hats off to ellen

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You have to WANT to do it, equally theres not good working your socks off if you work hard doing everything incorrectly!


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Yes but with the training Ellen has received she's hardly going to be doing it the 'wrong way' is she?

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So there you go then, she MUST WANT TO WIN/DO it if not, she wouldnt be at the top of her sport
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QR!!!

So, all we need is loadsa money, top trainers, guts and determination and we can ALL be top riders that do well?!!! Do we not think there has to be a tinsy winsy bit of actual talent to do well. So, does that go for all disiplines, sports, careers?
 
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No you can not, you can say you'd have a better chance than you do now.
Remember these people still buy youngsters so yes they buy more potential than you can but money can't turn potential into talent.....they still have to do that themselves like everyone else.

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Er...Tim G doesn't, as already mentioned he has someone do it for him. I'm with P.G on this one!

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Someone competes the horses at lower levels. You will find he spends time riding the youngsters at home.
 
Well, to be honest, if Ellen Whitaker with all her money, horses, training etc wasn't very good we would all be moaning about that too!

I think she is just a very lucky person to be born in to such a family/situation but that doesn't make her any less deserving of the success she has. Regardless of anything else she has still got to go out there and actually do it.
 
They need ability, like guts, balance, determination, but I think most of what they do is taught! How many beginners get on a horse and can ride through natural talent? Maybe I'm just cynical, but I think most things in life are taught.

I'd be interested to find out how many top sj have started from nothing - ie little money, non-horsey parents, no proper training etc?
 
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I'm jealous of all the fun she gets to have. Bet she has a lorry that works. and doesn't leak.

Cow.

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Have you not seen her lorry?! Its a work arctic.. it carries about 11 horses but doesnt have living in it!! LOL! They also have a cattle wagon for Joe...
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I agree, TBH reding this post I wonder why we respect/look up to/listen to any of our top riders because I mean they aren't doing anything special, they are not talented. They are just doing what anyone could with their money.

people who say they could be at the top if they had the money are imo
1) missing the point of what it takes to be at the top of a sport
2) a little too full of themselves - those that really are good let their actions speak for themselves
and
3) probably a little insecure because again, those that know they are good do not feel the need to make comments about their talent as it speaks for itself.
 
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Well, to be honest, if Ellen Whitaker with all her money, horses, training etc wasn't very good we would all be moaning about that too!

I think she is just a very lucky person to be born in to such a family/situation but that doesn't make her any less deserving of the success she has. Regardless of anything else she has still got to go out there and actually do it.

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Yep exactly
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I'm jealous of all the fun she gets to have. Bet she has a lorry that works. and doesn't leak.

Cow.

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Have you not seen her lorry?! Its a work arctic.. it carries about 11 horses but doesnt have living in it!! LOL! They also have a cattle wagon for Joe...
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Thats why shes got Tim
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hes got a nice warm smart lorry for all those antics
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I dont want to get into an argument with you but im not missing any point at all, i know full well what it takes to be at the top of a sport, im certainly not at all full of myself in anyway shape or form and the people who know me on here will vouch for that, and thirdly im not at all insecure.

So i take it you are classing yourself in the 'not feeling the need to make comments as 'their' talent speaks for themselves' category then?

whatever......
 
I'm not in any category as I do not ride anymore.

Your posts clearly imply that the only difference between the top riders and the not top riders (using yourself as the eg) is money. That is missing the point of what it takes to 'make it'. If it is just a contest of who has the most money then no wonder the general public do not show any interest as thatis very boring and posts like this make me realise where the press get this idea from.
 
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I'd be interested to find out how many top sj have started from nothing - ie little money, non-horsey parents, no proper training etc?

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That's a VERY good point you make. If you look at the names of most of the successful jockeys, especially the YR's, they are very often related to former stars of SJ'ing. Obviously someone had to start somewhere, but these days the financial pressures are so much greater than they were....the sport of SJ'ing so much more commercial, that it is harder than ever to break into the top flight without money and the backing of a family dynasty !

There's a very long line of names that come from great SJ'ing families :-

Marie Edgar
Matthew Broome
Sophie Broome
Richard Davenport
Louise Saywell
Will Whitaker
Ellen Whitaker
Jo Whitaker
James Billington

The list goes on....
 
Having money at your disposal to attain the training/horses etc is certainly a massive advantage but at the end of the day you need the talent first and foremost and then you need the breaks...
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One that DDNT come from a privilged background is Geoff Billington (sorry that is the only one I can think of for now!)

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Yeah.. there arent many, but Geoff got the Olympics so is a brilliant example!
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ITs fantastic, I cheer for him so much and am SO SO glad he hasnt gotten back up there - sticks 2 fingers up at a lot of the doubters who wouldnt send hm horses when he needed them
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There are 2 SJing YRs that train near me. Neither are from SJing family dynasties, but both have a lot of backing from their families.

One has got more talent, the other has more money at their disposal.

Guess which one is higher up in the YR rankings???
 
There can be very talented riders, but if they never have the horse power, they will never get to the top. Equally, there can be exceedingly rich people that have no talent, so will still never get to the top. Its a mixture of both. Ellen is talented, but also very lucky, so has been able to make the most of her talent. Its a mixture of making the most of what you have, being at the right place at the right time and talent IMO. Being born into it can help, obviously!! But if she had no talent, still wouldnt be getting the result!!
 
I still think that we are jealous of Ellen. OK, maybe envious would be a better word. Just trying to be objective and, sure, she was born into a SJ 'dynasty' with all the help, connections and support a young SJ'er could ever want.

But she also HAS to be talented/brave. She nearly beat her uncle in the Derby aged just 18 - and to watch her she never looked like she was going to bat an eyelid (on a relatively new horse). How many people out there could imagine having the b**ls to do that??

I never said she was perfect....but I still say there are a lot of people out there who would like some of what she's got.
 
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They need ability, like guts, balance, determination, but I think most of what they do is taught! How many beginners get on a horse and can ride through natural talent? Maybe I'm just cynical, but I think most things in life are taught.

I'd be interested to find out how many top sj have started from nothing - ie little money, non-horsey parents, no proper training etc?

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Didn't Tim Stockdale have this sort of a background? My (totally, utterly unhorsey) dad heard him on the radio once and said what a good sort of bloke he sounded - nice that some high profile horsemen/women have public appeal. Guy Williams is a really down to earth, ordinary bloke although he comes from a farming background.

Maybe having wads of money (+the talent) is the best route into top class competing but having a family farm is a good second best?
 
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There are 2 SJing YRs that train near me. Neither are from SJing family dynasties, but both have a lot of backing from their families.

One has got more talent, the other has more money at their disposal.

Guess which one is higher up in the YR rankings???

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I'm guessing the one with more money is higher up the rankings??
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So there you go then, she MUST WANT TO WIN/DO it if not, she wouldnt be at the top of her sport
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Of course she does, but wanting to win doesn't make her talented!
 
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QR!!!

So, all we need is loadsa money, top trainers, guts and determination and we can ALL be top riders that do well?!!! Do we not think there has to be a tinsy winsy bit of actual talent to do well. So, does that go for all disiplines, sports, careers?

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No, funnily enough you don't need a million pound horse to win a snooker tournement! Hence why equestrianism is known as an ELITIST sport!
 
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I agree, TBH reding this post I wonder why we respect/look up to/listen to any of our top riders because I mean they aren't doing anything special, they are not talented. They are just doing what anyone could with their money.

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Nobody said top riders. The branding them all with the same name.

My respect goes to Tim Stockdale, Andrew Nicholson, people with true talent but not a rich walking cheque book of a 'daddy' to go with it.
 
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Didn't Tim Stockdale have this sort of a background? My (totally, utterly unhorsey) dad heard him on the radio once and said what a good sort of bloke he sounded - nice that some high profile horsemen/women have public appeal. Guy Williams is a really down to earth, ordinary bloke although he comes from a farming background.

Maybe having wads of money (+the talent) is the best route into top class competing but having a family farm is a good second best?

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Yep, Tims dad was just a builder and he has earned everything he has!
 
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