Bought unseen problems returning

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jhoward said:
I think she ment the yard owner tbf to her
Although the post about him on trace my horse indicates the owner of Izzy is younger person with kids so who knows.
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I'm going to guess that the person who posted him is a forum member trying to help and not Jasmine who started this thread. They seem to live in the north east, not Bradford so I'd say two different people ☺️
 
Jasmine2023 said:
Thank you that is exactly how I feel. I now feel unable to cope with any of this and I think the best thing for him and me is to sell him on. I will be having a chat this morning with the YO and see what we can work out. I was promised help with him from them but so far nothing but quiet and only talk to me when I message them.
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Good luck this morning. And I'm glad you've come to a decision.
 
Jasmine today is a new day. Tomorrow is another new day. Try to treat each day as a fresh start with him. Your yard are definitely best placed to help you but they can't help if you aren't attempting to help yourself too. You have to make the effort to go see him and yes it's hard but you have to want to do it. Right now you're definitely very unsure and it's ok to feel that. We all get days we feel what the hell did i do or i can't do this anymore. Reach out please . There are a lot of judgemental comments that are not helpful nor particularly kind but are direct and that is how some people are, but it doesn't mean they are being horrible to you. They are trying to help too. It's just very difficult to read that online and it's all too easy to misunderstand the context.
Please don't take it to heart and I think you really need to speak to your gp or mental health team as to how you are feeling about this all. Maybe a mental health support worker could be a useful assistant in this situation as can advocate for you to the yard and help you work through what you're feeling and see if you can actually begin to enjoy it.
 
I think it might be helpful if we now stop guessing what might or might not be a problem with him to be honest. It is only adding fuel to the fire of pressure on Jasmine's mental health at the moment, which has suffered a major set back by the sound of things. Lets just be here to encourage any steps forward as and when they come, which I am sure they will with all the help and advice that has been offered.
 
@Jasmine2023 - as others have said, just take your time...lots of us can understand how you feel. None of us would blame you if you've come to a decision to sell, but unless there's another reason, do take time to think things through and take advice from friendly & supportive people.

Look how many of us have stories about horses that appeared very badly behaved when they arrived on the yard after purchase - it's really not uncommon.
My first horse was very bad tempered when he arrived on the yard. I'd ridden him before purchase and he seemed fine - my only reservation at the time was that he seemed very attached to his (then) owner. When we got him to our yard he was grumpy, bad tempered and actually quite violent when given a feed bucket. I felt totally overwhelmed and went home thinking 'what have I done?'
That horse is now 26 years old - we've had him for 22 years. My husband, who wasn't horsey at all, learnt to ride on him and ended up hunting him (drag and bloodhounds) for years. I won't pretend that there weren't hiccups along the way but we've had so many brilliant times with that cob. And here's the thing: I wanted a horse because riding and being around horses was really good for my mental health. After all these years I can honestly say that our first horse - and the two I owned subsequently - have been brilliant for me; at times it's the main thing that's kept me going.
 
@Jasmine2023 . HHO can be a fabulous place, but sadly it seems a lot of people do still enjoy the primary school mentality of giving people a good kicking, being amazingly negative and rude and making everything way worse.
Very good luck with your horse and if you ever feel able to stick your head above the parapet again to ask for advice or support just get really good at filtering out the doomsters who do nothing to help.
Good luck.
 
Also I just remembered the time I moved mine to yard where it turned out the turnout situation was not what we were expecting when they said they stayed in if there was really bad weather, i assumed they might have to stay in the odd day if there was a storm or something, what they actually meant was everytime there was a few rain showers they'd be in for days on end to wait for the field to dry then if you were lucky you'd get a day or two of turnout before another bit of rain came. My very sane, sensible lovely gentle pony turned into a fire breathing dragon who I was scared to lead anywhere by the end of day 3 of being kept in, he is the most gentle pony who normally wouldn't dream of hurting me but he
spinning, bucking and rearing with feet aimed at me because he was so frustrated, all he wanted was to be free to do pony stuff. We left that yard ASAP and as soon he was turned out again he was back to his usual gentle self. This happened to other people as well who had well behaved horses that just couldnt cope with being kept in, if I hadn't already known my pony and known that he was actually a nice person when this happened and that was my first impression of him I would have panicked.
In a rambling sort of way what I'm trying to say is don't underestimate the effect being kept in can have on even the nicest of horses, maybe give him some time getting settled just getting to know him and give him another chance, he might be a lovely boy really that just didn't cope with all the change very well.
 
I moved house recently with 6 horses.
So they all moved house too.
4 of them were totally normal. One was edgy for a few weeks. But my horse, who isn’t great at having his routine changed, was almost unhandleable and definitely unrideable. It’s taken ages for him to settle, and that’s with the same owner, same field friends and still 24 hour turnout.

He is usually the easiest horse in every way, but moving just really worries him.

Some are just like that. If that makes you feel better - doesn’t mean he’s a bad horse or that he was drugged before.

He will settle, they all do in the end but you can speed it up with plenty of turnout, friends, a routine, and going to see him every day with a carrot 🦄
 
Patterdale said:
I moved house recently with 6 horses.
So they all moved house too.
4 of them were totally normal. One was edgy for a few weeks. But my horse, who isn’t great at having his routine changed, was almost unhandleable and definitely unrideable. It’s taken ages for him to settle, and that’s with the same owner, same field friends and still 24 hour turnout.

He is usually the easiest horse in every way, but moving just really worries him.

Some are just like that. If that makes you feel better - doesn’t mean he’s a bad horse or that he was drugged before.

He will settle, they all do in the end but you can speed it up with plenty of turnout, friends, a routine, and going to see him every day with a carrot 🦄
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Yes, OP, if you make yourself part of his routine, he will make you part of his 'herd' and look forward to seeing you.
 
Ozzy was bought to help with my mental health and arthritis. With my last horse I found my knees strengthened since I took up riding and lessons. I could get up stairs easier than used to. More often than not the only time I got out was when I went out riding or to the stable. Due to my health issues I am usually very fatigued which makes doing things and being positive very hard. I often suffer with anaemia also and at the moment I have my second bout of Vitamin D deficiency all of which can also make you tired. I have an ectopic heart beat, under active thyroid, gastritis, arthritis, psoriasis, as well as mental health issues. It's no wonder that at times I feel like giving up. I had to retire early due to my ill health about 13 years ago. I don't often envy people anything but I do envy those with good health. So something like this can really put me in a bad place. Believe it or not I am actually quite a strong person I have had to be so as not to take the step of quitting from life. I lost both my parents over the last 5 years and have never really got over it. I watched my mum dying of copd behind for the last year of her life all the while dad was getting dementia and ended up in care after mum died. So I think that explains why I have had a melt down over this it's just another bad thing in my life on top of other bad things.

So that's me warts and all. Please be gentle I know many of you have been and I appreciate that.
 
Jasmine2023 said:
Ozzy was bought to help with my mental health and arthritis. With my last horse I found my knees strengthened since I took up riding and lessons. I could get up stairs easier than used to. More often than not the only time I got out was when I went out riding or to the stable. Due to my health issues I am usually very fatigued which makes doing things and being positive very hard. I often suffer with anaemia also and at the moment I have my second bout of Vitamin D deficiency all of which can also make you tired. I have an ectopic heart beat, under active thyroid, gastritis, arthritis, psoriasis, as well as mental health issues. It's no wonder that at times I feel like giving up. I had to retire early due to my ill health about 13 years ago. I don't often envy people anything but I do envy those with good health. So something like this can really put me in a bad place. Believe it or not I am actually quite a strong person I have had to be so as not to take the step of quitting from life. I lost both my parents over the last 5 years and have never really got over it. I watched my mum dying of copd behind for the last year of her life all the while dad was getting dementia and ended up in care after mum died. So I think that explains why I have had a melt down over this it's just another bad thing in my life on top of other bad things.

So that's me warts and all. Please be gentle I know many of you have been and I appreciate that.
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You have a lot going on.

How did it go this morning?
 
Jasmine2023 said:
Ozzy was bought to help with my mental health and arthritis. With my last horse I found my knees strengthened since I took up riding and lessons. I could get up stairs easier than used to. More often than not the only time I got out was when I went out riding or to the stable. Due to my health issues I am usually very fatigued which makes doing things and being positive very hard. I often suffer with anaemia also and at the moment I have my second bout of Vitamin D deficiency all of which can also make you tired. I have an ectopic heart beat, under active thyroid, gastritis, arthritis, psoriasis, as well as mental health issues. It's no wonder that at times I feel like giving up. I had to retire early due to my ill health about 13 years ago. I don't often envy people anything but I do envy those with good health. So something like this can really put me in a bad place. Believe it or not I am actually quite a strong person I have had to be so as not to take the step of quitting from life. I lost both my parents over the last 5 years and have never really got over it. I watched my mum dying of copd behind for the last year of her life all the while dad was getting dementia and ended up in care after mum died. So I think that explains why I have had a melt down over this it's just another bad thing in my life on top of other bad things.

So that's me warts and all. Please be gentle I know many of you have been and I appreciate that.
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And hopefully one way or another , this situation will lead to a positive outcome one way or another. Totally overwhelming as it is now, my fingers are crossed for you both and I reckon he has a kind eye and may grow on you. I also have several of your ailments and I believe the routine of being at the yard daily has huge health and mental health benefits.
 
Wow, OP, you have really been through it...I admire you!

Horses have got the most amazing power to help heal us. I have suffered with various MH problems for decades but the positive impact of being around horses has been priceless.
There was a really bad phase around the time of Covid when AJ was literally the only reason I got out of bed. I am so thankful to have him.
I also agree that having a routine of caring for the horses has been brilliant. And at times they have provided a much-needed distraction for me when other stuff was going on.

I've had some nasty health issues (but nothing like yours) - two years ago I was finally diagnosed as gluten intolerant and now, in my 60s, I feel better than I ever did - and more able to enjoy my hacking as well as just being with the two gees.

So many people are here to encourage and support you in any way we can.
 
Jasmine2023 said:
Ozzy was bought to help with my mental health and arthritis. With my last horse I found my knees strengthened since I took up riding and lessons. I could get up stairs easier than used to. More often than not the only time I got out was when I went out riding or to the stable. Due to my health issues I am usually very fatigued which makes doing things and being positive very hard. I often suffer with anaemia also and at the moment I have my second bout of Vitamin D deficiency all of which can also make you tired. I have an ectopic heart beat, under active thyroid, gastritis, arthritis, psoriasis, as well as mental health issues. It's no wonder that at times I feel like giving up. I had to retire early due to my ill health about 13 years ago. I don't often envy people anything but I do envy those with good health. So something like this can really put me in a bad place. Believe it or not I am actually quite a strong person I have had to be so as not to take the step of quitting from life. I lost both my parents over the last 5 years and have never really got over it. I watched my mum dying of copd behind for the last year of her life all the while dad was getting dementia and ended up in care after mum died. So I think that explains why I have had a melt down over this it's just another bad thing in my life on top of other bad things.

So that's me warts and all. Please be gentle I know many of you have been and I appreciate that.
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I really am sorry for your struggles. I've had my own share of health problems and know exactly how debilitating they can be.

But please don't fixate on him being a "bad thing". He's a horse and it'll take time to get to know each other. It's positive that you've already ridden him!

Give him a chance to be a good thing. 💐💐💐
 
Spottyappy said:
Just a thought on the legs, as he was so reactive-
Could he have Mallanders or cpl?
Both can make a horse very reactive if they are sore, and it’s also the kind of thing many vets actually miss on feathered horses. Even with a 5* vetting.
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Bloody hell, what is the matter with you people??!?
And he could have a dicky heart, drop dead with ruptured aeorta, brain haemorrhage, blood vessel - anything else an armchair expert who has never laid eyes on the pony could helpfully deduce here?
He is likely very unsettled and will probably calm right back down again.
OP might have a reasonable chance of doing the same, if people stop making: 1. contributions like this, 2. nasty, totally unhelpful comments. Think on.
If there’s any health issue, that’s for the vet to diagnose, and even if so, there are myriad horses with all sorts of health issues living very happy and comfortable lives hacking and giving joy to their owners.
 
Jasmine2023 said:
Ozzy was bought to help with my mental health and arthritis. With my last horse I found my knees strengthened since I took up riding and lessons. I could get up stairs easier than used to. More often than not the only time I got out was when I went out riding or to the stable. Due to my health issues I am usually very fatigued which makes doing things and being positive very hard. I often suffer with anaemia also and at the moment I have my second bout of Vitamin D deficiency all of which can also make you tired. I have an ectopic heart beat, under active thyroid, gastritis, arthritis, psoriasis, as well as mental health issues. It's no wonder that at times I feel like giving up. I had to retire early due to my ill health about 13 years ago. I don't often envy people anything but I do envy those with good health. So something like this can really put me in a bad place. Believe it or not I am actually quite a strong person I have had to be so as not to take the step of quitting from life. I lost both my parents over the last 5 years and have never really got over it. I watched my mum dying of copd behind for the last year of her life all the while dad was getting dementia and ended up in care after mum died. So I think that explains why I have had a melt down over this it's just another bad thing in my life on top of other bad things.

So that's me warts and all. Please be gentle I know many of you have been and I appreciate that.
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This could be the beginning of your 'recovery' from the bad phase of your life. Just take time to get to know Ozzy, without the pressure of any time limit. No horse is going to magically cure all your illnesses but just being in their company can make us feel better. And when you know him better you will.probably feel like doing more with him.

He really hasn't done anything that wasn't predictable from a new horse shut in an unfamiliar stable. It is unfortunate that got mixed up with the 'dodgy dealer' discussion. But now you have made the wise decision not to try to get a refund, you can move forward.

Sadly illness and consequent death of parents is something that all of us of a 'certain age' have to deal with and as we age we all start finding out that we aren't as healthy as we thought we were(!). I know I have.
I am sorry you are so unwell, please can I suggest that when you get your VitD sorted out you continue to take a supplement all year round? I have to, VitD deficiency runs in my family. And you know that a deficiency makes you feel worse
 
OP- I think he will be fine.

it appears you’ve ridden him and I assume that went well and he didn’t chuck you off so that’s a great start.

Yes he’s been funny with the vet, mucking out etc but he had been cooped up in his stable, no turn out, in a new home with different people and was being faffed about with by a vet. He can definitely be given the benefit of the doubt.

I think you will be posting again in a couple weeks and tell us how he’s settled and a completely different horse.
 
Exasperated said:
Bloody hell, what is the matter with you people??!?
And he could have a dicky heart, drop dead with ruptured aeorta, brain haemorrhage, blood vessel - anything else an armchair expert who has never laid eyes on the pony could helpfully deduce here?
He is likely very unsettled and will probably calm right back down again.
OP might have a reasonable chance of doing the same, if people stop making: 1. contributions like this, 2. nasty, totally unhelpful comments. Think on.
If there’s any health issue, that’s for the vet to diagnose, and even if so, there are myriad horses with all sorts of health issues living very happy and comfortable lives hacking and giving joy to their owners.
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I think you’ve just added things that weren’t said. No one else has.
Also, IF you read the thread, you’ll see OP said heart etc were checked and were fine.
Jasmine, I hope you find your YO helpful today, and I hope that you feel better after seeing the horse and Yo. 🩷
 
Hi Jasmine

I hope you are feeling a little better today. I experienced a lot of issues with my mental health about eighteen months ago due to the significant difficulties DD was having at school and her own mental health. I didn't want to ride for a while, my non-horsy husband pointed out that the horse was happy on livery with her day to day needs being met and not to worry about it. He was quite right and this took the pressure off. Assuming the horse is on full livery let the yard look after him and go and see him as and when you are ready. If the yard isn't able to provide you with the support you need with him in the longer term then you can look at other options, but again this can be as when you are ready. Equally if you would like a vet to come and see him again they can, but this doesn't have to be today, tomorrow or even next week.

I will say that that rather ill-mannered cob that arrived on the yard where I ride a few months ago, has with some input from the yard staff made huge improvements. The family who own the cob are now really enjoying horse ownership and making progress each week.

Just give yourself time and don't think you have to do anything immediately. As long has his basic needs are being met and he doesn't present with a health need that require immediate input you take as long as you need.

Best wishes
Waxwing
 
Jasmine2023 said:
Ozzy was bought to help with my mental health and arthritis. With my last horse I found my knees strengthened since I took up riding and lessons. I could get up stairs easier than used to. More often than not the only time I got out was when I went out riding or to the stable. Due to my health issues I am usually very fatigued which makes doing things and being positive very hard. I often suffer with anaemia also and at the moment I have my second bout of Vitamin D deficiency all of which can also make you tired. I have an ectopic heart beat, under active thyroid, gastritis, arthritis, psoriasis, as well as mental health issues. It's no wonder that at times I feel like giving up. I had to retire early due to my ill health about 13 years ago. I don't often envy people anything but I do envy those with good health. So something like this can really put me in a bad place. Believe it or not I am actually quite a strong person I have had to be so as not to take the step of quitting from life. I lost both my parents over the last 5 years and have never really got over it. I watched my mum dying of copd behind for the last year of her life all the while dad was getting dementia and ended up in care after mum died. So I think that explains why I have had a melt down over this it's just another bad thing in my life on top of other bad things.

So that's me warts and all. Please be gentle I know many of you have been and I appreciate that.
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I keep a lot of what I have going on under wraps. I also struggle with my health. Have spinal cysts, EDS, POTS, diabetes, arthritis and mentally while somehow i have remained sane I have lost a child at age 12, my own mum died suddenly, seen my husbands mum and dad both die, I have issues around my spinal health and nerves and the problems it brings and my husband has cancer. I really do get completely how hard life can be, BUT horses are my life, probably the one thing that has actually helped me beyond anything else and i mean counselling, medical treatments etc. I have 2 horses currently and neither are what most would want to deal with. Please give you and Ozzy a chance. He may just be the best thing you have found yet for your health.
 
Jasmine2023 said:
Ozzy was bought to help with my mental health and arthritis. With my last horse I found my knees strengthened since I took up riding and lessons. I could get up stairs easier than used to. More often than not the only time I got out was when I went out riding or to the stable. Due to my health issues I am usually very fatigued which makes doing things and being positive very hard. I often suffer with anaemia also and at the moment I have my second bout of Vitamin D deficiency all of which can also make you tired. I have an ectopic heart beat, under active thyroid, gastritis, arthritis, psoriasis, as well as mental health issues. It's no wonder that at times I feel like giving up. I had to retire early due to my ill health about 13 years ago. I don't often envy people anything but I do envy those with good health. So something like this can really put me in a bad place. Believe it or not I am actually quite a strong person I have had to be so as not to take the step of quitting from life. I lost both my parents over the last 5 years and have never really got over it. I watched my mum dying of copd behind for the last year of her life all the while dad was getting dementia and ended up in care after mum died. So I think that explains why I have had a melt down over this it's just another bad thing in my life on top of other bad things.

So that's me warts and all. Please be gentle I know many of you have been and I appreciate that.
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Okay I’ve been pondering over what I want to say, and how best to say it, so it’s taken the right way rather than a criticism. Please bear with me on this ….

Firstly you have a hell of a lot on your plate with your health, so please cut yourself some slack and lower your expectations of what the horse ownership journey ‘should be’.

Any expectations you had of buying a horse and it all being perfect I’m afraid are a little too naive.

I’m sorry Ozzy has arrived and it’s far more challenging than you expected.

My advice would be to accept that naivety as a learning experience. I doubt you have the resilience at the moment to go into battle with the dealer (these pond life prey on buyers like you I’m afraid). I would advise swapping Ozzie for something else and have someone who knows what they are doing oversee the swap. You might improve your situation. That said, I understand you are reluctant/ unlikely to do this so assuming it’s off the cards next option ….

Cut your losses and sell. It’s a valid option. You will loose financially. But I’d be inclined to read on …

OR

Change your mindset and expectations. I know that sounds a bit flippant and easier said than done, but this could be a good thing for you.

Mental health and autoimmune type diseases are exacerbated by stress (as I’m sure you are well aware). The situation at the moment is high stress naturally.

Reframe the ‘I’ve bought a misdescribed mental horse that I hate and don’t want to see’ into ‘I’ve bought a troubled soul who has come into my life for a reason’. You may well find in time a real connection between you and him that will improve your mental and physical health tenfold.

Short term, allow others to help settle him. Critically evaluate the competence of those others. Is this the right full livery yard? But once he has had time to settle in and had some routine handling then give the boy a second chance!
 
Hi Jasmine

I've been reading this thread and really do feel for you. It's important to remember that horses are herd animals, yet we swap and move them all the time with little to no regard to the trauma they get from leaving a previous herd (people and horse herd). The herd is the horses safety. Some cope ok, others feel scared and stressed until they've settled into their new herd. Some horses become 'power freaks' when they feel they have to look after themselves without a strong herd around them.. usually those who are happiest when further down the pecking order, which can make them bargy, horrible to handle etc because as others have said, they don't feel safe.

My connie is lovely to handle when he feels safe and isn't in charge, but is a nightmare if he thinks he's the one responsible for keeping others safe.

Give him time, get to know him and give him chance to find his new herd and safety - I bet you'll have a different horse.

Insure him, let him settle, enjoy spending time with him and get to know him with no pressure. Ask for support and have a good chat with your YO about the support you'll need to make the relationship work.

Remember that you're the one who needs to make the decisions, not the horse or anyone else. Have faith in yourself, and your horse will have faith in you too. I was watching something recently - can't remember what it was, but they said something along the lines of 'the horse cannot trust you before you trust it - we're the concious, intelligent half of the partnership so we have to lead it.' Of course, once your relationship has built up, there will be more balance.

Ozzy looks absolutely beautiful, and I really hope this works out for you, but you have to make the decision to make it work, and do everything in your power to do so.
 
Amymay Again said:
You have a lot going on.

How did it go this morning?
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Why not quit questioning the lady, who is obviously struggling with multi aspects in her life. If she wishes to share how she is doing with the horse she will.

Endless questioning, which has been the leading point in the entire thread, is tiring, stressful and needless. Leave the Op alone, take the pressure off, she has enough pressure and worries to deal with.
 
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