Young horse rearing over backwards...WWYD?

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It's notnoften I ask for advice, but when faced with a situation I don't have vast experience in, I will not hesitate to seek advice and opinions from others, so here goes.

Some of you will know that last Wednesday morning, my 4yr old WBxTB mare reared on the road, went over backwards and landed on me. I have broken my pelvis, T12 and as I found out today, possibly L1 and L2 as well. Also two small fractures in my foot.

I am extremely lucky. Despite being sent home from hospital with no pain killers, apparently no broken bones and f all advice, I am actually quite mobile. I am totally pain and discomfort free 98% of the time. Just feels like Molly is still on me doing a dance off for the occasional few seconds it does hurt. Still no advice from doctors, got to speak to them tomorrow, so...all in all, I am very lucky to be walking. I can move around fairly easily, just slowly. Been helping with the girls (Fly amd Molly), but not lifting or doing anything strenuous.

My difficulty is in figuring out what tondo now. Molly has been fantastic through the whole working/backing experience. I have backed and started literally hundreds of horses and ponies, so am well experienced and it has all been done very slowly and she has been happy with everything. She's been more than happy...since the first time I got on, I can stand her by any mounting block, stone, bench etc...and she will stand perfectly with zero contact on the mouth while i get on and will wait as long as I want, not walking until I ask. She has not cantered yet as I have been mainly hacking her out with nanny horses a couple of times a week. Very slow as she is still growing, but needs to do something as getting bored. All ground work is fine. She would go up occasionally during initial training...probably 5 times in total, never more than 3 ft off the ground and as a babyish reaction to something. Example being, she pulled towards the gate long reining and my inexperienced friend shooed her away waving her arms in the air...Molly got scared, didn't run, just went up, turned and looked at me all scared. All 5ish times have been similar fear and only in the first three weeks i had her. By mid March, it stopped, she hasn't put a foot wrong.

Last Wednesday, myself and two friends stood, mounted in the wide driveway of our yard, while the third friend locked the gate and got on. Lead horse, next to me and Molly didn't want to walk on as was more interested in friend mounting horse behind her after locking gate. Lead rider smacked lead horse with a hand shaped crop so made a really loud noise and...at the exact same time, the horse that was being mounted bit Molly on the rump, so hard it cut her. Molly spooked out into the road...no problem as we already knew the road was clear for a good long way. There was a car about 400yds away. Car stopped, I thanked them, asked Molly to turn and go back into driveway. She was almost back to driveway and stopped. Lead rider was being very apologetic for the noise, but I told her not to be silly and please just stand still while I walk Molly back in. Mollynstarted tonwalk again when lead horse swung bum around towards her...not intentionally, she was just fidgeting, but it was enough to make Molly go straight up. She did try to step back and save herself a couple of times, but was teetering long enough that I was thinking what a beautiful colour she was as I sent my hands around her neck to not pull her back. Unfortunately, she is a baby, she isn't well muscled or well balanced and she couldn't right herself. As soon as I realised my weight was going backwards, I pulled my arms out to the side to let myself fall and not have my weight pull her over the edge. This meant I had time during the fall to sort myself out. I instinctively curled into a ball but before I hit the road, I saw Molly falling backwards. I put my right leg down and shifted myself backwards as much as I could as she was coming to land on my head/chest. Next I realised she was coming straight, so thought about her withers, neck and head and I pulled the right rein quite hard, but i remember even then thinking not to yank it, lol. Anyway, this pulled her to her side, so I just curled up with my right side to the floor, in the recovery position. I believe I was on my right side as I pulled her to the right. I had been happy that landing didn't hurt too much, but just watched as she came down on my lower back, left hip and legs. She mercifully got straight up, hardly touching the road herself...her own feet were not even on the ground when she landed on me, i could see them all pointing towards the horses in the driveway, when I also Noticed lead rider (extremely good friend) was already off her horse and stood waiting for Molly to get up. Molly didn't catch me with her feet at all and I watched her wander off down the road spooked, but sound and soon caught by one of the other riders.

Now...I do not believe she meant to go over. I do believe she tried to save herself. She is completely sound. She was apparently a bit jumpy Wednesday and Thursday, but was fine with me when I went to see her and Fly on Friday.

I just read an old thread on here about this subject and it was very sobering. Despite my disbelief at how poorly I have been diagnosed and the total lack of advice from Drs...I consider myself to be extremely lucky not to be paralysed or dead. I have no concerns about riding again and TBH, no concerns about getting on Molly again, but...given that I have nobody close to me that is experienced with youngsters, I am hesitant to do more with her alone. I want someone with me, take her back to the recent beginning and have someone clued up there just in case she shows signs of planting again. She did plant for a minute before taking that step and then rearing when lead horse moved, so the plant may be a signal of her being overwhelmed.

So...given that I won't be riding for a bit (I guess the Drs will advise me at some point)...do you lot think I should send her for training to a local and extremely good and sensitive trainer. I will always be open and honest with anyone when it comes to safety, so they would know what happened, but I hate knowing that It won't be me doing that work.

WWYD? Take the training option and get on her in a few months probably but know I will have to undo some stuff that I may not like, or turn her away, wait and do it all myself, just much more slowly?

Thanks for reading such a long post...I WILL actually make and send out special cupcakes to anyone who wants...just PM where I need to send them...
 
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Massive apologies...iPad manager to screw with so much of that post...I also thought I had edited loads out, will sort in the morning. X
 
I personally think that it was just one of those things - and just because she has reared once doesn't mean that she will do so again.

However, you will be out of the saddle for some time, and will not be riding fit once you are able to ride again, so personally I would send Molly away somewhere to continue her education slowly.

Hope you get better soon
 
But equally when your ready to get back on do you want a fit you gster? I'd get trainer to ride her for a couple of weeks to move on past this incident and then turn away. Sounds like a freak accident
 
I would send her away. Went through a similar thing recently myself, ran into troubles breaking a horse and came off. I too am v experienced breaking so it was a bit galling paying someone else to do a job I know I can do, but I just thought, I've got nothing to prove to anyone so I just swallowed my pride and off he went.
This was 6 weeks ago and he's now going brilliantly, the issue (bolting) has been completely ironed out and I'm bringing him home this week. I'm so glad I made the decision.

Out of interest :) how do you know you've broken anything if the drs say you haven't? I had a bad fall a few years ago where I was convinced I'd broken ribs but they said no, so just wondering!
 
I would send her away for a short while, get her hacking out nicely and then turn her out. Then maybe consider sending her away just before you are ready to go again.
Also as for your injuries I would be complaining as for your GP to have to diagnose what the consultant missed is pretty bad.
 
Now that she's gone over you may find that she's shook herself up and won't go up again but I'd still send her away for someone to keep ticking over for a while.
Patterdale I believe op's GP spotted the quite obvious breaks on the Xrays when she went for pain relief.
 
I'm sorry no real advice other than to say I'd agree with the others it was one of those things- and I'd not nesseserily class her as a rearer. It was her reaction to an event and she wasn't strong enough to deal with it.
The reason I'm replying is to say how horrified I am that you were sent home with fractures you can see yourself?! That's madness. Did you ask for a second opinion?
I'm assuming by the fact your mobile they are not severe fractures but please be so careful and even if your not in agony rest up as much as possible to allow time to heal properly.
I hope you have a speedy recovery x
 
When I first started reading this thread my heart was in my mouth and I was thinking how I would never get back on a horse that did that!

Reading on changed my mind and I agree that it sounds like she didn't mean to go over at all. She probably scared herself more then you and chances are she won't do it again.

I was going to suggest the same as rebles. Send her away now for a short while just to get her confidence back/finish on a good note and then turn her away until you can ride.

I hope you get some answers soon from the doctors so you can put a plan into action. Wishing you a speedy recovery!

Ps. I wouldn't say no to some cupcakes :p :o
 
Given that it was outside stimuli that caused her to rear, I suspect she frightenend herself going over and won't ever try it again. I had a perpetual rearer who did it because she napped, and the worst thing was she was athletic enough to go to the point of balance and never ever went over, so she knew she could (and because it was napping I got a window of warning in which to spin her tight before she went up and that was enough of an aversive for her to give it up). Could you find someone to ride her the first couple of times just in case?
 
I think I would send her away to the kind and sensitive trainer too - not because you can't do it, and not because your horse can't do it but because you have both got a big negative picture in your head now. You won't be able to ride for some time and so another trainer can delete/dilute that picture for your horse and, when your horse gets back, she'll be beyond the stage that you had reached and you can delete/dilute the picture in your head by watching her being ridden by the other trainer.

I don't think she is a 'rearer' as such although going up a little bit does seem to be her default position - she just went too high this time and overbalanced. Horrible bad luck.
 
Having had a broken pelvis from the same type of incident I initially had a real lack of confidence with anything that reared - still do, really.
She may well not do it again. There was always the "old school" experts who would advise pulling over a rearer, in long reins, in certain circumstances. I witnessed this myself when I was sixteen, and true, the mare never did go up again - although I do not recommend this to anyone reading!
She sounds a baby, not naughty. I'd either turn her away to mature, or send her to a professional to bring on.
Speedy recovery wishes:)
 
Patterdale said:
I would send her away. Went through a similar thing recently myself, ran into troubles breaking a horse and came off. I too am v experienced breaking so it was a bit galling paying someone else to do a job I know I can do, but I just thought, I've got nothing to prove to anyone so I just swallowed my pride and off he went.
This was 6 weeks ago and he's now going brilliantly, the issue (bolting) has been completely ironed out and I'm bringing him home this week. I'm so glad I made the decision.

Out of interest :) how do you know you've broken anything if the drs say you haven't? I had a bad fall a few years ago where I was convinced I'd broken ribs but they said no, so just wondering!
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Sent home from A&E with just a goodbye. Went to GP on Thursday pm as having severe pain higher up in back when trying to lie down and she looked up notes. Radiologist notes said break in right pelvis. It is a significant crack, but a stable one. She sent me for thoracic and ankle x rays and results were phoned to me by on call GP on Saturday morning. I too have nothing to prove to anyone...they'll have an opinion whatever I do so I gave up being bothered by that years ago :-)

3Beasties said:
When I first started reading this thread my heart was in my mouth and I was thinking how I would never get back on a horse that did that!

Reading on changed my mind and I agree that it sounds like she didn't mean to go over at all. She probably scared herself more then you and chances are she won't do it again.

I was going to suggest the same as rebles. Send her away now for a short while just to get her confidence back/finish on a good note and then turn her away until you can ride.

I hope you get some answers soon from the doctors so you can put a plan into action. Wishing you a speedy recovery!

Ps. I wouldn't say no to some cupcakes :p :o
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I will actually send you some if you pm your address, lol. I have nothing else to do at the moment. :D

Thank you everyone for reading that epic post. I wanted to detail it out to give a true description of what Molly did and that no, I don't believe she meant to go over, i just have the emotional attachment and usually I make decisions like this with no problem, but for some reason, I want her home with me on the sofa having cuddles, not out working, lol.

I am however liking the idea of a few weeks training, turn away for a few months then I'll maybe send her back for a fortnight before taking heron again myself.

I'm no wuss, but I'm not fearless either. I lost that when I had a few years away from horses so I will ride difficult horses, but not outright dangerous ones. I don't think for a second that Molly is dangerous, but the last thing we need with other family illness at the moment is me laid up in hospital.

Thanks for the responses xxx
 
Yes I would send her away, and keep a close eye on what the trainer is doing with her as you'll have lots of time on your hands to enjoy watching her progress while you recover :)

Has GP referred you to a consultant at all? Mr be worth asking for that, as a decent (!) consultant will help you with recovery time etc, and get referred for physio at the right time too.

Also will you get the mare checked over too (please)? Glad that she appears to be okay but when a rider gets on again they may trigger a back spasm or even affect a hairline crack on a broken spinious process that doesn't worry her at all while she is riderless - the last thing you want is for a painful experience for her next time she is ridden.
 
It does sound like it was an accident but I would be very careful. I would get physio/chiro to check her over and then i would also send her away. When I cracked my pelvis I was advised not to ride for 10-12 weeks.
 
I'd send her to someone so she can crack on whilst you recover. I doubt she meant a damn thing by it, she probably thought she was about to get bitten again but it won't do her any favours to be put down for three months without a few nice, happy rides first and I guess you aren't going to be able to ride for a little while yet..

I hope it doesn't turn into a big deal, my horse did it to me (nothing really meant by it, she was just confused by life!) but I can't move past it despite her being good for ages now and I am having to sell :(
 
I agree with the others - bet she wont try that again soon but I see where you're coming from - it knocks you a bit doesnt it ...

I had an ex racer who would out of the blue bolt but rearing and bucking as he went ... as a confident rider - it knocked me I couldnt sort him out ... I ended up in hospital :(

I'd send him away but go and watch them ... then turn away again and perhaps as someone suggested send him back two weeks before you're ready to ride again??

Pink cupcake for me????? ;):D

xxx
 
I'm sorry to hear of your incident - glad you're not in too much pain though :). If she was mine I think I'd just turn her away for a couple of months, just because I wouldn't want anyone else to be involved with a horse intended to be mine at this stage in their training (whereas if it was a client's horse or a horse I intended to sell in the longer term I would send definitely send it to someone else if I was injured). But I do like the idea of sending her away for a bit and then turning her away until you're ready to ride again.
Good luck with her, from your description it sounds like she is actually quite sweet and was turning into a lovely horse before this setback - horses eh. :)
 
But as I'm reading it wasn't one time she reared up. With you on board maybe. But you said she's done it other times in the starting process. So this seems her go to response when in a sticky situation.

You know what your at. You know from the many other horses you've started this just isn't normal. Part of starting and then riding is the different situations and yes pressures they must deal with. I like you have started hundreds of horses so a rearer before riding to me is cause for concern. Could be physical, could be how they choose to deal with pressure. I know typing this people are thinking me a nutbag. I'm not a good explainer. Yup she may have scared herself. She may be fine hacking and doing her arena work. But she may meet a situation she's not comfortable with and she may go over again. You don't know. I'm also in the camp of never be too proud to send away. To a good person obviously. Like all riders I have strengths but I also have weaknesses and I don't for one second think I can be all for every horse that crosses my path.

If she was mine I would also think a vet exam with a specialist in lameness and nuero would be a good idea. I had one with a pretty severe head injury as a foal. I can't tell you how many times I've had her examined just in case. She has never reared though. Well under saddle. Quite happy being big scary reary mare to her field mates.

Hope you're feeling better.

Terri
 
Yes I'd agree with the people who have said send away then end on a nice note to turn away for a while. Hopefully the fact she went over will have stopped her from ever doing it again.

I was speaking to a real old fashioned (brilliant) horseman recently and he said he has given up riding as he's too old for it now. He'd been out on a stallion that he'd got from the meat man as it kept rearing and thought, right boy I'll sort you and he pulled him over :eek: fracturing lots of his own bones and breaking his hip! The horse didn't rear again tho :o

I did feel like saying he is probably not too old to ride horses in a normal manner then just to avoid pulling rearing stallions on top of himself :eek::eek:
 
It's amazing just how much thinking you pack into these split second frightening and dangerous episodes, isn't it?

I remember teetering backwards for what seemed like an eternity on a WB mare at my yard. All I remember thinking what '*****, I'm coming down backwards on the arena fence and she's coming down right on top of me.' :( I still to this day will never know how the mare managed to right herself. We were both very lucky and survived totally unscathed and still united. It turned out she was suffering from gastric ulcers. Vets had spent £8k trying to find out what was wrong with her, and as she went well for their staff, and it was only her owner and myself that had problems, they came to the conclusion that she was just being nappy. The rear came after I decided to have no more nonsense and sort her out. I rode her firmly into her scary corner. She tried to nap but I gave her no way out, so she came up. Never done it before or since. We had her scoped for ulcers and she was found to have them. Once treated, the napping stopped completely. But never will I push her again. I will listen to her and not the vets!

You have been incredibly brave. I am not sure I would want to get back on Molly if I were in your shoes. I agree with others who say she probably won't do it again, but I would be seriously spooked by what you have been through.
 
Molly will get a full check over by experienced equine vet in a couple of weeks when she has her shots as I had to restart her vaccs so yes, she will get a full MOT, just not calling for it now as I want to be there and I rely on Dan for driving me.

I have watched her in the field, rolling, playing, trotting and cantering. I am lucky in that I didn't hit my head on the floor and I watched her body through the whole thing, couldn't take my eyes off her. I was on my side and her saddle hit my hip, she was kind of curled upwards, so neither her shoulder, rump or any part of her hit the tarmac...just her legs as she for up but they were thoroughly checked. If she had hit the road herself or I wasn't sure, a vet would have been called that afternoon as normally with this kind of thing I would be very concerned about her back, ribs, neck etc.

Yes, I do believe her going up is a default response to stress, but she is a four year old who, until February had had zero discipline...just fussed over in a field, so still acted like a yearling in every way, hence her starting being taken so very slowly. An average four year old that had been well handled rearing would be a concern for me as they should have grown out of it...but she never got that training as a baby.
 
Wagtail said:
It's amazing just how much thinking you pack into these split second frightening and dangerous episodes, isn't it?

I remember teetering backwards for what seemed like an eternity on a WB mare at my yard. All I remember thinking what '*****, I'm coming down backwards on the arena fence and she's coming down right on top of me.' :( I still to this day will never know how the mare managed to right herself. We were both very lucky and survived totally unscathed and still united. It turned out she was suffering from gastric ulcers. Vets had spent £8k trying to find out what was wrong with her, and as she went well for their staff, and it was only her owner and myself that had problems, they came to the conclusion that she was just being nappy. The rear came after I decided to have no more nonsense and sort her out. I rode her firmly into her scary corner. She tried to nap but I gave her no way out, so she came up. Never done it before or since. We had her scoped for ulcers and she was found to have them. Once treated, the napping stopped completely. But never will I push her again. I will listen to her and not the vets!

You have been incredibly brave. I am not sure I would want to get back on Molly if I were in your shoes. I agree with others who say she probably won't do it again, but I would be seriously spooked by what you have been through.
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I probably will be in time. Reading through the old thread last night and hearing how many people have been paralysed or worse was very sobering. Dan wants me to get back on her when I am ready, but to then possibly sell her when I believe she is safe. He loves her to pieces, but doesn't know if he'll ever be happy with me riding her. We shall see. She will go for training I think, then have some time off, then as I said, perhaps have another couple of weeks before I do get back on.

Will be speaking to Dr this morning and will have a fair few things to say...including a medical receptionist telling me to lie flat on my back if my leg goes numb...OK...because that works with a broken back I can't even touch! So much for not giving medical advice, lol.
 
I'm only saying these things because you know what you're doing. And sometimes no matter how good we are it's hard to be objective. I include myself in this category. I get horses and ponies that get a headcollar on in a cattle chute and run up into the horsebox to come to me. They haven't got a clue either. I'd still be concerned if I saw rearing in sticky situations.

Best of luck and please know I'm not trying to be a smart mouth. I'm not very objective in my own situations sometimes.

Terri
 
Equilibrium Ireland said:
I'm only saying these things because you know what you're doing. And sometimes no matter how good we are it's hard to be objective. I include myself in this category. I get horses and ponies that get a headcollar on in a cattle chute and run up into the horsebox to come to me. They haven't got a clue either. I'd still be concerned if I saw rearing in sticky situations.

Best of luck and please know I'm not trying to be a smart mouth. I'm not very objective in my own situations sometimes.

Terri
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If I thought I knew it all, I wouldn't have posted the thread. As said in OP...I am not afraid to ask when I am not sure and my emotional attachment means I welcome outside perspectives.

The day we think we know it all, we should pack it in and walk away IMO.

Thanks...I know exactly what you are saying. Only time will tell I guess. :-) X
 
You have been through a very traumatic incident OP and you need to put yourself first now. I'm sure Molly will cope if she is turned away for a few months or sent to a sensitive trainer. You've probably got a few 'what ifs' flying through your thoughts at the moment and you must give yourself time to deal with these as you heal. Agree with Terry, some horses seem naturally to evade or react to fear by rearing just as others will plant or buck or bolt. I don't think any horse plans to go over backwards but it's probably one of the worst scenarios when it does happen. Molly sounds as though she is very well looked after so concentrate on yourself now and get well :)
 
doriangrey said:
You have been through a very traumatic incident OP and you need to put yourself first now. I'm sure Molly will cope if she is turned away for a few months or sent to a sensitive trainer. You've probably got a few 'what ifs' flying through your thoughts at the moment and you must give yourself time to deal with these as you heal. Agree with Terry, some horses seem naturally to evade or react to fear by rearing just as others will plant or buck or bolt. I don't think any horse plans to go over backwards but it's probably one of the worst scenarios when it does happen. Molly sounds as though she is very well looked after so concentrate on yourself now and get well :)
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I read thinking, "******, that's precisely what I would say if I wasn't the OP" lol.

Wise words from all of you. Thank you x
 
I also agree with Terri. I would send to another trainer for a few weeks and then turn away, as I would worry that this horse's default reaction to stress or pressure is standing up on two legs. Another horse dancing around and swinging its bum towards her won't be the scariest thing she'll ever encounter. What happens when you're on a hack and you meet llamas, out of control dogs, hot air balloons, rattling tractors, hang gliders, burnt out cars, screeching children on bicycles, etc.? Or when the horse in front of you gets spooked and whirls around into you?

Because I am a chicken about such things (and certainly would be even more so if the horse fell on top of me), I would pay someone else to fix that.

Do I get cupcakes? :D
 
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