Cant help him no more

I'm a bit hazy about if it would indicate high blood sugar, but I wonder if this horse could be insulin resistant?

For diet, with the process of elimination could you take him off everything except for 12 hour soaked hay?
 
Naturally said:
I'm a bit hazy about if it would indicate high blood sugar, but I wonder if this horse could be insulin resistant?

For diet, with the process of elimination could you take him off everything except for 12 hour soaked hay?
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I second this advice.

Safe & Sound has 5% sugar, that amount would have blown my mare's mind.
Sugar + yeast = alcohol. If he is susceptible, it's no wonder he's aggressive.
 
Mine (spanish x) is intolerant to sugar too, he doesn't get aggressive but I worked out that's what makes him ultra sharp, spooky, bucky and nappy (and makes me get thrown off)

There are lots of feeds I can't give him and found Safe and sound too sugary. I know many Iberian owners have success with Simple Systems feeds, in fact that is what I was advised to feed mine by members of BAPSH forum, but I couldn;t find a stockist nearby.

As an example I will explain what mine is now fed - Summer - 24 hour turnout with a few D & H equibites for vits and mins in a Greenguard muzzle ALL DAY AND NIGHT. Winter - 12 hour turnout unmuzzled (late out if it's frosty) in a lightweight rug, in at night unrugged with 1 slice soaked last-year's hay plus a handful of Topspec lite chaff OR (as he often turns his nose up at that!) a tiny amount of spiller's cool fibre, with his equibites added. I often have to add his Calmer to the feed to take the edge off.
Many people would be horrified at the tiny amount my horse gets to eat, he is treated like a laminitic BUT he is STILL chunky even on that (and ridden 5-6 times a week!). Thankfully he is calm and settled in his brain which is what is important.

But like everyone says, it is up to you and the vet to decide what's best. If you tried the 'sugarfree diet' and it didn't work you would STILL have a dangerous horse on your hands...
 
I would give this ago but why is he safe as houses ridden never ever spooks and does every asked. It seems the person who beat him only did it on foot maybe ? or when he was backed at the stud Im still not sure what to do yes they found a problem but is it the right problem. And next time he explodes will i be so lucky next time. I now have doubt in my mind and i had made the decision to pts
 
traceyann said:
I would give this ago but why is he safe as houses ridden never ever spooks and does every asked. It seems the person who beat him only did it on foot maybe ? or when he was backed at the stud Im still not sure what to do yes they found a problem but is it the right problem. And next time he explodes will i be so lucky next time. I now have doubt in my mind and i had made the decision to pts
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Personally, I would stick with your original choice. You could cut all the sugar out of his diet and have a safe horse at the end of it as long as it was managed properly, or it could kill you in the meantime. Also, all very well saying you will never sell him/would PTS if you couldn't keep him, but what happens if (heaven forbid) you get hit by a bus tomorrow and someone thinks they will 'rescue' a nice looking horse that's on the way to Potters?! I would probably pay for a post mortem exam though, because otherwise I'd always wonder....
 
Poor you. I'm afraid that the very well intentioned posters on here have never experienced the type of aggression you talk about. I have as have some others. Back your gut - the indescribable feeling of relief once you are again safe (and others) will be testement in itself to the fact you are making the right decision. Feeding him this that or the other will make NO DIFFERENCE. He is fine when ridden, lethal on the ground. This rules out brain tumours, back etc etc etc.
 
have just read the whole thread, and can only say I think you are doing the right thing very sad though it is. If god forbid you had an accident or illness that needed you to go into hospital for a while then you would be putting someone else at risk if they had to look after him. He is for whatever reason in his past a very disturbed horse and even if you could deal with the high sugar levels it may not solve his mental problems with his past. I am not a pts for no reason person but sometimes it is the right thing to do and to me this is one of them.
Very well done to you for being brave enough to let him go quietly and not to ship him off to a sale or meatman, if all owners were like you many horses would be a lot happier and the occasional horse that is for whatever reason dangerous would not hurt anyone else. Hugs to you.
 
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Having read most/all of the thread my initial thoughts were that you should PTS because its too dangerous and maybe he cant be helped. BUT the fact that vets found hte high blood sugar (indicating insulin resistance) I would not, personally, be able to PTS a horse htat I knew had a medical problem that could have caused all of the aggression and I hadnt tried my VERY best to put that right first.
Of course it's always your choice and I dont think anyone could judge you either way.
 
As I'm sure other people have already mentioned, there is usually a reason horses go to the meat man.

It's sad, and I've no doubt you rescued him with the best of intentions but it would have been far less traumatic for you and him if he'd have gone to Potters. Horrible as it sounds.

I wish you both well, do what you think is best
 
samlf said:
Having read most/all of the thread my initial thoughts were that you should PTS because its too dangerous and maybe he cant be helped. BUT the fact that vets found hte high blood sugar (indicating insulin resistance) I would not, personally, be able to PTS a horse htat I knew had a medical problem that could have caused all of the aggression and I hadnt tried my VERY best to put that right first.
Of course it's always your choice and I dont think anyone could judge you either way.
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Please can you point me towards the scientific literature which links insulin resistance with aggression in equines - I'd be interested to read it. Thanks :)
 
I have told all my friends if anything happen to me he must be pts. I have thought this though because he is dangerous and iv had some close calls. Bad as it sounds i have considered all of this
 
I don't think it sounds bad - and TBH if that's the way you feel about him (and rightly from what you've written), I have no real comprehension of why you would want to keep putting yourself in such unnecessary danger and why he isn't already on a one-way trip to the vets (or your PTS method of choice!).
 
I hope my subsequent posts about the Reiki etc have not made you change your mind or given you doubts. go with your gut instinct, yes we tried everything with poppy but an animal communicator. Yes if I had known about these I would have got one in but the horse would have still ended up being sold, once I didnt trust her and was becoming afraid of what she was capable of she would have had to have gone even if she had communicated to an ac what her issues were. The fact of the matter is she was so dangerous she killed a child. I am truly sorry if my babbling on has given you doubts I didnt mean too. Go with gut instinct, you will have to deal with your horse every day, you deserve to be safe and unafraid yourself..... for your little cobs sake! what would happen to him if something happened to you??
 
SpottedCat said:
Please can you point me towards the scientific literature which links insulin resistance with aggression in equines - I'd be interested to read it. Thanks :)
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I don't think that there is any scientific evidence concerning equines, although there is this zoology paper relating to agression and metabolic syndrome:- http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19800745 which suggest the opposite would be true.

Personally if the op's decision has been made to pts then I'd go along with that, I don't think there will be any regrets by pts for the op and it could well be a kindness for the horse. There could well be further regrets in keeping the horse alive and even tragic consequences and the potential for an unhappy horse.
 
I have just read the thread, and think it is very easy to comment on what you would or wouldn't do in the same circumstances. My instinct if often that someone else might manage the horse or the problem better, but there are horses and problems that can;t be managed, for any number of reasons.

I will say that there are worse fates for a horse than being PTS. Remember, he will know nothing of it, and will not know your plans.

Yes other people might do something differently but they are other people and YOU are the one who will have to deal with this horse for the rest of his life.

JuliaG - thank you for sharing your story, it is the exact reason that sometimes a horse should be PTS, and sometimes this does need pointing out.

Out of interest, and as a cynical person (!) does anyone know of a decent animal communicator in the east anglia region? Might be worth a try with my idiot creature.
 
OP, I have read all the posts and feel so deeply for you and your difficult descision. You have done so much for this horse and if you do PTS he will feel nothing and you can reasure yourself that he has wanted for nothing in his last year - hugs to you
 
Pearlsasinger said:
I second this advice.

Safe & Sound has 5% sugar, that amount would have blown my mare's mind.
Sugar + yeast = alcohol. If he is susceptible, it's no wonder he's aggressive.
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I am no expert and have no knowledge of supplements etc but I would agree with this.

My friend has a gelding who would bronc, she took him off all hard feed and supplements and he has calmed down considerably, no more bronc'ing.

However, if he is dangerous then I would have to agree with those who have advised PTS, as much as i love horses I would never endanger either myself or my daughter with a dangerous horse.
 
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I was thinking of you while I did mine this morning please be careful I was attacked once and was lucky to escape with out serious injury you will never be able to trust him even if you find a reason for his behaviour there are far worse fates for a horse than to be PTS under the supervision of the people who have cared for it. Lots of hugs.
 
scarymare said:
Feeding him this that or the other will make NO DIFFERENCE. He is fine when ridden, lethal on the ground. This rules out brain tumours, back etc etc etc.
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Unless you are a vet and have examined this horse, how can you possibly know that it would make no difference, or that being okay to ride but not to lead necessarily rules out those things?

The aggression on the ground vs in the saddle thing may simply be that he knows how to be aggressive to another being on the ground, but not how to do so with a rider on his back and out of sight.

traceyann said:
I would give this ago but why is he safe as houses ridden never ever spooks and does every asked. It seems the person who beat him only did it on foot maybe ? or when he was backed at the stud Im still not sure what to do yes they found a problem but is it the right problem. And next time he explodes will i be so lucky next time. I now have doubt in my mind and i had made the decision to pts
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Please will you reassure me that he is being handled with a minimum of hat (done up!) and gloves on now? Preferably also a body protector, and a long lead rope.

I don't envy you and your decision, and still respect it no matter which way you decide to go.
 
Naturally said:
Please will you reassure me that he is being handled with a minimum of hat (done up!) and gloves on now? Preferably also a body protector, and a long lead rope.

I don't envy you and your decision, and still respect it no matter which way you decide to go.
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And that you won't handle the horse if you are there on your own, it's so easy for accidents to happen never mind throwing on half a tonne of unpredictable horse flesh.
I always cringe when you read stories of people being killed by horses due to freak accidents.
PM if you want moral support, this horse has had plenty of chances by the sounds of it, how many more chances does he get.
 
Sometimes the best, kindest and safest thing is to put a horse down. It does sound like he is dangerous, you are being responsible by saying that you won't just pass him on and it sounds like, having bought him from the meat man you were his last chance anyway.

Good luck with whatever you decide to do.
 
I have posted further up this thread about my experience with my sugar-intolerant mare. She would have been PTS in the very near future (only Christmas got in the way). We didn't stop the sugar because of her behaviour, it was a completely different reason. We would never have known that her behaviour could be improved and wo,uld have had no regrets about PTS, having done all that we could think of to make her life better. As it was, we kept her for another 12 yrs but could never trust her completely because we never knew if passers-by had fed her. She became a field ornament. Admittedly she was a very useful companion to her best friend and very affectionate towards people. We had only a short distance to lead her after we moved to our own place, so she was easily handled.
OP, if you decide to PTS, I certainly wouldn't say that this was the wrong thing to do, you need to make sure that you and others are safe.
If you do go down the 'no sugar' route, be careful. For the 1st 3 days my mare's behaviour became even more odd, she cowered at the back of her box, when it was time to go out to graze and really was like a drug addict going 'cold turkey'. If I was to do it again, I would withdraw the sugar more gradually.
 
I have not read all the replys so hopefully I won't repeat anything, I felt I had to reply my old boy 17.2 used to rear and box, if you hit him it made him ten times worse. He was also a git for riding we bought him really cheap cause the advise was pts he is dangerous :-( it can be done my boy was hard work lots of tears and days that I felt I couldn't cope but with firm boundaries voice worked well chiffney using all the correct equipment he turned a corner and became a horse that we learned tons together. I had an excellent instructor and YO who helped advise me.
Am not knocking your decision cause I know myself the worry of someone else getting hurt or worse is a constant worry but it can be done :)
 
I have read all of the replies, and I really do feel for you OP. I can't imagine how difficult this is for you.

I just hope you do what is best for you and your horse, and if you PTS, you do so when you feel it is the right time.

Sending my best wishes x
 
Leviathan said:
speek to Chris Haywood or Pippa Haywood they are amazing trainers.


There is NOTHING Chris wont get on and Train. Believe me some of the horses he told me what they were like before one being an !*hh horse he bought for a £1 bolted out the arena jumped out arena etc. Now he has it doing dressage and got placed with it .http://www.deepmillfarm.com/index.php/showjumping-training
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The problem being is that this horse isn't a problem to ride, it's on the ground that it's dangerous and unpredictable.
It's a good decision that it won't move home, now your difficult decision will be how many more chances does he get.
 
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