Your views please...

If a horse is playing up i.e prancing etc.. i stay on as your less likely to be hurt whilst on their back.

But if the horse is literally scared stiff and stood there trembling i'd get off but not without an arguement!!
 
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Sorry, haven't read all thread, but I would think it is as simple as the horse seeing you walk unscathed past the object and taking confidence from that.

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Thats EXACTLY what I am pondering Soots
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And also why I was interested in the NH/Parelli people's input, as they take *making themselves the alpha* VERY seriously and absolutely believe they are, so does that mean that when they are on the horse's back it never quibbles as soon as they say *go*. And WHY do horses sometimes require the visual confidence if they truely believe you wouldn't put them in harms way (as in, will happily follow you on foot) - I find it ever so intriguing!
 
I personally feel safer on Bert than on the ground if he is being a ninny.

Obviously all horses are different and it may be the right choice for many people to get off and lead but with Bert I have not found it so. Normally he will go past things if I am on board and the only time I have got off was when he was being an arse rather than scared and I was dragged back to the yard which was not a fun experience.

With Bert, who is not the best mannered horse in the world, it is safer to be on top than under his feet if he panicks as he has spacial awareness issues. Also I cannot get on him from the ground which makes it tricky.
 
Very interesting thread, and its made me remember something strange!

A few years ago at my old yard there was a horse called Sam, she wasn't very good in traffic at all and was particularly scared of lorries and tractors etc. The girl that owned her was a very good, confident rider.
One day Sam was tied up to the gate that lead to the farm next door, and a big tractor and trailer went past with a big blue plactic sheet over the back of it, Sam didn't bat an eye lid and her owner was speechless and said 'if I had met that out hacking she would have freaked'
She then tacked up and went for a hack, and met the big scarey tractor and the horse freaked out at it and spun round and p**ssed off home!

Horses eh!!
 
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to those who say they'd get off.....

what do you lead them with??

do you take a long line out hacking, just in case??

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No..just lead them with the bridle as I would when leading the horse anywhere...
 
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I am really surprised that people are happier on the ground with a panicking horse.

Its quite easy for a 650kg horse to barge you out of the way and p*ss off home causing an accident.

I'd rather be on the horse every time, however as stated on other posts, I did have to get off recently to jump a ditch with one of mine, as he didn't get it (still doesn't get it and more training required!)

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Are we talking about a paniking horse? I though we were talking about one that was refusing to move forwards past something!
A horse will win everytime in a battle of strength if it so chooses.. whether you are on its back or on the floor. Me, personally have never let a horse go yet...
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Just a note to add that if the horse is panicing and prancing around I back off and wait for the horse to settle before I dismout and then take it as slowly as necessary to get past safley and happily.

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Ditto
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There is no right or wrong answer to this one. Like people, every Horse is different. You only need to watch them for a while to see that some are dominant, some prefer to be told what to do and others are more passive. I have a pack of Huskies and they are the same.

For people who say you should never get off, well, perhaps you have never experienced a Horse where it might be a better answer. I got off mine the other week because he was unsure about some deep sand. I asked him forward while I was onboard and he took a step then went back. Once I got off, I walked forward and he gingerly followed me. I then got back on and the next time he was confident to 'go it alone'. I guess in this instance he liked the visual aspect of me showing him it was safe. I could have sat all day and whacked him with a stick...it wouldn't have worked. My Horse is a pretty passive one. He doesn't nap and he doesn't get worked up. When he has an issue (rare) there's a reason for it. On the other hand I used to ride one who would stop now and again and not move. I would never have jumped off and led him. I had to sit and outsmart him. You will never get the upper hand physically but you will mentally...unless it's fear of course.

Who's to say how Horses minds work. Think of it this way, let's say you had to do a bungee jump and were scared. How many of you would rather someone took you by the shoulders and pushed you over and how many would rather watch a friend do it first, come back up and tell you it was brilliant?? I guess some will prefer one way and the rest the other way.

The true Horseman/Woman is that one who knows their Horse well enough to know which way is right. Just my ramblings though.
 
Generally I prefer to stay on. In 3 years I've only had to get off and lead him past something once.

The other day I wish I had got off though. A pony was running loose up and down the lane. He kept galloping straight at my boy then spinning around and running away. My boy held it together for the first 2 charges but on the 3rd near collision he spun around and I slide over his shoulder. I probably should have got off but I didn't fancy being on the ground with the pony charging around.
 
I have been trying to reply to this one all evening - but have been getting distracted!

We all deal with things in different ways and I don't think there is a right way, necessarily. Usually I would choose to stay on board, but equally there are times when clearly is it better to get off and lead, or put myself between whatever is scary and the horse to show them that it is in fact safe. I don't feel bad about getting off, or feel that I have failed, and I am just as happy that I am in control on the ground as I would be on board
 
When I got Willow had previously had a nasty fall on the road and he was spooky but not nasty in any way. TBH spent the first 3 months leading him everywhere til I got fed up of walking. He'd follow me anywhere now tho and would do the same again with the newbie rather than get dumped, anything is better than being dumped on the road, losing the horse and causing an accident.
 
I've always always stayed on board - I'd probably still be clinging on when my horse leaps over the edge of a cliff! I feel much safer up there however that was until I got a couple of arabs. I've never got off them for being silly but occasionally we'll be out hacking and come across something terrifying. Anyone who knows arabs will know that bossing or bullying them never works - they have a stubborn streak a mile long. So you can either sit there for hours until they get bored or leap off, lead past and jump back on. It's rare I have to do this but when I do I'll lead past, jump back on then make neddie go past what was terrifying them a few times with me mounted - just to make sure we can. I only have to lead them past once and then they're fine with going past with me in the saddle. I think they just want to see if Mum gets eaten first.

As for the old warning tale of 'if you get off once the horse will learn and start stopping more and more' it's certainly not the case for my two neds. But it totally depends on the horse and why they're not doing what you want them to do.

As a rule of thumb I say stay on board.
 
I haven't read all the posts, BUT I HAVE gotten off PF to go past something when she was genuinely nervous AND there was traffic about. I can tell she's scared and not just messing about because her legs go wobbly and I can feel her heart pounding at the girth. Normal spooking I can deal with but spooking in traffic, nope. Plus she always settles down when I'm leading her. Probably because she realises she can run faster than I can so the scary lions/dragons etc will get me first
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What a good question. From the majority of the replies I have read I think most people that get off do it for there own safety, & it makes them feel better. However I have had some involvement with mounted police who state catergorically that a horse MUST go forwards at all times into any situation. Whilst I accept that a (pardon the phrase) happy hacker just wants to go out & enjoy a ride, I ask myself. How can you enjoy something that is based purely on the horses terms? Think of Eventers & showjumpers & probably many other riders & horses, if every time the the horse said " Oh I dont want to do that" What the hell would happen if riders said " Oh ok it's allright I will get off" I dont believe that horses have different brains. So on that note maybe it's food for thought that as the mounted police say. " Horses should be more wary of the rider than what it may face on ridden excersise. Whilst I am sure many will shoot me down in flames, horses are working animals.
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The reference to police horses is an interesting one. From that though you have to remember that out of the many, many horses they see, only a small proportion are ultimately suitable. Even those purchased for the work don't always make it through the training, or turn out to be suitable in the long run. So you are drawing an example from a very small number of specially picked animals.

Are these horses selected because they have shown that they are particularly trusting of their riders? My experience is that police horses will have one regular rider, I know of a few that will happily throw off a rider they don't know and haven't worked with regularly. That does put things in a different context I think.
 
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Hi Weezy. I've scanned through a few of the replies & haven't noticed anyone directly answer your Q, but apologies if I'm saying what 10 other people have said!

In a nutshell, the horse will more confidentally take a lead whether it be another horse or a human leader. I don't agree that the nerves of the ridden rider are particularly relevant as the horse will be able to sense the same when you're leading it just as much as riding it.

The horse is naturally a 'follower' & just wants some other bugger to go first!

In terms of what's 'correct', my opinion is that you should dismount if in danger (I think the 'you should NEVER dismount brigade' are just people trying to prove how brave/competant they are - sorry).

However, in terms of your horse's education, they don't really LEARN to deal with their confidence issues by being led past always - there will come a time when you need to get the horse past something on board if they are ever to learn that they can do it without being eaten alive. You can't lead a horse past everything for a year then one day decide not to get off any more & expect them to be fine about it - by leading, they learn to go past with a leader, not to go past period.

That said, it's valuable to go out with a braver horse initially if on a youngster as the optimum situation is to teach your horse not to react in the first place! Once it 'learns' that hacking past these objects is no big deal, you are better set up to take the lead for a while & then ultimately do it on your own. It's about not chucking the youngster in at the deep end - best way to educate a youngster is to do it all within his comfort zone, i.e. increase your chances of always getting a positive reaction, which hopefully becomes a 'habit'.
 
My Jack is scared of Carrier bags and will not go past them if I am on board but if I get off he will walk past. I think he believes there is a monster living inside it and he'd rather it ate me first!
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However, in terms of your horse's education, they don't really LEARN to deal with their confidence issues by being led past always - there will come a time when you need to get the horse past something on board if they are ever to learn that they can do it without being eaten alive. You can't lead a horse past everything for a year then one day decide not to get off any more & expect them to be fine about it - by leading, they learn to go past with a leader, not to go past period.

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I agree with this. There was a short period where Paris got very funny about a particular area on our hacks - she'd get very nervous, very spooky, and would spin and try to run away. A few times I led her past it and it was fine, but I realised the only way to get her to behave properly past it was to ride past. After a week or so of making her go past, she was fine with it again. I'd still dismount and lead past in a desperate situation - sometimes it is safer for horse and rider to do so, and I'd rather have us both in one piece than stay on for the sake of proving how good I am.

re. FRESHMAN - I don't think most people who hack out do so on the horse's terms. I know personally, the times I have dismounted and led past something 'scary' is only a handful of times in the four years I owned horses. 99% of the time they would listen to me and if something was scary I would persevere and they'd go past. I agree that they are working animals and they should do what you say every single time - but I don't think its a case of quitting or giving up, or letting the horse win, if you very occasionally dismount and show them its ok to go.
 
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Well of course!!
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There's 3 times the wiseness coming out of this body at the moment
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Mwahahaha you just wait, once those blighters pop out you will have no brain, they leach it from you
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Ha ha - I bet! Well I'd better get all my knowledge on everything onto this forum sharpish so everyone thinks I'm dead clever, so maybe I'll get some grace next year when I'm a totally wally
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Also, I may need to refer back to it for my own benefit!! OK, what can I start writing about..?
 
haven't read whole thread but will add my two penneth.

With fleur I have no doubt she acts differently when I am on the floor. I know she has a fair degree of trust in me when mounted but she is very very strong willed and sometimes she will just refuse to listen to me. IF i am on my own I tend to stay on till she goes where I want her to go which she will eventually and she no longer goes up so I am confident in my safety as she will just edge slowly forwards. On the floor though she definetly takes confidence from me being at her head 'leading the way' and will pass the object/creatures (cows and chickens are very scary creatures you know
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) quickly and relatively quietly. I like to think she is not picking up anything from me when mounted as half the time she has stopped at something I don't even realise exists until I try and work out why she has stopped and spot offending thing (i.e. chickens in hedge!)

The reason I do occasionally get off her to take her past something which is increasingly rare it is because I am in company with a horse who will not lead and who easily gets very hyped up and does become potentially dangerous. The horse basically panics and so the best way to prevent it is to pass as safely and calmly as possible and with the situations its normally best for me to dismount.

Interestingly this other horse once having spooked doesn't really improve its behaviour/bravery being led from the ground.

Dan I don't get off as he is bad on the floor as on top so if he refuses to go past something we just reinback past which apparently according to him is not a problem!
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However I have had some involvement with mounted police who state catergorically that a horse MUST go forwards at all times into any situation.

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It's a different kettle of fish here though. If you got off to lead your Police horse past an angry mob at a protest you'd probably get a damn good kicking. You've also got to think of the back up and safety of your colleagues so the horse is merely a 'vehicle' in this instance and your life might literally depend on the horse doing exactly what it's told.

Leading a horse past something scary on the roads seems sensible to me TBH, far better than a confrontation IMO.
 
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to those who say they'd get off.....

what do you lead them with??

do you take a long line out hacking, just in case??

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No..just lead them with the bridle as I would when leading the horse anywhere...

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so...you'd have about 3 1/2 ft of rein if it reared up, turned about face and pi55ed off down the road?....

where's the control in that scenario?

accident awaiting 500 mtres down the road..................
 
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to those who say they'd get off.....

what do you lead them with??

do you take a long line out hacking, just in case??

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No..just lead them with the bridle as I would when leading the horse anywhere...

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so...you'd have about 3 1/2 ft of rein if it reared up, turned about face and pi55ed off down the road?....

where's the control in that scenario?

accident awaiting 500 mtres down the road..................

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have never let go of a horse yet...tbh, my point is that in situations like that it often helps to get off and lead a horse past whatever is upsetting it rather than try and force a situation and 'encourage' the horse to prat about even more. Works for me...not everything is set in stone
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