Badminton Grass Roots

I hope nobody thought I was criticising when I said the dressage of some horses was amazing and horses and riders were ready to move up the levels but didn't due to championships. I wasn't. That's just the way it is. Everyone qualified and was quite entitled to go. Everyone deserved to be there. Some people qualify early and have a long wait until the champs, they're naturally going to improve in the meantime. I enjoy watching the videos, seeing the photos and reading people's reports on here. Hats off and well done to everyone. I'd have loved to have been able to do it.
 
LEC said:
I am personally thrilled it was not just a dressage competition. Long may this remain that its a proper championship cross country where people can move up in the placings. A friend came 9th in the 100. Moved up 22 places after dressage with a clear Sj to about 12th and then finished 9th on a clear xc. To me this is how it should be weighted.

Its a tricky balance to get a championship course right but I feel that Badminton has got it right. Everyone was safe and sound even if the result was disappointing. I would be really sad if they dumbed it down as it would just make it a dressage competition.
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Exactly this :)
 
Here here LEC - agree totally. I walked the course yesterday and thought it was a good tough test at both levels. It is not meant to be a dressage competition and there were very decent championship level questions in both courses. My old novice schoolmaster would not have struggled with either course, but my little grey lad would certainly have had a few wibbles around the 90, even though he has done 6 of them at normal events.

I spent a lot of time up at the coffin where the bulk of the problems in the 90 were occuring - interesting variety in the approaches and tactics used. Have to say those that did truly come back to a proper coffin canter and then rode forwards from that canter made a much better job than those who tried to use pace to get them over. One girl brought horse right back to trot and then wrapped leg on in the last three strides and made a beautiful job of it - easy to say with the benefit of being a spectator, but I do think nerves took over with some riders who were rushing the question rather than letting their horses assess it.

That said, well done to all who gave it a shot - must be nerve wracking to have so many watching, and the crowd that gathered around that fence must've only added to the spookiness for the horses.
 
LEC said:
I am personally thrilled it was not just a dressage competition. Long may this remain that its a proper championship cross country where people can move up in the placings. A friend came 9th in the 100. Moved up 22 places after dressage with a clear Sj to about 12th and then finished 9th on a clear xc. To me this is how it should be weighted.

Its a tricky balance to get a championship course right but I feel that Badminton has got it right. Everyone was safe and sound even if the result was disappointing. I would be really sad if they dumbed it down as it would just make it a dressage competition.
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Normally I would agree with this 100% but I do feel in particular for the BE100 riders who (if I am right) are restricted about moving up to Nov until they have qualified and as the qualifiers are towards the end of the year and Badders pretty early it makes it hard for them to perhaps "practice" over a harder track. Correct me if I am wrong with this please!!!!!

It is pretty tough to do a course which sounds close to the equ of a Nov and is a long distance with the added pressure of being a championship for one of your first runs at a "higher" level.

So bearing that in mind TOP MARKS to all of the clear XC round's, something to be very very proud of and big hugs to those that had their dreams shattered and did not complete.
 
Dunlin said:
Have a look at this Hat Cam video of last years winner of the BE100 section

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9L8sK8-OLfI

It's flippin' massive! The lady even says "oh my god that was big" about a brush fence in the latter part of the course and again over a more solid fence.
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That links to the second placed combination in the BE90 from last year. Still a long and testing course though!

LEC said:
I am personally thrilled it was not just a dressage competition. Long may this remain that its a proper championship cross country where people can move up in the placings. A friend came 9th in the 100. Moved up 22 places after dressage with a clear Sj to about 12th and then finished 9th on a clear xc. To me this is how it should be weighted.

Its a tricky balance to get a championship course right but I feel that Badminton has got it right. Everyone was safe and sound even if the result was disappointing. I would be really sad if they dumbed it down as it would just make it a dressage competition.
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100% this. After all the amazing dressage scores, I was glad to see it didn't end up being a dressage comp. There is only so much prep you can do for this sort of competition, nothing can prepare you for the atmosphere on the day and the added nerves/pressure.

Huge congrats to those who topped the leader boards and well done to all those who did so well to make it there in the first place!!
 
Actually you can accrue a small number of points betweern RF and 100 final. Certainly someone I know ran his horse at Nov a couple of times last month and he went clear yesterday in the 100. I think I would prefer to do that for the 100 final so it felt easier. Even if you get a point for a DC ytou can still go steady-ish round the xc so you don't end up with too many points from a placing.
 
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I would disagree that it was novice complexity. Last year was much more technical. If you walked Aldon BE100 three day I would say it was on a par.

You can compete at novice, nothing is stopping you but you cannot get any points until after the regional final and then you are limited to 5 points? So you take a gamble and decide how good your horses chances are. But if we are talking gamesmanship there is plenty you can do to not get any points. If you did go clear novice in the Sjing then you would have to WD or run slowly xc. Maybe do a rubbish dressage test? All this is within the rules.

The horse that won the 90 has been novice it just never got any points nor was it particularly successful at novice.
 
OK then good prep may have been aiming for a easier Nov at the start of this season (I know plans don't always work out).

I got the impression from the posts that it was tough, course pics only tell half a story.

Well done to those who did complete!
 
We speaking from experience (GR 2010).
I reckon this was a brilliant championship. There were some fabby dressage scores, showing jumping course was a nice course, then most of all the xc phase really was a challenge - look at the penalties collected by folk.
I take my hat off the everyone who was competing WELL DONE
To all the moaners and HHO arm chair riders - get out and ride your own horse and the green eyed monster is not a nice thing to show - life is for living....................
Esp well done Star can't wait for your report :) :)
 
Kick On said:
We speaking from experience (GR 2010).
I reckon this was a brilliant championship. There were some fabby dressage scores, showing jumping course was a nice course, then most of all the xc phase really was a challenge - look at the penalties collected by folk.
I take my hat off the everyone who was competing WELL DONE
To all the moaners and HHO arm chair riders - get out and ride your own horse and the green eyed monster is not a nice thing to show - life is for living....................
Esp well done Star can't wait for your report :) :)
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I haven't seen anyone on here being a moaner or an armchair rider! And no one whatsoever has been a green-eyed monster! Did you read this thread? Everyone has been really congratulatory?!

Strange!

But well done on getting there in 2010. I can't even imagine getting there, let alone doing well.
 
Becky D - I agree 99.9% replies very positive - (sorry sometime a bit of a straight talker....) I always find it odd when folk question rider or horse qualification etc....

Thx - I was helping yesterday and I was so wanted to get on horse and ping around again :) :)
 
Kick On said:
Becky D - I agree 99.9% replies very positive - (sorry sometime a bit of a straight talker....) I always find it odd when folk question rider or horse qualification etc....

Thx - I was helping yesterday and I was so wanted to get on horse and ping around again :) :)
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Wow yes I bet you did!

I think the term grassroots can be confusing to people - BRC Grassroots competitions are at something like 70cm, and I think people who don't know much about the qualifications for Badminton Grassroots might be surprised to learn how competitive it is just to get there, and just how good you have to be. It really is the cream of the crop.
 
I also competed there in 2010 and have to say, that year it was a dressage competition! I would far rather see a course like they had yesterday with lots of questions and a real challenge.
I think qualifying is getting harder because it seems the reg finals are held over normal 90 courses so they end up more of a dressage competition again. I think they should find a way of making the xc more technical for the reg finals too.
 
''I think qualifying is getting harder because it seems the reg finals are held over normal 90 courses so they end up more of a dressage competition again. I think they should find a way of making the xc more technical for the reg finals too.''

this.

I would love to qualify, I have a great cross country horse but our dressage is average, and it is so disheartening to see folk with winning with low 20's all the time. I would be really up against it, although I am going to give it a go!
 
I so agree, about the regional finals, it would be so good and good preparation if they could beef up the xc for the RF. I'm the same as you Trules, but I shall keep trying!
 
agree Lilyboo, both of my local RF 's are over really straightforward xc courses on dead flat ground, they could chose much more testing xc venues.
 
Yes, it is a CHAMPIONSHIP and therefore everything is going to be the maximum for your level. I think anyone who had qualified, but had never been to Badminton would be at a disadvantage because you wouldn't know what the terrain is like nor the whole set-up. Any competitor has to think that they will need to be not just fit and prepared, but extra fit and prepared.

I was there yesterday, so I obviously didn't see the course being ridden, but it looked challenging.

It is a lovely idea to have a championship at Badminton, and I think it is going from strength to strength and it is certainly tough to qualify.
 
Orangehorse said:
Yes, it is a CHAMPIONSHIP and therefore everything is going to be the maximum for your level. I think anyone who had qualified, but had never been to Badminton would be at a disadvantage because you wouldn't know what the terrain is like nor the whole set-up. Any competitor has to think that they will need to be not just fit and prepared, but extra fit and prepared.

I was there yesterday, so I obviously didn't see the course being ridden, but it looked challenging.

It is a lovely idea to have a championship at Badminton, and I think it is going from strength to strength and it is certainly tough to qualify.
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Totally agree. A championship is supposed to be for the creme de la creme. Hence the course being challenging.

If you are not flying round PN with your eyes closed and on the verge of stepping up to Novice then you should not be there unless you are prepared to accept it will be tough.
 
I don't think that anyone is arguing for Badminton to be made easier - it is, as you say, the Championship and therefore it should be the hardest event. The issue is whether those competing 1 - understand what they're up against and 2 - have adequate opportunities for preparation.
 
armchair_rider said:
I don't think that anyone is arguing for Badminton to be made easier - it is, as you say, the Championship and therefore it should be the hardest event. The issue is whether those competing 1 - understand what they're up against and 2 - have adequate opportunities for preparation.
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How could anybody not be aware of what they are up against and everybody has the same opportunity to prepare and if you feel you are not ready dont do it.
 
popsdosh said:
How could anybody not be aware of what they are up against and everybody has the same opportunity to prepare and if you feel you are not ready dont do it.
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That goes back to the reason this thread got so many posts - DD posted saying that over the commentary it was said that riders were unprepared for the course...
 
popsdosh said:
How could anybody not be aware of what they are up against and everybody has the same opportunity to prepare and if you feel you are not ready dont do it.
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Totally agree with this.

Imagine you were doing the REAL Badminton for the first time (ie. CCI4*). You would blooming well make sure you were spot on prep. and experience-wise!!

It is no different at PN/Intro level.

Personally 100 courses vary so much in standard that sure it is easy to pick and choose the hard ones if you are concerned about the Championship course.
 
Thanks for all the well wishes and excitement when you guys thought we'd done well. I will do a proper report when I've finished nursing my bruises and licking my wounds. Monty did a cracking dressage for 27.8, then despite hardly being able to warmup for SJ due to him massively spooking at the tent nearly taking off and 4 people holding down the archway into the ring he jumped an awesome clear.

We then did the long walk down to the XC warmup to find they were running half hour behind, not really long enough to go back to the lorry so I walked him round and round and round as the course got held again and again. Half an hour turned into an hour, the wind was blowing a gale and Monty turned into a raving lunatic. I generally avoid spending much time in the XC warmup for good reason. He was bucking, rearing, spinning, launching, you name it. When I tried to jump he galloped at them ignoring me and then skewed over them. He hates wind and he hates waiting around. He isn't very good with things around the course and will generally spook at anything other than his jumps so there was an awful lot for him to look at and I struggled to keep his attention on me. We jumped the first 7 fences well then I got him back into a coffin canter, rode forwards for a lovely stride and instead of taking off he whipped round and threw me off before disappearing. I got back on, he refused again and we got through on the 3rd attempt with him leaving a leg and it wasn't pretty.

I don't know how anyone could say I hadn't prepared for it as much as possible. I took him XC schooling and jumped Novice technicality and height, I competed at three 100's this year and was placed in all of them but I'd never asked him to do an old fashioned rail-ditch-rail coffin with a crowd next to it because where on earth would I find one of those? I've never seen a coffin like that at BE100, only Novice and not on any local schooling venue, plus I was doing the 90 Champs so surely shouldn't have to go Novice to prepare? He's never been ditchy or had a problem with any coffin I've jumped so far so I wasn't prepared for him to throw the towel in with quite such force. I do think maybe things might have been different in different weather without the hold in the warmup but we'll never know. I got back on and completed and am determined to try and go back next year and do a better job. I know someone broke their arm badly at the coffin and I know people will just think I'm biased but I think that fence was a test too far - it wiped out a large percentage of competitors and hurt some of them too. I'm all for the accuracy questions - all the skinnies and tough lines inviting runouts where you get 20pens for making a mistake but I think a full coffin with upright rails in a 90 when you don't get that at any other competitions at that level is a bit much. I agree that they need to make the Regionals stiffer. Why is it ok to be a dressage competition at the Regionals and then make the jumping so much tougher at the champs? I say make the jumping tougher at the Regionals so you make sure you get combinations going through who are capable of jumping the Championship track without getting injured.

And I disagree with anyone who thinks a horse competing at Elementary pure dressage cant be a grassroots eventer. I have worked hard on Monty's dressage and he has won at Elementary BD and will come out at Medium this year but I had zero experience of eventing before getting him and no way are we capable of doing more than BE100 (and clearly not capable of BE90 Champs either) so pretty sure we are just what they mean when they say Grassroots at eventing.
 
Star I am really looking forward to your report, and slightly saddened that you have had to come on here defensively when you have made the massive achievement of qualifying in the first place!
 
Darremi said:
Totally agree with this.

Imagine you were doing the REAL Badminton for the first time (ie. CCI4*). You would blooming well make sure you were spot on prep. and experience-wise!!

It is no different at PN/Intro level.

Personally 100 courses vary so much in standard that sure it is easy to pick and choose the hard ones if you are concerned about the Championship course.
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I'm sure all those doing real Badminton prepared as much as they physically could but look how many of them ended up on the floor/having refusals. The point of a Championship is to test you to your limits and there's only so much preparation you can do - sometimes it's just circumstances on the day and not enough luck that makes things go wrong rather than a lack of preparation. It's quite upsetting thinking people would have looked at us go round and thought we hadn't done our homework. I threw absolutely everything into giving us the best chance possible but it just didn't work out :(
 
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