AmyMay
Situation normal
Because ‘murder’ is an act of purpose, and it’s highly unlikely that the owner ‘set’ the dog on the man that died - hence manslaughter.
Another fatal dog attack
- Thread starter SilverLinings
- Start date
bonny
Well-Known Member
There are rumours that they knew each other and that might be exactly what happened.
AmyMay
Situation normal
Obviously if that’s the case, then let’s hope a murder charge sticks.
Goldenstar
Well-Known Member
That’s a rumour, however they would have to prove that the owner of the dog set out to kill the victim .
How that fits with the media coverage saying the victim picked up his puppy to protect it and the dog grabbed him by the throat I can’t see.
Manslaughter is a reckless act leading to death of another that’s a breeze to prove .
How that fits with the media coverage saying the victim picked up his puppy to protect it and the dog grabbed him by the throat I can’t see.
Manslaughter is a reckless act leading to death of another that’s a breeze to prove .
SadKen
Well-Known Member
You could argue that and I’m open to debate but I think those with larger dogs (and I have 2) have a greater responsibility to ensure public safety because it’s those big dogs that can and do kill - adults, easily. I know JRTs have killed babies but it’s hard to argue that a JRT is a lethal weapon to anyone other than a tiny baby. And that’s an issue of parenting if a JRT is in a position to kill a baby.
At the very least the sentencing for death by out of control dog should be severe, along the lines of death by dangerous driving - at its maximum rate. The owners of Beast who killed Jack Lis got 4 yrs from memory. Out in 2, likely.
J&T
Well-Known Member
Another attack
Woman's horrific wounds inflicted by Bully-type dog which attacked her
WARNING, GRAPHIC CONTENT: The 55-year-old nurse limped home alone after the owner of the dog ran away from the scene of the attack by the Texaco garage near Paignton, Devon.
www.dailymail.co.uk
skinnydipper
Well-Known Member
This was on Facebook yesterday.
Kenz George
Be carful around feniscowles and witton area just took my dog on a walk found a guy led on the path so ran over to see if he’s okay and he’s told me he been attacked by a dog and then seen a guy running off with a big dog so called the police turns out it’s an XL bully police caught the guy with the XL bully and the the guy who been attacked is being taken to hospital with serious head and leg injuries.
Kenz George
Be carful around feniscowles and witton area just took my dog on a walk found a guy led on the path so ran over to see if he’s okay and he’s told me he been attacked by a dog and then seen a guy running off with a big dog so called the police turns out it’s an XL bully police caught the guy with the XL bully and the the guy who been attacked is being taken to hospital with serious head and leg injuries.
Cinnamontoast
Fais pas chier!
.
Red-1
I used to be decisive, now I'm not so sure...
I don't think the Police are trying very hard there! With all that is in the news, and with the injury, and with it being unprovoked, you'd think they would at least talk to the lady.Another attack
Woman's horrific wounds inflicted by Bully-type dog which attacked her
WARNING, GRAPHIC CONTENT: The 55-year-old nurse limped home alone after the owner of the dog ran away from the scene of the attack by the Texaco garage near Paignton, Devon.www.dailymail.co.uk
No viable lines of enquiry? It was near a petrol station, who likely have cctv. It is a dog commonly seen in the area, so likely local. To simply ignore it is bad policing.
tristar
Well-Known Member
with all this going on the government, if they had one brain cell, would act immediately, all this should on the telly ,like covid, coverage, where and when, discussing what action to take, now it is becoming an urgency
its like if you step outside the house, walk down the road, who knows, like when it happens however random it may appear it is too late
its like if you step outside the house, walk down the road, who knows, like when it happens however random it may appear it is too late
conniegirl
Well-Known Member
Moment brave mother shields her toddler from 'XL Bully' attack
Witnesses have described the moment a mother protected her toddler from an 'XL Bully' attack outside a hotel in Greenwich.
conniegirl
Well-Known Member
Pictured: XL Bully which mauled dog walker in Sunderland to death
This is believed to be the XL Bully that mauled a dog owner to death while he was trying to protect his pup from the crazed animal which has allegedly attacked at least two dogs previously,
Morwenna
Well-Known Member
What I cannot get my head around is how many of these dogs had previously attacked people or other dogs and the owners had received cautions which clearly did nothing as they then went on to seriously injure or kill people. So many of these attacks could have been prevented.
AmyMay
Situation normal
Exactly. It seems only now the police are sitting up and taking notice.
misst
Well-Known Member
Are they though? Still all seems a bit hit and miss with no consistency.
Errin Paddywack
Well-Known Member
splashgirl45
Lurcher lover
I came to the end of a path and there was someone with a French bulldog on lead and what looked like a small XL bully off lead. My 3 were on lead luckily and I stopped and waited for them to catch the bully, the woman didn’t put it on lead just hung in to it’s harness, we discussed which way we were all going and I went a different way and kept mine on lead until i they went out of view.. I must admit I felt quite scared even though it didn’t seem to be aggressive , but the people seemed a bit ditsy and I’m sure they were not expecting trouble but I was anticipating that there could be … it’s the first I’ve seen in my area and hope it’s the last
CanteringCarrot
Well-Known Member
So, time and time again on this thread and the other (Irresponsible Owners) we've heard of people having "interactions" or passing an XL Bully/Bully. Almost every time the dog has been with some idiot/ditsy/clueless owner.
While the dogs are an issue, this just keeps highlighting that ultimately, it always goes back to the owners.
I just can't wait for the breed to be banned and all problems to be solved by this
Ok, I know that no one (that has a decent level of intelligence) is claiming that this breed ban will solve everything, we have to consider the safety of the public, and it's easier than solving societies real problems, but it's a sh*t show over there.
While the dogs are an issue, this just keeps highlighting that ultimately, it always goes back to the owners.
I just can't wait for the breed to be banned and all problems to be solved by this
Ok, I know that no one (that has a decent level of intelligence) is claiming that this breed ban will solve everything, we have to consider the safety of the public, and it's easier than solving societies real problems, but it's a sh*t show over there.
splashgirl45
Lurcher lover
I think that too many gullible people have bought into the idea of them being good family dogs, which some may be if owned by sensible dog people . You only have to go on social media to see countless videos of bull breeds with babies and small toddlers to know that the owners are clueless as even a small dog shouldn’t be in the position of being close enough to a baby so it could bite before anyone could stop it..let alone an XL bully… I still think a lot of the problem is with the owners but must admit I would be happy to never see another XL bully especially when I am walking mine
skinnydipper
Well-Known Member
We are not the only country to have banned breeds.
Are banned breeds and restrictions managed successfully in other countries, does anyone know?
Or is it just here that people try to circumvent the law?
petolog.com
Are banned breeds and restrictions managed successfully in other countries, does anyone know?
Or is it just here that people try to circumvent the law?
Full banned dog breeds by countries updated 2023 XL Bully UK
List of banned dog breeds by countries: some of the breeds are now considered to be dangerous, and in most countries these dogs are banned or have imposed certain restrictions for keeping them
petolog.com
CanteringCarrot
Well-Known Member
I mean, I get that. You're scared. It's not a totally irrational fear!
We are not the only country to have banned breeds.
Are banned breeds and restrictions managed successfully in other countries, does anyone know?
Or is it just here that people try to circumvent the law?
Full banned dog breeds by countries updated 2023 XL Bully UK
List of banned dog breeds by countries: some of the breeds are now considered to be dangerous, and in most countries these dogs are banned or have imposed certain restrictions for keeping them
Yes, you are not the only country to have banned breeds. I think that everyone knows or recognizes that.
I think we've been here before in conversation, but these threads are long.
I can try to find some sources when I have time, but breed bans are more successful in some countries than others. There is always going to be a collective they tries to circumvent it, but that number may or may not be larger in the UK.
My point is, that you all have a larger problem over there than breeds.
Also I've seen and known some of those "banned breeds" in Germany. You can still own them. Usually under special circumstances.
Edit: after reading that article and it's lists, some of it is not correct or is just partial information.
skinnydipper
Well-Known Member
I accept the list might not be accurate. I searched for banned breeds in different countries and that's what came up, I didn't look into it further.
Tiddlypom
Carries on creakily
Not always, as the dogs themselves (XL bullies) are inherently dangerously loose cannons with unpredictable temperaments.
You, as the owner of a large breed that many (including me) are wary of, would understandably prefer it if it was always numptie humans who could be blamed, rather than psycho dogs. You want to be able to keep your own dog, but are getting concerned and defensive that your chosen breed could be under threat.
I just want to be able to go out and about on my daily business without being hassled by or concerned about overly large potentially or actually nasty dogs.
ycbm
Einstein would be proud of my Insanity...
So, time and time again on this thread and the other (Irresponsible Owners) we've heard of people having "interactions" or passing an XL Bully/Bully. Almost every time the dog has been with some idiot/ditsy/clueless owner.
While the dogs are an issue, this just keeps highlighting that ultimately, it always goes back to the owners.
I just can't wait for the breed to be banned and all problems to be solved by this
Ok, I know that no one (that has a decent level of intelligence) is claiming that this breed ban will solve everything, we have to consider the safety of the public, and it's easier than solving societies real problems, but it's a sh*t show over there.
We will never get rid of bad owners.
So if there are inevitably going to be bad owners, I would prefer it if the dogs they were allowed out in public with were only capable of inflicting a nasty bite and not of ripping out my throat or tossing me around like a rag doll.
.
skinnydipper
Well-Known Member
^This^
Whichever way you slice it XL bullies are bigger, more muscular pitbulls.
I don't think we need a breed which has to be very carefully managed in order to avoid dog on dog and dog on human attacks/fatalities.
CanteringCarrot
Well-Known Member
That eliminates many dogs then. How far do you want to go with this? Genuine question.
paddy555
Well-Known Member
what do you mean?
CanteringCarrot
Well-Known Member
"...inherently dangerously loose cannons with unpredictable temperaments."
Please, please, do not get me wrong (any of you), I am not in denial of this.
I think some of you are getting me wrong here. It's like the minute that you question a ban it's like blood in the water and the sharks are comin'
I also want to be out and about without being hassled by or concerned about overly large potentially or actually nasty dogs. I live in a neighborhood with a Great Dane, Staffy mix, GSD, Boxer, 2 small Pitbull looking dogs, a Newfy, and a Malinois mix. If I fan out the radius there are more large dogs. Nary (I hope I don't jinx myself) an incident. I could live in fear, but I don't. I am however, aware.
While I want to keep my own dogs, if there were a ban and it kept idiots from owning them and ruining the breed, then I'd comply. Would it be unfair to me and many other owners? Absolutely. Especially because the Cane Corso is an older breed with much history. So I'd hate to see it die out.
As I've mentioned before, many will give up much of their rights and liberties for the sake of public safety. Which I understand, and it's a tricky thing to balance in some cases (wrote a whole thesis related to that once).
As for me getting defensive, if you see bringing up alternative ideas, questions, or actually speaking about a real issue (the idiots), then you're entitled to your opinion on that. It's part of a discussion. I like to discuss varying views, sides, and takes on things. Even if they're not what I believe or know to be true.
If you (generally speaking) want to ban dogs that are capable of substantial damage to life and limb, that's going to be quite the list.
Edit:
"You, as the owner of a large breed that many (including me) are wary of, would understandably prefer it if it was always numptie humans who could be blamed, rather than psycho dogs."
Numptie humans are to blame. Psycho dogs are too.
Still circles back to humans though. Who created these beasts? Keeps on breeding them, owning them, not properly training, containing, and/or housing them? Why does this psycho dog exist? Humans.
I'm not doubting that the dogs are psychotic! They are a problem. I just don't want to discount the idiotic human factor at all.
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CanteringCarrot
Well-Known Member
I don't entirely disagree with that.
CanteringCarrot
Well-Known Member
The idiots. The dumbass owners. Society in general at times.
It's entirely possible to have multiple problems. I get choosing the easiest, quickest, and most efficient solution. That's just natural.