Breeding One of My Bitches

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Tia

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I am thinking about breeding my Springer X Collie bitch and am not sure which sire to choose; what do you all think?

Two dogs have been made available to me; an Afghan hound X JRT or a Scottish Terrier X Wolfhound. Which one would you go for?

There is another option, one which appeals to me as for one I'd end up with rare dogs and two, it won't cost me a penny. Our pack of wolves are living in the woods next to the house right now and I thought if I tied Lily to a stake in the middle of the field when she next comes into season then he might just come along and providing he doesn't eat her, then we should have some nice little pups.

Don't worry about finding nice homes for them as we will be keeping all the pups but if she has more than 15 then we will have to get the big bucket of water out and take them for a little dunking as I wouldn't want to fill up the rescue centres with even more dogs.


Honestly
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. People are capable of making their own decisions and hopefully in the best interests of their dogs. Not everyone wants a purebred dog and not everyone will abandon their puppies to rescue centres.

I would be very very interested in any statistics anyone may be able to turn their hand to regarding dogs being abandoned or taken to rescue centres....where do these dogs generally come from? Country owners or town people? Links please would be useful.

I can tell you right now though, if I were going to breed any of my dogs, not that I will because that is not what I do, but if I were to, then I would! No-one on here would change my mind about something that I would obviously have thought long and hard about, covering all angles and any surprises. I think that the majority of people on here work in the same manner as me - I doubt they breed without taking due care and putting in a lot of thought. Give them a break, please.
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I would be very very interested in any statistics anyone may be able to turn their hand to regarding dogs being abandoned or taken to rescue centres....where do these dogs generally come from? Country owners or town people? Links please would be useful.


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Well, I don't have any statistics, but I doubt location makes a blind bit of difference. There are idiots everywhere, sadly.

In the Bronx and Brooklyn, there is a major issues with people turning Pits free, just as you hear plenty of stories about Greyhounds/Lurchers being found half-starved in rural English locations.

As for breeding mixes deliberately, we shall have to agree to disagree
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As for breeding mixes deliberately, we shall have to agree to disagree

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Hmm not sure where you got that from. I would never breed a crossbred dog and never said that I would, so not too sure what we are disagreeing on?
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If I were ever to breed any of my dogs, and as I said no I wouldn't, it would certainly only be the 2 purebreds and not the crossbred.
 
The dumped Greyhound/Lurcher issue is entirely due to travellers who get the dogs to course, those that are not fast enough of are being worked when the police turn up are just dumped.

This issue would not be solved by any rules or regs as these people are known for not obeying rules.
 
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I would be very very interested in any statistics anyone may be able to turn their hand to regarding dogs being abandoned or taken to rescue centres....where do these dogs generally come from? Country owners or town people? Links please would be useful.

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According to a survey performed by the Dogs Trust a staggering 101,586 dogs were found as strays in 2006.

This figure just represents the number of dogs removed from the streets as strays by the dog warden and not dogs that have been handed over to charities for rehoming, so the number of unwanted dogs is in actuality a lot higher.

In 2006 7,743 dogs were euthanased simply because a home could not be found for them.

In 2006 the Dogs Trust managed to find homes for 10,119 dogs about 10% of the dogs picked up as strays.

The Dog Trusts neutering campaign is aiming to help reduce the unwanted dog problem but despite all their efforts, they estimate that at the current rate of decline in numbers it would still be 350 years(!) before this problem was a thing of the past.

Here is a link supplying you with data as to how many dogs were picked up by the authorities and what areas of the country they came from.
http://www.dogstrust.org.uk/press_office/stray_dog_survey_2006/full_statistics_breakdown/
 
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As for breeding mixes deliberately, we shall have to agree to disagree

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Hmm not sure where you got that from. I would never breed a crossbred dog and never said that I would, so not too sure what we are disagreeing on?
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If I were ever to breed any of my dogs, and as I said no I wouldn't, it would certainly only be the 2 purebreds and not the crossbred.

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Weird! You quite plainly said in your original post that you were thinking of breeding your springer x and choosing sires between 2 other crossbreeds or a wolf. Methinks you are being deliberately contentious perhaps? Breeding crossbreeds, staking your dog out to be mated by wild wolves (provided she doesn't get eaten!!!???), drowning unwanted pups if they have a large litter and asking for opinions and then saying you don't give a toss what we say anyway? Feeling a little bored are we
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Tia - The only thing I would add is that, as you rightly say, I'm sure most people do give it alot of thought. But some don't and I think it is always worth people pointing out the various pro's and con's - just in case not a lot of thought had gone into it or in case others are reading who didn't know the issues.

Also - it is an issue that people feel very strongly on - so I can understand why they want to state their position.

The only sad thing is both sides of the arguement get very cross with each other... which is a shame..
 
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Think Tia's tongue might be firmly in her cheek here!

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I'm sure it is but not sure why? Is there a point?
 
I'm involved with 2 local rescues via my o.h's work...we attend their AGM's etc & the figures are shocking.
The majority of dogs in one are surplus from pedigree K.C registered breeders, who can't find homes for the pups. The pups reach 16 weeks , no longer cute pups & are handed over to rescues to make way for the next litter.

I'm sick of reading posts like " Fifi, is so nice we are going to breed from her so we can keep a little Fifi" or "Ohhh poor Fido my hubby said we should let him be a Dad before getting him done"

If people post on here that they are thinking of breeding dogs & asking for opinions why shouldn't both sides be given ?

Why do people only want to be told what they want to hear ?
(& that doesn't just apply to this subject)
 
Well Tia....I for one thnk it is very noble of you to keep all the puppies.....if everyone did this....and kept the puppies for themselves...instead of trying to make a quick buck...or just breeding...well for the sake of breeding then our rescue for one would be empty
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I agree re-the bucket method to....better they are placed in a bucket at a day old if you cant keep them rather than them end up in a rescue.....as trying to re-home them could end up in them being returned to you.....and if you cant take them back for any reason.....then they are sure to end up dumped on someone.


RE- the people being sensible and making their own decisions.....is this the same for all the forums, inc SB,PG,NL e,t,c cos I seem to recall alot of disagreeing, debate, discussion in those too.
Like I said before some people will have a very blasai attitude to breeding.....this I would conclude is due to ignorance more than anything.
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Some on the other hand do think long and hard.....but are still suprised at what they can learn/pick up from the advice they get on here
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As with everypost there will be some agreeing and dis-agreeing....and also some very good advice.....if people dont want it then dont post it....Isnt that what everyone says
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Im sure if you need any advice re-breeding from your bitch....you will get it on here...but be prepare for all manor of advice/opinion
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I agree re-the bucket method to....better they are placed in a bucket at a day old if you cant keep them rather than them end up in a rescue.....as trying to re-home them could end up in them being returned to you.....and if you cant take them back for any reason.....then they are sure to end up dumped on someone.


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I'm shocked & disgusted at anyone who suggests and agrees with this comment!!!
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THAT is wrong
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- if you have a litter of pups then you NEED to take responsibility for the LIFE of that/those animal(s)... it is NOT responsible to drown the mites because YOU were irresponisble in letting the b*tch get pregnant in the first place!!!
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and NO I don't mean then dump them intoa rescue centre is taking responsibility either!!!!
 
I didn't read CALA's post that way - I thought she was trying to say it would be better for unwanted pups to be drowned at birth, rather than being passed from pillar to post repeatedly and eventually ending up abandoned.

It's clear from her previous posts that she doesn't support irresponsible breeding and wants people who do breed to take responsibility for their pups.

I think her statement was intended as a shock tactic to make people aware of the consequences of irresponsible breeding
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But then again I may be wrong and she is really a crazed nutter who encourages people to drown their day old pups!
 
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I didn't read CALA's post that way - I thought she was trying to say it would be better for unwanted pups to be drowned at birth, rather than being passed from pillar to post repeatedly and eventually ending up abandoned.

It's clear from her previous posts that she doesn't support irresponsible breeding and wants people who do breed to take responsibility for their pups.

[/ QUOTE ]TGM I am aware that CALA doesn't support irresponsible breeding - TBH I don't think ANYONE on here supoprts irresponsible breeding!!!
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What I was suggesting was that ANYONE who advocates/jokes/thinks that drowing 'mistakes' is the best thing .. I'm sorry but THAT animal is alive/in the world unless of course there are MAJOR deformaties etc the dog should LIVE (if there are deformaties - they should be PTS humanly!!!)

PEOPLE who irresponsibly breed should be MADE to take responsibility for those animals... be it homing to an APPROPRIATE home or looking after them themselves!!!! (I know that this NOT an option but it should be!!)
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I think her statement was intended as a shock tactic to make people aware of the consequences of irresponsible breeding
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But then again I may be wrong and she is really a crazed nutter who encourages people to drown their day old pups!

[/ QUOTE ]TGM .. CALA made a comment stating that she AGREED with Tia's statement re drowning!! be it in jest from both CALA and Tia.. the statment was made and CALA suggeted it would be better that they were drowned than end up in a rescue home!! So technically she is AGREEING - albeit tongue in cheek (HOWEVER that is NOT the way I read it!!)

I don't think I suggested she ENCOURAGED it.. but the comment was made...

hey why aren't you at the SoE show??? Thought you were 'handling'?
 
Yep.....TGM was right it was definatley for the shock factor.....and it worked (clearly)
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I was making light of Tia's suggestion of drowning her puppies.

I see far worse than puppies being drown unfortunatley
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Yep.....TGM was right it was definatley for the shock factor.....and it worked (clearly)
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[/ QUOTE ]LOL - I just think the idea of it stinks no matter WHO says it!!
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I was making light of Tia's suggestion of drowning her puppies.

I see far worse than puppies being drown unfortunatley
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[/ QUOTE ]I'm sure you do chick... drowning puppies is wrong - but what I was saying was that those irresponsible breeders should be MADE to take responsibility of those pups...
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I think people should have to have a licence to keep dogs!!
 
But CALA didn't say that drowning was the best thing - of course for a pup to go to a good permanent home is the best thing! She said that drowning may be better than being dumped and abandoned! At least that was the way I read it - our interpretations may differ.

To be honest, if her 'shocking' comment stops even one person from breeding irresponsibly then in my mind it is worth it!

Change of plan re: SoE - my friend wanted me to show her filly as she was going to show her colt in the same class. In the end she bottled showing the colt as she was worried his hormones might explode with all the young equine totty around - so she has hired a man to show him for her! So she is going to show the filly herself!
 
In an ideal world....breeders would be made to take responsibility....but its not an ideal world....in this world the animal suffers.

If the rescue centers where not there....what is to happen to these animals.....that is those that make it to the rescues....and are not destroyed/disposed of before hand.

Although I dont think drowning is a good way of disposing of unwanted puppies.........however i do think in some of the cases I have come across they would have been better of culled at/before birth rather than suffer the abuse/torture they where bound for in life.

Take our rescue greyhound....would it have been better for her to starve and die slowly on the side of the motorway.....or for her to have been culled or never been born at all....I know which one I would choose, I know not everyone will agree......because you cant see the truly horrendous things we deal with on a daily basis....for those who have....then Im sure they will see where Im coming from.



Another debate coming on....which I suspect is what the OP was posted for
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I think you hit the nail on the head......re-irrisponsible breeding......and that is surley why....people comment/agree/disagree/give advice when ever a topic re-breeding arises on the forum.
 
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But CALA didn't say that drowning was the best thing - of course for a pup to go to a good permanent home is the best thing! She said that drowning may be better than being dumped and abandoned! At least that was the way I read it - our interpretations may differ.

[/ QUOTE ]I guess we interpretted differently - but that IS what she meant - see new post... I'm not saying she agrees just that is what MAY be best in come cases.
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To be honest, if her 'shocking' comment stops even one person from breeding irresponsibly then in my mind it is worth it!

[/ QUOTE ]OR it will make people 'drown' their puppies instead of trying to home!
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Change of plan re: SoE - my friend wanted me to show her filly as she was going to show her colt in the same class. In the end she bottled showing the colt as she was worried his hormones might explode with all the young equine totty around - so she has hired a man to show him for her! So she is going to show the filly herself!

[/ QUOTE ]Ahh OK.. so you decided not to go along?
 
I think Cala's latest post explains things much more eloquently than I could and makes her views completely clear!

Re: SoE - I could have gone along today anyway, but decided it would be better to go tomorrow with OH & sprog - especially as we have free tickets
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In an ideal world....breeders would be made to take responsibility....but its not an ideal world....in this world the animal suffers.

If the rescue centers where not there....what is to happen to these animals.....that is those that make it to the rescues....and are not destroyed/disposed of before hand.

[/ QUOTE ]I know and that STINKS to high heaven
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I know what your saying hun - think of the way the dogs are abraod - all the strays etc.. it's so unfair on those poor poochies.
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Although I dont think drowning is a good way of disposing of unwanted puppies.........however i do think in some of the cases I have come across they would have been better of culled at/before birth rather than suffer the abuse/torture they where bound for in life.

Take our rescue greyhound....would it have been better for her to starve and die slowly on the side of the motorway.....or for her to have been culled or never been born at all....I know which one I would choose, I know not everyone will agree......because you cant see the truly horrendous things we deal with on a daily basis....for those who have....then Im sure they will see where Im coming from.

[/ QUOTE ]Again I know what your saying and agre.. but drowing is not the way - the damn pups shouldn't have been concieved in the first place!!!
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Another debate coming on....which I suspect is what the OP was posted for
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[/ QUOTE ]Indeed!!
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I think you hit the nail on the head......re-irrisponsible breeding......and that is surley why....people comment/agree/disagree/give advice when ever a topic re-breeding arises on the forum.

[/ QUOTE ]Exactly... I guess SOME people don't see their breeding of their dogs as irresponsible etc... Hmmmm
 
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I think Cala's latest post explains things much more eloquently than I could and makes her views completely clear!

[/ QUOTE ]I think it does...
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Re: SoE - I could have gone along today anyway, but decided it would be better to go tomorrow with OH & sprog - especially as we have free tickets
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[/ QUOTE ]Ahh Ok, well keep your eyes peeled for me tropping around on my own with my poochy!!!!
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So is there only the 3 of us
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I think people need to look at the fact that when they breed....and secure what they deem to be good homes.....they should be aware that those puppies can/probabley will be bred from themselves.....and this is when the numbers begin to multiply....and the the chances of your dogs off spring, be it second generation.....could end up in as a rescue.
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or worse.

Re- the drowning....I dont think what me and Tia mentioned would encourage people to drown puppies.....they can easily off load them when they are still cute puppies or get what they deem a fair price.....Its when they are older they become aproblem.....and that when the cruelty begins
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I suppose if people are happy in that knowledge.....than go for it
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If your not then ....DONT!

Like I mentioned in a previous post.....I can see why the prospect of breeding from your dog appeals to other people......but surley you should be made aware of the consequences too
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Its not just irrisponsible breeding Im against......people can breed responsibly.....but in some cases there is still no need to do it....esp for monitery gain
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Everyone has their opinions and reasons for them
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QR -

My tongue was VERY firmly placed in my cheek when writing this....just for anyone who wasn't sure LOL!!

Thank you for the link Ann and others for your statistics.
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Thank you everyone for your replies.......which brings me on nicely to the second part of my post. Indescriminate human breeding.....if only so much care were taken in this eh?
 
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Thank you everyone for your replies.......which brings me on nicely to the second part of my post. Indescriminate human breeding.....if only so much care were taken in this eh?

[/ QUOTE ]Didn't someone mention drowing at birth?!
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