Feeling bitter and twisted!

[Marigold4]

While I understand that the OP is (slightly) tongue in cheek and that in every walk of life, or just life full stop, there will always be people with "more" who appear to glide through life untouched by any troubles I have never understood the reverse snobbery in horses.

If someone is able to have their hobby/sport funded in some way then their horsemanship will be lacking, or they aren't enjoying it or all the work has been done for them. It's not just this thread but it's been a common theme on here over the years. it's almost a sport in its own right to "look down" upon those with money and pick holes because they must have had it so easy. If someone handed me a £100k horse tomorrow and booked Caroline Moore to teach me I still wouldn't be able to ride one side of it; to think that they just sit there and haven't put in any work or effort, let alone have any skill, is really quite rude. If I had access to training, horses and funding too right I wouldn't be saying "but that's not fair on the people who don't". Horses are a luxury and always have been.

Yes getting correct tuition on correctly schooled horses will undoubtedly be a huge benefit and not all of us had access to that when starting out but as LEC and others have said where there is a will there is a way and there are plenty of things that anyone could do to improve their "game".

Like Milliepops has said it can be hard if you're competitive but are restricted by money/time/only one horse but it's not impossible. I don't understand why so much time is spent comparing oneself to others. You have what you have and if you want to see a change then you've got to put in the time/work/money/effort somehow. I'm not talking about people who solely have horses for the enjoyment but if you have horses to compete/that's a big part and competing means a lot to you then you do what it takes.

For example while I have passing notions that I'd like to do X,Y or Z I don't want to do it so much that I want to go back to 4.30am starts and purely living and breathing horses. I quite like the balance that I have just now and with that I have to accept that I'll never be bothering Ros Canter. If somehow it did become very important to me to be the best that I could possibly be then you betcha I'd be up crack of dawn putting in the hours, reading, watching, learning, listening, doing my keep fit, building core strength, changing priorities and devoting hours and money on getting where I wanted to be. People have pointed out ways, on this thread and others, to progress, improve and better results but there are always without fails excuses given as replies. I mean that's fine if you don't want to do/try what's been suggested you don't have to but don't say that it can't be done.

I never understand complaining about dressage either (clearly there is a lot I don't understand on here about people). In dressage you are being judged against the set out scoring scale for performing the movements, IMO you go out to "beat" yourself and better your score. So it really doesn't matter if Millionaire Maisie is out riding Thousand K Tommy in the ring before you because you aren't being judged against them. If you want to score higher then do better and stop complaining that there aren't rules to stop Millionaire Maisie from competing!

Perhaps I didn't word my original post very well. It wasn't partly about the money but it was partly despair that I would never be able to ride as well as someone who was started properly when they were young. And yes, I do compare myself with others and the judge compares me with others. It's called a competition!!! I also have my own ambitions. I'm getting old and I want to have achieved more. But think I've reached my limitations. I wish I'd had lessons when I was younger like them. I wish I'd gone to competitions. I think I would be a better rider now if I had.

 

[Winters100]

Why on earth would you assume that? There are pushy parents in all walks of life just like there are kind supportive parents, some rich, some poor and lots who are neither. Parents tend to spend what they can afford, I certainly did, this meant my daughter had a nicer pony than some and a much less established pony than others. Many years ago I came across a couple of sisters, daughters of a self made millionaire from quite humble beginings. They were bought a team pony each, a huge lorry with a pop out side and given access to the best training available tbh he could afford it and why shouldn't he do it for his girls? I felt so sorry for them, the vile sniping and general schadenfreude when they didn't have a good result was disgusting. They obviously had their father's grit and they did rather well which pleased me hugely.

Well said. No one has to justify spending money how they wish, and there are much worse things to spend it on than helping your children to progress in a sport.

 

[Marigold4]

Jumbled thoughts.

I was soooooooo jealous of the other girls in Pony Club with the fancy horses while I did my best on fluffy, nappy, difficult riding school borrows! But the year I won overall Tack and Turnout AND the Combined Training was very, very sweet.

Finally getting my own horse at the age of 26 was such a huge thrill I'm not sure I'd switch it for years of horse ownership before...

One of the shows I helped out at last year there was a lassy sweeping the board on a gorgeous hunter type... I was a bit eye rolling thinking she'd been bought the posh horse. We got chatting to the family and it turned out they'd basically rescued the mare as a malnourished wreck and paid a pittance for her but had seen the quality underneath... abd her brother was doing a stirling job wrestling the rather difficult hand me down pony around various classes! So I put my judgey hat away for the day!

When I took The Beast dressaging everyone, including the judge, thought I was a novice on a made horse pot hunting in the intro. I've been riding since I was a kid, was riding my previous horse at medium type level at home, and have done 50% of the schooling of The Beast who was definitely still only intro level at that point! Why we looked the other way around I don't know. But appearances can be deceiving. It's kind of pointless getting jealous about a scenario thar might not be true. But it's not like I haven't been there myself with the jealous.

Agreed. I am definitely guilty of jumping to conclusions! Mybad

 

[Marigold4]

couldn't agree more!

I'm always an advocate for the underdog getting out there and having a bloody good crack at it but I also don't get the reverse snobbery on HHO, unless it's just people trying to make themselves feel better if i could change my circumstances in the blink of an eye you can bet your life I'd take the parental help and the fancy lorry and the nice horses and all the rest of it, and yes I reckon it would make me happy it's tremendously hard pulling yourself up by your bootstraps and I'd 100% rather not have to.

that said it's still hard to do well even with all the leg ups cos you've still got to ride the horse well

It's not really the money I'm jealous of, it's the opportunities at that age that they have though

 

[Marigold4]

I know your pain.
Getting called dear is right up there too.

I like that story.

Feeling better now I have discovered we came second and beat patronising girl!

 

[TPO]

Perhaps I didn't word my original post very well. It wasn't partly about the money but it was partly despair that I would never be able to ride as well as someone who was started properly when they were young. And yes, I do compare myself with others and the judge compares me with others. It's called a competition!!! I also have my own ambitions. I'm getting old and I want to have achieved more. But think I've reached my limitations. I wish I'd had lessons when I was younger like them. I wish I'd gone to competitions. I think I would be a better rider now if I had.

Well no one can rewind so make the most of the time that you are fortunate enough to have now. Wishing doesn't achieve anything, make a goal write it down then make a plan to achieve it.

Read LEC's post about "confidence" (but she named it better than that); there is lots on there that you should take away to help your mental attitude towards "competition". You're never too old but until you reset your mindset you will forever be stuck in that same rut. There will be people out there who would sell organs to have what you have and to have the opportunities and choices that you have available to you right now. If you're content to say that you will never "catch up" and you are at your limitations with no scope to go further then why waste your time being upset at the people who are putting in the hours and doing everything possible to give themselves the slightest competitive edge.

In dressage the judge does not compare you to who went before or after; they judge you on how you perform the movements and ride the test. It's you against the test, I'm aware of how dressage competitions operate.

ETA. Sports Pysch Thread

 

[honetpot]

The secret of ponies and children is buying the right pony/horse for the child, the pony may not be expensive, it just has to help the child progress. A daughters friend had parents who had a title and land to go with it. My daughter asked why she didn't have a flash does everything pony, I said because her mum has enough sense to buy or borrow that she can enjoy.
My daughters worked hard on their ponies at home, I think when you do 'badly' it seems to be the assumption that it's your fault, but when you do well, well obviously someone helped you or you are lucky and have a 'good' pony. I have seen children bought expensive mounts and if they do not put the work in it doesn't matter how well the pony has done before eventually it will work out what it can get away with, or just not perform as well. Buying an established mount makes it easier to progress, but you still have to learn how to ride it, and I think the pressure for some kids can be too much, and when they do not as well as the previous rider they lose heart.
I think the best idea is to think that you are only competing against yourself, only you know how hard you have worked, or how much you and your horse have progressed. If you only see your value or progress in comparison to others, it's a road to dissatisfaction.

 

[DabDab]

I'd say that particularly with young people/kids it is very difficult to ascertain the full dynamics going on underneath that confidence, competence and opportunities that might be all an outsider sees. I was once one of those envied kids, not in horses, but in music, and the truth of how I felt about it was not what you would have seen on the surface I don't think.

I could read music long before I could read words (partially thanks to dyslexia), I could play pretty much any instrument I laid my hands on, and between 7 and 17 i would practice 1-2 hours a day with at least 2 lessons a week. I have a grade 8 in three separate instruments, where most people would consider it an achievement to have just one, I played in national orchestras and won many awards, the first at age 6. My parents paid for lessons with the best teachers, bought me expensive instruments and knew all the right auditions to take me to for all the best opportunities.

And not for a second do I think that anyone looking on would have expected the kid who often spent lunch breaks practicing, in fact had precisely zero emotional connection to it. I kept going at it because it was routine, because I liked being good at something, and because I knew it made my parents happy. And the last day I played anything properly was the day I moved out of home.

I remember a boy joining my school when I was doing my GCSE's, a year lower. He played the piano and saxophone, but he couldn't read music. He had just listened to jazz and copied what he heard. I taught him to read music so that he could play in the school band and still now I remember, clear as a bell, the look of all consuming joy on his face one day while playing. And I remember the penny dropping in my head as I realised that that was what it was supposed to be like. I have often wondered about him since, where he is now and whether he achieved his dreams...I really hope he did. He had none of my training, accolades or technical ability, but he was a better musician than I would ever be.

These days I ride horses 1-2 hours a day, and I'll never be a world beater, but I do it because I love it. And that experience with music as a child means that I pinch myself every day that I am lucky enough have something so valuable in my life.

 

[Chianti]

All very true. I just wish I had that wonderful balance and correctness that comes from riding under expert supervision from an early age on a well-schooled horse.

I'm feeling bitter and twisted about the fact that I'm just never going to ride like this.

At my last dressage competition, one of them congratulated me on "giving it a go".

You should have thanked her and then asked, with great concern, if she was sure that her pony was completely sound on the near fore as you thought it had looked a bit off on her last circle.

 

[Marigold4]

You should have thanked her and then asked, with great concern, if she was sure that her pony was completely sound on the near fore as you thought it had looked a bit off on her last circle.

Ha ha. I like it. I beat her and came second so last laugh is on me!

 

[Lammy]

I do really dislike the mindset of “oh I wish I’d done that years ago, it’s too late now.”
If everyone thought like that then nobody would ever get anything done. Not horse related but I used to think I should have gone to uni and got my degree when all my friends did and thought at 26 it was too late to think about going to uni...well guess whose halfway through a degree now? Yes I have to work full time and put the hours in to complete a full time uni course, never mind riding and competing a young horse on top of that.
But it’s never too late for anything.

In terms of riders isn’t the NZ event rider Jock Paget an ex bricklayer who went from not riding to going around his first (old) 3* in 2 years? Of course he’s talented but he’s clearly worked hard and put the hours in.



It’s only ever too late when you’re dead. Set your mind to a task and go do it, the only thing stopping you is you.

 

[milliepops]

View attachment 54391

It’s only ever too late when you’re dead. Set your mind to a task and go do it, the only thing stopping you is you.

I love this ?
I'll still be madly attempting to get to GP when I need a zimmer to get round the house ?

 

[Lammy]

I love this ?
I'll still be madly attempting to get to GP when I need a zimmer to get round the house ?

I will be supporting that all the way ? I think a stairlift on a horsebox would be doable by then?

 

[daffy44]

I'm afraid I dont think learning to ride "properly" when you are young is very relevant to competitive success as an adult. I think it helps if you ride as a child, but belting about bareback, being daft and falling off is fine, that teaches you feel, balance and a good seat. There are plenty of very competitively successful adults from Olympians downwards who didnt have a lot of serious tutition as children.

Life isnt fair, and neither is sport, there will always be people who are worse off than you, and others who are better off than you, none of it matters, all you can do is your best with what you have. I think TPO nailed it, so much is down to how hard you are prepared to work and sacrifice for what you want, and you also need a good dollop of luck.

 

[Caol Ila]

Interesting thread. I have similar feelings to the OP, but about music, not riding. I started playing Irish traditional music when I was about 21 and felt terribly jealous of people my age and younger who were sh*t hot players because they'd started as wee kids. I felt I would never get anywhere because I started too late, and learning music and a complicated instrument (Irish pipes) as an adult is a bitch. I still feel like I've maxed out and will never achieve anything with it, other than being a mediocre session player. Since the start of lockdown, I can count on one hand the number of times I've picked up the pipes. Feeling like I'm going nowhere anyway and now can't even play in pub sessions due to Covid has not helped. At one point in my life, I was practicing two hours per day. I worked my arse off for years, but eventually got to a point where I felt disheartened by the whole traditional music scene, which in Glasgow is a morass of politics and nepotism, and kind of gave up.

 

[DabDab]

Set your mind to a task and go do it, the only thing stopping you is you.

Um, I dont think that has been true in any walk of life I've ever encountered...it's a massively naive (and somewhat patronising) thing to say.

Unless the task you've set yourself is relatively straightforward and doesn't rely on lots of other people (e.g. a degree), then what you want to achieve will always be affected by factors external to yourself. Some of those will be navigable by you (once you've acquired another skillset or bought in expertise), some will be solved by luck, some diminish over time, and some will always be there. Hard work is self-evidently import for anything that you want to become proficient at, but learning which things to work at and which just have to be worked around is important. It is particularly important in anything horse related, because more than any other pursuit I've experienced, people are prone to spending huge amounts of time and money going down rabbit holes trying to fix something that can't be fixed, or trying to fix it in the wrong way (I've done it myself, I think most people have).

 

[Frano]

OP you learnt resilience, independence, self reliance and I am sure you know more about horse management etc. I bet you had more fun.

 

[Marigold4]

Um, I dont think that has been true in any walk of life I've ever encountered...it's a massively naive (and somewhat patronising) thing to say. The only thing stopping you, is you - really?

Unless the task you've set yourself is relatively straightforward and doesn't rely on lots of other people (e.g. a degree), then what you want to achieve will always be affected by factors external to yourself. Some of those will be navigable by you (once you've acquired another skillset or bought in expertise), some will be solved by luck, some diminish over time, and some will always be there. Hard work is self-evidently import for anything that you want to become proficient at, but learning which things to work at and which just have to be worked around is important. It is particularly important in anything horse related, because more than any other pursuit I've experienced, people are prone to spending huge amounts of time and money going down rabbit holes trying to fix something that can't be fixed, or trying to fix it in the wrong way (I've done it myself, I think most people have).

Um, I dont think that has been true in any walk of life I've ever encountered...it's a massively naive (and somewhat patronising) thing to say.

Totally agree. Some of this homespun psychology is just people spouting their self-help books. Life is different.

 

[Marigold4]

Interesting thread. I have similar feelings to the OP, but about music, not riding. I started playing Irish traditional music when I was about 21 and felt terribly jealous of people my age and younger who were sh*t hot players because they'd started as wee kids. I felt I would never get anywhere because I started too late, and learning music and a complicated instrument (Irish pipes) as an adult is a bitch. I still feel like I've maxed out and will never achieve anything with it, other than being a mediocre session player. Since the start of lockdown, I can count on one hand the number of times I've picked up the pipes. Feeling like I'm going nowhere anyway and now can't even play in pub sessions due to Covid has not helped. At one point in my life, I was practicing two hours per day. I worked my arse off for years, but eventually got to a point where I felt disheartened by the whole traditional music scene, which in Glasgow is a morass of politics and nepotism, and kind of gave up.

Exactly. If you want to do something that requires HUGE amounts of skill and innate ability, it really isn't as simple as just wanting to do something and trying very hard!

 

[Marigold4]

I'm afraid I dont think learning to ride "properly" when you are young is very relevant to competitive success as an adult. I think it helps if you ride as a child, but belting about bareback, being daft and falling off is fine, that teaches you feel, balance and a good seat. There are plenty of very competitively successful adults from Olympians downwards who didnt have a lot of serious tutition as children.

Life isnt fair, and neither is sport, there will always be people who are worse off than you, and others who are better off than you, none of it matters, all you can do is your best with what you have. I think TPO nailed it, so much is down to how hard you are prepared to work and sacrifice for what you want, and you also need a good dollop of luck.

My post wasn't really about "fair". It's about the fact that my most important ambition - to ride well - is beyond my reach. I have spent years undoing the bad habits I learnt as a child when unsupervised. It is a fact that those who learn a sport when young do better than those who take it up in later life. Their bodies and minds are just more receptive.

 

[Marigold4]

I love this ?
I'll still be madly attempting to get to GP when I need a zimmer to get round the house ?

I wonder if you will actually be doing this though when you are in your sixties. Let's see.

 

[Marigold4]

I do really dislike the mindset of “oh I wish I’d done that years ago, it’s too late now.”
If everyone thought like that then nobody would ever get anything done. Not horse related but I used to think I should have gone to uni and got my degree when all my friends did and thought at 26 it was too late to think about going to uni...well guess whose halfway through a degree now? Yes I have to work full time and put the hours in to complete a full time uni course, never mind riding and competing a young horse on top of that.
But it’s never too late for anything.

In terms of riders isn’t the NZ event rider Jock Paget an ex bricklayer who went from not riding to going around his first (old) 3* in 2 years? Of course he’s talented but he’s clearly worked hard and put the hours in.

View attachment 54391

It’s only ever too late when you’re dead. Set your mind to a task and go do it, the only thing stopping you is you.

Good luck with believing this. I hope it works for you!

 

[Marigold4]

My post wasn't about this though. It as tongue in cheek and in despair that it's too late to reach my goals. I am envious of those who had lessons and transport when they were young. If they carry on, they will be very good riders. That's all. I adore my horses, have a lovely time with them, am very happy that I have bought cheap young horses and backed them myself, and all their amazing achievements. I just wish I was a better rider ...

I don't lie awake consumed by the green-eyed monster, filled with dissatisfaction, wishing others ill - I'm too busy doing other things - like work, family and friends.

Leaving the thread now. The self-help manual content is beginning to make me feel a little queasy!

 

[Gloi]

I've never really been jealous of other people's horses because in my eyes my pony was always the best even if nobody else could see it

 

[Flicker]

I get what you mean OP, but whilst you might not have their polished finish, you have years of true horsemanship. You can spot an injury, know your horse's digestive system (probably better than your own), and you have that certain sense of contentment when you look at what you've achieved by your own graft.

I'm not saying the rich ones don't work for it. Of course they have to put the hours and work in, but most of them are riders and not horse people. Plus, the pressure that some of those 'rich girls' to win is ridiculous. It's not fun. It's an extension of a parent's psyche (think I've got the right word there).

Have 100 ‘likes’ Mrs M. So true.

 

[Flicker]

I think the other thing to remember is that the young riders who succeed are very, very driven themselves. One of our young liveries is now making a serious name for herself on the SJ circuit. She will be a name we will see on TV very soon, I am sure. Olympics even in time.

Her mum is horsey, and yes the family does have some means but they are by no means in the millionaire category. This lass has just finished school. Her mum told me the other day that she has never been abroad on holiday. Yes, they have travelled to compete, but never to just lie on a beach or on a city break. I’ve never known her to go out with the other girls on the yard because she’s up at the crack of dawn every morning.

She is now riding and working for an owner. But while she was at the yard, outside her stable was a schedule of competition dates, training clinic dates, riding plans etc. It was military in its level of detail. Her mum once laughed that all she has to do is turn up and drive the lorry - daughter has it all worked out herself.

She has had amazing horses, but they were all bought to do a job, and sold when that job was done. She never really was able to form the kind of bonds we do with our horses.

Essentially, her life is only about the show jumping. And even then, she’s had to work exceptionally hard to get to where she is. I have tremendous respect for her, but by Christ I wouldn’t want her life for anything.

 

[oldie48]

I've always been a late starter, mainly my own fault because I was a really stupid arse in my teens and twenties! Got my degree having studied part time when I was 40, took up tennis at 35 and became an Okish club player, bought a piano for my 40th birthday as I'd always wanted to learn, passed grade 4 a year later despite barely being able to reach the piano due to pregnancy (that was a shock!) took up riding and bought first horse for my 50th, another for my 60th, 65th and 70th. I have done the best I can with what I was given, which means tbh I'm not very good at anything but I am fortunate that I enjoy trying to be better and I love to watch people doing things really well, especially riding!

 

[TPO]

Exactly. If you want to do something that requires HUGE amounts of skill and innate ability, it really isn't as simple as just wanting to do something and trying very hard!

Then it doesnt matter how rich you are, or aren't, if its now "innate ability" at the crux of it ??‍

No one said it was about "wanting" to do something; it's a out working for and towards it. It's about perfect practice, learning the correct way, finding the right people to have on your team. It's fairly simple but not easy.

Literally text book the excuses that have been used as retorts rather than taking any ownership of the issues. No admittance that "it" just isnt wanted that much to make the huge effort and sacrifices required (& that's ok!) or that it is wanted so need a plan, goals and more effective use of time and put the work in.

I wonder if you will actually be doing this though when you are in your sixties. Let's seehard!

Your bad attitude aside my mum is mid 60s and is "actually doing this". Shes restarted a "cut and shut" cob who was free because of extreme behavioural issues. Shes got him going under saddle after almost 2yrs of working with him and her aim is to take him out to dressage (& the beach). She has MS too so normal things are very tiring for her. But yeah it's definitely not your problem and theres no way you could improve ?

It must get tiring real quick carrying all those chips around.

 

[milliepops]

I wonder if you will actually be doing this though when you are in your sixties. Let's see.

I truly believe I will. I'm 38 now. Just bred my first homebred which is the best quality horse I've ever had, hopefully I'll be breaking her in in a few years time and I'll be approaching 60 by the time she's retiring if we are luck... who knows what we'll have done together by then. I have no children and no intention of having any because all I ever wanted to do was horses and that's still the case. Unless something catastrophic happens that means I physically can't, I really don't see myself stopping trying to keep improving my riding and developing my horses.

TBH I think you really do sound bitter and twisted. I was prepared to see this as a light hearted thing earlier but now it just smacks of whinging. life isn't fair. Not everyone has parents with the means or care to support them in their chosen hobby, but that time has already passed, there's literally no point thinking about it as an adult. My mum now says she wishes they did more to support me with my riding because now they see what a huge driving force it is for me. but whatever. I'd rather not even know she feels like that, it's easier to think they just don't give a toss tbh because regrets make me sad. Life is what you make it so you just have to keep looking forward, not back.

those of us fortunate enough to have horses in our lives are already doing pretty well in many respects, it's a wonderful experience that gives meaning and structure to my life. I will never be at the Olympics. I'll never be at the sodding nationals even! I'm just not good enough. But I'm still going to keep trying. I'm not prepared to give up. there's a fire burning inside me that just doesn't go out.

 

[milliepops]

I've always been a late starter, mainly my own fault because I was a really stupid arse in my teens and twenties! Got my degree having studied part time when I was 40, took up tennis at 35 and became an Okish club player, bought a piano for my 40th birthday as I'd always wanted to learn, passed grade 4 a year later despite barely being able to reach the piano due to pregnancy (that was a shock!) took up riding and bought first horse for my 50th, another for my 60th, 65th and 70th. I have done the best I can with what I was given, which means tbh I'm not very good at anything but I am fortunate that I enjoy trying to be better and I love to watch people doing things really well, especially riding!

I love your attitude oldie and this post is a great inspiration