Your Horse/ILPH quote re Fat Farms

  • Thread starter Thread starter Donkeymad
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You're obviously not the horse lovers you pretend to be, they're not a comodity that you can disregard when you've finished with them. they have every right to a life.

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How old are you?
Your looking at this very black and white, NOTHING ever is.

What exactly makes a horse different form a cow/pig/sheep/rabbit?
Why is it disgusting to eat horse but perfectly OK to eat other animals?
If your only reason is "they are cute/pets" then sorry but bog off-rabs/sheep and pigs are also kept as pets.

Everyone here cares about horses and their wellfare(which is why so many of us donate to the ILPH), we are just mature enough to see that beeding them for slaughter isnt an evil thing to do.
What needs to change is the conditions the horses are kept in and how they are treated.
Buying one horse from the meat man and giving it a lovely home doesnt help the hundreds of others out there going to slaughter.
 
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How old are you?


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That's what crossed my mind too, bless her. I am sure we all felt like Chip when we were little children. As children we aren't able to see the bigger picture whereas adults the picture is more clear.
 
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How old are you?


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That's what crossed my mind too, bless her. I am sure we all felt like Chip when we were little children. As children we aren't able to see the bigger picture whereas adults the picture is more clear.

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Sure we were!
Would be nice to be a teen and out to save the world again at times.
Quite sad when you find out yes, one person can make a diference but only as part of a bloody large group.
 
WHAT!!!!!
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No easter bunny.......
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No SANTA
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That's it, sod the horses, the campaign to bring back Santa starts HERE!!!




*can'tbring backwhatneverwas- sigh*
 
Santa does exist!!
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I know cos my Dad told me so
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Next time I go to the supermarket, Ill take the camera with me. Laid out at the meat counter are various cuts of horse meat-its incredibly dark red in colour and has no fat running through it. They do all sorts of cuts and things-there are horse hamburgers, foal fillets, mince, stew and salami,. Ive never seen horse liver or kidneys though
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, wonder why!
 
Do you think that if we aways had various cuts of horse meat on display in butchers here in the UK, that, in time,'we' would get over our prejudice and accept it as we accept beef etc?
 
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I'd say yes.

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so do I.....



and chip......don't take ANY notice of those nasty ladies...there IS a Santa....honest.....
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What needs to change is the conditions the horses are kept in and how they are treated.
Buying one horse from the meat man and giving it a lovely home doesnt help the hundreds of others out there going to slaughter.

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Completely agree with your first sentence which is the number one concern we should all have no matter what the animal.

BUT what we buy, where we buy it from and what equine we choose to buy with our own pennies is a matter of personal choice. Do you really think if you buy one horse from a fat farm in France you are perpetuating the trade any more than someone who buys a New Forest foal to bring on? Or someone who goes to a mart and buys some skinny Arab mare who the local meat man was bidding on because they felt some compassion? I don't think it makes a zot of difference how far up the line the horse was before cash is handed over. A lot of people take on sorry cases and part with their cash and plenty of those horses or ponies would and could have ended up for slaughter

We all care about welfare and humane treatment and THAT is what compels people to buy some poor rake of a horse, some meat horses can be bloody good horses!
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My sentiments exactly
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I was thinking about this post earlier whilst watching tv with my springer asleep on my lap. my partner and i have sometimes talked of getting another dog. Would i go to the rescue centre and think- on no, theres no point because i can only take one dog home -and thats not helping the others so i wont bother?
As boudicea says, its down to personal choice. its as simple as that.
 
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Can I congratulate everyone on not getting heated this time round. The whole problem is massive and finding a solution is such a big problem.

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Very credible comment as you say this is a serious topic and then.........
 
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No SANTA
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That's it, sod the horses, the campaign to bring back Santa starts HERE!!!

*can'tbring backwhatneverwas- sigh*

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Donkeymad, here's an example of exactly what happens on some of these farms in France. This donkey had no treatment from the injury onset until he disappeared. I have no idea how he coped with the pain and blood loss and survived. I expect it would have been better had for him had he bled to death. The ownere doesn't give a toss either way. I don't know whether or not you imagine the fat farms are all nicely fenced and the animals checked and fed regularly. This particular field is full of deathtraps, wire etc, the farmer was reported and nothing was done. I really don't want to inflame this thread, but I get the impression you don't really have any understanding of what it is actually like being on the ground here in France. I suppose at least your post is keeping the subject alive, but I get the impression you are still pointscoring, not really trying very hard to bring to people's attention the meat trade. If I'm wrong, I apologise, but you seem only able to contribute with sarcasm, as if somehow people removing a horse or pony from circumstances such as this, is a terrible act.
This donkey was reported to the SPA, the gendarmes and the mairie. No action was taken for several days, in the interim the owner heard, he removed the donkey and we have no idea what happened to him.

This is not pretty to look at.

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This is not an isolated case.
 
All the rubbish that is lying around in the fields, wire, traps, old machinery. We think he got his foot caught and just eventually somehow, I can't quite bear to think how, pulled free.
 
EMW Sanctuaries were alerted to this awful case. We did our utmost to try to get something done, including contacting the ILPH, but as has already been said, getting authorities to act, especially outside of our own country, is a hard task. The fate of this oor donkey will never be known but death can only have been a release.
emw.
 
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Ive never seen horse liver or kidneys though
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, wonder why!

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Horse liver and kidneys accumulate cadmium which is highly toxic and so those organs are not generally used for human consumption.
 
Hi, i have seen this before, it really does bring the reality home.
It is sickening-without a doubt there is nothing remotely funny about it.
I don't think the plight of these horses is fully appreciated so big thankyou for the post
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What needs to change is the conditions the horses are kept in and how they are treated.
Buying one horse from the meat man and giving it a lovely home doesnt help the hundreds of others out there going to slaughter.

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Completely agree with your first sentence which is the number one concern we should all have no matter what the animal.

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*Nods*

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BUT what we buy, where we buy it from and what equine we choose to buy with our own pennies is a matter of personal choice.

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Of course!
Have said it before in another thread on the topic, anyone that has bought a horse form the meat man,best of luck and I hope you and your horse have a fab life together.
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Do you really think if you buy one horse from a fat farm in France you are perpetuating the trade any more than someone who buys a New Forest foal to bring on? Or someone who goes to a mart and buys some skinny Arab mare who the local meat man was bidding on because they felt some compassion? I don't think it makes a zot of difference how far up the line the horse was before cash is handed over. A lot of people take on sorry cases and part with their cash and plenty of those horses or ponies would and could have ended up for slaughter

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Yes.
A horse at a fat farm is going for slaughter.A horse at the sales isnt but may end up there-big difference IMO.
Like I have said before, we ALL want to help every single one of these horses,we just go about it in different ways.


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We all care about welfare and humane treatment and THAT is what compels people to buy some poor rake of a horse, some meat horses can be bloody good horses!
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Very true, horses end up there for all sorts of reasons.
Trouble is, you dont know the good from bad untill you have them home.
 
Thats what I thought-horse meat raised in Poland is wicked-its so full of heavy metals that it glows in the dark!!!
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. The Italians really believe that its 'the best' and fill their children with it! How daft can you get-beef aint much different here either
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Blueberry and gonetofrance, being serious does not mean that I cannot respond in jest, to somebody elses comment.

Gonetofrance, I have NEVER tried to point score. If you have bothered to read any of my posts before, then you will know that I have said that, to those who have rescued a horse, well done and good luck. However, I have, and will continue, to point out that, in my - and many other peoples opinion - we must support the ILPH in their campaign, this is the priority.
The fact that this donkey is injured does not detract from the fact that, by removing it, by whatever means, you are simply creating space for another equine to be subjected to the non-care this donkey received. I would also point out that it does not need to be a fattening farm for this sort of thing to happen. Take a look at the Donkey Sanctuary website and follow some of their links to how working donkeys are treated in some countries, see the horrific injuries they suffer and still have to work, through immense pain etc. Go check out some gypsey horses, those that are not cared for.

Now, both of you, go back to my OP and re-read it. I have, and always will, support the ILPH in their Hook not Hoof campaign.
 
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The fact that this donkey is injured does not detract from the fact that, by removing it, by whatever means, you are simply creating space for another equine to be subjected to the non-care this donkey received.

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I quoted you because on this and other threads you have appeared to be sarcastic and derisory of what is essentially welfare. What you see and read on a screen bears no testament to the reality of what hits in the face in the actuality.
You suggest that no horses/donkeys for any reason should be removed from the meat chain because that is just fuelling it? NOTHING is black and white. Would you have had us just ignore that donkey? I cannot quite believe that you consider it acceptable to ignore such suffering. I don't imagine for a second any ILPH field officer seeing that in the UK would walk away having made a decision to leave it in case alleviating it's suffering fuelled the meat trade. Sadly, we didn't remove it in time. I hope he had it shot.
I really do feel that in the looking at the bigger picture, it is still important to keep sight of the little one that inspired it. I am not and never have suggested buying up all meat horses, but you must have a degree of debt to poor sods like that donkey.
We are supporting the ILPH. We are in discussion about the possibility of affiliation to them, as they cannot act in France. I am fully aware of what the ILPH do, and have been for the last 20 years. Many of my friends work/have worked for them, I know the unpublicised horrors. I have raised money for them in the past and am about to do so again. I'm really not sure why you seem to think that your knowledge is more significant than mine, or anyone else who is out her seeing the reality of the fat farms and the sheer F***ing neglect that exists.

If I sound aggressive then, I'm sorry, it is frustration. I needed to say what I said. In my defence, I have spent a lot of today trying to get the French Welfare Laws on animal welfare translated into English so that we know where we stand when dealing with stuff like this. The SPA, France's version of the RSPCA, has NO available field officers. It's not that that wouldn't like to send them, they have none. So the laws as I understand them are in place, just nobody to enforce them.
But we are trying.
 
I'm sorry, but you seem to be deliberatly ignoring part of my posts. The bit where I say, and for your benefit, I quote

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If you have bothered to read any of my posts before, then you will know that I have said that, to those who have rescued a horse, well done and good luck.

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Does this say nobody should rehome them? No, absolutely not. If anybody wants to rehome them, that is up to them. My friend has one. I respect these people for doing what they think is right, and saving any life is right.

'Look at the wider picture' is what some people are saying. The wider picture is that we need to help ALL the horses, not a select few.

I now find myself getting into a postion where, for the first time, and against an earlier post of mine, things are starting to get heated. For this I apologise.
 
Boudicea!
You will probably be surprised to hear from me as last time I was all on the side of rescue. I screamed and raged and went at it full bore (I'm a Scorpio, what can you expect, and a bolshy American to boot), but since being inside just such a rescue operation for only a few weeks I opened my eyes plenty. One does not save a horse by dragging it long distances in the other direction and stressing it even more. I will say no more on that issue.
I don't know what I was thinking, I honestly don't. I have fought puppymills in the USA for 50 years. Why I didn't see your point is well...just plain stupid. I stumbled into the French long distance transport for slaughter arguement by accident. I was looking for a cheapish thoroughbred, as I love the breed, can handle their sometimes difficult ways, but am not loaded. I had no knowledge of the auctions here, I knew what was happening to the TBs that just couldn't go fast enough. I just didn't know how to find them. Would have helped if I had just posted what I was looking for on here, but I am old and it didn't cross my mind! What the heck are we doing cleaning up the French problem when there are healthy horses being killed right here? I would dearly love to give a secure happy home to a thoroughbred, even an aged one, that needs one rather than see it shot. I just didn't realize I could find one right here.
I am against the long distance shipping of horses to slaughter and support the ILPH in their quest to do something about it. But I will not do it, personally (if anyone else does, that's up to them) as long as their are horses here in just as much danger.
And if it is happening here, a place I long had imagined loved horses and dogs more than life (which is one reason I wanted to live here!) we have to start right here with getting the overbreeding stopped.
I can see only one problem that is a major one in the comparison to dog breeding. A bitch can easily be spayed, not so a mare. Stallions and colts can be gelded, but too many think that they have the next Secretariat and don't bother and think they can make some cash on stud fees.
The ILPH and other rescue organizations who loan out mares do so with no knowledge as to if or when one would be bred, do they?
I do not see the RSPCA doing much when they come across horses in obviously horrendous conditions. They post notes and diddle around for days while the poor animals suffer just because they have to "get it right" in case of prosecution. What drivel! They do the same with dogs, cats and execute loads weekly because the compost helps pay their salaries.
Well, this is one person who shall go on coaching in dressage and will perhaps be seen hanging over the rail watching at disgustingly awful sales hoping to save just one British horse to be my last horse in my old age.
Think that makes more sense. To me. No one has to agree, here, but thanks Boudicea for making me see sense.
Suzi
 
I personally think there is a huge difference in a horse being travelled to its death (if it does not die on the way) for several days in inhumane conditions with no consideration for the horses welfare as oppose to being considerately and professionally travelled with rest/food and water in an air conditioned 5 star luxury horsebox....to pastures new.... where may i add great care and attention is taken to limit any stress to the horse.

I am realistic enough to accept that caution needs to be taken in respect of french farmers who may exploit sympathising individuals. this is a situation to be avoided.
 
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