Dog thefts and prevention - Red Dog Spray

[Meowy Catkin]

In the UK we would have gone up to him, stuck a drip in his arm, put him in a neck brace, placed him on a spinal board and gently transferred him into the back of an ambulance with accompaning words of comfort.

I just want to pick up on this as it has been on my mind.

If someone is injured, even if they are a criminal who was injured trying to escape arrest, it is entirely correct that they should get medical help.

Do you remember the London Bridge attack where former prisoners helped to keep the attacker restrained to prevent him hurting anyone else? https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-55084126

 

[paddy555]

Fight/flight/freeze are innate responses over which most people have no control and no matter what plan they think they have.

I personally, if I meet someone I know on a walk, want to stop and have a chat with them without my dog turning itself inside out. If a person, especially one with a large/naturally suspicious dog, is constantly eyeing everyone passing by or stopping for an innocent chat as a threat and passing that insecurity down the lead, they are putting their dog in an extremely unfair position and potentially endangering innocent members of the public.
Are people who do martial arts as a hobby generally walking down the street always prepared to karate chop someone? As I imagine that would making walking down the street pretty stressful. Same for a dog.
JMO, I agree there needs to be balance and I appreciate that I say that as a person with dogs who perhaps offer an immediate visual deterrent anyway...but also ones who would get into real trouble with the authorities if they were popping off at anyone and everyone if I was feeling nervous and making them feel unstable/insecure.

I don't get that. To my mind having a plan puts you in control it doesn't make you fearful in fact quite the opposite. Being alert is very different from eyeing everyone suspiciously in case they are a threat.

It is very much like riding, something goes wrong and the horse panics. You don't want the rider to fight/flight/freeze. You want the rider to tell the horse they are in charge and have assessed the situation and it is perfectly OK to carry on. That way confident horse on all occasions. I expect the horse to keep a look out as we ride along and tell me who is around and for me to then make a decision as to whether it is safe to carry on.

No different with my dog. I expect him to react (not bark or bite) and tell me who is around. I am never nervous or fearful walking him so I am not passing any insecurity down the lead to him. In fact, as with the horses, I am extremely confident and there is no chance of him popping off at anyone accidentally. In fact as he is under constant control the public are at far less danger from him than the numerous off lead dogs causing havoc.
However if we really did get into a dangerous situation whilst I hope his size and breed would act as the deterrent if an undesirable really did come close (which they haven't as yet) I would expect him to do something and I know that he would.

I don't agree F/F/F which essentially is fear are responses over which you have no control. If they were you may as well not do anything, just be a victim.

 

[CorvusCorax]

It's not about whether you agree or not, it's a scientifically recognised response to stress.
What part of 'fight' are you not understanding, out of those three? This is what you've indicated you would do.

You said your dog is 'very reactive if anyone is within 100 yards of me. Any closer and he will be extremely reactive.'
If 'anyone' means just a normal passer-by/postman/child on a bike etc etc, I'd personally be wanting to either fix that for his own sake or not put him in situations where he gets stressed by passive human beings minding their own business.

 

[skinnydipper]

Apologies if someone has already pointed this out.

A reactive dog is not protecting its owner, it is protecting itself. Reactivity is fear based. The owner should be working with the dog to have the dog look to the owner for guidance and protection. The dog should not feel it has to protect itself.

 

[skinnydipper]

Christ, 100 yards . If he is reacting at 100 yards then 100 yards is too close.

This is also cause for concern "He would attack if someone was close"

 

[GSD Woman]

Living in the lawless USA I always make an effort to be aware of my surroundings and the people near me. As a woman it has become second nature. And I agree with those who are saying a weapon can be used against you. That is why I prefer pepper spray, legal here, over a gun. Pepper spray may hurt like the devil but it won't kill me. And my dogs are a good deterrent. There is something to be said for the general bad reputation that German Shepherds have.

 

[Birker2020]

I just want to pick up on this as it has been on my mind.

If someone is injured, even if they are a criminal who was injured trying to escape arrest, it is entirely correct that they should get medical help.

To be fair I didn't say it wasn't exactly I was just saying that we are way too soft over here. In the example I gave in respect to an episode of 'PD Cam' they didn't assess his injuries as they didn't have time on their hands, they just yanked him out. You have to remember in the USA there would be a very high chance, given that he is fleeing from law enforcement, that he would be likely to use a firearm. So the police use a different response. You are not going to hang around and give a criminal a chance to come back at you with a firearm so the majority of their actions would be reactive. Guns are a constant potential threat to police, whereas in the UK it is unlikely (although not guaranteed) that an assailant would have a gun.

The police in the states have my full admiration for what they have to deal with on a day to day basis. Unless you have watched PD Cam and can see for yourself how often they get shot at and the type of people they have to deal with then you cannot understand fully where I am coming from. Yes they made a huge unforgivable error of judgement with George Floyd but that is one or two police not entire law enforcement.

 

[skinnydipper]

.......

 

[Birker2020]

.......

???

 

[skinnydipper]

???

Okay. Seeing as you asked, this is what I deleted.

What a funny old thread this is turning out to be. It's difficult to keep track.

We've got someone obsessed with having a plan for dealing with dog thieves when out walking, when they themselves find it too stressful to take their own dog off their property for fear of nuisance dogs.

And someone fond of promoting 'muzzles for all' "liking" a post where it says a dog would kick off 100 yards from people and would attack if a person came close.

I sometimes hold back from saying what I think on the forum but mostly what you see is what you get so I find this sort of thing perplexing.

 

[Birker2020]

Okay. Seeing as you asked, this is what I deleted.

What a funny old thread this is turning out to be. It's difficult to keep track.

We've got someone obsessed with having a plan for dealing with dog thieves when out walking, when they themselves find it too stressful to take their own dog off their property for fear of nuisance dogs.

And someone fond of promoting 'muzzles for all' "liking" a post where it says a dog would kick off 100 yards from people and would attack if a person came close.

I sometimes hold back from saying what I think on the forum but mostly what you see is what you get so I find this sort of thing perplexing.

The thing is, you are not the Worlds authority on dogs and how to handle them. So your views may well be skewered against others who have a different experience/take on things.
At the end of the day just because people want to arm themselves to protect their dogs and you think more of the thief's rights than you do of the bereft dog owner, we can't all agree can we?

We are all different and all have different views based on our experience. It wouldn't do to make us all the same would it?

 

[skinnydipper]

The thing is, you are not the Worlds authority on dogs and how to handle them. So your views may well be skewered against others who have a different experience/take on things.
At the end of the day just because people want to arm themselves to protect their dogs and you think more of the thief's rights than you do of the bereft dog owner, we can't all agree can we?

We are all different and all have different views based on our experience. It wouldn't do to make us all the same would it?

Ah, I see. You asked me what I had deleted so you could start an argument.

 

[Birker2020]

Ah, I see. You asked me what I had deleted so you could start an argument.

No sorry I didn't. I was just curious what ...... meant, that was all.

I'm not trying to argue, I do in all honesty feel a bit piqued by you condemning me for wanting to be 'armed' but heh, none of us are perfect. Believe me if I could use pepper spray legally I'd have no hesitation but I can't so I won't. Even though a can of it is for sale on ebay at the moment! Or it was, it's now been pulled.

 

[Smitty]

Oh FFS: There were 3 paragraphs on that post, not just one sentence.

 

[skinnydipper]

Oh FFS: There were 3 paragraphs on that post, not just one sentence.

On which thread?

Milan has brought back breed selective licensing

or

I am DONE

I have a cross breed molosser, ? one of the types of dogs you would like to see muzzled.

 

[Smitty]

I for one am sticking to the posts on this thread which is primarily about dog theft and prevention.

 

[Penny Less]

Have been told this today and its on local facebook apparently. There have been a lot of dog thefts and attempted thefts locally. Police have said that thieves are putting plastic ties around lamp posts outside properties where dogs live ( bit like the chalk marks on gates etc) A chap in our road with a small dog has discovered a tie around the lamp post outside his house . Anyone else come across this?

 

[bonny]

Have been told this today and its on local facebook apparently. There have been a lot of dog thefts and attempted thefts locally. Police have said that thieves are putting plastic ties around lamp posts outside properties where dogs live ( bit like the chalk marks on gates etc) A chap in our road with a small dog has discovered a tie around the lamp post outside his house . Anyone else come across this?

Do you have a link to the police saying that plastic ties are identifying houses with dogs because that sounds like paranoia to me ?

 

[CorvusCorax]

Are these lamp posts which may once have had posters attached to them, by any chance?

 

[skinnydipper]

Ex-burglar explains truth behind signs thieves leave at your home
https://www.examinerlive.co.uk/news/uk-world-news/ex-burglar-explains-truth-behind-19732478

 

[Birker2020]

Are these lamp posts which may once have had posters attached to them, by any chance?

It's like the wind plaits that would be thieves spend ages putting in horses manes in the middle of a field standing in the open so that they may be easily spotted. But if that fails the owners can be alerted before the horse/pony is stolen by seeing the plaits in place

And chalk marks made by bored kids with nothing better to do.

 

[Penny Less]

I said I had been told, I dont do facebook. thats why I asked if anyone else had come across it. Two different people have told me this morning. Lamposts in our road have never had posters attached. Its true that there have been a lot of thefts locally

Interesting SD !

 

[skinnydipper]

Local Police have confirmed a rise in dog theft in our area and have urged people to be careful about posting pictures of their pet on social media.

 

[skinnydipper]

Dog thieves “tagging” pet owner’s homes with paint – Dog thefts increasing

https://www.vetreport.net/2014/10/d...wners-homes-with-paint-dog-thefts-increasing/

 

[bonny]

Dog thieves “tagging” pet owner’s homes with paint – Dog thefts increasing

https://www.vetreport.net/2014/10/d...wners-homes-with-paint-dog-thefts-increasing/

Says a man with a cctv company, that’s very convincing!

 

[skinnydipper]

Says a man with a cctv company, that’s very convincing!

Did you read this link? https://www.examinerlive.co.uk/news/uk-world-news/ex-burglar-explains-truth-behind-19732478

Luke, consultant at a smart home security company said: “This is something that is common with criminal groups, as opposed to single burglars or opportunist thieves.

Someone will suss out a house or houses and mark it with some sort of sign – on the fence or something – and is most common around dog thefts.

This is a tactic I was aware of when I was involved in burglaries, around 18 years ago, but seems to be much more common now."

 

[bonny]

Did you read this link? https://www.examinerlive.co.uk/news/uk-world-news/ex-burglar-explains-truth-behind-19732478

Luke, consultant at a smart home security company said: “This is something that is common with criminal groups, as opposed to single burglars or opportunist thieves.

Someone will suss out a house or houses and mark it with some sort of sign – on the fence or something – and is most common around dog thefts.

This is a tactic I was aware of when I was involved in burglaries, around 18 years ago, but seems to be much more common now."

Your two links are both comments from home security experts, coincidence ?

 

[skinnydipper]

A spokesperson for Durham police said: “It is believed that these markings, letters or symbols may be used by thieves to identify houses containing dogs with a view to stealing them at a later date.

We would encourage all dog owners to pay attention to their properties and report any such instances to the police as well as taking extra care when walking their pets as to who is watching them enter their property.”

 

[Smitty]

Did you read this link? https://www.examinerlive.co.uk/news/uk-world-news/ex-burglar-explains-truth-behind-19732478

Luke, consultant at a smart home security company said: “This is something that is common with criminal groups, as opposed to single burglars or opportunist thieves.

Someone will suss out a house or houses and mark it with some sort of sign – on the fence or something – and is most common around dog thefts.

This is a tactic I was aware of when I was involved in burglaries, around 18 years ago, but seems to be much more common now."

 

[Smitty]

Did you read this link? https://www.examinerlive.co.uk/news/uk-world-news/ex-burglar-explains-truth-behind-19732478

Luke, consultant at a smart home security company said: “This is something that is common with criminal groups, as opposed to single burglars or opportunist thieves.

Someone will suss out a house or houses and mark it with some sort of sign – on the fence or something – and is most common around dog thefts.

This is a tactic I was aware of when I was involved in burglaries, around 18 years ago, but seems to be much more common now."