cauda equina
Well-Known Member
I did, and didn't see anything that would stop him having a job as a hack
What did you see?
Bought unseen problems returning
- Thread starter Jasmine2023
- Start date
- Status
What did you see?
HBB
Well-Known Member
@Jasmine2023 This must be hugely overwhelming but try not to allow it to consume you and end up in a MH downward spiral. Try and take one day at a time, get to know the pony without any added stress and pressure to actually do something with him. Go in his paddock, poo pick, wander about and start from there, you may find a connection with him.
He sounds completely overwhelmed too and needs to decompress, give him a bit of time. Let your yard help with day to day handling but again don't add further pressure to this lad.
I am not going to add to any further stress to you by going over the buying process and the dealer, I just want you to take time and decompress and try not to catastrophize or you will make yourself ill.
He sounds completely overwhelmed too and needs to decompress, give him a bit of time. Let your yard help with day to day handling but again don't add further pressure to this lad.
I am not going to add to any further stress to you by going over the buying process and the dealer, I just want you to take time and decompress and try not to catastrophize or you will make yourself ill.
paddy555
Well-Known Member
the passport is a great idea. Do you have the original passport Jasmine?
before any decision can even be considered Jasmine2023 needs to know exactly what she is looking at. Is this a horse who has been so upset by the move, kept in, maybe had some poor handling. Turned out and with reasonable handling he may be a lot better and his handling needs may not be such of a problem. If he can at least be reasonably handled it will be easier to sell him. Give an experienced person a couple of hours and you will learn at lot. You don't need a behaviourist just someone experienced. Is there perhaps a local instructor who you could pay for a couple of hours to asses him? Someone away from your yard who starts with an open mind. As he is already ridden they may be able to try him if he behaves to see where you are with riding.
It may be if his behaviour was assessed and reasonably OK he could be sold to an experienced home. Behaviour wise he wouldn't bother me in the slightest and I'm sure there are many other similar people.
From the health side ask the "instructor" to handle him for a vetting. This will then give you more info. from reasonably OK to serious problems.
Having got all of that info ie health and handling you will be in a position to make a decision.
whilst it may not be very desirable this is a very stressed horse who was probably even more stressed being restrained. It's not the end of the world
tristars
Well-Known Member
There's kicking out and kicking out, if they are being seriously mean they usually get ya
meandmyself
Well-Known Member
Honestly, it's so hard to actually tell anything meaningful from videos - I have clips of my lad where he looks like a total loon, and clips where he looks like tnt wouldn't shift him.
I don't know how to say this without sounding harsh, and it's not meant in a nasty way at all (god knows I've had my own MH battles) but you sound stuck in a bit of a loop at the moment. What's happened has happened and now you need to move forward. You've had a lot of good suggestions here and I agree that getting someone confident and experienced to spend a couple of hours with him (and ideally hold him for the vet) would be a good start.
How is he behaving now he's getting some Dr. Green?
Beausmate
Well-Known Member
Could you afford the vet if he needed, say, a cut stapled on a Sunday afternoon? It would cost you less than that to get a trainer in for a couple of sessions, so look at it as treating his mental health.
cauda equina
Well-Known Member
Some good things here you (or someone) might try
Some of it is about specific vet jobs, some is just general handling
www.youtube.com
Some of it is about specific vet jobs, some is just general handling
Don't Break Your Vet!
Equine vets have one of the highest injury risks of all civilian professions. To help address this serious issue the British Equine Veterinary Association (B...
www.youtube.com
Jasmine2023
Well-Known Member
Sadly it is already making me ill. I feel so sick all the time and all I want to do is sleep. I can't go see him at the moment as I don't want to get attached when ultimately I don't know what to do with him. I can't believe I got conned like this when I am normally a savvy person but sadly my heart ruled my head when I saw him.
SEL
Well-Known Member
I feel for you OP. I follow the dodgy dealer FB pages because I was shopping 3 years ago and Devine Cobs set off alarms even then.
You won't get your money back (these dealers couldn't care less about court judgements) but leaving the ethics of swapping him to one side - is there even a horse you'd want from them to replace him with? If there is and you can get it independently vetted BEFORE parting with cash then do it. It doesn't secure the future of the one you have but you can move on. I'm just not sure you'd trust the dealer with anything now after this though.
Otherwise chuck him in a field and just spend time getting to know him over the fence. Take things slowly.
Gloi
Too little time, too much to read.
Does his passport have his history in it back to birth or is it a replacement one?
AlinFaolan
Well-Known Member
There was a post a little while ago, if I remember rightly the pony was seen before purchase and was for a child. The pony was a nightmare when it arrived, new owners wanted to return it, but given a short amount of time to settle it became the pony they thought they had bought. Not saying this lad will be absolutely as described, but given a couple of weeks to settle and get used to you and the new yard maybe a different boy to what you have at the moment.
Gloi
Too little time, too much to read.
We had a Fell gelding that was normally extremely quiet but being kept in even overnight turned him into a snorting hyped up lunatic as we first found out when we bathed him one time ready for an early show the next morning. 
Have the staff at the yard commented on how he is now he is in the field? He might be different altogether. Just going down and giving him a carrot over the gate and talking to him might let you both settle down. Just give him a bit of time to get used to a new home. You don't have to have it in your head about needing to ride in the future. Just be a pet for a while and get an experienced person to hold him for the vet and dentist.
Have the staff at the yard commented on how he is now he is in the field? He might be different altogether. Just going down and giving him a carrot over the gate and talking to him might let you both settle down. Just give him a bit of time to get used to a new home. You don't have to have it in your head about needing to ride in the future. Just be a pet for a while and get an experienced person to hold him for the vet and dentist.
KatieDM
Well-Known Member
I would get the support of somebody used to handling challenging horses. Turn him out, get the basics sorted - worming, jabs, maybe no hard feed yet but if his condition is quite poor he might need something at some point.
Let him relax and recover somewhat. Then start to bring him into work from scratch. As if he’s unbroken. Establish boundaries and manners on the ground.
See how he is then. He needs to feel safer and find trust in you as his handler. It’s not what you expected no, but other than sending him back I don’t see another solution. I feel for you and the poor horse.
Let him relax and recover somewhat. Then start to bring him into work from scratch. As if he’s unbroken. Establish boundaries and manners on the ground.
See how he is then. He needs to feel safer and find trust in you as his handler. It’s not what you expected no, but other than sending him back I don’t see another solution. I feel for you and the poor horse.
Jasmine2023
Well-Known Member
This is the thing I could have been to see him and he could have been exactly as seen in the videos but has got here and is a totally different horse. Viewing doesn't always guarantee anything.
I am 63 in a couple of months I don't have loads of riding time left to have him as just a pet for however long that will take sadly .We had a Fell gelding that was normally extremely quiet but being kept in even overnight turned him into a snorting hyped up lunatic as we first found out when we bathed him one time ready for an early show the next morning.
Have the staff at the yard commented on how he is now he is in the field? He might be different altogether. Just going down and giving him a carrot over the gate and talking to him might let you both settle down. Just give him a bit of time to get used to a new home. You don't have to have it in your head about needing to ride in the future. Just be a pet for a while and get an experienced person to hold him for the vet and dentist.
cauda equina
Well-Known Member
Horses are almost always different when you move them, and who can blame them?
Everything in their world has changed so it's not surprising if their behaviour changes too
Everything in their world has changed so it's not surprising if their behaviour changes too
palo1
Well-Known Member
I very rarely comment on these posts but...I appreciate you have some serious health issues and that you wanted a horse to help get you out and feeling better. With a little bit of help, which someone may give for free or very little cost, you do have a horse and potentially a very rewarding project. He may have significant health issues but horses can get hurt or sick any time - we cannot avoid that risk. He may still be good for you in many ways even if he doesn't seem suitable for riding. I would suggest considering how he might be a good thing and still of some value to you, whilst you do your best for him. Lots of people on this forum have had unridden horses that are absolutely brilliant in terms of interest, comfort, companionship, learning and health. I wish you well @Jasmine2023 whatever you decide but hope you can develop a bit of interest in your horse.
marmalade76
Well-Known Member
£10k cheaper than he could have been? Come on, who the hell pays £15k for a hacking cob?
As for those saying sell with full disclosure and you might get a grand or two back, he will simply be snapped up by yet another dealer and end up back on the merry go round again. My guess is he is either younger than advertised/his passport claims or he's done nothing, been dragged out of field and had some tack chucked on him for photos.
wills_91
Well-Known Member
OP wants to ride. She doesn't owe this horse anything.
OP I wouldn't be surprised if you stopped commenting here. If his basic needs are being met and he's safe & secure there is absolutely no harm in stepping back for a few weeks until you decide what you want to do.
Patterdale
Well-Known Member
Have you considered that maybe he might end up needing you just as much as you need him? Sometimes these things happen for a reason. Not every time, but sometimes
Anyway, he’s being turned out and that will settle him to some degree.
You don’t need to make any decisions today xx
AdorableAlice
Well-Known Member
Very sadly the position the OP finds herself in is far too common and there is no doubt the trading of dealers, be it bin end or elite needs regulating.
With my legal hat on, I would urge the OP to speak to the trading standards officer covering the premises address, whilst TS won't take her case she may well find that many more complaints have been made over a period of time and her experience can form part of an ongoing evidence gathering intelligence exercise which may, in the future lead to legal action being possible. Looking through some information regarding the premises it does seem that some individuals involved are banned from keeping animals. That ban may be farmed animals not horses though. This is information TS will already hold.
The CCJ route would be fruitless even with a judgement as the type of person running the business will have no fear of magistrate courts or their judgement or any future impact on their credit rating.
There has been endless assumption of what the little cob is or isn't. Assumption helps no one. Hopefully the OP, when her health permits, can have help from a horseman and hopefully the horse can become suitable for her needs. Very best of luck, horses are wonderful for mental health and well being, I hope you can achieve your dreams.
With my legal hat on, I would urge the OP to speak to the trading standards officer covering the premises address, whilst TS won't take her case she may well find that many more complaints have been made over a period of time and her experience can form part of an ongoing evidence gathering intelligence exercise which may, in the future lead to legal action being possible. Looking through some information regarding the premises it does seem that some individuals involved are banned from keeping animals. That ban may be farmed animals not horses though. This is information TS will already hold.
The CCJ route would be fruitless even with a judgement as the type of person running the business will have no fear of magistrate courts or their judgement or any future impact on their credit rating.
There has been endless assumption of what the little cob is or isn't. Assumption helps no one. Hopefully the OP, when her health permits, can have help from a horseman and hopefully the horse can become suitable for her needs. Very best of luck, horses are wonderful for mental health and well being, I hope you can achieve your dreams.
Pearlsasinger
Up in the clouds
Unfortunately she does owe the horse something, she is now his owner, like it or not.
OP, if it is better for your health to ignore your new horse, then do so but as you are paying the livery bill you might as well get some benefit from your investment. Just spending time in the company of horses can do wonders for MH issues, people pay just to spend half an hour grooming someone else's horse at RDA sessions or similar.
FieldOrnaments
Well-Known Member
If I wasn't about 300 miles from you I'd come and help. Cobs can be the most incredible horses, strong, sensitive, affectionate and surprisingly athletic for chunky beasts, I absolutely adore them and would take a green cob any day over a fancy WB. 
(Sorry!)
Regardless best of luck with whatever you choose to do but don't underestimate the companionship of a horse in helping the emotional wellbeing of both the person and the horse, it would do you both good to spend some no pressure time together, even just grazing in hand maybe or sitting with him whilst he's out in the field. (I have fairly complex mh issues and love doing this.)
I can understand you're disappointed but he's a living being who deserves sympathy and empathy as well. Dodgy dealers hurt people and animals and he's been through a lot, it's no wonder he's unsettled.
(Sorry!)Regardless best of luck with whatever you choose to do but don't underestimate the companionship of a horse in helping the emotional wellbeing of both the person and the horse, it would do you both good to spend some no pressure time together, even just grazing in hand maybe or sitting with him whilst he's out in the field. (I have fairly complex mh issues and love doing this.)
I can understand you're disappointed but he's a living being who deserves sympathy and empathy as well. Dodgy dealers hurt people and animals and he's been through a lot, it's no wonder he's unsettled.
ester
Not slacking multitasking
They've posted on this thread
OP the reality is that horses are stressful I've always said it comes out about evens good mental health things vs additional stresses/worry
cauda equina
Well-Known Member
To misquote Homer Simpson:
Horses - the cause of and the solution to all of life's problems
Horses - the cause of and the solution to all of life's problems
HBB
Well-Known Member
Oh @Jasmine2023 I really feel for you, please don't beat yourself up! You saw something in him that you loved, you had a connection and you acted on it, he is still that same horse. Allow yourself to go and see him, it might do you the world of good and him too, can you imagine the stress he might be experiencing in a new unfamiliar environment. Some of the best "happy Hacker" types can have a wobble when moving yards, so this might just be a temporary blip for him. I wish I lived closer to come over and meet him and see whats going on.
It is so easy to catastrophize and fall into a deep dark place of anxiety and doubt but give yourself a day or 2 to have a calm moment, it might not be as bad as it feels now xx
Last edited:
nutjob
Well-Known Member
The lady who is riding most of the horses looks identical to Lucia (Kate) Stanton who in 2023 was banned from owning, dealing, transporting and arranging transport for horses for 10 years.
Leeds teenager handed 10-year ban on owning horses after miniature pony found with ‘heavy lice infestation’
A Leeds teenager has been banned from owning horses for 10 years after admitting causing unnecessary suffering to a miniature pony.
www.yorkshireeveningpost.co.uk
There was someone on one of the dodgy dealer pages who was trying to get the RSPCA to follow up as you can see her face in some of the pictures and some people had previously taken video footage but I assume this didn't come to anything.
Since then, the number 1 rule at Devine cobs (in capitals) is that you are not allow to photograph or film the staff which is something I have never come across at any other dealing yard and I've been around a few relatively recently.
I have personally found trading standards to be rubbish but it very much depends on the area that the dealer is in. Also, while there may be multiple people complaining about a dodgy dealer on fb they often have not reported the problem to trading standards.
@Jasmine2023 if you paid by bank transfer, contact your banks fraud department and see if they can help you reverse the transaction as the horse is not as described and you want to return.
Beausmate
Well-Known Member
HMRC might be interested, as I bet they're not paying tax.
Jasmine2023
Well-Known Member
Thank you for your understanding. I know that people are worried about Ozzy but at the moment it's all very raw for me and of course I am concerned with how I am feeling at the moment. Depression does that to you it's awful and you can't think straight or logically. Ozzy is being cared for he is on full livery and turned out during the day now.
wills_91
Well-Known Member
She owes the horse a decent standard of care and to make sure his basic needs are met. She doesn't owe it to him to spend time with him if she doesn't want to nor does she owe him thousands in investigations
I'm not sure how many times she has to say she is scared of him & currently doesn't have the capacity to spend time with him or the finances to pay a pro before people stop suggesting it over and over
The horse is safe and secure and now has access to turnout. It reads like he is in full livery so all his needs are being met. She does not owe this horse anything else.
Jasmine2023
Well-Known Member
wills_91 he is on full livery.
- Status