Highly Aggressive Horses - Long but NEED advice!

I know its not done much these days but what about no food or water for a couple of days, once she is in isolation, take the edge off her, I would never normally suggest somehing like that, but this horse has very nearly killed you already by the sounds of things, and I would want her as quiet as possible before attempting to lead her in hand.
 
The small corral is a breeze to get her in as it comes off the main corral, which comes right off her field, so I will move her in there. It's also only about 70 ft long so she won't be able to get into too much trouble there, plus she will still be within the main part of the yard so will still see and be able to touch other horses but won't be able to do anything else unless I allow her to.
 
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I think I'll leave her in the sub-corral for a few days and see how she deals with this as even if she were to jump out, she can't get anywhere. My worst fear is that somehow she gets free on the farm....
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Absolutely, especially as you have the rest of your family to think about.
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She has to have ad-lib hay still as it is so cold here and she won't have a field shelter in this corral. This small corral is the entry to my stocks though, so she will have shelter from the wind as we have huge solid rails there and they are close together. She hasn't a blanket either so life will be pretty miserable for her in there.

She will see me feeding all the other horses as they all are fed from within the main corral as all of the fields lead into this corral.....and she won't be getting any feed for a few days.
 
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I think I'll leave her in the sub-corral for a few days and see how she deals with this as even if she were to jump out, she can't get anywhere. My worst fear is that somehow she gets free on the farm....
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Can she see other horses from there? it may be best if she can't, otherwise if she gets the others wound up she could be more tempted to jump out
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Put lots of food out and make sure she is good and hungry and fingers crossed she settles
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Not really as this corral is purely used for the horses from another field to make a short-cut into the main corral - that field has another gate to get out of though so it doesn't matter if this corral is taken up for a long period of time.

If she were my horse, she'd be there for the forseeable future....
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Can you put her in a stable for a few days perhaps with top door shut at first or something to stop her coming over it, and let her be dependent on you for a while? She might see you then as provider of feed and company, not someone to fight for feed, companionship etc.

Sounds like she would try to jump the fence if she has never been properly weaned, and with her attitude, she would probably manage it!! So that would be your worst case scenario - filly free on farm ready to take on the world, perhaps with a few injuries to boot.

My young horse was weaned late, and he certainly had a food agression problem and would regularly throw tantrums about HIS feed and HIS hay, still does in fact, but I had him gelded asap which helped. Pity you can't do same to her - how about hormone supplements, paid for by kind but too gentle owner?
 
Yes she will be able to touch horses from another 2 herds - both have herd leaders who are BIG GUNS on my farm and I know they will not like her at all.....she will be surrounded by them!
 
Ah good suggestions but if I put her in my stable block it means I have to lead her down to the stable block (it's a small American barn type stable) passed a couple of herds which she has never met before - that journey might be the biggest nightmare ever.
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I have no probs with foals being weaned late. I actually naturally wean all of mine....however by that I am talking about the milk. My little ones are used to their mothers going back into work within a month or two of them being born so by the time they are 6 months or so, their mothers are away from them for up to 4 hours at a time and they don't have any problems with that. Trouble with this one is that she has never ever been away from her mother - the owner only rode in the field with the filly wandering around within the field too.
 
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Yes she will be able to touch horses from another 2 herds - both have herd leaders who are BIG GUNS on my farm and I know they will not like her at all.....she will be surrounded by them!

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Oh, well that will probably do her the world of good, she can be told firmly to B***** off, from all sides. You will be able to see, from the others horses behaviour, when she has been accepted too. Look forward to reading her story
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Does the aggression seem to be primarily food-related? If so, once you have her separated, you could try and work it so she only receives food in the absence of her showing any aggression. Perhaps tying it in with the cattle prod or a shock collar to reinforce the fact that showing aggression brings no benefits and only something negative.

I'm assuming that she has learnt that being aggressive to other horses has brought her the result of food, and then she has tried that behaviour towards humans. This may have been accidentally reinforced by the fact that presumably you feed in the field - so you enter field, she behaves aggressively, and then lo and behold, feed appears.

Sorry, I haven't probably explained myself well, but in a rush - just about to go out for the evening!

If it is not a learnt food-related behaviour I would be more worried that there may be something abnormal and perhaps unsolvable about the filly.
 
Thanks everyone. I have to go out for a while now and I am just waiting on someone to come to the farm to give me a hand with opening and closing gates and she will be moved this afternoon. Will let you know after Christmas how she is doing.

I hope she makes it. I think she has potential with a bit of time and trouble.

Thank you once again.
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I know the feeling - I have to go out too.

Yes I think the feeding has exacerbated this situation. She wasn't great before, but now she is atrocious and lunges over the fence at me when I fill the feed buckets up. Even when I go to place her bucket over the fence, my arm is in jeopardy of being munched and my face being grabbed. You can't shout at her (learned that one quickly) or she will fly at the fence and spin around and lash out at you and if you talk nicely to her, she does exactly the same!
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I would get her in the small corral. I would feed and water her normally BUT I would go in with feed AND a bucket of water and make her wait for the feed - use body language and a verbal command - like BACK! If she tries to crowd in or get nasty, throw the contents of the bucket of water straight in her face. Do THAT a couple of times and she'll learn that manners at feed time are imperative.

I would NOT use a zapper, or hobbles - but I WOULD have a nice long length (about 4 foot) of poly pipe (underground water pipe type) handy - and use it in response to any aggression. It will make a noise and sting - and it's highly visible. We use it with the older colts if they get too big for their britches! A shouted warning (use the same one every time - like BACK) should be followed immediately by a good swat if she keeps coming.

If there's a tap handy, I would equip it with a hose and a jet nozzle which is also a very effective way of teaching a horse to stay out of your space.

(And I'd probably use it on the owner too - she CANNOT expect you to deal with this poor filly - and I repeat - it is NOT the filly's fault, it is her STUPID owner's!! - without paying for it.)
 
Extreme dominance...lack of correct weaning...no discipline from dam, other horses or her owner by the sound of things....
This could also be inherited dominance...as foals usually inherit the social status of their dams within a herd...and also, at 2yrs old, the other 'witches' will be more lenient on her as a youngster, than they would with a full adult.
I would;
1. Wean her asap (emotionally not nutritionally)
2. Put her in a small paddock with the most dominant horse you've got, mare or gelding
3. Feed the other horse first preferably by splitting a corner off or otherwise to keep yourself safe.
4. Leave filly with no food whilst other eats....then go into her field with feed and/or hay. If filly attacks, smack her as hard as you can, and leave again, with feed. Wait ten minutes, try again. She will eventually get the message that when her behaviour is undesirable, she'll not get what she wants.
5. I would also start handling her more (in hat, gloves, back protector and with someone else there) and if she goes for you, smack her until she backs down. Needs guts though. Once she backs down, make a big fuss of her....I would also try to get her working...to give her calculating little mind something to do.
Both my youngsters are naturally quite dominant...but I was lucky enough to have them from youngsters...so have instilled manners....plus my old mare is a strong and persistent disciplinarian....hurrah for old mares!
Once you've sorted the filly out, I'd take the owner aside and beat her until she agrees either never to breed again....or to discipline her youngstock to be civilised, socialised herd members... with a respect for humans. If not I think you should ask the vet to put the owner down.
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I dont think PTS is the option I would be rushing to consider with a 2yr old. I noted above you've only had her a month. I personally would favour leaving her in the corral with water and bringing her hay/feed. Only giving it to her when she is reasonable pleasant.
Could you get her into the stocks and do a bit of all over touching etc. maybe with a glove on a stick. I think it is probably a long haul but it would be a shame to end her life so soon.
Just my thoughts on the matter.
 
I like the bucket of water idea as a training aid. My comment about pepper spray and a cattle prod were not to be used as a punishment, or training aid, but rather for protection. It is far too harsh for anything else.

I also am shocked someone said not to provide food or water - talking about backing a horse into a corner.
 
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I like the bucket of water idea as a training aid.

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Perhaps one of the posh water pistols would be easier to handle and aim...without harming the minx?
And for the owner....'dance!'
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Geez, if it behaves like this as a baby, what's it going to be like as an adult ??? Sorry, I would defo consider having it destroyed in these circs and I defo would not have it on my yard . . . just not worth the risk to the other people and horses.
 
Do you have blue pipe over there?
I broke in a mare(6yo) that had been in exactly the same growing up environment, apart from her mum had died and she had been by herself for 2 years.
She was just as you describe your filly, but was surprisingly easy to break. She did have her moments, but I swear she actually enjoyed being hit. No beatings as such, just one proper one whenever she took me on.
She was actually quite sweet, my dog got shut in her stable for a few hours one day. I was mortified, but when I got there they were curled up together asleep.
Shutting her by herself is definetly the right way to go. I would be tempted to try socialising her with something before putting her back in with the horses. Do you have any sheep?

*NOT FOR TIA*
TBH, I am shocked anyone could suggest no water and feed. You don't break a horses spirit by force, you find out what makes them tick and work around it.
 
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I like the bucket of water idea as a training aid.

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Perhaps one of the posh water pistols would be easier to handle and aim...without harming the minx?
And for the owner....'dance!'
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S

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Unless it is a firemans hose it is not enough!
 
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I like the bucket of water idea as a training aid.

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Perhaps one of the posh water pistols would be easier to handle and aim...without harming the minx?
And for the owner....'dance!'
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S

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Unless it is a firemans hose it is not enough!

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I think this is why nervous/inexperienced handlers should never breed or handle youngstock
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It does sound as though she has become a bit of a spoilt brat. Young horses are like any other young creature; they need to be put in their place. I cannot add to the other excellent advice other than to say I'd be wary of handling her without a decent tool of some sort to discipline her physically (a smack will not always suffice), and if she shows no improvement it might be worth asking the owner to pay for some vet checks, in case she has a physical reason for her behaviour. Whatever you do, take care!
 
I am really shocked by the amount of people that have said PTS.

I had very similar problems with my mare. I discussed her behavior with my vet who suggested they scan her ovaries and check her hormone levels. Scan found a Granulosa Cell Tumor the size of a rugby ball which was producing masses of testosterone and causing her dangerous behavior.

Following surgery to have the tumor removed within a couple of days she was a changed horse and we have never looked back.

People said I ought to have my mare PTS because she was so dangerous. Thank god I had the sense not to listen to any of them.

I really think it would be worth having a vet check this filly, even if it's just a blood test to check the hormone levels.
 
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*NOT FOR TIA*
TBH, I am shocked anyone could suggest no water and feed. You don't break a horses spirit by force, you find out what makes them tick and work around it.

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But how else would you be able to get a life certificate for showing?
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*NOT FOR TIA*
TBH, I am shocked anyone could suggest no water and feed. You don't break a horses spirit by force, you find out what makes them tick and work around it.

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But how else would you be able to get a life certificate for showing?
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Scuking off the vet?
 
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