Can I cry pls?

Amaranta said:
So sorry to read this, have no experience of gs so not able to help, just wanted to give you a hug.

The hedgerow plant you are thinking of is Hedge Parsley, the bad one that looks similar is Hemlock.
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Aka Cow Parsley up North.

It's just coming out of it's season now.

They go mad for it when it's in season.

It's a natural midge repellent.

Hemlock isn't so common to come across, so don't worry about letting her browse for what she takes a fancy to. Horses are pretty good at self medicating. She won't go wrong.

So sorry Ebony not doing so well.

I wish I had any sort of answer or idea.....but I'm stumped :(

In the absence of any conclusive findings....it seems as though some sort of pathogen has ravaged her?
 
Amaranta, thank you that's it!!
Pooks: yes all that is totally normal!
I know cortisol can be due to many things... It's not a cause, it's a by product of something that's going on, but it does affect the protein in muscle and destroy it and it is at a high level! We are talking about treating symptoms not cause, but without knowing the cause yet it's all we can do!

Bc. Thank you x I will buy ours Cornwall farmers feed supply before I give up and you should see the size of their warehouse :eek: ;)

It does make me laugh that last year people were berating me re ebony for not ( in their eyes) caring about her welfare, I hope they see this isn't the case, I would do anything in my power to secure her health and well being, if I hadnt had her to cling to over the last 4 yrs I would probably have lost myself forever... I owe her everything!
 
Queenbee said:
Pooks: yes all that is totally normal!
I know cortisol can be due to many things... It's not a cause, it's a by product of something that's going on, but it does affect the protein in muscle and destroy it and it is at a high level! We are talking about treating symptoms not cause, but without knowing the cause yet it's all we can do!
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I know, and I'd be doing the exact same thing. Final Q before my brain dribbles impotently from my ears for the evening...what's her coat like? Normal or greasy?
 
Oberon, that's actually quite interesting, we were talking Compromised immune systems earlier in the thread, and at the beginning of this story I made mention of the fact that she has gone scurfy and half her mane was missing, now she didn't lose it with her rug, it went after her rug came off, I thought mites at one point but no evidence, her tail is fine but it seemed like she had rubbed her mane, she has lots of midges in her field and I was chatting with someone who said when her horse moved to its field (2 fields away) he developed sweet itch) could she have developed some sort of compromised immune system because of midgies?! *straws, clutching?!*

Bbh yes she has always been shiny but I must admit its quite strange how shiny considering how poorly she is!! She did look rougher a few weeks back but she is constantly rugged to which I think makes her even shinier.

Broke but happy, that sounds fantastic hun let me know how much you want for it x thank you x
 
Coat did go ropey but now looking normal and glossy, she's a bit greasy but she's just finishing moulting although she did moult earlier on this year its almost ongoing, she's been moulting for about 2 months solid! It's got a lovely shine now and looks pretty much normal, but I stupidly get scared brushing her.. I'm so it ao gingerly because she is so skinny!
 
Do you want me to send a carrier bag of it? It does swell up when soaked so should do a few days feed then you know if she'll eat it? Don't want anything for it :)`
 
Bbh, that would be amazing Hun, I'm more than happy to give you something for it if you want x I will pm you my address in the morning ( another thing to do on my list lol) you are a star thank you x have used copra before so know to soak it :) thank you, thank you thank you!!
 
Just rolled over in bed and thought - try asking Roger Hatch of Trinity Consultants for advice.

He has an excellent reputation. He may have a 'tonic' for her.

Also you could join the Whole Horse health Yahoo group. Many people and a few vets post on there - you could bounce ideas off them?
 
Oberon... If I could bottle you up and sell you I'd be a very rich woman! U always have lots of really useful contacts and links, I'll look into it tomorrow. My dear old computers going to take a pounding!
 
Spend far too much time mooching online :p

eg. I started on cow parsley....moved onto hemlock.....hemlock poisoning......and then all about Socrates :D

Good luck. xx
 
Oh bless her... I've been following your updates and hoping she'd turn the corner a little...

pookie said:
And her enzyme levels are ok? Exocrine etc? Have her insulin levels been tested? Urine is normal colour and smell?

I'm not a vet by any means (humans are my thing) but the cortisol could easily be a red-herring.
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Ditto... My first thought, outside of cushings, would be pancreatic insufficiency or maybe lymphoma - although high cortisol could help with that... Perhaps the steroid suppression test will give some clarity...

Has the vet suggested trying Chaste Berry at all to see if it would give the dopamine production a kick and negate some of the cortisol before trying the steroids?

I've got my fingers crossed you're able to get to the bottom of this... Horribly frustrating when the problem isn't identified so you're unable to do anything that you know will help... :(
 
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Really sorry to hear she's still not right. Re he gs can your vet speak to Liverpool perhaps? My prev horse had worst type, lost lot of weight but no other symptoms until impacted colic, he was eating anything we could tempt him with and still pooing and weeing a little. Lost him 5 days after colic surgery as took a turn for the worse and I had him pts. Hugs
 
I'm so sorry to read this. Lots of helpful advice already and I have nothing to ad realy except send you some massive (((((((((hugs)))))) and Ebony some (((((((((((vibes))))))))). I know how hard it is to watch your belovid horse so ill and not knowing whats wrong. Don't feel guilty (although I also know how hard that is) you are doing all you can for her and she will know that. I realy hope you get some answers soon and she starts to improve. xx
 
I've no suggestions to offer either I'm afraid, but I hope that you get some resolution soon, it is so stressful when they seem to turn a corner and then go backover again.
I hope you get some resluts soon. xx
 
Queenbee said:
Ah cow parsley is also used to promote healing, treat water retention and stomach problems... Interesting!
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HI QB , just be careful about the cow parsley as it does have similar flowers etc to water hemlock and giant hogweed both of which CAN be poisonous but mostly towards the root end , but if your mare is sensitive to it then it maybe worth having agood look around the paddock . We have hemlock all down the river bank towards Gweek and when you look it's every where damp and watery , i'm not sure where you went after you left SB's but if you need me to pop and see you and have a good stank round the fields i would be more than happy to..
Al
P.s on the hospital note , i can so understand your reservations for not sending your mare in , but believe me Paddy's currently in hosp at somerset , and i can honestly say that the team up there is amazing and he's being treated like royalty - google Langford vets services , north somerset and look at the vet team - my vet is evita brusshers and she's at the top of the equine vet tree - amazing woman.
 
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I'm not surprised you wan't to cry - what a horrible place to be in.

Don't be afraid to ask for second opinions or to get a referral to a vet that specialises in this type of problem if your vet has run out of ideas. Sometimes vets are reluctant to admit defeat but other vets might have fresh ideas or different expertise.

In the meantime I don't know if you've tried Equijewel or Omega Rice balancers as can give lots of calories in small amounts - however they are expensive and as she is very picky its a lot of money if she won't eat it, You may be able to get samples though.

Wish I could be more helpful - wishing you all the best and hope Ebony improves soon.
 
Lady d: We have the surpression results... High at night, little lower the following morning, it's the ACTH results we are waiting on. No vet hasnt reccomended chaste berries but I bought some last week, they arrived on Monday, so she's only just gone on them (forgot to put them in the list!) hopefully this will help a bit.

Thank you all for your hugs and best wishes and ideas it's overwhelming x

Paddy, it is cow parsley not hemlock although she doesn't eat it constantly she dives for it when I walk her in hand or pop her in a little lane we graze down, she started to dive for it after she got poorly, so I was wondering what it's properties were. They are just above helston boating lake, on fields that used to belong to penventon farm.
 
No pearls of wisdom here, just huge hugs and lots of get well soon vibes for you both.

I have everything crossed for you finding whats up with poor Ebony, you're lucky to have each other x
 
Hi QB. I just wanted to send you & Ebony my best wishes. I've been following your posts and I feel your pain.

Like another poster, I think you will just instinctively know if/when the time has come to make a decision. In the meantime, she has a shiny coat, she calls to you when you arrive and she's still 'with it' enough to worry about where Ben is, so don't give up yet!

I too am a scientist and have some understanding of the medical aspects of this discussion (NOT a vet though!) and also agree that it sounds like some sort of enzyme inbalance/insufficiency OR an inflammatory reactionin her gut. I am well aware that we can't use examples from other species to draw conclusions, but two years ago my collie suddenly developed exocrine pancreatic insufficieny - he lost over half his bodyweight, lost his appetite entirely and had hard, small poos. He did recover (despite a similarly traumatic bout of colitis since - which also made him los weight at an incredible rate), but at the time it was touch and go. He too had raised cortisol levels - we think as a pain response.

The suggestions to let her graze on what she wants to are good ones. The other thing that occurred to me (because this is what happened to my dog) is is it possible that any of the drugs she's on act as appetite suppressants? The antibio my dog was on completely killed his appetite - exacerbating his weight loss.

Anyway, enough ramblings! Good luck with her - I hope it works out.

ps Outshine (Baileys) is very high oil and good for weight gain and my horse LOVES it. Comes in 10kg bags, pricey but may be worth a go? Baileys would almost certainly send you a sample if you call them.
 
Micronised linseed is full of oil and if you mix it in feed an add a drop of warm water, smell yummy. Other than that small suggestion I'm useless to you.:confused:
 
So sorry QB. It doesn't look like an ulcers case though to me as I have never known one lose so much weight because of them. Also, she has a shiny coat, and horses with ulcers often don't. She sounds as though she has life left in her yet. She also looks as though she is enjoying the grass. Is she on good grazing?
 
Well all I can pass on is what my friend has gone through from Sept up to the present day.

Ella was diagnosed with sever Grass Sickness. She was wasting away in front of my friend. She phoned rang GS company etc and vets. Tried so many different feeds and supplements . She could not keep her in as she hates it and would get more stressed. She( my friend) was up at yard late and early mornings nursing trying to tempt her to eat even a morsel of food.



Many months nursing upsets thinking she would die) up to present day she is now in lean condition all thanx to * FAST FIBRE* tHE only thing she would eat and will eat to this day. My friend has actually sat on her now.

It was a case of finding what she would eat and nursing with Ella. Hope your we one improves.:)
 
All our horses went mad for alpha beet. I stopped using it as it was so messy, but have never known a feed that was so popular with all the horses. mine wouldn't eat fast fibre once they had had it for a few days.
 
Hi all,

Excused the very rushed reply, im running late for the stables...

I have so far got 9 feed companies donating samples (allen and Page are even giving her a bag of feed AND samples) and BBH sending some copra, thank you!!

Wagtail, her coat wasnt always looking so dandy, its only recently got its shine back, although we stopped gastroguard today as we reached the same conclusion as you.

Alfami: yes we have used outshine in the past, she really liked it, Baileys are sending her some :D

Levithian: I spoke to the GS org today and they said that whist she isnt exhibiting classic GS symptoms, not to rule it out as some form of variant, and to keep doing what im doing

Test results back, not cushings! so still in the dark, she is staying on chaste berries to try and get cortisol down, vet thinks this is a good idea

Vet has already contacted Liverpool with the full history, we expect to hear back by tomorrow.

Next step is referral for scans possible tap and/or steroids, we will decide which we start first or whether we do both at once after hearing back from vets old colleague at Liverpool.


Right m'ducks, you are all being very very fantastic. Im off up to the stables... I shall give your hugs to ebs (and a very well ben!):)
 
At least you still have some options to persue for an answer.

Hope you find her feeling well today.
 
My thoughts are with your mare, have you had your vet check her heart?
My friends horse dropped a huge amount of weight over a very short period of time, she like you thought ulcer, grass sickness etc but vet struggled to find out what was causing it and he was so very poorly it was awful to see.
Finally the vet suggested checking his heart which was enlarged and was failing. It may well be worth speaking to your vet. Best of luck xxx
 
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