Anyone's yards on lockdown (flu) ???

[meleeka]

I don’t go anywhere so was a bit shocked that vaccinations aren’t usually insisted upon at venues and hunt meets and passports checked, I always assumed if you wanted to compete it was mandatory. I suspect that’s why vaccination rates are so low in this country.

 

[Ambers Echo]

It is mandatory at BE, BS, PC and NSEA events but not unaffiliated. I hope that changes.

 

[ester]

I don’t go anywhere so was a bit shocked that vaccinations aren’t usually insisted upon at venues and hunt meets and passports checked, I always assumed if you wanted to compete it was mandatory. I suspect that’s why vaccination rates are so low in this country.

Because checking is a total ball ache, we used to insist (BRC) that photocopies of passport vaccinations were sent with entries, thankfully we now have the computer set up to work it out but it still takes time to check it is up to date and the first three were given at the correct points, even more so with an older horse.

 

[Ambers Echo]

They could do spot checks: turn away anyone who forgets the passport plus anyone who has travelled in the same lorry or trailer with them and give the person 48 hours to send a scan of the passport page to prove they just forgot and were not bringing an unvacced horse. Lengthy ban for anyone who is not able to provide proof of in date cover.

 

[Carrottom]

Because checking is a total ball ache, we used to insist (BRC) that photocopies of passport vaccinations were sent with entries, thankfully we now have the computer set up to work it out but it still takes time to check it is up to date and the first three were given at the correct points, even more so with an older horse.

The problem with photocopies was highlighted when we bought a horse at the sales whose vendor had "forgotten" the passport and had a copy faxed to the sales office - when we received the original passport the vaccinations page wasn't the same.

 

[ester]

yes, the point I was making was that even when receiving them 3 weeks before the event it still took a lot of time to go through them all and hence a lot of work to do at an event without pre-entries or not much time between entry and event. It was a fairly pointless exercise given how little it gets done and was mostly to ensure on the day that you didn't end up with a winning team who weren't complicit (real passports checked at that point).

 

[Meowy Catkin]

The reason why some of us are advocating a short shut-down is to give everyone a chance to get those stay-at-home unvaccinated horses jabbed.

The problem with this is that when I talked to local owners of unvaccinated horses, they have have no intention of getting them vaccinated. It is very frustrating.

 

[Ambers Echo]

So we are in the same page then, no?
Hunting has questions to answer but going out competing at well regulated venues is an acceptable risk.

😂yes, that's what I was getting at.

Hurray we have agreement! I think!!

 

[Ambers Echo]

The reason why some of us are advocating a short shut-down is to give everyone a chance to get those stay-at-home unvaccinated horses jabbed.

If this is what was happening I would be fully supportive. But there is little evidence that it is. These yards are not on lockdown 'until the horses have been vaccinated' but until some externally perceived risk has passed.

Dab Dabs comment about me desperately wanting to compete made me stop and think. Because it is true I desperately want to compete and carry on with my 'Fab Feb' plans. And I am as capable of confirmation bias, selective attention etc as the next person. But actually I really don't think I am being driven by competition fever. All my horses had strangles 2 years ago and it was the most traumatic experience. Much as I want to compete, I want my horses to be safe and well far, far more. So the reason I am not stopping is because i honestly believe it will neither reduce my risk not anyone else's. These voluntary lock-downs are (in my view) pointless. Restriction of movement would only work if a core mass of horses complied. And that would only happen if it was mandated or at least recommended. But with dozens of events carrying on every day and the majority of horse owners carrying on as normal, that is not what is happening.

If the BEF had recommended restricted movement then all events would have been cancelled. Hunts would probably have followed suit. Insurance companies could have refused to pay out on people who went out anyway. And that might have worked. I would have supported that - alongside a huge education campaign on vaccination. But a bunch of horses in yards A, B & C staying home while yards D-Z carry on just won't achieve anything I don't think. And as I said it is a distraction from the far bigger problem of low vaccination rates imo.

But I fully respect the choices of other people who weigh things up differently.

 

[Gazen]

We are in a country that so far has no reported cases. My horses are vaccinated however I will not take my horses off the yard at the moment because vaccinated horses have been contracting the virus. The vaccinated horses are showing either no symptoms or very mild symptoms that could be mistaken for other things, e.g. a dust allergy. (I know because one of my horses has a dust allergy).

There are 4 horses in their 20s on the yard.

I could go for a training clinic or a show and my horse could become infected but not have any symptoms and then pass the virus on to one or more of the oldies. The oldie could then have complications relating the the virus, bronchitis for example and die. Indirectly I would be responsible for the death of that horse, just because I wanted a morning of fun!

I have a responsibility to the other horses on my yard to keep them safe as well as my own.

Over-reaction?, maybe but my horses will survive and so will I if we don't leave the yard for the next couple of weeks.

 

[EventingMum]

We are in a country that so far has no reported cases. My horses are vaccinated however I will not take my horses off the yard at the moment because vaccinated horses have been contracting the virus. The vaccinated horses are showing either no symptoms or very mild symptoms that could be mistaken for other things, e.g. a dust allergy. (I know because one of my horses has a dust allergy).

There are 4 horses in their 20s on the yard.

I could go for a training clinic or a show and my horse could become infected but not have any symptoms and then pass the virus on to one or more of the oldies. The oldie could then have complications relating the the virus, bronchitis for example and die. Indirectly I would be responsible for the death of that horse, just because I wanted a morning of fun!

I have a responsibility to the other horses on my yard to keep them safe as well as my own.

Over-reaction?, maybe but my horses will survive and so will I if we don't leave the yard for the next couple of weeks.

This is why I favour lock downs. Obviously, in an ideal world, everyone would vaccinate but it won't stop the virus spreading as far as I'm aware, it will just minimise the risk of most but not necessary all vaccinated horses becoming seriously ill. IMO if movement and contact was minimised then it would contain the virus and prevent it reaching large numbers of the equine population.

 

[lannerch]

A vaccinated horse should never become seriously ill as it already has adaptive immunity to fight the infection, more so if vaccinated in the last 6 months ( for the right strain) and for that reason should also not get any complications even if old . It is also less likely to pass it on to anything else as it’s symptoms will be a lot less including respiratory secretions that is thought to be the main cause of spreading.

To me just confirms the importance of vaccination, especially if your horse like mine is getting on in age. I’m glad my yard insisted that everyone who was out of the 6 month period had a booster.
( they already insisted everything was vaccinated) .

 

[Bernster]

But in your example AE, doesn’t that mean that those on yards A B and C are likely to be lower risk than the other yards? So overall it might not help but, if you’re on yard A, wouldn’t you be more comfortable about your horse’s risk factor?

 

[Tiddlypom]

Today's latest update from the AHT.

https://www.aht.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2019/02/Equiflunet-update-17-02-19.pdf

Includes more detail on one of the multiple Worcestershire outbreaks.

On 15 February 2019, AHT confirmed an outbreak of EI on a premises in Worcestershire. There are a total of 24 non-Thoroughbreds on the premises, of which 16 were confirmed positive by PCR on nasopharyngeal swabs. All horses were sampled three days after the suspect exposure. Multiple outbreaks in this region are thought to be related to mixing of horses at an event such as a hunt meet. There are five horses that are vaccinated in the group, of which three were positive on the day of sampling, two have no clinical signs and one only has mild signs. The other 13 positives are unvaccinated and presented with coughing, nasal discharge and pyrexia, with three of these demonstrating quite severe clinical signs. All are gradually improving. The premises has instigated voluntary movement restrictions

 

[Tiddlypom]

And 5 main protocols issued today by the AHT for horseowners. I've put the third one in bold. You'd hope that all current events, inc hunting, are on the case.

The Animal Health Trust recommends five basic protocols:

Vaccinate – boost your horse’s vaccination if it was given more than six months ago and encourage others to do the same. If your horse is not vaccinated, it will need to start a course of vaccinations and will not have protection until two weeks after the second vaccine in the course is given.

Isolate – what biosecurity measures are in place at your own yard? Immediately isolate new or unwell horses away from the main yard to help prevent the disease spreading. Flu is easily spread amongst a group of horses. Make sure you know your own biosecurity policies, and if you’re not sure ask the yard owners and managers.

Investigate – if you’re planning to attend an event or equine gathering, speak to the organisers and ask about their biosecurity policies – what is in place to minimise the spread of disease at the event / gathering? If you are not comfortable with what is in place, don’t attend!

Communicate – we encourage vets and horse owners to be open if they have a suspected or confirmed outbreak, to help minimise the spread of flu to others.

Mitigate – horse owners are encouraged to do all they can to know the risk of moving their horse or attending an event. Gather as much information as you can to enable you to mitigate against the risk and make your own sensible decision based on this.

 

[DD]

yes, me. i keep my 2 at home. I am not hacking or letting anyone onto my premises and that incldes the farrier.

 

[Follysmum]

What annoys me is that whilst people are being respectful and careful about going to shows and clinics etc hunting is still going on with no requirements for any vaccination checks. I was talking to someone today that hunts regularly and he hasn’t even got his horses vaccinated for tetanus!

 

[Tiddlypom]

yes, me. i keep my 2 at home. I am not hacking or letting anyone onto my premises and that incldes the farrier.

Very wise. I haven't got anyone due here for a while, but when I do I will be quizzing them in advance re biosecurity between clients.
ETA I now use a podiatrist, but the farrier who I used to use shod a lot of hunters. I'd have have been treble checking his biosecurity.

 

[tristar]

we are in a very quiet spot, saturday the hunt went right past the house within yards of our horses, this is how it can happen, they never came down here before, if we had flu they could have picked it up and gone back to gaud knows how many yards

 

[oldie48]

It is mandatory at BE, BS, PC and NSEA events but not unaffiliated. I hope that changes.

Are you sure about this AE? the PC does not insist on vaccs except at area level and camp and I know that lots of PC members compete UA. I also think RC members can compete at UA comps without vaccinations but need them to compete at area level. I don't know about NSEA though. I am very happy to be corrected if I am wrong.

 

[EventingMum]

Very wise. I haven't got anyone due here for a while, but when I do I will be quizzing them in advance re biosecurity between clients.
ETA I now use a podiatrist, but the farrier who I used to use shod a lot of hunters. I'd have have been treble checking his biosecurity.

My son is an EDT and he has checked the disinfectant he uses for his tools kills the flu virus and is now using it on his boots. He always changes overalls at each yard but he is now also bagging them securely after use.

 

[Red-1]

Are you sure about this AE? the PC does not insist on vaccs except at area level and camp and I know that lots of PC members compete UA. I also think RC members can compete at UA comps without vaccinations but need them to compete at area level. I don't know about NSEA though. I am very happy to be corrected if I am wrong.

I am in 2 riding clubs and both have inspected passports just for lessons. One needed a booster within 6 months, the other just to be in date (12 months).

 

[milliepops]

I am in 2 riding clubs and both have inspected passports just for lessons. One needed a booster within 6 months, the other just to be in date (12 months).

I suspect this is a very variable thing across the country. The RC I have just lapsed my membership on only checked for area qualifiers.

I would support a lockdown if it was mandated from the top... all yards, all horses, all shows. I feel that kind of step could make a difference. am I desperate to be out and about & competing? You betcha... which possibly does affect my thinking, that piecemeal isolated lockdowns in unaffected areas are not essential at this stage. So, as it is, I'm choosing to continue going out in what I consider to be low risk areas and events, to places that are taking responsible steps to keep the risk as low as poss. And will continue to monitor. If we start getting cases closer to home then that will be a different story, obv.

 

[Velcrobum]

The hot spot outbreak in Worcestershire was due to a meet of Worcestershire Hunt there are at least 4 yards containing 70 horses in isolation. The Warwickshire Hunt has been proactive and stated all horses have to be vaccinated/boostered within 6 months

 

[The Fuzzy Furry]

I am in 2 riding clubs and both have inspected passports just for lessons. One needed a booster within 6 months, the other just to be in date (12 months).

I've been out over the weekend and mid last week, county with no reports.
RC insisted on seeing vaccs for training, last jab had to be within 6 months. They have noted each one down too, for future ref.

Other training was at comp centre (several different lots of training going on but no comps), not allowed to unload till vaccinated cert checked, must have had jab within 6 months. Very thorough checking too, as horse ID visually done to match passport.

 

[Tiddlypom]

But the WH are only being 'proactive' in so far as they are responding to an outbreak spread by a meet which allowed unvaccinated horses to take part?

 

[HashRouge]

People are still going out competing from my yard, so it doesn't make any difference that my 2 are retired and don't go anywhere. They are both having boosters tomorrow. One was due anyway and the other was done just over 6 months ago so want to be safe.

 

[Bertolie]

My yard holds regular busy dressage competitions and these are still going ahead and no requirement to show vaccs record. We have not had any cases near us and vets advice was to carry on as usual at present. Liveries on yard are still allowed to hack out. As far as i am aware all livery horses are vaccinated and those whose vaccs were more than 6 months ago have had a booster.

 

[Ambers Echo]

Are you sure about this AE? the PC does not insist on vaccs except at area level and camp and I know that lots of PC members compete UA. I also think RC members can compete at UA comps without vaccinations but need them to compete at area level. I don't know about NSEA though. I am very happy to be corrected if I am wrong.

PC is insisting on vaccinations and checking passports. At least our branch is. But prior to the outbreak you're right - vaccs were only needed at area and camp.

 

[Velcrobum]

But the WH are only being 'proactive' in so far as they are responding to an outbreak spread by a meet which allowed unvaccinated horses to take part?

4.7uf

My post stated 2 seperate hunts with 2 seperate policies......!!!!