Community Access to Private arenas?

[spacefaer]

There's a community arena in Halkirk in the North of Scotland. It was funded entirely by hard working volunteers in the early 1980s. It's really popular. As you can imagine, riding in the winter in the Highlands requires fairly hard core dedication!

https://hallbookingonline.com/cira/ .

 

[MotherOfChickens]

There's a community arena in Halkirk in the North of Scotland. It was funded entirely by hard working volunteers in the early 1980s. It's really popular. As you can imagine, riding in the winter in the Highlands requires fairly hard core dedication!

https://hallbookingonline.com/cira/ .

That's amazing!

If Scandinavian countries have them, it might be due to the vast amounts of money in building indoor arenas there, they have to be able to withstand a lot of snow.

But sorry, if community access had been a stipulation in my planning, I'd not have done it. Not that there is a community here lol. I moved here to get away from folk, not to be forced into some sort of community sharing scheme.

 

[TGM]

I agree that requiring private 'home-based' arenas to allow community access is ridiculous and would cause a whole host of problems. But proper community arenas are a good idea. Riding Clubs could be one way to do this. I know Sevenoaks Riding Club in Kent have their own field called 'Redlands' with a XC course and 20m x 60m arena. You can opt to be a RC club member in the usual way, or a 'Redlands member' for an higher yearly fee which gives you access to the facilities including the school.

 

[stangs]

I like the idea of community arenas, but I imagine that they'd only happen in small rural communities, with a high percentage of equestrians, and probably just in areas where the mud gets quite bad in the winter. And the community would surely have to be quite tight-knit to make sure everyone's looking after it. That said, even just a field and jumps for hire - which I know one RC near me offers for around £10 an hour - is beneficial, and pretty affordable too. So maybe we should be prioritising supporting our local RCs?

 

[CanteringCarrot]

Are ya kiddin' me?

Out of all of the things to get bothered by, environmentally, this one is way down on my list.

Have you ever dealt with the general public?

There are some Equestrian communities in the US, in the Carolinas maybe, and they have some shared riding spaces, but I'm not sure how it's funded or if it really works out well for all involved.

If I want to build an arena on my land, I should be able to do this (with a few exceptions, of course). There's no way I should be obligated to let the community use this. I'm not about that life or that style regulations.

I'm fine with common facilities, sharing in the community, and reducing negative environmental impact, but I'm not ok with this idea, in particular for a variety of reasons.

It actually made me angry thinking about it and it's not even real and I don't even live there at the moment ?

 

[criso]

From a private point of view, there would be issues with maintenance and would the surface need to meet higher standards. If being used by a variety of users for different purposes, would it need to be tougher and need replacing sooner than if just used by the owner.

There would be insurance and other regulations if there is a charge and it's a commercial transaction.

Then access and parking, there may not be space to park an additional horsebox and people may arrive in much bigger vehicles than ideal for the access.

From the pov from the objectors to planning, the disruption and nuisance from large vehicles, extra use and possibly noisier use than someone schooling their own horse quietly. Here lighting is a big issue and often permission is only given without lighting, a community resource is much more likely to need lights and have them on more often.

For a community facility rather than use of a private one, what are the advantages over hiring a local arena. I think riders are too spread out and wary of hacking to ride to a facility. If you are going to drive somewhere, you may choose somewhere that is bigger,indoor, has arena cross country, a full set if showjumps or dressage boards to make it worthwhile.

However people who choose to build their own arena want the convenience of not having to box.

 

[SEL]

I'm rural and if you go on google earth there are tonnes of arenas around that aren't visible from the main road - never yet heard a complaint when they are for private use, only when a freelancer started using hers for lessons. Community couldn't care less about the arena, but they did about the extra traffic.

Surely though if someone wants to hire an arena then in most areas that is possible through the usual commercial channels? There are 3 I can immediately think of within a 30 minute drive that I could hire out. They are all business premises so have insurance, parking etc.

 

[Caol Ila]

I think Caso's owner said that she lived near one when she was in Germany, and she could hack to it. Sounded like a good system. Meant she could keep her pony at a cheaper barn because it didn't need its own facilities.

 

[CanteringCarrot]

I think Caso's owner said that she lived near one when she was in Germany, and she could hack to it. Sounded like a good system. Meant she could keep her pony at a cheaper barn because it didn't need its own facilities.

Did she mean something like a State Stud? For example I can box over to the Landgestüt, pay a small fee, and ride in any of their schools at any time. They do have a calendar to show if they're blocked for anything (training, demonstrations, competitions, etc.). There are places like this, but they're not privately owned. This is a bit different from riding at a privately owned place in the OP.

Of course most yards/livery yards will let you box in for a fee too. There's a guy that rides over to our arena in the winter sometimes, but this is at a livery yard.

 

[palo1]

Are ya kiddin' me?

Out of all of the things to get bothered by, environmentally, this one is way down on my list.

Have you ever dealt with the general public?

There are some Equestrian communities in the US, in the Carolinas maybe, and they have some shared riding spaces, but I'm not sure how it's funded or if it really works out well for all involved.

If I want to build an arena on my land, I should be able to do this (with a few exceptions, of course). There's no way I should be obligated to let the community use this. I'm not about that life or that style regulations.

I'm fine with common facilities, sharing in the community, and reducing negative environmental impact, but I'm not ok with this idea, in particular for a variety of reasons.

It actually made me angry thinking about it and it's not even real and I don't even live there at the moment ?

Sorry for making you angry!! Yes, I deal with the general public and yes I understand all of the logistical issues; I just thought it was quite an interesting idea tbh. It is totally hypothetical and yes, it is also interesting what people get bothered by, especially environmentally speaking. I think here that probably reflects some elements of community division between traditional farming and more personal use of land from newer members of the community. I really like the idea of community facilities myself but would think realistically that allotments would be better than equestrian facilities. It still irritates me to see old meadows turned into arenas actually but I am not about to enact a one-woman Kinder Trespass style activism hahahahaha!!

I think supporting local riding clubs is a really good idea too.

 

[Reacher]

It would depend on how many there are, how convenient to access. If they are more than say a 15 minute hack away I think people with the resources to build their own will still do so unless there is some change in the planning laws to prevent this - people can hire an arena about 25 minutes drive from me but people still build their own arenas locally.

 

[CanteringCarrot]

Sorry for making you angry!! Yes, I deal with the general public and yes I understand all of the logistical issues; I just thought it was quite an interesting idea tbh. It is totally hypothetical and yes, it is also interesting what people get bothered by, especially environmentally speaking. I think here that probably reflects some elements of community division between traditional farming and more personal use of land from newer members of the community. I really like the idea of community facilities myself but would think realistically that allotments would be better than equestrian facilities. It still irritates me to see old meadows turned into arenas actually but I am not about to enact a one-woman Kinder Trespass style activism hahahahaha!!

I think supporting local riding clubs is a really good idea too.

Ok, angry was a strong word ? the idea flusters me a bit, but after living in America for a number of years, I'm a bit more about freedom on your own land and it being for your purposes and use only. Obviously you shouldn't be dumping waste into streams or committing other acts against the environment, but perhaps there's a line somewhere. If it's not obstructing anything, then you can build it.

I like some of the idea in theory, but I'm so people sour, that it just doesn't work for me.

 

[palo1]

There is no way in hell I would allow a compete stranger to turn up and come onto my property to use facilities I paid a lot of money for, even if I could trust them to leave it in a good state, which you couldn't.

Not one of your best ideas Palo ?
.

Not my idea at all and I don't think anyone suggested complete strangers using local private arenas - more of an 'access' arrangement for local community (possibly of arena owner's choice I would think!). This is an idea that a local environmental group have been exploring/discussing - I am not part of the group but a friend is and the idea is entirely hypothetical. There is a sense here that there are 'too many' arenas being put in though that hasn't been particularly quantified I don't think. I would NOT build an arena generally but especially not if it meant that community access was part of the pp tbh. It would be a PITA and cause my OH many palpitations...

 

[CanteringCarrot]

It would depend on how many there are, how convenient to access. If they are more than say a 15 minute hack away I think people with the resources to build their own will still do so unless there is some change in the planning laws to prevent this - people can hire an arena about 25 minutes drive from me but people still build their own arenas locally.

I would possibly be one of those people. There's loading and uploading your equipment into the trailer, driving, and nearly an hour out of your day, just driving. For a person like me who is a bit crunched with time and/or works full time, an arena hire becomes an event in itself. Plus, if unorganized, there arenas get crowded, and sometimes even limits liveries access to it, which is a bit unfair, when it works that way.

No commute and freedom to ride as you please, when you please, and with whom you please is so valuable to some.

 

[Caol Ila]

Also in the US, you have community airstrips -- a bunch of houses where people own their own private planes all clustered together in a single neighborhood, which has a runway for the use of all residents.

I imagine you could have a similar sort of equestrian community.

 

[Tiddlypom]

Absolutely not. No, no, no. The planning for my arena is strictly for private use only, phew.

I briefly allowed a former neighbour to use my then newly built arena. She completely took the p1ss. Even when a super trustworthy former HHOer used it, it was a major pain in the butt, as access to my arena is via the main house entrance off the road, so the dog had to be shut in, the vehicles rearranged and that was even before anyone got onto the arena itself.

I ended up worrying if it was still 'safe' to leave my arena leveller tucked away in a corner of the arena as usual. What if a visiting horse got caught up on it and I got sued for negligence? Ought I to leave my horses turned out as usual on the adjacent fields - what if they started to run around resulting in the arena borrower getting decked by their own horse?

Who would pay if the arena borrower accidentally broke one of my £500/each arena mirrors when shifting a jump pole? Trying to get them to cough up for the full cost of replacement would be a thankless task.

 

[Peglo]

https://www.orkneycommunities.co.uk/orkneyridingcentre/

I know the local rugby club used this for training but no sure how many other clubs use it now (it’s an old link) it’s a great facility. Didn’t realise it wasn’t common elsewhere.
(correct me if that’s not what you mean by a community school)

I can kinda see what you mean @palo1 but I think if I had one I wouldn’t like having to allow people to use it. Especially as some people wouldn’t care about looking after it.

 

[CanteringCarrot]

The problem here, with some riding clubs, studs, or other public facilities is that it only works if the organisation has money and is, well, organised. There are some places that sort of fall into disrepair or aren't used because they aren't maintained and it's difficult because no one is really responsible for them.

Just up the hill from my yard there are 3 large outdoor schools, toilet facilites, a small building (office), lighting, and a few other things. No one is allowed to use it because they had issues with who keeps up with it/takes care of the grounds. It's a nice place, designed for competitions, but now is mostly overgrown. It's such a waste, and just odd. Money was put into it, and then...they just let it go to sh*t. It's still reasonably saveable though, so not totally gone yet.

At another public facility, again, its the management of it and you get people who think they have more rights to it than others (they don't, even if they have more money or a higher status in the community). This one is pricey and works out ok if you're alright with overpaying and doing a bunch of work yourself.

I'm sure there are others that work out a bit better than these local ones. The State Stud isn't terrible, and fairly organised.

 

[Goldenstar]

I am guessing Palo does not have an arena and therefore has no idea the time it takes to care for the surface, the cost of maintaining the surface that ever hour of hooves degrade the surface and that has to be paid for .
That every poop you scoop removes some surface .
Presumably I would be expect to suck all that up under this scheme
Like TP I keep my leveller in the corner and felt the need to take it out when someone else used it .
No no no no.
Hell in arena terms is truly other people .

 

[Nicnac]

As PP said Sevenoaks Riding Club has great facilities. Unfortunately under threat as the bloody National Trust want to build a car park on the land.

Mr Nicnac played volleyball for his country. When we moved to the UK and had the arena built one of the things we did was modify the fencing so that 3 beach volleyball courts could be used across the width. For many years throughout the summer we held weekly training and tournaments at home. It was great fun and didn't damage the surface at all.

I did let friends use it but as access is up the house drive it was a pain and some took the piss - one turned up with 7 friends one morning - so I stopped being so nice!

A community arena is fine if, for example, at a rec, but can see it fraught with issues as so many don't respect anything.

 

[palo1]

I am guessing Palo does not have an arena and therefore has no idea the time it takes to care for the surface, the cost of maintaining the surface that ever hour of hooves degrade the surface and that has to be paid for .
That every poop you scoop removes some surface .
Presumably I would be expect to suck all that up under this scheme
Like TP I keep my leveller in the corner and felt the need to take it out when someone else used it .
No no no no.
Hell in arena terms is truly other people .

No I don't have an arena but I am not desperate to use one either!! This wasn't 'my' idea - but an idea mooted by a local environmental group who probably have very little idea of arena maintenance. I do understand all that having had plenty of experience at a decent livery of looking after the arena. I am not entirely clueless. I do think it is interesting that people are seeing things this way though; in relation to development of any kind and consumption. It grates on me to see old land turned into spanking new equestrian facilities but thankfully we do currently live in a free country and I do things that other people might not appreciate too. I get that as well as the privacy issue. As I said, I don't think it would be unworkable but for most people it is clearly unreasonable. That's ok too.

 

[Hallo2012]

no way do i want my peace disturbed by every tom dick and harry turning up, making a mess, damaging property, unsettling my horses and dog and ruining MY private space.

i cant imagine anyone supporting this ridiculous idea tbh.

 

[palo1]

no way do i want my peace disturbed by every tom dick and harry turning up, making a mess, damaging property, unsettling my horses and dog and ruining MY private space.

i cant imagine anyone supporting this ridiculous idea tbh.

no way do i want my peace disturbed by every tom dick and harry turning up, making a mess, damaging property, unsettling my horses and dog and ruining MY private space.

i cant imagine anyone supporting this ridiculous idea tbh.

Well I understand that and my OH would move out if he thought that was how it would be but I don't think the suggestion was for every tom dick and harry at all...just limited, identified community access which I presume the owner could select. The idea was coming from an environmental group too so not from an equestrian or parish council group. Entirely hypothetical but it IS interesting to see how people would respond to that suggestion. It's clearly not a go-er lol!! There are other ideas that groups of people come up with that I feel similarly infuriated by tbh so I do understand the reaction.

 

[mariew]

Community arenas sound fab, if there is enough demand around. I suspect people who can afford to build an arena wouldn't be the ones to chose a communal arena in the first place. Plus having a planning stipulation on a property to say you have to allow external people in just opens a can of worms on so many levels.

However, I admire the thought process though in relation to not having tons of arenas used once / day or week kicking around.

I suspect community arenas would work if they had decent parking and were monitored a but like a leisure centre. Booking slots, regular harrowing, people on site to prevent dog walkers and others ruining it etc. Run like a business really. Maybe it could be something the council could approach a yard or farm with a disused arena/barn and build one.

 

[Xmasha]

Perhaps the environmental group are looking at this the wrong way. Firstly, there are less and less arenas using rubber now, so thats a positive. Ive seen planning given but specifying that rubber isnt used. Secondly , when you consider how a paddock of that size would look if it wasnt given an all weather surface , im sure wed all agree it would be trashed.
Perhaps we should look at ways to counterbalance any environmental issues by stating if planning is given then an X sized area within the total acreage be given over to wild flowers to help the birds and the bees ?

 

[criso]

No I don't have an arena but I am not desperate to use one either!! This wasn't 'my' idea - but an idea mooted by a local environmental group who probably have very little idea of arena maintenance. I do understand all that having had plenty of experience at a decent livery of looking after the arena. I am not entirely clueless. I do think it is interesting that people are seeing things this way though; in relation to development of any kind and consumption. It grates on me to see old land turned into spanking new equestrian facilities but thankfully we do currently live in a free country and I do things that other people might not appreciate too. I get that as well as the privacy issue. As I said, I don't think it would be unworkable but for most people it is clearly unreasonable. That's ok too.

It terms of use and old land, presumably the same people who want to build an arena also want to graze their horses so for every 20 X 40 that gets dug up for an arena, there are 4 acres plus turned over to grazing and left undeveloped. So access to an arena sustains land around it. If the land is sold to someone who doesn't have a use for it, they may sell of parts of it resulting in more development.

 

[AnShanDan]

It is actually a cool idea to have a community arena, if it was workable in practice.

There used to be a facility near here that included a big outdoor (100x100m approx), 50x30 indoor and surfaced dressage arenas with excellent parking. It belonged to the local council and was run by their staff. It worked OK for hires and was used for riding mostly, inc. competitions but also rugby training and dog agility. It can't have made the council money so eventually the running of it changed to a private person, that didn't end well and the site was sold, the whole thing flattened and rebuilt on.

I've also been to the community indoor arena in Orkney, it was for a party

I can't see how it would work on an private arena being made available to the community basis, who would oversee the bookings and maintenance?

 

[chocolategirl]

I’ve just checked the date, I thought for a minute there it must be April 1st!?

 

[SEL]

It terms of use and old land, presumably the same people who want to build an arena also want to graze their horses so for every 20 X 40 that gets dug up for an arena, there are 4 acres plus turned over to grazing and left undeveloped. So access to an arena sustains land around it. If the land is sold to someone who doesn't have a use for it, they may sell of parts of it resulting in more development.

My old livery yard now has planning permission to build 8 houses on the footprint of the old barns and the arena. Before we were evicted one of the property developers was round doing surveys and I suggested that you could turn the whole site into a community equestrian property (there's 40 acres of grazing land they won't get planning permission on which the farmer still owns). Not A Chance was the response! My vision of 7 houses with stables and an arena was not something they even wanted to contemplate - they wanted 8 big houses down a private road which they could sell for a lot of money. The arena is developed land in planning terms and therefore can have a house on it.

Round me arenas going in are because the owners intend to hang onto the land for horses rather than selling it off to hit government housing targets. Its a plus in the local community.

 

[TGM]

With regards the point about whether people would build their own arenas if there was community access to one near by, I think it depends on individual circumstances. We were fortunate to be able to use two arenas within 10 minutes hacking from us, but still ended up building our own. One huge disadvantage in hacking to an arena is the short daylight hours in the winter and the fact that many people fit riding around school/college/work hours, With your own arena you can ride in the murky twilight or ride under lights. However, hacking to an arena in those circumstances would not be safe. And boxing up takes time and is not really very eco-friendly and you obviously need appropriate space to park at the arena, which is not always the case in a private yard. In addition, obviously the arena owner quite rightly has priority over their own arena. So you might find they have set up a full course of jumps or a jumping lane when you want an empty arena to practice a dressage test in. Or you find that the arena is out of bounds for some reason just before you are heading off to an important championship and need to practice. Also if you have a young horse (or a difficult one, or one in rehab) then having a space at home to do groundwork, lunge, long-rein or loose school is a godsend.

I must say on visual/environmental grounds a sensitively-sited small private use arena is not a hugely terrible thing in the scheme of things, in my opinion. As pointed out above, rubber surfaces are often not approved these days. We have sand and fibre, and as we are in a sandstone area I don't think it looks hugely out of place. It is timber-fenced and is partially screened with native hedging that we planted around it. Although we are in an AONB, it is grouped near existing houses and assorted garages/stables and other outbuildings and doesn't interrupt a swathe of untouched countryside. (And if it did then it would be unlikely that we would have gained planning permission).

I don't think arenas (particularly sand-based ones) are such a permanent thing as, say a housing development would be. If you don't use it and maintain it, it will grass over and look just like a small grass paddock very quickly!