Crosses that just don't work

[Yubbie]

My share horse is 5/8 TB 1/4 Sec D and 1/8 Shire so the potential to be a terrible mix (conformationally he's a bit odd!) but he's the most genuine horse you'll ever meet. He's very laid back, but so honest that he'll never say no. He gives everything just enough to get the job done and not an ounce more which makes him very safe. He's not the most confident of horses but if something bothers him he just freezes, takes a little bit of time to work it out and then gets on with it. He wouldn't know what a tantrum was. If he feels a rider wobble he'll slow down and gently push his head up to pop you back in the saddle. nobody has ever fallen off him *touches wood* just fallen over with him. He really is worth his not-insignificant weight in gold.

He sounds so much like my lad!! Mine also has the softest mouth, will slow & stop from subtle aids and is NEVER strong. He's just a very polite, sensible ride who'll try anything that is asked of him! I mainly do dressage with him now and despite the Shire side making him look like a tank he has lovely paces....courtesy of his TB side!!

 

[Lintel]

.... I'm sure I've seen a Highland X Shetland... Coudlnt imagine a worse...more stubborn... Dangerous cross EEK.
That being said its your luck really... Have seen some nice TBX cobs... And some horrendous!

 

[Annagain]

He sounds so much like my lad!! Mine also has the softest mouth, will slow & stop from subtle aids and is NEVER strong. He's just a very polite, sensible ride who'll try anything that is asked of him! I mainly do dressage with him now and despite the Shire side making him look like a tank he has lovely paces....courtesy of his TB side!!

We barely have to touch the reins, just a "woah" does it and we get complemented on his paces too, although I think the Sec D also helps with that. He has a very expressive, naturally elevated trot in particular. He's 21 now but was the same as a 5 year old. His owner's 10 year old has lost his nerve with his 13hh pony so rides M instead at the moment. M is 17hh!

 

[Welshie95]

I have always wondered what drew the breeder to cross these two:
Dam:

Sire:

 

[Nicnac]

Many, not all, of the crosses will be by and out of poor stock especially the Friesians. Breeds like Friesians are highly controlled and pure breds lose their papers if they cross breed.

There are some fugly crosses out there but some stunning ones as well.

 

[Caol Ila]

The problem with F1 crosses (the first generation of animals from a cross between two different breeds) is that you have no clue what characteristics of the parents your offspring is going to get, whereas carefully selecting individuals from the same (or similar) breed gives you some idea. A German friend of mine said crossing Halflingers and Arabs was a thing in Germany at one point, and for every decent horse, you were getting dozens more with weird conformations who were stubborn, smart, and nuts.

Crossing a draft horse with a light horse, for instance, is a risk. No matter how quality the parents are, it's a risk. You might get something with a bit more bone and a cooler head than the TB, or a bit more energetic than the draft, but still light on its feet and athletic, or you could get something more downhill than a ski slope with the draft front end and TB back end that's mad as a barn swallow on crack. You don't know. That's why some of us know wonderful draft crosses (I own one -- smart, sane, genuine) while others know ones they would not touch with a bargepole.

If you breed like to like, an Arab to an Arab, warmblood to warmblood, PRE to PRE, you know you'll get a horse that looks and moves like an Arab, warmblood, or PRE. The phenotype of your offspring is somewhat predictable (that's what makes it a breed!). The F1 cross between wildly differing breeds is a crapshoot.

 

[TheresaW]

I have a Suffolk Punch cross, I believe he's part ID. (Don't know for sure). He is the type of person you either love or hate. Can be a **** bag sometimes on the ground, luckily I can read him like a book and deal with him, but ridden, I would put my 88yo Nan, or my 2yo nephew on him. He has the head and body of a Suffolk, but his legs let him down. He's been retired for the last 3 years as he's very arthritic. Pic really don't show him as he is.

 

[teddypops]

I suppose the thing with crosses is people do it hoping for the best of both, but there will always be some out there that get the worst of both. I have met a few shire x tb like that - a stereotypical wired TB brain in the body of a brick outhouse probably wasn't what the breeder was aiming for! But it can also be a very useful cross when it works.

I used to break in and ride lots is shire x tb crosses. I loved them! Fast and forward going but sensible. They were all very tall but not massively chunky.

 

[Nudibranch]

My tb x "shire" (drum, so shire with pwb) has good confo and a lovely attitude but is totally unsound at 6. Such a shame. I won't go down that route again.

 

[Antw23uk]

Ive a mare whose sire is a big 15.1 traditional gypsy cob and the dame is a TBxID ..(she is a two times HOYS champion though) and he is a successful showing stallion so basically Im just showing off because I have an amazing horse

I also agree with one other who said shetland crosses are ugly and odd looking, lol

 

[eatmyshorts]

I know many people swear by them, but almost all the ShirexTB (not many I admit) I have known have had a filthy temper.

Equally, I love the idea of a HighlandxTB but they seem very few and far between, which suggests it may be not be a winner....

I had a Highland x Tb mare, a nice useful little type but with a mind of her own.

I know of a lovely cob x Lusitano. I'm just glad folk haven't started making up stupid names for them eg Cobitano!

 

[pip6]

My first mare was 3/4 arab and 1/4 highland. Superb mare, do anything, go anywhere yet forward and fun. I owe everything to her. thank you Kazella.

 

[Alibear]

It's the naming thing that concerns me, we're not heading down the designer dogs, cockapoo , pugalier route but with horses are we? we've go Warlander, Azteca, Qarab, etc ? May well be just me.

 

[Janah]

My Highland x TB

Brilliant hack, would have done really well in dressage and SJ if I had been a better rider.

 

[Chinchilla]

Perhaps the thread should be a 'why the h3ll would you let that reproduce?' rather than focusing on particular types? There was a bit of run on FB a while back of mares who were out of work being passed on as 'potential broodmare'. Most of the time I couldn't see why you would want a foal out of them, but there was always interest.

I'll throw my draft x appy mare into the mix. She was bred for meat so we'll forgive her her many shortcomings, but the only plus about breeding from her is I'd get a spotty foal - and I like spots. BUT that is the only plus, so I'm afraid she'll have to continue safely flirting with the geldings!

Ha I have a mare you could get a spotty foal from too - she is a fewspot who you couldn't exactly call beautiful in the traditional sense. I can't even say she's a cross between two particular breeds, was sold her as an 'potential appaloosa sporthorse broodmare/ridden horse' but a quick google revealed that that's not an actual breed. Not that I actual gave a d*mn I think she's the most wonderful creature to ever draw breath ...

...though removing my rose tinted specs I suppose she is a bit weird to look at though: only just a horse at 15.00hh with thick wavy mane and tail, a pathetic excuse for feathers, 7 4/5" bone, massive ears, okay paces when she can be bothered, and a big arse. But such a kind face. I do adore her.

http://i.imgur.com/0qFoiKg.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/EmHSLbZ.jpg

This is why she's been nicknamed the 'mule elf'...long pointy ears.
http://i.imgur.com/6RFDxfE.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/MdUOB3M.jpg

 

[skint1]

When I was a girl I had occasional riding lessons, I fell madly in love with a grey mare there called Silver System, she was a Quarter Horse/Arab Cross, just beautiful she was

 

[Annagain]

It's the naming thing that concerns me, we're not heading down the designer dogs, cockapoo , pugalier route but with horses are we? we've go Warlander, Azteca, Qarab, etc ? May well be just me.

God knows what a Shetland/Shire cross will be called

 

[Cowpony]

God knows what a Shetland/Shire cross will be called

Shirty!

 

[HufflyPuffly]

I'd say dangerous :lol:

 

[rachk89]

I think the mental horse at the last yard was a shire x tb. They tended to use a chiffney just to take him out to the field as he would rear unexpectedly at times. He would also throw his rider off a lot. But he was just a nutcase, I think possibly a fair few physical problems and possibly brain ones too. Specific breeds didn't create that behaviour. There was just times it was like a switch flicked on and he went nuts. Strange horse.

My horse is weird, oldenburg x connie and I think shouldn't be repeated. Pony characteristics combined with the power and random spookiness of a warmblood. Fantastic idea. At least he has one hell of a character, everyone loves him. Happiest horse ever. Just a bit weird at times to ride.

 

[Rollin]

I have seen some very nice and useful TBxClydesdale. The CBXTB is a superb sport horse, two Olympic SJ and one winner of Burleigh. I always felt the ShagyaXCB would be as good as if not better. We have bred my Shagya stallion to two CB mares and one Friesian owners are delighted with their foals - cannot post photos as there is yet another problem with photo bucket!!

 

[Ceriann]

Funny how we are all different, I think the baroque pintos are stunning!

I do think there can be good and bad examples of any cross though. For example a draught crossed with something lighter that ends up with a substantial body on scrawny legs.

I think that's v lovely!

 

[Amye]

My first horse love was a Shire x TB. I rode him for years at the riding school I grew up with as a teenager. I used to get him week on week on week as we got on so well.

He was proportioned like a shire but smaller and a bit slighter. He behaviour wasn't that bad as he was a riding school horse but he *could* be stubborn and lazy if you didn't ride him *right* so alot of people found him hard work, and he'd protest if you smacked him on the bum with a buck! But we just clicked and he was lovely, we used to bomb about the cross country field together - he was a cross country machine.

 

[DabDab]

Maybe so, but it's this particular trend for throwing 'fashionable' breeds into the mix that seems to be particularly prevalent at the minute. I guess that what I was really wondering was whether anybody else has noticed this ploy by backyard breeders, or whether it just seemed to be happening in my own little corner of Facebook!

I can see how it might increase the value of offspring from a gypsy cob or a thoroughbred, but one of the reasons I love and am endlessly fascinated by first generation crosses is that you can find some really nice horses as unbacked youngsters for next to no money because the market just isn't interested is a random cross.

Friesians are an interesting breed to cross out because they are so typey that they're usually pretty evident in the offspring.

 

[MiJodsR2BlinkinTite]

Mmmm..... an interesting thread this.

I went to see a lovely little mare this week, she was as sweet as honey, a real Christian little soul, fab with kids/dogs, the lot. A real darling.

Problem was the way she was put together. She was papered with the WP&CS as her Dam had excellent bloodlines; the sire was unknown.... looking at her she'd obviously been a bit of an accident, bless her. Put it this way, the head and the bum was OK, very "Welshie", but everything in between, OMFG!! She had a very straight upright shoulder and an incredibly short back; when I rode her she had a child's size saddle (14.5") because they said that was all there was room for on her back, I wouldn't disagree with that. Under saddle, there wasn't anything at all in front of the saddle and her ears were right in your lap, very disconcerting indeed.

A real shame as she was a really nice little girl She was 14.1 and admittedly has some growing still to do but IMO will only ever be suitable for a child.

However I have seen some very nice Welsh crosses so possibly the Sire in this case was a bit runty.

Some native/TB crosses work well, saw a very handsome Welsh D X TB out hacking when I was miles from home the other day, have also seen a very nice Dartmoor X TB; also a good few years ago now rode a very passable Shire X TB mare over Exmoor who was steady over rough terrain and sure-footed to a fault but could go like a deer when she was asked.

 

[Crugeran Celt]

I bred from my mare who was out of an arab x TB to Welsh Sect D (Nebo Black Magic) and put her to a TB stallion. I have kept the foal who is now 24 having lost her mum many years ago. She is a lovely little mare and very attractive but has many health issues but as I have kept her not really been a massive issue. Having worked in an equine rescue charity it is heartbreaking how many badly bred foals, usually colts are dumped and left to die. I wish there was much more legislation on breeding and keeping entire horses. The fashion to have a coloured cob seems to be waning but unfortunately so many coloureds have been produced and whilst breeders are trying to put their mares to solid coloured stallions the gene must be strong as inevitability the off spring is coloured. Many of these horses are changing hands for a couple of pound, they are of poor breeding and quality and probably suffer due to their poor conformation and not up to the job they are expected to do. Very sad.

 

[Slightlyconfused]

I had a welsh D X TB. The most stunning animal I've ever seen, he seriously used to turn heads. But he had inherited the worst traits from both breeds. He was hilarious though, such a character and actually really easy to back and bring on, but he was sharp and when that switch in his head went, there was not much that you could do.

I had one of these.
Stunning and moved beautiful but was so sharp and a slightly nervous wreak.
Loved her to pieces though.

 

[onetomany]

I've just seen another of the numerous posts on sales sites that advertise a cob crossed with a Friesian, and I simply can't work out why people do it. Although I'm sure there are some lovely mixes out there who buck the trend, I've yet to see one, with most appearing to have oversized heads and oddly long, scrawny necks and bodies. Nor have I seen a single good example of cobs crossed with warmbloods, which seems to be another new fad. I honestly think that these crosses are done simply because cobs are cheap, and warmbloods and Friesians are in vogue right now, making the offspring economical to breed but more marketable when aimed at novice buyers.

Does anyone else see some of the new crosses around and wonder why, or am I the only one? There are lots of fantastic old-fashioned mixes, but the abundance of backyard breeders appear to prefer getting hold of a fashionable stallion and just letting it run with poorly conformed coloured cob mares to get youngsters with no real utility. It all seems rather sad to me, especially for all of the resultant ponies who appear doomed to conformational issues down the line because of a lack of foresight on the parts of those who've bred them.

And no, I'm certainly not a breed purist or a Gypsy Cob hater, as these two prove, so if I've noticed it, I'm sure other people must have too!

 

[onetomany]

At home we have a friesian x cob or shire, can't work out which.
I'll admit he looks like 2 horses put together: huge head, chunky legs with a small friesian body and high thick neck.
Not really pretty to look at and Defo not show worthy. His head is handsome thought! Jet black with 4 knee high socks and a lovely blaze.

However do I care? Not really! He's a hack for my mum and he looks after her 100%. Yes he's got his conformational faults but he's not doing an event, he's just plodding about.

With the life he has lived pulling tourist wagons in Ireland he's as bomb proof as you could get....i doubt I could find a warmblood or smart cob as laid back as he is. For us the cross works, he's safe, reliable and such a good friend for a hack out with mum!



Edit to add he's about 20 years old so it's not a new breeding thing!

I think some horrid things have been said about the cross breeding. You have what you want and let others chose what they want. All animals need love. I have crossed my gypsy cob mare with a Friesian. We got a perfect foal which we will keep for life. Many cob's are getting smaller. By cross breeding the cobs should gain some size. Also Friesian pure breed horses only live for around 15 yrs. This is because of choosy breeding many years ago by us human's.. Mix breed Frisians live a normal life ,. I think if you dont like cross breed horses fine but that is up to the person than owns the animal. Not for others to point fingers and make remarks about being ugly . Why do so many horses people think they are perfect. ???

 

[scruffyponies]

Call me cynical, but I'm certain some of the cross-bred things you see advertised aren't anything of the sort. Given that they aren't registered anywhere, what's to stop you saying that dobbin is an Arab x Freisian x Connie (or whatever) if you think it will add a few quid to the price?