Bought unseen problems returning

[JenJ]

I tried to stay away but in your opinion is this good advice for someone long term depressed ?I am not a doctor, I don't know what advice should be.

I get everyone wants to do right by the horse but the amount of emotional pressure onto a mentally unwell person on this thread is quite staggering.
The horse is fine and being looked after. Nothing else needs to happen until op chooses otherwise.

I've been struggling to think what to say on this thread, as I desperately want to help OP, but as yet hadn't been able to find the words for what I mean.

I think I've found them now - you said them right here.

OP - you're very unlikely to get any money back, so the time pressure to return within 14 days is effectively non-existent. Therefore, take your time to adjust to the new situation from your original expectations. Then you can start to look at the options. Take care of yourself first x

 

[ester]

I think the trouble is that we’ve had plenty of examples of horses not being well looked after on full livery when the owner has been away/not visiting regularly.

 

[dottylottie]

Hi, I could do with some advice on a horse I bought unseen from a dealer. The horse was supposed to be suitable for a mother/daughter share and rda with very good stable manners. The horse has anything but good stable manners. The first morning after he arrived I went to visit him and when I went towards him he pinned his ears back and tried to move me with his bum. Fair enough I thought he needs time to settle. As the week progressed he barges past the yard girl when she brought his net in the morning and ran out onto the yard. The on another occasion when the yard owner was skipping him out he jumps over the wheelbarrow placed at the door and runs off again. Whenever I try to do anything with him, putting tack on, putting a head collar on, he pins his ears back. The worst incident was yesterday when I got the vet to give him a health check and restart his vaccinations as apparently he wasn't up to date with them all though I was told he was. He was extremely rude and aggressive with the vet whatever she tried to do he had something against it and pinned he against the wall at one stage and kicked out at another point. We decided against anything involving needles at this time. We decided to take him outside to trot him up and down where he proceeded to nearly knock the yard owner over, who was leading him, and ran off down the yard again. We did not continue with vetting. This has all been documented by the vet. I have asked the dealer to take him back as he was still in the warranty period. He will take him back but will only exchange for another horse and will not give a refund as per his terms of conditions which I sadly did not notice. I do not want another of his horses. He insists the horse was fine at his yard. Is there any chance I could take this further and get my money back. Sorry for the long read.

i’m about an hour away from you, but i’d be happy to come and meet you both if you’d like a hand.

I don’t claim to be an expert, but when i bought my now 6 year old at 4, she was an absolute menace. I knew the person i bought her from and knew i couldn’t trust a word she’d said, but i couldn’t even walk her from a to b without her trying to drag me. you couldn’t get near her in the stable without being pasted into the walls, and having her feet done was almost worthy of paying danger money to my poor farrier. she was truly horrible, multiple people told me to cut my losses and sell her, but i knew she’d only end up being beaten black and blue and passed around.

2 years later, whilst still very welsh and opinionated, she’s a poppet to be around 99% of the time. farrier does her on her own when i’m at work, i can do anything with her in the stable without her tied up, and i regularly muck out with the barrow in the doorway

send me a pm if you’d like to chat, and have a big hug - i spent a hell of a lot less money, and knew full well she was most likely going to be hardwork, and i was still at my wits end wondering what on earth i’d decided to buy at times.

 

[ThatAwfulCPLwoman]

Arrgh dammit is nobody else going to mention the elephant in the room here? You're forcing me to post!

Very pretty 8 year old straight legged cob dumped on the market for too little money.

If he doesn't have PSD I've got a series of hats lined up.

I'm so sorry Jasmine but please don't pass him on without checking this out.
.

Same here, but CPL.

 

[Fransurrey]

Hope you're ok, OP. I know what it's like to be in that cesspit of despair that is depression and to feel overwhelmed. Is there anyone who can go with you to the yard, perhaps on the way to another errand or outing? Just a wingman/woman to metaphorically hand hold? Just pop in to say hello. No need for anything else. Touch base with the yard owner and see how he is with food now and if he's ok, maybe take a carrot for him. If he seems in a much better place, perhaps give him some scratches, find his 'ooh yeah' spots. Go from there. There's a good chance these early days (and they are very early days) stem from a combination of his background and being shut in. Horses can behave incredibly different when confined. As hard as it is for you at the moment, you're in a good position to understand him and to empathise with him also feeling overwhelmed and despairing of life. Perhaps you can help each other?

 

[Jasmine2023]

I think most new horse owners spend the first few weeks worried, stressed and anxious!
I actually think he will make a good horse, but he needs some imput - from the yard or you - at this stage I don't think it matters who!
So why don't you take a step back, breath and repeat 'nothing bad happened'
He's on full livery and being taken care of.
Maybe you coul pop down the yard in a week or so and just stand back and watch how he is at being handled etc.

It won't always be easy but you'll muddle through, whatever you decide to do.


There are lots of people who are saying the horse is in pain, it'll be broken etc but he is most probably just afraid.
He may have some health issues, he may not. Your vet will tell you - not people on the internet who have never met him.

You bought a horse!!!
So what's your favorite thing about him?
Are you keeping his name?
Also.... we need proper pictures!!!

EDITED TO ADD
This is him right?
So when I look at him I see a younger than 8 horse who has probably never been ridden in a 'correct ' way.
He looks like I do now, under muscled and unfit!!
He is on the leaner side, but that's an easy fix

If he wasn't looking back at the camera person I think he'd have a kind eye. He's got a great cob head on him.
He has a nice neck which leads to a nice shoulder.
It's a bit of a crappy picture they used, with an awful 'rider'!
His back is of the length I'd expect for a cob - so on the shorter side,
and he has a very under muscled bum, tail is well set.
A little imagination would see him with his summer coat in properly and muscled up, riding out nicely, maybe doing
a few in hand showing classes and perhaps some unaffiliated clear rounds.
I like him a lot!
I don't think you've bought a bad horse, just bought from crappy people who couldn't be bothered ( or don't have the talent, or both ) to put some work in to show off all his great bits.

View attachment 161357


I wouldn't pay £15k for a hacking cob!
I agree with the above.

That's him yes. Can I say thank you for being about the only one to say anything positive about him. There have been so many negative reactions to him physcially which has made me not want to try anything with him apart from sell him with full disclosure which I know will be at a loss. People have made it sound like he is going to be expensive to treat which I cannot afford. Obviously when I buy a pet I make sure I can afford vet bills but they are general vet bills not 1,000's pounds on operations etc. I usually have all my animals insured but no company will insure him with pre existing conditions. So what is the point in me getting to know him if I cannot afford to pay for expensive treatments and keep him. He has seen a vet, in case anyone missed that, but we stopped half way through due to his behaviour. His heart and lungs sounded fine and his eyes looked okay. But if there are issues with his legs as people are saying then I just cannot deal with that. I am having to deal with all this on my own. For those who are understanding of my mental health issues I thank you. Both my parents are dead, I have no children, so no one to help me here. I am married but my husband does not understand mental health issues even though I had depression when we met. It not only affects me mentally but physically as I have an irregular heart beat I get heart palpitations when stressed. I could not sleep much last because of this. I am trying my best for him too he hasn't been forgotten in all this. I just wish some people could be a little less harsh and judgemental. I made a mistake and by god am I paying for it now.

 

[Jasmine2023]

Oh and I don't the the YO will appreciate anyone visiting to help out with him much as I appreciate the offers.

 

[Amymay Again]

That's him yes. Can I say thank you for being about the only one to say anything positive about him. There have been so many negative reactions to him physcially which has made me not want to try anything with him apart from sell him with full disclosure which I know will be at a loss. People have made it sound like he is going to be expensive to treat which I cannot afford. Obviously when I buy a pet I make sure I can afford vet bills but they are general vet bills not 1,000's pounds on operations etc. I usually have all my animals insured but no company will insure him with pre existing conditions. So what is the point in me getting to know him if I cannot afford to pay for expensive treatments and keep him. He has seen a vet, in case anyone missed that, but we stopped half way through due to his behaviour. His heart and lungs sounded fine and his eyes looked okay. But if there are issues with his legs as people are saying then I just cannot deal with that. I am having to deal with all this on my own. For those who are understanding of my mental health issues I thank you. Both my parents are dead, I have no children, so no one to help me here. I am married but my husband does not understand mental health issues even though I had depression when we met. It not only affects me mentally but physically as I have an irregular heart beat I get heart palpitations when stressed. I could not sleep much last because of this. I am trying my best for him too he hasn't been forgotten in all this. I just wish some people could be a little less harsh and judgemental. I made a mistake and by god am I paying for it now.

Well I think he looks like a nice little horse.

I can't see any reason not to insure him, especially if funds are tight.

 

[HopOnTrot]

Oh and I don't the the YO will appreciate anyone visiting to help out with him much as I appreciate the offers.

Will your YO help you? What have they said about him? Is he behaving going to/from the field?

Everything is overwhelming until you have a plan, meet with YO and put a plan in place for this horse.

 

[Jasmine2023]

Will your YO help you? What have they said about him? Is he behaving going to/from the field?

Everything is overwhelming until you have a plan, meet with YO and put a plan in place for this horse.

I have hardly spoken to them since Friday. The one time I did ask about his first day of turn out they said it went fine. I basically have no plan or any idea of what to do. All I know is that if he has health issues I can't afford to fix them so what's the point in bonding with him if he will even want to bond with me.

 

[doodle]

I didn't say there was anything wrong with your horse. I said he needs turning out and time to relax and then you can spend time with him doing nothing and getting to know him. No horse arrives and settles immediately. I have no idea how people can diagnose horrendous things wrong with a horse from one photo and a price.

I also very much struggle with my mental health and get it. Give yourself and your horse time. I moved my horse this time last year. I had had him for 8 years and he had always been at the same yard. He was unsettled and that was with him knowing me, I spent alot of time sitting in his field with him and doing nothing other than being with each other. Your horse dosnt even have a face he has seen before. Luckily we could do isolation in a field as he would have been very difficult if in a stable.

Take a breath, try and chill and deal with one day at a time. I get the freaking out and panicking about a less than ideal situation. You don't need to be spending loads on help or vets fees or anything just yet. Give it a month of chilling and see where you are then.

 

[LadyGascoyne]

@Jasmine2023 what were you riding beforehand?

You mentioned you showed the photos to your YO so did you have a relationship with the YO before? Could you keep riding whatever you were riding and then give this horse some time?

It would be unusual not to let other people on the yard as most people have their own coaches, riders, physios, farriers, trimmers, vets, sharers etc. Is there a reason for the YO not wanting other people about?

 

[Red-1]

That's him yes. Can I say thank you for being about the only one to say anything positive about him. There have been so many negative reactions to him physcially which has made me not want to try anything with him apart from sell him with full disclosure which I know will be at a loss. People have made it sound like he is going to be expensive to treat which I cannot afford. Obviously when I buy a pet I make sure I can afford vet bills but they are general vet bills not 1,000's pounds on operations etc. I usually have all my animals insured but no company will insure him with pre existing conditions. So what is the point in me getting to know him if I cannot afford to pay for expensive treatments and keep him. He has seen a vet, in case anyone missed that, but we stopped half way through due to his behaviour. His heart and lungs sounded fine and his eyes looked okay. But if there are issues with his legs as people are saying then I just cannot deal with that. I am having to deal with all this on my own. For those who are understanding of my mental health issues I thank you. Both my parents are dead, I have no children, so no one to help me here. I am married but my husband does not understand mental health issues even though I had depression when we met. It not only affects me mentally but physically as I have an irregular heart beat I get heart palpitations when stressed. I could not sleep much last because of this. I am trying my best for him too he hasn't been forgotten in all this. I just wish some people could be a little less harsh and judgemental. I made a mistake and by god am I paying for it now.

I think a few of us have said he looks a nice sort TBH, and many people have said that he is worth working with. Many more people have said that this is normal behaviour for an inexperienced horse, or sensitive horse, when placed in a new home.

Many people have also been positive about how much you could learn from this.

Many have given your various courses of action too.

Admittedly, some posts have been less than friendly and maybe have not taken your particular situation into account. I think that, if you are to rely on social media, you are best to accept that some suggestions won't be either applicable or appropriate to you, and ignore those.

I too am alone in that my parents have died, my husband died, I have no children and I am not in the first flush of youth. I have a relatively new boyfriend who is not financially connected to me and who is not from a horse background. When I have been overwhelmed, I have stepped back from social media and taken advice from trusted friends and professionals like vets and trainers.

People on social media give advice according to their own experiences and mental state. If it doesn't align with yours, it is not necessarily 'bad' advice, just not applicable to you.

I would agree with posters who say that you have provided for your horse by putting him on full livery and there is no rush to make any decisions while you feel so bad. I would pop down once a week to ensure that work is being done and the horse cared for, as the yard has not covered all bases so far.

I would stand by my previous suggestions, as in to either sell quickly accepting a loss, with full disclosure, or to take the horse to a training yard to get professional help. I would usually say to have a pro come to your yard, but it seems that the cob has out-witted staff there so that may not be best. If he has now settled there, then I would get a pro to come and help you there, if keeping him is what you want to follow.

But no need to do that immediately.

Once a pro has helped with his handling, or once he is settled (which he may do without a pro) then I would get him vetted and insured. I'm afraid general vets bills can easily top £1000 for an unfortunate incident. Inflation and other things have sent vets fees up.

It may be that you would enjoy riding at a riding school more, as many horse purchases are complicated, and if you worry about finances, the outgoings on a riding school are totally controllable as opposed to ownership where a surprise vets bill can occur at any time.

Good luck with whatever you decide.

 

[Jasmine2023]

I didn't say there was anything wrong with your horse. I said he needs turning out and time to relax and then you can spend time with him doing nothing and getting to know him. No horse arrives and settles immediately. I have no idea how people can diagnose horrendous things wrong with a horse from one photo and a price.

I also very much struggle with my mental health and get it. Give yourself and your horse time. I moved my horse this time last year. I had had him for 8 years and he had always been at the same yard. He was unsettled and that was with him knowing me, I spent alot of time sitting in his field with him and doing nothing other than being with each other. Your horse dosnt even have a face he has seen before. Luckily we could do isolation in a field as he would have been very difficult if in a stable.

Take a breath, try and chill and deal with one day at a time. I get the freaking out and panicking about a less than ideal situation. You don't need to be spending loads on help or vets fees or anything just yet. Give it a month of chilling and see where you are then.

I didn't say anyone in particular had but there have been several comments about the horse possibly having problems with it's legs psd etc. things I had not heard about until I looked it up. This has added to my anxiety more than the rest of the issues

 

[SaddlePsych'D]

I guess a next step could be getting the rest of his vet check including checking his age done once the yard thinks he's settled enough to handle, then once you have that information you can go from there.

 

[cauda equina]

I didn't say anyone in particular had but there have been several comments about the horse possibly having problems with it's legs psd etc. things I had not heard about until I looked it up. This has added to my anxiety more than the rest of the issues

I could take photos of my 2 geldings which would probably get far worse comments!
Yet they both hack happily and safely

Good dealers will stand a horse square for sales photos; you can't tell much at all otherwise, except that it's a bad photo

 

[HopOnTrot]

I have hardly spoken to them since Friday. The one time I did ask about his first day of turn out they said it went fine. I basically have no plan or any idea of what to do. All I know is that if he has health issues I can't afford to fix them so what's the point in bonding with him if he will even want to bond with me.

Well you don’t know what the issue is, so how do you know you can’t afford it? There might not even be an issue!

 

[doodle]

That's him yes. Can I say thank you for being about the only one to say anything positive about him. There have been so many negative reactions to him physcially which has made me not want to try anything with him apart from sell him with full disclosure which I know will be at a loss. People have made it sound like he is going to be expensive to treat which I cannot afford.

This is what I was responding to. I wasn't saying you had picked me out specifically I was trying to point out that not everyone had said that. People are trying to help. I still think people (in general, not just you) should take responsibility for their mistakes rather than just throw hands up and say I was miss sold when a horse reacts like a horse. I have given advice, stop, breath and take your time, but your head has gone to panic mode. Again I understand that, (my mental health such that I am hospitalised, with crisis team etc) and was trying to show support as I know sometimes the hardest thing to do it to take a breath and the easiest thing to do is panic.

However I'm out now. You have been given lots of suggestions.

 

[Pearlsasinger]

You don't know whether he has anything that needs treatment, expensive or otherwise, until your vet has had a good look at him. That wasn't possible while he was desperate to get out of the stable. I wouldn't take too much notice of posters diagnosis of all kinds of problems from a few photos/a bit of video. You will need to make a decision about his future but it should be an informed decision. If he is now turned out I bet he is much easier to handle. So perhaps now would be a good time to visit him and chat with YO about what happens next.

Aos now would be a good time to visit him and chat with YOThat's him yes. Can I say thank you for being about the only one to say anything positive about him. There have been so many negative reactions to him physcially which has made me not want to try anything with him apart from sell him with full disclosure which I know will be at a loss. People have made it sound like he is going to be expensive to treat which I cannot afford. Obviously when I buy a pet I make sure I can afford vet bills but they are general vet bills not 1,000's pounds on operations etc. I usually have all my animals insured but no company will insure him with pre existing conditions. So what is the point in me getting to know him if I cannot afford to pay for expensive treatments and keep him. He has seen a vet, in case anyone missed that, but we stopped half way through due to his behaviour. His heart and lungs sounded fine and his eyes looked okay. But if there are issues with his legs as people are saying then I just cannot deal with that. I am having to deal with all this on my own. For those who are understanding of my mental health issues I thank you. Both my parents are dead, I have no children, so no one to help me here. I am married but my husband does not understand mental health issues even though I had depression when we met. It not only affects me mentally but physically as I have an irregular heart beat I get heart palpitations when stressed. I could not sleep much last because of this. I am trying my best for him too he hasn't been forgotten in all this. I just wish some people could be a little less harsh and judgemental. I made a mistake and by god am I paying for it now

 

[Jasmine2023]

@Jasmine2023 what were you riding beforehand?

You mentioned you showed the photos to your YO so did you have a relationship with the YO before? Could you keep riding whatever you were riding and then give this horse some time?

It would be unusual not to let other people on the yard as most people have their own coaches, riders, physios, farriers, trimmers, vets, sharers etc. Is there a reason for the YO not wanting other people about?

Sorry I should have stated they are also a riding school and wouldn't appreciate anyone else doing their job ie training etc. I have not been with them long I started out taking lessons and as they do livery also I took one of the stables for him.

Sadly I don't have any other horse now just Ozzy.

 

[SO1]

You can insure him. At the moment he has no vet diagnosed problems. I would be insuring as soon as possible. Any horse even with perfect conformation can get a medical problem or have an accident.

 

[Mrs. Jingle]

I didn't say anyone in particular had but there have been several comments about the horse possibly having problems with it's legs psd etc. things I had not heard about until I looked it up. This has added to my anxiety more than the rest of the issues

Please don't take too much notice of our fully self taught NAVs (Nearly a Vet) there are a few posters on here with the magic eye that can fully diagnose a horse from top to tail purely looking at a few pics, pics by the way that are far from professional and not taken to show your horse in a good light.So try to ignore if you can.

I do agree there maybe either physical or mental issues causing the behavior but you really need a thorough vetting once your horse has calmed down and isn't quite so frightened of life. Not opinion from social media enthusiasts with their own agenda.

I also believe you do owe this horse some chance and you also deserve a chance to get through this one way or another. Just to add, I have had many cob types over the years and as I got older and no longer enjoyed showing and became a nervous happy hacker, I had a few quite, shall we say, not the best specimens of cobs, but by golly with their dodgy confirmation, less than ideal paces and quirky habits without exception they were all ideal very safe happy hackers. After they had settled in of course.

Good luck and please try to remain calm while things settle down and you can make reasoned decisions and protect your own health as well as your new horse's.

 

[LadyGascoyne]

Sorry I should have stated they are also a riding school and wouldn't appreciate anyone else doing their job ie training etc. I have not been with them long I started out taking lessons and as they do livery also I took one of the stables for him.

Sadly I don't have any other horse now just Ozzy.

It might be worth asking regardless. My horses are at a pro yard and the pro offers riding, coaching, etc but she's happy for me to bring my own dressage coach. I use her for everything else.

Could you keep up riding lessons on one of the school horses?

 

[cauda equina]

I don't know how you, or the yard, would feel about this, but I wonder if he could go on working livery and be used in the riding school?
He'd get worked and you'd get to see what sort of horse he turns into
I slightly wonder if the YO had this in mind all along, hence her advising you to buy him from the photos

 

[Mrs. Jingle]

I don't know how you, or the yard, would feel about this, but I wonder if he could go on working livery and be used in the riding school?
He'd get worked and you'd get to see what sort of horse he turns into
I slightly wonder if the YO had this in mind all along, hence her advising you to buy him from the photos

Gosh, you are as cynical as me cauda equina!

 

[Jasmine2023]

It might be worth asking regardless. My horses are at a pro yard and the pro offers riding, coaching, etc but she's happy for me to bring my own dressage coach. I use her for everything else.

Could you keep up riding lessons on one of the school horses?

I have been having lessons on one of their horses.

 

[jhoward]

I didn't say anyone in particular had but there have been several comments about the horse possibly having problems with it's legs psd etc. things I had not heard about until I looked it up. This has added to my anxiety more than the rest of the issues

This will always be a thing when you post on a public forum you have to expect the good and the bad, just remember it's just people's opinions you don't know these people so don't over think it..bit like Google you could probably self diagnose yourself and the cob with all sorts of ailments that actually don't exist. However that said there are some very knowledgeable and kind people on here.

Ask the yard staff to have a look at his teeth see if anyone has the experience to age him. There's a high chance he's younger than 8. That would explain some issues ...he could of been broken in Badly. Then a rider chucked on for videos etc riders in dealers yards have stickability and dealers know all the tricks in the books to get a horse quieter. But this sort of thing could explain how he's ended up at dealers, some one like yrself gets him home hops on to a badly broken in and pony that doesn't have a clue reacts Badley rider lands up on the floor sends pony back and so the cycle begins.

Cobs by nature are yes bolshy but they are not generally bad ponies.

Id also suggest taking out some insurance on him then leave him to settle in for a couple of weeks. And if you think he's lame or has a issue call the vet ( most insurances will require a couple of weeks before you can claim. )
I honestly don't see an issue with just leaving him be for a moment and letting him settle in to the routine of the yard/people.

 

[Gloi]

I don't know how you, or the yard, would feel about this, but I wonder if he could go on working livery and be used in the riding school?
He'd get worked and you'd get to see what sort of horse he turns into
I slightly wonder if the YO had this in mind all along, hence her advising you to buy him from the photos

Cynic here too. It happens a lot.

 

[Miss_Millie]

I didn't say anyone in particular had but there have been several comments about the horse possibly having problems with it's legs psd etc. things I had not heard about until I looked it up. This has added to my anxiety more than the rest of the issues

I'm sorry that you're going through this Jasmine, those kinds of comments are so incredibly unhelpful and realistically no-one can possibly know from looking at a couple of static photos whether or not a horse has health problems. It could be that he is just a young cob lacking muscle who is in need of some TLC.

Equally, you can buy a clean-limbed horse who passes a 5 stage vetting and find a whole host of problems down the line. Sadly that's the gamble with horses, you always have to be prepared for something to come up. Unfortunately many of us have ended up with walking vet bills, despite ticking all of the boxes in the purchasing process. Buying unseen is much more of a risk, but you're best off working with the horse you have in front of you now.

If he were mine, I'd start bonding with him in the stable or out in the field on his terms. Let him come to you, give him a scratch and some treats, get to know him. When you feel that he's less scared and defensive, try ascertaining if there's anything standing out to you health-wise. Pick out his feet, watch him move to see if he seems comfortable or if there is any lameness present, run your hands over him for any lumps and bumps. You may well find that he just needs some better management/lifestyle changes. It's important to make sure that he's up to date on the basics though - teeth, feet, vaccinations. Once he's less defensive, another vet visit to make sure his teeth are okay is essential if it hasn't been done already.

As someone who has been clinically depressed in the past, I really empathise with what you're going through, but in my experience, inaction will only heighten your stress and anxious feelings. It may be that Ozzy needs you as much as you need him, so go give your pony a hug and tell him you're going to look after each other.

The offer above from dottielottie is lovely, I would take her up on that

 

[Jasmine2023]

So how can I see if a Passport is genuine or not? I have looked up his number and all details seems to say he's 8 years old and he's micro chipped too.