Elderly dog with weakening back end - to walk, or not to walk.

[skinnydipper]

NSAIDS are not the only tool in a vet's tool box. The vet might recommend multi-modal treatment.

Did you voice concerns about her joints and the abnormal (for her) way of standing?

Vet are busy people. They routinely listen to the heart, check the mouth but in my experience don’t examine joints, hips and back unless I feel there is a problem.

Also a dog can be fine one week and not the next.

What have you got to lose by taking a much loved dog for a vet check?

 

[scruffyponies]

NSAIDS are not the only tool in a vet's tool box. The vet might recommend multi-modal treatment.

Did you voice concerns about her joints and the abnormal (for her) way of standing?

Vet are busy people. They routinely listen to the heart, check the mouth but in my experience don’t examine joints, hips and back unless I feel there is a problem.

Also a dog can be fine one week and not the next.

What have you got to lose by taking a much loved dog for a vet check?

We talked about her hips specifically and vet examined the area because she has a very obvious growth there (deemed not problematic).

 

[AmyMay]

Metacam is not the only pain relief available.

 

[skinnydipper]

We talked about her hips specifically and vet examined the area because she has a very obvious growth there (deemed not problematic).

So the vet manipulated her joints? Palpated her spine? Or just examined a growth?

Anyway, not my dog.

 

[Teaselmeg]

There is a great Facebook page called Canine Arthritis Management ( CAM), its run by a lovely vet. Lots of resources on there, videos/talks/ information, it's definitely worth joining and following, you would at least see what options are out there regarding pain management.

 

[Tiddlypom]

You seem to have a very poor opinion of what your vets can offer you to help this dog.

Your dog is in evident discomfort. Why would you not take her to the vets for an exam and to discuss what options are available to make her more comfortable in the time she has left?

 

[AmyMay]

There is a great Facebook page called Canine Arthritis Management ( CAM), its run by a lovely vet. Lots of resources on there, videos/talks/ information, it's definitely worth joining and following, you would at least see what options are out there regarding pain management.

Really interesting page. Thanks for the heads up.

 

[MurphysMinder]

You seem to have a very poor opinion of what your vets can offer you to help this dog.

Your dog is in evident discomfort. Why would you not take her to the vets for an exam and to discuss what options are available to make her more comfortable in the time she has left?

The fact that she is an old dog would make me keen to help make her comfortable. The approach I take with oldies is that if something helps with pain relief I don’t worry too much about long term effects as realistically they probably won’t be here long enough for it to be a problem .

 

[Clodagh]

Also if they can walk without pain they keep better muscle tone.

 

[scruffyponies]

To be clear; at no point since her episode 4 years ago have I seen her legs cause her pain. At the time (during lockdown) it was pretty awful. She couldn't get up several times and cried out. The various supplements seem to have worked a treat to keep inflammation at bay and joints lubricated. The issue now is muscle-loss, not pain. You can see it in the shape of her head.
Right now there's nothing which is causing her to be anything other than her usual perky self, or different one day to another. She greets me every morning with little rears and frolicks and sometimes mooches around the garden for hours, coming back with soil all over her nose from mice and rabbit holes.

 

[Pearlsacarolsinger]

But you acknowledge that she is in pain. Why would you not want to mitigate that?

 

[CorvusCorax]

If there's no problem you wouldn't be on here asking, eh?

 

[skinnydipper]

Frankly, I think we are wasting our time. I feel sorry for the dog.

 

[Katieg123]

Not necessarily going to engage with this thread as its gotten a bit heated but if your dog has Arthritis we have had very good results from Cartrophen injections.

 

[scruffyponies]

If there's no problem you wouldn't be on here asking, eh?

Does exercise help to strengthen muscles that age has atrophied?
That was the question, but apparently it can also be read as 'please give me a hard time because my dog is old'. Who knew?

 

[Clodagh]

Does exercise help to strengthen muscles that age has atrophied?
That was the question, but apparently it can also be read as 'please give me a hard time because my dog is old'. Who knew?

I think that’s a bit unfair. Muscles don’t atrophy if they are still used correctly, she has done well to get to such an impressive age with no medical support.
When we’ve put our slowing down oldies on pain relief they have been wanting to walk again.

 

[skinnydipper]

she had acute inflammatory issues in her hips, which paralysed her with pain about 4 years ago

What was the cause of the inflammation of her hips? Is it something that is likely to have resolved or progressed?

 

[scruffyponies]

What was the cause of the inflammation of her hips? Is it something that is likely to have resolved?

It was lockdown so she couldn't see a vet at the time. SI rather than hip, was our assessment. We honestly thought we would have to PTS.
Treated with human meds, for want of anything else and she's been on tumeric and yumove (fantastic stuff!) ever since, strengthened back end through exercise - especially play where weight is shifted back to 'box' - and yes, it resolved.

 

[AmyMay]

Does exercise help to strengthen muscles that age has atrophied?
That was the question, but apparently it can also be read as 'please give me a hard time because my dog is old'. Who knew?

Yes, exercise helps strengthen muscle. But. If a dog is experiencing any degree of pain (which you yourself acknowledge you think your dog does) then it won’t use itself properly. Loading more use on one part of the body than that experiencing the pain. You then entire a downward spiral - quicker than if the pain is medicated and managed.

 

[MurphysMinder]

It was lockdown so she couldn't see a vet at the time. SI rather than hip, was our assessment. We honestly thought we would have to PTS.
Treated with human meds, for want of anything else and she's been on tumeric and yumove (fantastic stuff!) ever since, strengthened back end through exercise - especially play where weight is shifted back to 'box' - and yes, it resolved.

My old GSD had several visits to the vet, x rays and scans during lockdown , can't believe a vet wouldn't see a dog in pain. Maybe you need to look at a new vet.

 

[skinnydipper]

It was lockdown so she couldn't see a vet at the time. SI rather than hip, was our assessment. We honestly thought we would have to PTS.
Treated with human meds, for want of anything else and she's been on tumeric and yumove (fantastic stuff!) ever since, strengthened back end through exercise - especially play where weight is shifted back to 'box' - and yes, it resolved.

So really you don't know what caused the problem or the most appropriate treatment - I'd be very surprised if it was turmeric.

 

[skinnydipper]

My old GSD had several visits to the vet, x rays and scans during lockdown , can't believe a vet wouldn't see a dog in pain. Maybe you need to look at a new vet.

My dog was also seen, examined and treatment prescribed.

 

[AmyMay]

My dog was also seen, examined and treatment prescribed.

As was mine, and many others I know of.

 

[CorvusCorax]

Does exercise help to strengthen muscles that age has atrophied?
That was the question, but apparently it can also be read as 'please give me a hard time because my dog is old'. Who knew?

My dog is a year younger than yours. If I have a management query my first point of contact is either a vet and/or experienced friends, HHO comes quite far down the ladder but it is good to get a second opinion, more options/opinions. You've been given lots of different advice but on the same general theme, but seem to have rejected most of it. If lots of people, who don't historically always agree, are all saying the same thing, then I think there is a reason for that.

 

[Umbongo]

Yes exercise can help, but the muscles have probably atrophied because she has probably not been using herself properly for a long time due to pain and has learnt to cope with it (also muscles will atrophy with age).

Like if a dog had a ruptured its cruciate ligament and couldn't use one back leg properly. The muscle on that whole side would atrophy. But once the leg is fixed and they are pain free, they will use the leg normally again and build the muscle back up. There is a limit to how much your dog can achieve though, due to her age. As she is 14 and wouldn't be doing as much exercise as she used to. So she isn't going to build the muscle up and spring back like a young dog might.

At her age and with the issues you have stated, I would expect her to be on some sort of prescribed pain relief, or a combination of medications. If she has a sensitive tummy with metacam then talk to your vet about alternatives....there are loads nowadays. I would expect her to have arthritis. So ensuring she does not get too cold, and gentle exercise little and often rather than 1 big walk a day. A big comfy orthopaedic bed can help. Physio and hydrotherapy can help too.

At the end of the day she is 14 years old, and nearing the end of her life. I think making sure she is pain free should be a very important consideration.
Could you at least trial some medication from the vet and see how she goes?

 

[CorvusCorax]

Yep, my dog wears a jumper when it is cold and wet to keep him warm, even though he is heavy coated. Also be aware of things like floor surfaces/put mats down in slippy areas.

 

[Aru]

Start a pain managenent trial for mobility with you vet (there are multiple pain control medications that may significantly improve her quality of life) and try keep her comfortable and painfree so she wants and is able to continue to exercise.
Movement is essential for health in old age, walks etc are good to continue because it will allow her to keep more muscle mass and not become unable to rise due to muscle atophy from lack of use.
dogs stop wanting to rise as easily, move stiffly, exercise less when in chronic pain. They dont cry out etc unless its severe acute pain. They stop and reduce moving so it doesnt hurt and their condition spirals downwards from that point.
Reducing the pain slows the deterioration in condition.

 

[skinnydipper]

@scruffyponies

Please read Aru’s post again and follow their advice.

Aru is a vet.

 

[Pearlsacarolsinger]

My old GSD had several visits to the vet, x rays and scans during lockdown , can't believe a vet wouldn't see a dog in pain. Maybe you need to look at a new vet.

We had several vet visits during the same time, for our own dogs and Daycare Dog. They were handed over in the car park examined/treated by a vet and returned to the carpark along with any prescribed meds/instructions

 

[AmyMay]

Start a pain managenent trial for mobility with you vet (there are multiple pain control medications that may significantly improve her quality of life) and try keep her comfortable and painfree so she wants and is able to continue to exercise.
Movement is essential for health in old age, walks etc are good to continue because it will allow her to keep more muscle mass and not become unable to rise due to muscle atophy from lack of use.
dogs stop wanting to rise as easily, move stiffly, exercise less when in chronic pain. They dont cry out etc unless its severe acute pain. They stop and reduce moving so it doesnt hurt and their condition spirals downwards from that point.
Reducing the pain slows the deterioration in condition.

Really interesting. Thanks for taking the time to post.