Your Horse/ILPH quote re Fat Farms

[blueberry]

http://www.unitedpegasus.com/PMUranch1main.htm

The above link takes you to a rescue site in Canada. I was impressed to see that potential adoptees have to fill in a detailed application form and provide a vet reference before being considered to purchase a horse to adopt.

It would be a useful template for other rescue groups maybe?

Its truly awful what happens to these mares and foals.

 

[Gonetofrance]

It is horrible.....there is this one as well...........

http://www.pmurescue.org/

The more you look the more you find..........jeez........

I still can't find a reference to a European set up, just that the carcasses are shipped to Europe......

 

[Tia]

QR -

Welll thankfully, due to heavy pressure on the Canadian Govt, by regular people like me petitioning againt PMU, most of the ranches have had their contracts cancelled and none of the existing ones are being renewed once the contract time is up.

This didn't bother the PMU companies as from what I have been able to find out, they simply moved location from Canada to Europe.

I have only been able to find minimal information of the PMU organisations in Eastern Europe. I don't know whether this is because of language barriers or because it is a bit of an underworld type of business.

Some kind people did PM me with information but not enough to get anywhere because it is all being swept under the carpet and hushed up and they aren't allowed to talk about it.

My gripe is why are none of the horse charities in England mentioning this happening? They are the ones with the clout to actually go over there and find out exactly what is going on....but they aren't.

 

[JM07]

Tia...maybe us over here should email the ILPH and ask if they know of it..and if so, what can be done..if nothing is ongoing ATM??

Another thing is..if women of a certain age REFUSED treatment if the drugs that contained PMU and took alternatives, surely that would help too??

so come on girls..as there are a fair few of us on here

GET BEHIND THIS ISSUE AND GET THESE PLACES SHUT DOWN

 

[spaniel]

Hear hear, there is no excuse to blindly accept PMU derived drugs from your GP anymore.

 

[MilkyHill]

Couldn't agree more JM07 My mother was offered it a few years ago and I thought she was going to rip the doc's heart out for suggesting it! Unfortunately a lot of women don't care enough and are too wrapped up in their own needs

 

[Suzibn]

I was an old lady once, now an older one, and refused treatment when the time came because I knew about the horses in the PMU places. Hot flashes are a small price to pay to put these places out of business. Have been to them in South Dakota where at that time, foals were simply thrown out in the snow (sub -50f temps) to die as they were a byproduct.
I used to be quite an activist, but have slowed down because of the huge amount that seems to be piling up with no solutions in site.
Truly disgusting.
Bodecia (sp. American, know who she was, just can't see how you spell it on wrong page lol) glad to see you are posting.
As to what we can do, we can do what California did when overpopulation of dogs became such a problem. You license breeders. You are allowed one litter a year, and those who break the rules are fined SEVERELY. You have to pay a fee and register to breed a litter there. A lot of the big time breeders went a bit crazy there for a while. Especially those with toy breeds that could only have one or two pups in a litter compared to say greyhounds who can have up to 15, but the law stayed put. Volunteers went out and checked posing as puppy buyers and if there were records that the person advertising said pups didn't have a liscence then their dogs were seized. It sure stopped the problem in it's tracks.
Now look. Some of you will say, but my mare is 20 and I want one more foal from her. Okay, pay a license fee or give the poor old girl a break and go buy one that has already been produced.
I firmly agree in the MOST with what Bodecea said about checking where these rescue horses go. That is sooo important. No use rescuing something that is going to be abused and end up back in a sale ring and on to Italy in the end.
I have Canadian friends will see what they have to say. Also you could check with ERF and see what they know about the PMU mares and foals.
Love ya all
Suzi

 

[Tia]

Well I think the very best thing that could have happened (although with sad consequences for some) was the highlighting of PMU HRT causing cancer and other conditions in woman using them. This momentarily informed many ladies of the options of using synthetic HRT instead.

I have told everyone and I still tell everyone about what natural HRT is. My mother, when she was going through this, was given natural HRT - I was aghast and told her everything about it; even sent her some photos and information - she immediately came off it!

I have no idea how to go about getting the European operations brought to the forefront I'm afraid. It was easy over here in Canada as there was already a massive petition ongoing and I just jumped on the bandwagon. The trouble, as I can see it, is that no-one is talking about it over in Europe....or at least the small few who are, are talking about it very discreetly.

 

[Suzibn]

I am going to post this as a new thread but want to share this with you all first, as I know those who post here want more than anything to help horses one way or the other.
This link will take you to a very informative document with 20 questions and answers (R is rebuttal of information provided my the vet association) about horse slaughter for human consumption.
It will open your eyes...do you know that bute is a carcinogen? I didn't. Did you realize that a race horse or competition horse can go from being alive to being processed for food in less than a day? I didn't. Do you know that certain testing was stopped when it was found that 1 out of 8 horses tested were positive for antibiotics or bute?
Maybe we should all read this and pass it on to our European brothers and sisters that insist that eating horse meat is just great. Anyone want to post this to our famous chef?

http//:texashorsetalk.com/AVMA%20Questions and %20Answers.pdf

You smart ones out there, let's figure out how to get this info to a larger group of folk in Europe! It's a long read, but very very informative.
Love ya
Suzi

 

[Donkeymad]

QR

Do you mind if I bring in another abhorrent system? The practice of Donkey Milk Farms. I know that there are also horse milk farms but, as yet, have not looked into them - but will. Last week donkey milk farms were brought to our attention when a man who is a renovator of some kind, joined the DBS Forum board for advice on DMF's. He has o.85 acres on which he wishes to keep in excess of 100 donkey mares, from which he will breed foals, in order to milk the jennies. The milk is to be used for premature babies and cosmetics. The care of the donkeys and the resulting foals remains a bit of a mystery, but there will be little if any care for these mares, as the area in Greece has little in the way of vets, let alone knowledgable donkey vets.
This may be a far cry from the origins of this thread, but is yet another way in which our beloved equines suffer abuse for/from mankind (minus the kind!!)

 

[Suzibn]

Sorry didn't get the link right...tired. Lots of things going on in the horse rescue business today.

http://www.texashorsetalk.com/AVMA%20Questionsand%20Answers

 

[Tia]

Yes absolutely. I think we should highlight all of these things. What a heartless world we live in...poor little donkeys

.

 

[Tia]

Yes I knew those things but I would be interested in looking at your link; sadly it doesn't work.

 

[Suzibn]

Sorry, will try to make the darned thing work tomorrow...now too late to think straight for me. Perhaps we should start another thread about horse abuse or something? This one is drifting hither and yon and we are all obviously concerned about various issues. All important, and all needing to get to the public fast.
Love ya
Suzi

 

[wilder]

i think the more you delve into the way we treat theses animals the more dissappointed i become (and not just horses) i knew about the pmu but not about the donkeys i think abuse and neglect goes hand in hand with these disgusting practices why does it have to be that animals are treated this way
fair enough a horse goes to slaughter but does it have to be beaten on its way to death, fair enough women need hrt but at the expense of foals no, and i can,t comprehend where donkey milk goes into make-up is it really neccesary i don,t think so
its disgusting

 

[Suzibn]

I agree with you.
It sometimes seems to me that people must just sit around and think of good ways to get by with abusing animals, be it for make-up or something to take the wrinkles off that come with old age. I'm proud of mine. I earned them and plan on keeping them.
We need to keep the cruelty in front of people's eyes though, and you can't force people to watch the horses being stabbed to death in Mexico, or the bad shots with captive bolt guns in Canada. I find the more I delve into this (and get myself deeper and deeper in trouble with those I most do NOT want to offend like yourself!) the more troubled I am in.
Why isn't the problem of heavy metal in horse meat coming out of Eastern Europe on the news? Bute and antibiotics in the meat their children are eating? Why isn't the cruelty invoved in PMU farms highlighted...people love to watch tragedy's...look at how we were all glued to the screen to watch 7/7 or the whale in the Thames...but no one seems to want to highlight the cruelty to horses world wide.
I have pictures of bits from south Africa that I actually saw and examined when a rescue group came to one I was working with to buy used equipment to try to educate the public there. They would literally make you weep and would post them on here for you to see if I could figure out how!
Keep going all of you who care, guess that's all any of us can do, and write to your government officials. Burn the keyboard up. Send messages to all your friends. Get the news interested!
Love ya
Suzi

 

[Suzibn]

Here you go, yet another way to torture equines, I don't care how it is produced, but just another scheme to make donkeys no one wants and bilk the British and American public out of more money.
Please if you have wrinkles see a plastic surgeon before resorting to this. It gives me nightmares. All of this stuff does!
Donkey Milk Cosmetics


This exclusive, innovative cosmetic line, based on 100% natural Donkey's Milk, is especially good for adults and infants with sensitive skin!

Last year, archaeologists in London discovered what may be a 2,000 year old jar of face cream. The ingredients are unknown, but one leading theory is that they include donkey's milk.

That is hardly a surprise to many high end cosmetics companies, cosmetologists and dermatologists: in literature and cinema, the legend of Cleopatra frequently recurs. This famous beauty bathed in donkey’s milk in order to keep her skin radiant and youthful.

Biochemical analysis of donkey milk enables us to determine its precise dermatological role. Donkey's milk contains an incredible amount of fatty acids, vitamins A, B1, B2, B6, C, D and E, minerals and high proteins that help skin feel smooth and silky. Thanks to this composition, donkey milk is extremely effective against dry skin and wrinkles: it’s a natural tensor, able to prevent skin from aging and also regenerate it. Donkey milk is the closest in composition to human milk from any mammal!

Donkey milk was highly prized by ancient peoples. The Greeks considered it an excellent remedy, the Romans regarded it as a luxury drink. Hippocrates recommended it for all sorts of maladies : poisonings and snake bites, joint pains, wounds, etc. In fact, in the 19th century, and even at the beginning of the 20th, many people used it as a remedy. At that time, especially in Paris, many “donkey milk dairies” were established so that upper class women could purchase the precious beverage.

Now, it is not easy to produce high quality cosmetics with this prized ingredient: donkeys have a very small reserve of milk. In addition, no all donkeys are capable of producing high quality milk. For that reason, it is very hard to find cosmetics with high concentration of donkey milk. At present time, there are only three countries in the entire world that rise Jennets donkeys exclusively for the cosmetic industry: Chile, Belgium and France.

Bohemia Style UK is proud to introduce this extraordinary cosmetic cream to our worldwide customers: Cleopatra Cleopatra Donkey's Milk Night and Day Face Cream. Produced in Chile by Donkey's Milk Farm following the highest standards, this cream contains 100% natural donkey's milk!

Watch the CNN Report about the makers of our Donkey Milk Products

 

[Fairynuff]

Beauty products based on donkey milk have been produced here in Italy for a good few years now. Donks are kept as milking herds in a few regions here and most of the milk is destined for paediatric hospitals and for babies with intolerance problems. As you said Suzi, unlike other domestic milk producers, jennies cannot store milk so they have to be milked every 2 hours.I have no idea what becomes of any jack foal born-I presume they are fattened and despatched like any bull calf born in a dairy herd.If this is the case then okay, I dont like it but I can live with it.So long as there is no suffering along the way...........

By the way, donkey milk tastes of hazelnuts-its quite nice ( in a strange sort of way).

 

[Boudicea]

Tia, I honestly believe that there are a lot of loud voices out there but not enough being heard. Our Charity is a very small one based in Scotland with voluntary Inspectors, and what makes me want to fight is the amount of so called 'crap' coming to us which although it may not be an easy ride at times ( excuse the pun) turn out to be wonderful ponies and horses with some kindness, firmness and understanding. These are the ponies and and horses going for meat which is why if we love our equines we should be standing up and stating to the government we want no more of this wastage, but I doubt until I give my last breath that will happen, although I wish it could.

To everyone else, if you want my support I am right behind you on every issue, just send me a PM x

 

[Suzibn]

Mairi,
You a nice Italian girl drinking donkey milk who do you think you are Cleopatra?? No she bathed in asses milk that's right. Hazelnuts, hummm. Nope still don't like it. Don't want the babes going for slaughter, but better that then to the middle east which will be the next humane issue. Gees does it never stop>
Buodecea...you will be hearing from me. And vise versa if you need any help any time any where.
Love ya
Suzi

 

[Fairynuff]

 

[Suzibn]

Oh goodness, you look all puzzled! Wasn't having a go at ya girl! He he! Can't we have a little joke occasionally?
No I feel that the donkey milk issue is one thing if it is for pediatric units (I know I spell it the American way!) but I just hate the thought of yet more equines being used and used, and yet I don't want to stop riding or having horses like PETA wants us to either.
The PMU thing I am firmly against, but the donkey thing, well, will do a bit more research before spouting off about it. Certainly not having a go at a girl in Italy. How could I do that being half Sicilian???
Love ya
Suzi

 

[Fantasy_World]

I have been reading this thread with interest.
The PMU situation I am def against and have been for years since to me it seems a totally inhumane and unnecessary process involving the cruelty of animals when there are more viable methods and alternative drugs and therapies available for the treatment of the menopause.
I am also not too keen on the idea of milk farms for donkeys either. On the face of it it seems like just another exploitation of animals for mans' needs.
Before anyone jumps on my no I am not a member of PETA and the like.
Unless donkey's milk is any different to cows and goats milk then I cannot understand the reason it is being produced for babies?
Perhaps someone with more knowledge on the subject could shed more light on this so to speak?
If it is purely to do with babies being lactose intolerant which is prevailent in cows milk then why not just use goat's milk for the purpose?
However I think Mairi hit the nail on the head with her response ( not having a go at you btw about your nationality as I have very good friends of many years who are Italian).
Donkey meat is used in certain salamis am I correct?
Is it therefore perhaps astute of me to point out that by using donkeys to produce milk and fattening and killing any unwanted offspring that essentially two birds are being killed by one stone. The requirement of one resource is being fuelled by another. Ie milk is needed and so is donkey meat therefore by creating an industry which results in unwanted offspring which can be used to fuel the meat demand then it would seem to be a very profitable business on the face of it?
Could this situation be compared to how unwanted calves produced from the cow's milk trade fuelled the demand of veal meat in Europe?
I suppose for me personally the eating of any equine meat will always be a contentious issue in my mind. I just simply cannot get my head around the whole process.
We are all entitled to our opinions though and are all very different people and as such have very different beliefs. That is not to say anyone is right and anyone is wrong in the beliefs which they uphold.

 

[JM07]

goats milk is TOTALLY different to cows milk...

i'm intolerant to cows milk/dairy products but can drink goats milk.

o i would see that Donkey milk would/could be beneficial to infants...

doesnt make it right though...

 

[Fantasy_World]

Yeah I know that goat's milk is totally different to that of cows as I use the stuff to give my ferrets that are lactose intolerant.
My point was that if donkey's milk was being used for the same purpose ie easier to digest and less likely to cause digestive problems due to allergies or being intolerant then why not use goat's milk for the same purpose.
My thoughts on this is that the donkeys are being used for both meat and milk from the same business source very much alike how the unwanted calves from the dairy industry fuelled the continent's demand for veal ( another source of cruelly produced meat imo).
Caz

 

[Fairynuff]

I have on average 5 turns in 24 hours

.Its awful, I feel like Im going to spont combust and I can do nothing about it! In the last 3 months Ive had sore throats, colds and chest infections due to my sweating like a pig during the night and in consequence throwing the covers off when the windows are open and its 4 degrees outside

. I really dont know what to do but...I WILL NOT BE TAKING PMU RELATED DRUGS! Im just going to have to put up with it, sooner or later it will stop.

 

[blueberry]

You do well to bear it without the support of drugs, very commendable!

 

[Suzibn]

It does get better...honest...plus there are some herbal alternatives that DO work, believe me. Sorry you are there, but it will get better and suddenly one day you'll wake up and feel better!
Love ya and your care about the animals!
Suzi

 

[nuffield]

equinesection appears to be sold. maybe it wasnt all it appeared to be?

 

[blueberry]

i doubt it was sold. it is still being run but some prior members have decided to cease their membership.