Badminton 2023 thread

It wasn't that long ago that most of the eventers at Badminton would have been doing the dressage phase on a top hat.

Charlotte started the trend with dressage riders in helmets and now she'll do the same with correct gear at trot ups and I hope that the 'sponsors of best trot up outfit' will be rewarding blingiest helmet and matching blingy yard boots in future.
 
OrangeAndLemon said:
It wasn't that long ago that most of the eventers at Badminton would have been doing the dressage phase on a top hat.

Charlotte started the trend with dressage riders in helmets and now she'll do the same with correct gear at trot ups and I hope that the 'sponsors of best trot up outfit' will be rewarding blingiest helmet and matching blingy yard boots in future.
Click to expand...
Abi Lyle got there first šŸ˜‚ but yes it will take someone like Charlotte or Carl to make an impact...let's hope so!
 
From a racing perspective - OT's horse did indeed look to tire and lose its spark very quickly. If one of our racehorses did this then the first thing we would do would be to check for an irregular heartbeat as soon as we got back to the stableyard. There is always a vet there. If that comes up with nothing but the horse is coughing a bit then we would either scope or assume the horse has bled. The horse may well show blood in one or both nostrils by this point which would make scoping pointles. Both of these issue would cause a horse to "stop like its been shot" not travel and not jump very well there after. The other option is the horse can't breath and needs a wind op. Lack of oxygen means lack of performance
 
Surely there should be a list of riders with the same warning after Saturday? Those who had horse/rider falls due to tiredness. I saw Dan and Oli chatting in the trees after the turn when they had both been stopped/held after Fiona Kashel's fall. Oli was off his horse leading him around and Dan remained in the saddle. Both had grooms there cooling down their horses and both horses looked fine.

I agree with those who have said that the OT witchhunt is uncalled for. The reason for the Elimination is OT = Other. Not dangerous riding or abuse of horse. There are others on the list for worse reasons who are never mentioned. One is another British rider who at Burghley was warned for more and wasn't discussed. Even Tim Price is on there for abuse of whip.

Dangerous riding / series of dangerous jumps, lack of responsiveness, pressing a tired horse Burghley 2022
 
Surely the reason that wasn't discussed is more to do with how high profile the rider is/isn't. The higher your profile the more it is likely to be discussed.

Oh and it was discussed if you do a name search on here.

Burghley 2022 XC thread

I was thinking I would pull that horse up so Iā€™m glad they pulled her up. Frustrating for her but would rather see the horse and rider come home safely.
forums.horseandhound.co.uk
 
Iā€™ve only seen the BBC highlights (was away all weekend so no point in paying for full coverage) and would agree with those who say nothing disastrous seemed to be occurring with OTs horse until after the table jump incident. I think an argument could be made for pulling up at that point as horse wasnā€™t responding to aids but can also understand continuing thinking it may be a one off mistake. He should definitely pulled up of his own accord after the lake though as no way on earth was that horse making it to the finish from there (whether the ground drastically improved from that point on & he thought this might give the horse a second wind I donā€™t know but no way should he have continued beyond that point with how the horse was going). Good on the ground jury for stepping in when common sense of rider had failed.
 
Not that I think there should be a witch hunt for OT, but at what point does this become a pattern of behavior?

He has had many atrocious rides that resulted in a verbal warning. Some of those should have been a yellow card.

At what point is he going to learn? Yes the higher ones profile is in the sport the more criticism one gets, but come on. It seems to be the same every year. OT makes a wildly bad choice and then the next year everyone has forgotten about it.
 
Personally think it was a really really poor show of horsemanship and would class as dangerous riding as it looked like a fall was imminent. I'm really shocked that some don't think it was that bad!! Watching it live at the time it was awful to see, yes other horses were tired which was equally horrible to see but I think SS was the worst to watch. I couldn't believe he continued after the water. And as others have mentioned it isn't the first time which I think is relevant to people's reaction to this.
 
stangs said:
I can't produce much fanfare because I can only watch what gets posted in the public domain. However, from what I've seen, I'm a bit smitten with the way Caroline Powell rode her little mare around the XC course - love her equitation, love how quietly she handled the refusal at the LeMieux Mound, and mare looked to be doing well even towards the end of the course. Felt like watching a class on schooling young horses XC.
Click to expand...
Totally agree - Caroline Powell rode that horse beautifully, was lovely to watch.
Also really enjoyed the post-XC interview with WFP and his son, who had cajoled him into riding the XC that morning, so refreshing to see WFP admitting to nerves and his son having his back.
 
Itā€™s totally valid to criticise OT for yet another poor XC on a tired unresponsive horse. Heā€™s a huge name in the sport, with many titles to his name, and even came second this year on his other horse. He is certainly experienced enough to know better, and has had many many chances to improve his reputation.

I have nothing against OT personally, I just felt very disappointed to see him carry on after crashing through the fence because I really couldnā€™t see any good reason to do so when the horse had clearly downed tools. It casts a shadow over his result and brings the sport into disrepute.

At this point I donā€™t need him to apologise, I need him to stop pushing tired horses round when theyā€™ve clearly had enough.
 
I have no opinion on Oli beyond what I see of him and twice now Iā€™ve seen him ride an overly tired horse to the near point of exhaustion at Badminton (2018 and 2023). This is a man who represented GB in his sport at Tokyo. What is that saying about the sport?

He knows better. Heā€™s a professional. Itā€™s not a witch hunt, itā€™s calling out a pattern of behaviour
 
OT competed 37 times in March- May 2023, he rides a lot of horses eg he had 7 listed at various levels for Kelsall in April, the yellow card given at Badminton 2023 did not mention pushing a tired horse, although that can be a reason. His BD record for the last 12 months is below and he didn't receive a warning during that time and between Blair 2018 and this Badminton 2023, he is not on the FEI list either. Let me make it clear, I am not condoning bad behaviour but I think people should be more careful with their comments. Verbal warnings are listed and I don't think getting a warning or yellow card in 2018 and then nothing until May 2023 constitutes a pattern of behaviour. If you take the time to check, quite a few well known names get warnings (and yes it shouldn't happen) but they are not pilloried like OT. All I am suggesting is that people should be fair with their criticism and back up any claims with evidence.

Discipline List

Rule 3.8.2.1: Disciplinary Sanctions will be shown on this list for a period of at least 12 months. The named person will be notified. Entries on this list will be published by BE from
www.britisheventing.com www.britisheventing.com
 
As I was the one who mentioned the number of times OT was on the FEI list - while yes theyā€™re dotted about cross a fairly lengthy time period, 11 instances (granted one was abuse towards stewards), doesnā€™t personally sit right for me when itā€™s the same type of warnings time and time again, especially so when that person is meant to be at the top of their sport and represents Team GB.

The next ā€˜big nameā€™ mentioned across the same period is Tim Price, a mere five times.
 
teapot said:
As I was the one who mentioned the number of times OT was on the FEI list - while yes theyā€™re dotted about cross a fairly lengthy time period, 11 instances (granted one was abuse towards stewards), doesnā€™t personally sit right for me when itā€™s the same type of warnings time and time again, especially so when that person is meant to be at the top of their sport and represents Team GB.

The next ā€˜big nameā€™ mentioned across the same period is Tim Price, a mere five times.
Click to expand...
How many starts do they each have during the same period?
 
Kat said:
How many starts do they each have during the same period?
Click to expand...

Probably hundreds a year, but Iā€™m not sure ā€˜oh well itā€™s only a warning every 245th runā€™ makes it any better, personally. Not when the sport is becoming increasingly scrutinised as well.

ETS - I could also see the anti horse sports lobby eventually finding that data and using it to their advantage.
 
Last edited:
teapot said:
Probably hundreds a year, but Iā€™m not sure ā€˜oh well itā€™s only a warning every 245th runā€™ makes it any better, personally. Not when the sport is becoming increasingly scrutinised as well.

ETS - I could also see the anti horse sports lobby eventually finding that data and using it to their advantage.
Click to expand...
I'm not suggesting that it makes it better but it is relevant to whether the response to Oli is proportionate compared to attitudes to Tim Price or other riders.

I think it is also interesting that the two riders with most warnings are right at the top of the world rankings, both male, and both have fairly large strings. Further analysis could help improve the sport.
 
And in terms of editing of footage - Iā€™m sure I saw OT jump more fences after the water when I was watching on Badminton TV on Sun than when I was watching the BBC highlightsā€¦maybe Iā€™m wrongā€¦but it probably was editedā€¦

Letā€™s all brush it under the carpet so these event riders can still have their adrenaline fix and we can all go and watch them šŸ™„
 
equinerebel said:
Iā€™ll talk about any rider who is receiving as many warnings as Oli is and/or very clearly pushing on a tired horse beyond what is fair.

I donā€™t think ā€œbut Tim Price is the next big nameā€ is a good argument to make. Oli presumably still has more warnings against his name?
Click to expand...
100%. Is it really relevant what Tim Price is doing? Just because others have behaved poorly too doesn't make any of it OK. And we're talking about putting animals at risk for sport - never excusable!
 
equinerebel said:
Iā€™ll talk about any rider who is receiving as many warnings as Oli is and/or very clearly pushing on a tired horse beyond what is fair.

I donā€™t think ā€œbut Tim Price is the next big nameā€ is a good argument to make. Oli presumably still has more warnings against his name?
Click to expand...

ramsaybailey said:
100%. Is it really relevant what Tim Price is doing? Just because others have behaved poorly too doesn't make any of it OK. And we're talking about putting animals at risk for sport - never excusable!
Click to expand...

Thatā€™s not what I was implying - I was simply highlighting the difference, aka double the number of mentions, between the person who stands out on a years long record, and then who follows next.

None of it is good, ideally a rider would learn from their first mistake which becomes their only mistake but alas. Iā€™d struggle to justify anyoneā€™s behaviour over a couple of incidents, let alone double figures.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top