bringing in or new yard owner who didn't employ anyone else or take any of his rubbish. A difficult situation on both sides but all it sounds like is yard owner needs some people handling lessons and to learn to be a little more tactful!
 

Littlelegs

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Agree with Goldenstar. It's also much harder to teach a horse manners if you only turn it out a few days a week, rather than if you do it daily.
 

northernsoul

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you say hes a plod your mam loves him she wants to keep him , yes id be weary of someone who wants my horse sold and has a friend who is a dealer !!! At end of the day you dont know whats going on when you are not there at the yard, id try moving him , without offending anyone, just because people are/ were qualified this and that- youngsters are youngsters and need patience and experiance and confidence, i know people who have taught in riding schools but not confident to break/handle youngsters and send them away for breaking this is no offence to anyone, horse is young,you will hav ups and downs maybe people on yard are scared of him . My son is autistic, what made her think hes autistic? Dont sell the horse unless you want to !And not to this deaker, your yard owners friend.Have you thought about all year turnout,and how do they handle him when you are not there ?
 

Laafet

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Reading between the lines it sounds like he's a rude, bad mannered brat who's rhino skinned and frustrating to work with. I know the exact kind of horse and can't stand them either. :eek:

I suspect you let him walk all over you (like making excuses as to why he kicked the farrier hard enough to send him flying.......:eek: ) and he's not the right horse for you, so selling and getting something more suitable may be the best idea. I prob wouldn't be sending him to a dealers though.

I am left thinking this really. Just because he is two does not mean that he should be walking all over you. Our foals walk politely on a rope, never pull for grass etc and that is just with minimal handling, we wouldn't expect any less of them. I get frustrated with those who seem to think that handling youngsters is easy and that they miraculously turn into nice people at 4 years old when you break them in. Some do but most don't and you just have to read the posts on here to see that.

As to what you do, it's up to you, either move to another yard if you want to keep him or if you feel that he is not right then sell. I had the 'autistic' comment from my YM about my neurotic Welsh D x TB, he was a box walking weaving mess and I persevered with him for 5 years before I admitted defeat and sold him back to his breeder, the one I bought after is an angel. In the end they were all right, I have no idea why I struggled on for so long with a horse who just didn't gel with me, inspite of all the trying.
 

AmyMay

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Reading between the lines it sounds like he's a rude, bad mannered brat who's rhino skinned and frustrating to work with. I know the exact kind of horse and can't stand them either. :eek:

I suspect you let him walk all over you (like making excuses as to why he kicked the farrier hard enough to send him flying.......:eek: ) and he's not the right horse for you, so selling and getting something more suitable may be the best idea. I prob wouldn't be sending him to a dealers though.

Must say, reading the opening post only - I came to the same conclusion.
 

Honey08

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Must say, reading the opening post only - I came to the same conclusion.

Me too.

It doesn't add up that both your yard owner and you mum have come to the conclusion that he is too much, while you're saying he is a dream to handle..

Also, from the other side, suggesting a friend who may buy him could be meant to help you - where else would you sell a difficult two year old...?

When I had DIYs we had one lady whose horse was a nightmare. It bullied other horses and ripped rugs. It kicked her and broke her arm when she was leading it. We got to the stage where we dreaded her at the yard as we felt one day we would find her badly injured. She could not see it as anythiing other than her baby and an angel. Having such a horse on DIY is stressful. I used to end up doing loads for her, or spending time consoling her when she was in tears.

I actually think this YO is on your mum's side, its just not what you want to hear.
 
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Patterdale

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Was just going to put and quote exactly what amymay said.

The YO will know the horse much better than you as she is the one that deals with it.
It's rubbish having to handle something every day that you dislike and feel is dangerous.

And as she's going to be losing a quarter of her livery income once he's gone I really can't see why she would be doing this maliciously.
 

AmyMay

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And persevering with the post, it would seem that yes, the regular handler is the groom or YO.

So, OP - if you and your mum want to prove the YO wrong, start dealing with and educating your youngster yourself.
 

Luci07

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And babies change so much and so quickly. My youngster was Mr Sharp and spooky on hacks when I first got him as he had done very little ( which I knew when I bought him ) so had to go out in company. Moving on and 5 months later I am hacking solo, with dog on a 5 year old who is totally chilled out and doesnt care about anything that comes flying out of the woods or near us. I have seen a lot of youngsters at our yard and they often seem to undergo numerous complete character changes when growing up. However, do agree that manners need to be taught from day one. A foal trying it on is not as dangerous as a large 3 year old , though they can still do a huge amount of damage.

I appreciate you are frustrated and maybe you should suggest selling the youngster privately, ask your mum to give you a little time to do so before resorting to the dealer. As for kicking out at the farrier, how does he react when you pick his feet out yourself?
 

I See Clover

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Agree with Goldenstar. It's also much harder to teach a horse manners if you only turn it out a few days a week, rather than if you do it daily.

But he isnt any bother turning out. This is what I am trying to say. He will happily stand while I put a rug on him, he donders out to the field no problem. He doesn't barge, bolt, pull. Nothing of the sort. In this respect he does have manners. He has improved a lot.
 

zaminda

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How big is this horse? I would say that a horse not being forward going doesn't always make it a plod, sometimes it is just being piggy. I have been on yards where people don't like my horses, but I never expect anyone else to deal with them, so it has never really been a problem. I would question whether the YO has visions of the problems this horse may cause further on down the line when he is bigger and stronger, and also if he is going to be suitable for your mum, who she obviously knows quite well. Generally I don't side with the YO, having come across a few who are downright crackers, and deeply unpleasant, but in this instance, I do wonder whether she may have your best interests at heart.
 

I See Clover

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I am left thinking this really. Just because he is two does not mean that he should be walking all over you. Our foals walk politely on a rope, never pull for grass etc and that is just with minimal handling, we wouldn't expect any less of them. I get frustrated with those who seem to think that handling youngsters is easy and that they miraculously turn into nice people at 4 years old when you break them in. Some do but most don't and you just have to read the posts on here to see that.

As to what you do, it's up to you, either move to another yard if you want to keep him or if you feel that he is not right then sell. I had the 'autistic' comment from my YM about my neurotic Welsh D x TB, he was a box walking weaving mess and I persevered with him for 5 years before I admitted defeat and sold him back to his breeder, the one I bought after is an angel. In the end they were all right, I have no idea why I struggled on for so long with a horse who just didn't gel with me, inspite of all the trying.


I said in my original post that he used to be like this. He does not do this anymore. He goes out no problem. We dont let him always things left, right and centre.
 

Archangel

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To be honest if I had to turn out a bolshy cobby 2 year old that pulled me all over the place and was a bit of a pain. It wouldn't be long before he was walking smartly to the field in an orderly manner, even if the owners allowed him a bit more leeway. However, being a YO doesn't automatically make you a good horseperson these days so maybe she isn't up to ironing out difficulties? What has she done to improve his behaviour (maybe it is yelling and pulling him about which is never going to work with a stoical cobby chap they just turn to wood).

Take a long hard look at your horse, is he rude? Look at when you ask him to do things. People often say "s/he has such a lovely temperament, loves being groomed and a fuss" This is passive stuff, of course the horse likes it! It is standing still, move over, stand quietly with farrier etc that counts. Take a look at that farrier incident and be honest with yourself. A rude bolshy cobby person is a pain in the neck but it is also sad if they are being handled roughly and inappropriately and not being educated properly.
 

I See Clover

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Me too.

It doesn't add up that both your yard owner and you mum have come to the conclusion that he is too much, while you're saying he is a dream to handle..

Also, from the other side, suggesting a friend who may buy him could be meant to help you - where else would you sell a difficult two year old...?

When I had DIYs we had one lady whose horse was a nightmare. It bullied other horses and ripped rugs. It kicked her and broke her arm when she was leading it. We got to the stage where we dreaded her at the yard as we felt one day we would find her badly injured. She could not see it as anythiing other than her baby and an angel. Having such a horse on DIY is stressful. I used to end up doing loads for her, or spending time consoling her when she was in tears.

I actually think this YO is on your mum's side, its just not what you want to hear.

My mum hasn't come to the same conclusion. She told me its due to money. And I have never said he is a dream to handle. He can be cheeky sometimes, but no more than most. I really disagree that he is a difficult two year old.
 

I See Clover

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My mum hasn't come to the same conclusion. She told me its due to money. And I have never said he is a dream to handle. He can be cheeky sometimes, but no more than most. I really disagree that he is a difficult two year old.

And persevering with the post, it would seem that yes, the regular handler is the groom or YO.

So, OP - if you and your mum want to prove the YO wrong, start dealing with and educating your youngster yourself.

This is untrue. The YO feeds him in the morning - that's it. The groom turns him out 2 or 3 mornings a week at the very most. He is on DIY livery and is looked after by my mum and myself. I turn him out on the other mornings and bring him in from the field and my mum does the rest. She does ground work with him and some long reining.
 

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I hate to say it, but this thread is just going round in circles - it's very difficult when advice is given, and it's all countered by the OP. And this is what's happening here.

This is a problem that needs to be resolved between you, your mum, and the YO. No-one on a forum can see the true facts, and therefore give the advice you need.

get round a table and sort this out between you, get a decision made, and stick with it.

sorry to be blunt, but this post could go on and on.
 

Maesfen

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That statement offends me to no end.

Why? If a person is autistic it's accepted as fact you don't beat about the bush and nobody is offended; there are some horses that earn that title too and this could be one of them (I'm not saying he is But it IS a possibility; not all horses are perfectly bright and normal.

OP, I'd be inclined to be a bit cynical of YO's motives myself but if you can't do anything about it it's a bit pointless worrying about it TBH.
 

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I have had two people leave because I did not want the horse on the yard. The first was acting like a rig and charging through fencing to go and beat up another geldng he had taken a disliking to. He was lovely with people but the owners of the other gelding that had been here far longer requested that I asked the other owner to leave as they were terrified their boy would get seriously hurt. Even though I had managed to double fence the new gelding successfully in, I asked the owner to move him for the sake of harmony on the yard.

The other horse was an ex racer who had the most incompetant owner I have ever come accross. Her awful handling of the horse (far too soft) was resulting in him becoming more and more dangerous to handle. I lost track of the number of times he was charging uncontrollably loose around the yard. She never rode or worked him in any way and just turned up to stroke him for two hours every day (no exaggeration). Then he started to rear up and box at people including me. He broke my finger, knocked me down, barged through me. I told her he needed a job and she either had to get him in regular work or I would not have him on the yard for another winter. She left soon afterwards and the new yard owner rang me up to ask what the hell this woman was doing with her horse! He said he feared he would seriously hurt him or a member of staff or other horse on the yard.

I have also refused to take on new liveries if I don't like the sound of their horse, even if I really like the people.
 
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Honey08

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My mum hasn't come to the same conclusion. She told me its due to money. And I have never said he is a dream to handle. He can be cheeky sometimes, but no more than most. I really disagree that he is a difficult two year old.

Well your story has changed then from how I read it -

You did say he was great to put rugs on and plods behind you to the field..

You also said that your mum thought that she was too old to handle a youngster, you never mentioned money before.. And if it is down to money, then of course she should sell him if she can't afford him!

You've got your YO and your blacksmith who would probably say he was a difficult youngster...
 

guido16

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He is bad, he isn't bad, he is a bit bad, he is a dream, he is a bit of a dream. God I am confused.

Your yard owner obviously has a reason for not liking him, probably the same reason your farrier has. I would have booted him from here till tomorrow if he was mine and kicked the farrier. NO EXCUSE AT ALL for that behaviour.

Bottom line, he is your mums horse and she can do what she wants.

Two options move yard and keep him or sell him and stay at yard.


Is he the first youngster you have had?
 

I See Clover

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Well your story has changed then from how I read it -

You did say he was great to put rugs on and plods behind you to the field..

You also said that your mum thought that she was too old to handle a youngster, you never mentioned money before.. And if it is down to money, then of course she should sell him if she can't afford him!

You've got your YO and your blacksmith who would probably say he was a difficult youngster...

And he does. That doesn't mean he is absolutely perfect. He can sometimes. E cheeky in other respects but not overly so.

Yes I did say that but I also said in my first reply (on page 1) that she told me it was due to money. Of course she should sell him if that's the case, but I don't think this is the real reason. I made this thread to vent out my frustration at the situation more than anything else.

The farrier undoubtedly thinks he is difficult and/or dangerous, but this is all he has ever done to warrant this. In my opinion for a horse to be deemed difficult and dangerous they would have to have done more than kick the farrier. I'm not saying it's acceptable but I wouldn't go as far as calling him dangerous either.
 

rodeo12

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Might be quite controversial but I wouldn't take her comments to heart. We all have traits associated with autism and it's often quite accurate to horses. . .

I've had one who lacks social skills - doesn't like to be in a group and you have to try and ride them alone.
I've had one who doesn't like change and gets highly stressed.
I've had some who take a lot longer to understand things and need it really clearly spelt out.
I've had horses who like routine, who lose it if their routine is spoilt.

All autistic traits!

But then I also compare my horse to a fat overweight drunk man, as he'd be the horse who would be sat in front of the tv drinking beer and eating pizza ALL NIGHT.

Don't think it was probably meant how it's been taken. Was saying to someone the other week how saw a picture of a horse looking really intelligent and then could imagine it falling over instantly, getting back up with a 'what the hell happened there' expression as he can be so dumb.

People aren't always going to get on with horses. I know I've had to handle some I dread and it's always a worry once they've done something as you don't want it to become a habit. And to be honest, sometimes you just don't want the hassle of dealing with it.

I honestly think you just have to accept your mum's decision. She's old enough to decide what's best and maybe it was the yard owner but maybe it wasn't. As the horse grows up she'll have got a sense of whether she likes it/whether they've bonded/whether they trust each other. If she was madly in love then she wouldn't be agreeing to selling and would look at other options first? There must be some doubts in there somewhere!
 
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