Draw reins... Who uses them and why?

Queenbee

Well-Known Member
Joined
20 August 2007
Messages
12,020
Location
Cumbria
Visit site
Guido, no that's a fair question... Both horses were like this from the day I got them, although other horses that I ride/have ridden have not been like this. You must understand that pix was a teenage jogging stargazing pony that had been religiously used as a prince Philip cup pony before I had him, he evaded everyone and jogged with everyone, I was actually one of the only people who would ride him when the riding school got him on trial so I could try with a view to buy they also used him in a few lessons and I think the longest anyone else was on him was about 5 mins before there were tears and I had to swop onto him. This was just him, raring to go at all times anywhere! I only ever saw one person get him in an outline... I never even attempted it, I was 13 and it was far beyond my skill base to do so with such a horse, only my riding instructor could do it. With ebony she was a very green unschooled 7 yr old, sharp and headstrong with genetically a higher head carriage than some... She was like this on hacks with her previous owner... Although she only went out once or twice a month with them, and they were happy to let her do pretty much anything she wanted to :( twizzle on here has ridden ebony and she would tell you the same... Ebony would do this to her last day if she thought she could evade you, but eventually she became familiar with going in an outline too, which meant that I could ride her without her evading. Don't get me wrong, I know I've always had what is known as a bit of a hot seat, but equally I have a thing for hot sparky horses to start with... I'm pretty sure it's less to do with me and more to do with the type of horse I go for lol! As I said, there are many other horses that I have been able to get on and ride or school all the way up without ever using dr. X
 
Joined
28 February 2011
Messages
16,449
Visit site
I use them. I use them and abuse them. I absolutely love them!

Imagie tryig to lead 6 ponies at a time and holding onto 6 lead ropes?! Eh no ta! Clip one end to the furthest out pony then loop it through the headcollar of the next and so on and so forth until you get to number 6 which gets clipped on as well. Take up your position halfway through the line, grab hold ad off we go!

Et voila! Pony Express!
 

ecrozier

Well-Known Member
Joined
20 October 2006
Messages
6,173
Visit site
Lol at EKW I think you are very brave! I struggle ride and lead with one!
I use them. Not regularly and as yet never for school work - however my almost 17hh six year old has this year developed a habit of spooking/spinning when things look 'out of the ordinary' - for example squirrels, pigeons, bin day, carrier bag by road, etc etc. not a major issue on quiet lanes/bridle ways, however on main national speed limit road outside out old yard, with idiotic drivers aplenty, that just could t happen without huge risk to him and me. So he is hacked for roadwork in draw reins. It allows me to catch the drop-shoulder-spin manoeuvre before its fully executed and we are in the path of oncoming traffic.
I've since moved yards and am now hopeful that I won't need them for hacking, however he's currently being rehabbed from box rest, he's been in for 9 weeks today, and is now up to 30 mins ridden walk exercise at a time. I prefer to avoid sedation (acp/Sedalin) if possible so have had the draw reins on hand if needed, he's only needed them twice on particularly windy/busy days, and they have done exactly as required - allowed me to catch the spin/spook manoeuvre before either of us came to harm! But as someone said earlier they are never used to keep his head down in an 'outline', just to prevent it from going miles in the air and mid spin!!
I've yet to use them for schooling purposes and can't see myself needinh too, but for certain situations I think they do have a place.
 

The wife

Well-Known Member
Joined
29 August 2012
Messages
752
Location
It's a working progress
Visit site
I use them. I use them and abuse them. I absolutely love them!

Imagie tryig to lead 6 ponies at a time and holding onto 6 lead ropes?! Eh no ta! Clip one end to the furthest out pony then loop it through the headcollar of the next and so on and so forth until you get to number 6 which gets clipped on as well. Take up your position halfway through the line, grab hold ad off we go!

Et voila! Pony Express!

What an excellent idea!!! Have tried juggling 4 lead ropes before, me hands are too small. But threading through, ingenious !
 

Lyle

Well-Known Member
Joined
23 October 2010
Messages
1,075
Visit site
I have and do use them, but only with great consideration and thought to the horse first. I love using running reins on the lunge, the horses seem to like it too and they get a lovely stretch in all three paces and no tantrums!

Some horses need them to help the penny to drop. My last TB was incredibly inverted, had no idea how to yield to a contact and would just stop with rein pressure. Lunged him in the running reins for a few weeks until he got the picture. Introduced them to riding, and he responded very well. They helped him to get a clearer picture of what was being asked, they helped to direct him where to go.

New TB carries himself beautifully, very soft and I can place him where I want. Except in some transitions :rolleyes: I started to ask him to stay round throughout the halt, he started to ark up. Popped the draw reins on, and they helped him to stay engaged through the halt (no head popping up) he would halt square, and when his head came up they would encourage him down. The problem I'd been having was any rein contact from me would send him backwards, I'd send him forward, and he would shut down :eek:

One session with the DR, one measley moment of 'whatt?' and now his halts are beautiful :D Sqaure, soft, still.

I never use them to hold a head in a postion. The horse is free to lift his head to a degree, but anymore and the draw reins will come into contact then. He has the choice, follow the pressure down or fight it. I've found them invaluable for allowing me to show the horse what I want without the need for strong aids.
 

mandwhy

Well-Known Member
Joined
9 July 2008
Messages
4,589
Location
Cambridge, UK
Visit site
I have to admit I kind of thought they were the devil, mainly due to the cringeworthy sight of a strapped down false 'outline'!

Totally think it is fine if it will help with a rearer or dangerous behaviour.

How do they help with bucking though? They don't really look like they would stop the horse putting their head down to buck, or is it more the head forwards and that first 'up' movement that often precedes the buck (bronco stylee)?

My loan TB does not have a super high head carriage but just doesn't really know where to put his head in general, he has nice paces but his head can be all over the place (sometimes headshakes due to flies as well so a face net helps) which makes him unbalanced. I was thinking of trying side reins on the lunge and don't see how draw reins are much different.

The main issue I have with these things is that they are attached to the horse's mouth, does anyone ever use them attached to a noseband or anything, or would that not work?
 

Auslander

Well-Known Member
Joined
13 November 2010
Messages
12,783
Location
Berkshire
Visit site
I found them very useful out hacking on a big, strong, stroppy SelleFrancais - who (like most frenchmen) had no respect for women. Not only did it stop him from sticking his ears in my mouth then leaping and plunging like a fool - but I found that the girth to bit part is in just the right place to grab when you're wallowing around on your face in the mud, and the horse thinks it might be funny to sod off home without you.
 

martlin

Well-Known Member
Joined
3 December 2008
Messages
7,649
Location
Lincs
www.martlinequestrian.co.uk
I use them occasionally. Why? Because I consider them useful for a variety of situations. As long as you are aware what the potential pitfalls are, and what problems they solve versus what problems they create, I can see no reason for them to be condemned.

I shall take my coat and go to hell forthwith.
 

trottingon

Well-Known Member
Joined
18 December 2009
Messages
1,072
Visit site
I agree with Queenbee and also this..
'This was "teenage boy" tantrums and the draw reins were a quick and fair way of keeping me safe while letting him know what his priorities needed to be'
I am a bit too novice for my youngster and he's taking advantage, he is fine for the rider i have schooling him but I struggle like mad to get his attention, and he is currently testing me quite badly, so at the suggestion of my rider and instructor I put them on as a backup if my boy is showing signs of being a git, not to "bring his head in" particularly but just to help me get him to focus and listen to me and I have to say they have worked a treat, so although I've never liked them particularly and think they encourage a horse to move without engaging their back end, they are a bit of a lifeline for me at the moment.
 

indie999

Well-Known Member
Joined
16 January 2009
Messages
2,974
Visit site
They were used on a pony my son use to ride to stop putting the head down to eat the grass when small passenger on board. It was only whilst they were out the school ie middle of field and son was learning to canter. Not sure if thats what they were supposed for but it worked Havent read all the posts.
 

guido16

Well-Known Member
Joined
24 March 2009
Messages
2,565
Location
Somewhere
Visit site
Queen bee, like I said, now offence intended!

You answer explains it well. I used to have a hot seat when I was younger also. Or for me,e maybe it was just bad riding..:)

EKW - do you have to order extra long DR's for that? ;-p
 

Jools1234

Well-Known Member
Joined
31 August 2012
Messages
1,341
Location
the dark side?
Visit site
They were used on a pony my son use to ride to stop putting the head down to eat the grass when small passenger on board. It was only whilst they were out the school ie middle of field and son was learning to canter. Not sure if thats what they were supposed for but it worked Havent read all the posts.

i am not trying to be funny but are you sure they were drawer reins as they sre not designed to stop the head going down, in my mind they do the opposite
 

indie999

Well-Known Member
Joined
16 January 2009
Messages
2,974
Visit site
i am not trying to be funny but are you sure they were drawer reins as they sre not designed to stop the head going down, in my mind they do the opposite

I have absolutely no idea I was told by riding instructor thats what they were?? I am completely clueless on this(as you realise)! I will endeavour to educate myself and find a picture. But I really have no idea as I have never used them myself, long time ago. I remember them being attached to the saddle??? from the bit ie along the side below the normal reins. They may have gone up somewhere but def to saddle on both sides below the reins? It did stop the pony stretching its neck down ie to keep the head in line(if that makes sense). They werent used all the time as the pony was nice and well behaved. Just when we went out in the middle of nowhere for an off lead rein first canter. They did the job. Not sure would want to do this permanently as can imagine the horse being unable to move so freely??? Thats my interpretation!
 

Jazzy B

Well-Known Member
Joined
4 September 2011
Messages
1,240
Visit site
Queen bee, like I said, now offence intended!

You answer explains it well. I used to have a hot seat when I was younger also. Or for me,e maybe it was just bad riding..:)

EKW - do you have to order extra long DR's for that? ;-p

there is no such thing as a hot seat, just where people fail to sit properly in the saddle ;) I hate draw reins as currently reschooling a horse who has had been ridden to death in them.............
 

tallyho!

Following a strict mediterranean diet...
Joined
8 July 2010
Messages
14,952
Visit site
Never used one. I don't know if it's because I never needed one or because I saw an ex NH horse ridden to death on one. Oh my god that poor horse. It was even hacked in one. I was at this yard a whole year and I swear, I never saw him ridden without one. Anyway, he was retired a year later with kissing spine. Now, this is the thing... Was he ridden in DRs because he was naughty and in pain from his back so she put one on, or did he develop it from being ridden in constant overbend?

I completely understand that if used as an aid, temporarily to help the horse understand something then fine. But to use it as a restraint like the horse above, I wholeheartedly disagree.

Every gadget was invented by someone for something. Unless you understand it's primary use, don't use it. It then becomes abuse.

I have used side reins to reschool a horse. A few weeks is all it took to correct a behaviour I did not want. In total, 9times. Three times a week schooling. DR would have had a slightly different effect so that's why I chose SR.

Everyone has different opinions, all based on indidual experience. It's nice to come on here and find out what other people use things for. Well, actually, sometimes it's not nice but, it's interesting!
 

Minstrel_Ted

Well-Known Member
Joined
27 May 2010
Messages
149
Location
Aberdeen
Visit site
Yes I used them. For my horse who bolted by snatching the bit, they were used as a warning, it worked, it was not to look good it was for safety, they have now been hanging in the tackroom for a great many years as I phased them out, said horse is now a perfect hack. So they did the job for me, and if for the same reason I felt the need for them again I would not hesitate.
 

siennamum

Well-Known Member
Joined
18 February 2004
Messages
5,575
Location
Bristol
Visit site
R.

Everyone has different opinions, all based on indidual experience. It's nice to come on here and find out what other people use things for. Well, actually, sometimes it's not nice but, it's interesting!

I agree, nice to have considered and open minded responses. If you know why you use them and how to use them they are a useful tool in certain situations.

I really think it likely that most competition yards have draw reins on them. Many riders we admire use them, whether you think that's right or wrong, they clearly don't ruin all horses. I think if you make sanctimonious statements about your superior management and riding abilities in nothing but a frenchlink then you probably haven't ridden, schooled or competed many horses to any level. And on the subject of sweeping statements......
 

mon

Well-Known Member
Joined
29 June 2007
Messages
1,683
Visit site
Does an elastic bungee strap count as the same. One which.goes from side of girth through bit rings and and over head?
 

Wagtail

Horse servant
Joined
2 December 2010
Messages
14,815
Location
Lincs
Visit site
This is a problem that I have with discussions about draw reins. There is nothing inconsistent in my use of them and correct training.

And I never can understand why it is supposed in some way to be better to allow a horse to struggle, sometimes for months, with a part of its training than it is to explain it kindly and easily in draw reins in a few days.


For example,
I've retrained a number of ex racers whose idea of a canter transition on a bend in an arena was to throw its head as high as possible into the air in order to pull the forehand off the floor. They can go on like that for weeks because they know no other way of doing things. It can be associated with other lovely things like a big buck from behind - shoving you straight into their neck with your face - or a mad dash across the arena.

I can't personally see the point of waiting weeks and putting up with that level of discomfort as a rider, when a few sessions in draw reins, held so the the head is in front of the verticle, educates the horse very quickly that there is actually a more comfortable way to strike off for a canter transition. I don't see that the time delay of not using draw reins is of benefit to either the horse or the rider.

And I don't see that anything in that use is "incorrect" training. It's just taking a little help when it is offered.



Wagtail and Deicinmerlyn, does your more "correct" way of retraining include the use of side reins?

Cptrayes, I really, really, really do not struggle for days or weeks with a horse throwing its head up in a canter transition. I do not use draw reins when riding because I can do far more to train a horse without them. It is quite easy to train a horse not to throw its head up in the canter transition within a couple of ridden sessions and correct timing/release of the half halt. I never use side reins ridden because there is no need for them. However, when a horse is lunged, it does not have the benefit of the riders hands. My process of retraining an ex racer is to lunge firstly in the pessoa to strengthen the top line, and then to introduce ridden work and occasional lunging in side reins, but not until the horse has learned to go correctly under saddle. I can usually have an off the track horse going reasonably correctly within the first 15 minutes of ridden schooling. Correct transitions take more time as the horse has to build up the strength to execute them smoothly and correctly, but I think that draw reins are counter productive and just allow a horse to develop more of the wrong muscles enabling it to fight the rider. Yes, you will see an immediate lightening when you first take the reins off, but this is very short lived.
 

Queenbee

Well-Known Member
Joined
20 August 2007
Messages
12,020
Location
Cumbria
Visit site
Guido and miss bean... I don't disagree... As a teenager I was particularly drawn to hot and fizzy horses and I responded in kind, my focus at that age was never schooling for a calm horse but bombing around the countryside and jumping rounds at breakneck speed on said fizzy horses... To me, at that age a 'correct' seat was not what it was all about at all!!! As time went by I still stuck with the hot fizzy horses but I tamed my wild side down a tad lol and I did start to see the need for schooling etc and focused my attitude on that, in older days when my horse jogged or bunny hopped or pranced around I wouldn't check it or try and intervene just sit there with a grin on my face :D that's not to say I couldn't use my seat for those things and I did in my lessons but out of the lessons I was a devil child on the back of a demon pony :D ahh, the good old days ;)
 

Wagtail

Horse servant
Joined
2 December 2010
Messages
14,815
Location
Lincs
Visit site
I use them. I use them and abuse them. I absolutely love them!

Imagie tryig to lead 6 ponies at a time and holding onto 6 lead ropes?! Eh no ta! Clip one end to the furthest out pony then loop it through the headcollar of the next and so on and so forth until you get to number 6 which gets clipped on as well. Take up your position halfway through the line, grab hold ad off we go!

Et voila! Pony Express!

:eek: Sounds bl@@dy dangerous to me!
 

Tinsel Town

Well-Known Member
Joined
30 December 2010
Messages
1,065
Visit site
I dont becuase I dont really understand the point of them.... :eek:

My friend uses them, and ive heard her using the reason becuase her pony was strong or not listening.....

I asked another friend about this (classically trained prix st george rider) and she nearly had a heart attack! lol! she HATES them!
 

Wagtail

Horse servant
Joined
2 December 2010
Messages
14,815
Location
Lincs
Visit site
There is only one situation where I would use draw reins. For safety. If I absolutely had to ride a horse that was too strong for me and was liable to bolt or spook dangerously.
 

Queenbee

Well-Known Member
Joined
20 August 2007
Messages
12,020
Location
Cumbria
Visit site
Bugger I posted to soon, I meant to say I don't disagree but I don't entirely agree... There are such things as a hot seat... It has to do with the temperament of the rider, this like many other things is something the rider has to take charge of, not all riders have a hot seat and I do think it's very much linked to rider attitude and response to the horse they are rising, I love riding spunky horses and ponies, and in the past containing my response to riding them was not something i couldnt do it was just not something that was important.... That's not necesarily bad riding, I had a great seat, could ride either side of anything, sit any misbehaviour, jump anything, and I could calm horses if absolutely necessary... I didn't encourage misbehaviour deliberately winding horses up... I just didnt discourage it either... But then that's how I remember kids to be. I still love fizzy horses but I have more of a 'mummy says no' attitude than an 'ok do it' attitude ;)
 

Wagtail

Horse servant
Joined
2 December 2010
Messages
14,815
Location
Lincs
Visit site
What do people think about instructors who get their pupils to ride in them? In my experience this happens when the rider is unable to get the horse onto the bit and the instructor is too lazy to teach them to do it. You need endless patience with some people, and I think some instructors just give up.
 

Wagtail

Horse servant
Joined
2 December 2010
Messages
14,815
Location
Lincs
Visit site
Bugger I posted to soon, I meant to say I don't disagree but I don't entirely agree... There are such things as a hot seat... It has to do with the temperament of the rider, this like many other things is something the rider has to take charge of, not all riders have a hot seat and I do think it's very much linked to rider attitude and response to the horse they are rising, I love riding spunky horses and ponies, and in the past containing my response to riding them was not something i couldnt do it was just not something that was important.... That's not necesarily bad riding, I had a great seat, could ride either side of anything, sit any misbehaviour, jump anything, and I could calm horses if absolutely necessary... I didn't encourage misbehaviour deliberately winding horses up... I just didnt discourage it either... But then that's how I remember kids to be. I still love fizzy horses but I have more of a 'mummy says no' attitude than an 'ok do it' attitude ;)

One of my clients is the opposite. We joke that she has a cold seat as everything she gets on just shuts down, goes on the forehand and drags itself along. Even horses that are usually very hot and forward going. I think she carries a lot of stiffness through her body and is blocking them.
 

Pale Rider

Well-Known Member
Joined
15 June 2011
Messages
2,305
Location
Northern Spain
Visit site
One of my clients is the opposite. We joke that she has a cold seat as everything she gets on just shuts down, goes on the forehand and drags itself along. Even horses that are usually very hot and forward going. I think she carries a lot of stiffness through her body and is blocking them.

Cannot comment on the stiffness, but sounds to me like you're discussing an individuals energy. Some people always manage to gee horses up, as you say, I feel this is the horse picking up on someones high energy, conversely some folk display low energy and can shut a horse down. Learning to raise and lower your energy level when riding certainly has an effect on the horse when being ridden, or on the ground.
 

Wagtail

Horse servant
Joined
2 December 2010
Messages
14,815
Location
Lincs
Visit site
Cannot comment on the stiffness, but sounds to me like you're discussing an individuals energy. Some people always manage to gee horses up, as you say, I feel this is the horse picking up on someones high energy, conversely some folk display low energy and can shut a horse down. Learning to raise and lower your energy level when riding certainly has an effect on the horse when being ridden, or on the ground.

You make a good point PR. I have been teaching this lady for a number of years and have failed to get her riding in such a way that the horses go forwards for her. I have been concentrating on the technical aspects of her riding and her position etc, but had not even thought about her energy levels. You are right. When I think about it, she generally moves very slowly with low energy. I will try getting her to gee herself up and see what effect it has.
 
Top