How much should a yard “cater” for horses quirks

[fredflop]

Just a general musing, how much would you expect a yard to be able to cater for individual requirements...

For example being able to restrict laminitic’s grazing

or on paired/group grazing, say existing pair split up when one leaves. YO doesn’t assess the situation with horses remaining, and just shoves new horse in with one left on it’s own, despite new horse not being a suitable match.

 

[milliepops]

some simply won't make adjustments but as i have one particularly needy horse, i only look at yards that are able and prepared to make adjustments to suit her

 

[Berpisc]

I used to have a small livery yard, I would cater for different needs if it was a welfare thing (eg I had electric fence and could fence a bit off for a laminitic) or a behaviour thing (we had a very charming horse to people who was a complete thug with other horses) but I had limits or I would have been tying myself in knots. I think this also worked because it was a small yard; less easy on a big yourd I would imagine.

 

[chocolategirl]

Just a general musing, how much would you expect a yard to be able to cater for individual requirements...

For example being able to restrict laminitic’s grazing

or on paired/group grazing, say existing pair split up when one leaves. YO doesn’t assess the situation with horses remaining, and just shoves new horse in with one left on it’s own, despite new horse not being a suitable match.

I’m a DIY yard but not sure if that makes a difference or not? When I show prospective clients round, I make it crystal clear what they can expect from me with regards to paddock arrangements etc. I never make promises, and if I’ve had to move a goalpost (rare), I do it for a very valid reason. I have found however over the 25 years I’ve been operating, that clients regularly try to move said goal posts, which often leads to disgruntlement on their part, as I rarely budge. I must be doing something right though as most of my clients have been with me 10 years plus?‍

 

[Caol Ila]

I'm in the same boat as milliepops. I have a needy horse who totally malfunctions when a yard doesn't suit her, so yard hunting has always entailed lengthy phone chats wherein I explain her quirks and determine if the yard will work with her. Saves me a lot of driving around.

I've also been wrong, of course. Yards that seem okay at first become not okay. One of the (many) reasons I left my previous yard was the three-way impasse between myself, my horse, and the YOs on dealing with the fencewalking.

 

[milliepops]

I'm in the same boat as milliepops. I have a needy horse who totally malfunctions when a yard doesn't suit her, so yard hunting has always entailed lengthy phone chats wherein I explain her quirks and determine if the yard will work with her. Saves me a lot of driving around.

yup. if a YO sounds like they think i'm just being a PITA client then i won't bother. because I know I'm not, but also I know what my weird horse will and will not cope with. Last yard was a bit odd but the YO used to compete SJ stallions so understood that sometimes it was worth accommodating an individual who was talented but weird, and not just untrained or badly mannered. Current YO is wonderfully laid back. I don't abuse it when I find a yard that suits us

 

[Caol Ila]

yup. if a YO sounds like they think i'm just being a PITA client then i won't bother. because I know I'm not, but also I know what my weird horse will and will not cope with. Last yard was a bit odd but the YO used to compete SJ stallions so understood that sometimes it was worth accommodating an individual who was talented but weird, and not just untrained or badly mannered. Current YO is wonderfully laid back. I don't abuse it when I find a yard that suits us

I know I'm not a PITA client, either. I just have a (sometimes) PITA horse. When I was trying to explain the weirdo horse's neurosis to the YO who chucked us out after four days, YO blew me off by saying, "She's 26. What's she going to do? We've had difficult horses here. Trust me, your horse isn't difficult." Famous last words if there ever were any. LOLOLOLOL.

Current yard management and staff are very chilled, and my horse hasn't fencewalked (knocks on wood) in a year. The yard will accommodate as much as space, georgraphy, and manpower allows, but to be honest, the horse hasn't demanded too much accommodation. They understand her. If she feels like she has a cadre of human slaves, she is happy, and the staff/management/me don't mind being seen as slaves.

 

[Goldenstar]

I think it’s a balance and I think the ability to restrict grazing is important .
I think yard owners need to be upfront about what they can and can’t offer .
However there is the sort of farm livery which is twenty acres a not much else and these can excellent places for some situations but if you buy a cob you are not riding there’s no point in putting it in a situation where you can’t control the grazing so it’s down to owner to be realistic about the places they chose .
I understand why yards do individual grazing I think that’s what I would do now if I had a yard .

 

[Flicker]

I would expect a yard to accommodate genuine welfare needs or at least to have a conversation with the owner to work out what is in the best interests of the horse. On our yard, however, the nearest paddocks to the stable block happen to be the only ones on completely flat ground. The others are on a very gentle gradient, but further away. I am astounded by the number of horses on DIY livery who, over the winter months, suddenly develop soundness issues that necessitate turnout in a flat field and mostly without vet input. The same horses seem to cope brilliantly with 24 hour turnout ‘up the hill’ in summer and also the many and varied winter activities in which they participate. Call me a cynic if you will...

 

[windand rain]

When the horse's welfare is truly compromised then of course you need to adapt so restricted grazing when needed, 24/7 turnout when needed, A track system if the ground allows etc. I do think DIY should be that though if you can or need a small pen then if you are DIY you pay for it and erect it and make it safe for any other user

 

[ihatework]

A yard can only offer what they can offer. There may be some reasonable modifications but ultimately imo it is up to the client to assess whether the set up in offer suits their horse. I don’t think YOs should have to jump through hoops to accommodate nightmare horses, although a little flexibility is always nice.

 

[SEL]

I need to restrict grass intake, soak hay and have some form of turn out all year - so I make sure that's ok before going to the yard.

Current yard allocates a field and you can electric fence off bits as you want. Just asks that you are respectful of the ground. She has made quite serious accommodation for a livery whose horse is downright nasty to lead and a lot of yards wouldn't do that.

 

[Griffin]

I think there has to be a bit of understanding on both side. For example, I discounted a very nice yard for my mare because the majority of grazing was very lush, so she would have had to go out in a muzzle or have restricted grazing on her own.

I think if you have been at your yard for a while and something happens which requires adjustments for welfare reasons e.g. you need to feed soaked hay, I don't think it would be unreasonable to ask the yard owner to consider it.

I also think it depends on the quirk. I sometimes provide holiday cover for a small yard and I don't mind horses who need special feeding regimes, restricted turnout etc but I am not a fan of horses who destroy fencing or are dangerous.

 

[Tiddlypom]

Some yard ‘rules’ are bonkers. No hay allowed to be put out in the field even when there is no grass in winter is a common one round here.

Some flexibility is always good, but some yards lend themselves to certain types of horses better than others, so as owners we need to be selective - which is easier said than done in areas with little choice.

 

[stormox]

Some yard ‘rules’ are bonkers. No hay allowed to be put out in the field even when there is no grass in winter is a common one round here.

I wouldn't say that is bonkers- putting hay out can cause arguments in herds of horses, and there can be a lot of wastage and mess.

 

[Tiddlypom]

The alternative is to have horses standing around with nothing to eat all day, so not great.

I was gobsmacked when a horse of mine was expected to do just that at a fancy livery yard, and she was on individual turnout. Brought her home early.

I asked if I could bring my own hay from home to give to her. The answer was ‘No, because if you do that all the other horses will want haying, too‘ . ETA This was a full livery only yard.

I think it was the ‘mess’ they were worried about.

 

[Pearlsacarolsinger]

I wouldn't say that is bonkers- putting hay out can cause arguments in herds of horses, and there can be a lot of wastage and mess.

If there is enough hay spread in enough places, there are unlikely to be arguments. Ime, it's more likely that there will be trouble when there isn't enough for horses to eat. That only encourages them to hang around gateways vying to be first in. As for mess, well, words fail me!

 

[stormox]

Im assuming you mean individual owners putting hay out for their own horses (on DIY). Some people are messy and carry hay out withour sweeping the yard after, and it can encourage horses to push down fencing, and fights if theres not enough pules or a horse is a bully.
If its the yard owner putting hay out for all horses thats fine.

 

[Auslander]

I'll do whatever is necessary to make all the horses happy - it suits me as much as it suits them, as I can't be bothered with the drama if a horse isn't happy (or it's owner!) Basically, my lot are in two single sex herds, fed and hayed outside all year round, with a few adjustments to ensure that everyone gets to eat, and no-one gets hurt.
I've got a track and pens for fatties, so no problems restricting grazing - and most importantly, i have the ability to separate every horse within seconds, so there is rarely any drama.
I've had the odd issue - including one who managed to push his way through an electric fence, about 20ft of brambles, a ditch and 2 hedges, and was found in the mares field, having a high old time! He'd also smashed two rails on the brand new pen fence. Owner wasn't remotely sorry about the amount of damage he'd done, made no effort to help fix anything, nor did she offer to pay to replace the smashed rails - just made many insinuations that my fencing was inadequate! She is no longer here, and no other horses have escaped via that route since (or in the 5 years preceding!) Sometimes, you just cant do what needs doing for a specific horse!

 

[milliepops]

The alternative is to have horses standing around with nothing to eat all day, so not great.

I was gobsmacked when a horse of mine was expected to do just that at a fancy livery yard, and she was on individual turnout. Brought her home early.

I asked if I could bring my own hay from home to give to her. The answer was ‘No, because if you do that all the other horses will want haying, too‘ . ETA This was a full livery only yard.

I think it was the ‘mess’ they were worried about.

yeah, this was a problem at my last place. it was a mix of full and assisted and the YO had fairly fixed ideas of what horses needed to survive. my TB didn't do that brilliantly on the small amount of grass that he stripgrazed very tightly and we weren't allowed to supplement with hay (horses out 4pm til 8am). Friend told YO she was putting hay out for her ex racer and there was an almighty ding dong. I think it was a mess and control issue.

It's nice being back on "proper" DIY and being able to make my own judgements. I hang a haynet in the shelter for TB so he can help himself if he makes a mess I tidy it up. Simple

 

[Christmascinnamoncookie]

Re grazing, my yard is not keen on demanding owners. Re my horse rubbing his water drinker off the wall twice, they’ve been very tolerant. He’s also in one of the few breezeblock boxes, having somewhat destroyed his old wooden stable. If it’s for welfare reasons, I’d hope to have reasonable requests fulfilled, but I try to keep quiet unless it’s really necessary.

 

[Annagain]

Our yard is no good for good doers, the grass is just too good and even keeping them stabled part of the day in summer and/or muzzling isn’t really enough. On the flip side, it’s great for our big boys who can stay out 24/7 in summer and get plenty of turnout in winter as the fields aren’t overgrazed so it’s horses for courses. There are plenty of yards that wouldn’t suit us as they’d have to be in during part of the day in summer or only get a few hours out in winter. YO will do all she can to help with injuries and turnout pens etc.

 

[Jango]

Our yard will provide small, bare paddocks for laminitis/rehab, allow you to change fields if your horse was being bullied, there's a hay soaking area for example but some rules are fixed for everyone. No hay to be fed in the fields for example. But they only go out 6 hrs in the winter, (which starts tomorrow) and have enough grass until then and then they just have hay before and after turnout. It's a mixed DIY and full livery yard with over 90 horses so if they changed the rules for everyone it would be chaos! I'm very happy here, it's not perfect but it's one of the best in the area.

 

[Gingerwitch]

Some yard ‘rules’ are bonkers. No hay allowed to be put out in the field even when there is no grass in winter is a common one round here.

Some flexibility is always good, but some yards lend themselves to certain types of horses better than others, so as owners we need to be selective - which is easier said than done in areas with little choice.

Why have you seen the mess created ? One owner with mid to bottom horse puts hay in, other horses including one who puts hay in get beaten the crap out of. Top dog horse owner dies not out hay in as they know others will get chased off. Mrs penny pinch never Hays as why should she. Mrs I worry a lot, puts too much in which causes mr do good ers horse to get fat and Mr and Mrs COPD do t want hat feeding only haylidge which sends miss terrified of my horse hyper...... Mrs I turn out at 6am and Mr I turn out at 10 are at odds as it's not fair on what time hay us put in, and then you have the same in the afternoon. So I really see why yard owners say no to hay in the field.

 

[Tiddlypom]

So I really see why yard owners say no to hay in the field.

Thanks for your lengthy reply, but this was at full livery .

 

[milliepops]

Thanks for your lengthy reply, but this was at full livery .

And mine have individual paddocks. So the issue still doesn't apply

 

[conniegirl]

I think it would depend on the yard and the quirk.
Mine for example is extremely pleasant to handle and cuddly to people.
however he cannot be turned out with other horses, he WILL try and kill them. That said he will also fence walk if disturbed at all.
My YO has taken to turning him out next to one of her retirees in a quiet paddock away from the rest of the horses so he isn’t disturbed when people get theirs in or out.

it doesnt always work and he does have a huge track that he has worn in his field but it is the best we can do as we have yet to find what else is triggering him.

 

[MuddyMonster]

I'm fairly realistic that no yard is ever going to be perfect and you have to work with what you have available- be that location, budget or something else. I have a good doer/laminitic/grass sensitive native so only consider yards I think can cater for him and have discounted a few lovely yards near us over the years because of this.

I've no problem yards if yards can't cater and are upfront about it but it is frustrating when yards either lie on viewing, change the rules suddenly or make an allowances for someone but not another person in the same situation.

I've voted with my feet a few times because of this. I'm on a great yard though that is ideal for our needs now though, so very happy about that

 

[scats]

I’m so glad I’m on a yard that is as DIY as you can get. YO not around (unless we need her in an emergency) and we are left to run the place as we like and sort our own fields out etc.
I find a lot of livery yards around here are not particularly flexible, usually as they are pretty overstocked and have limited land, particularly in winter.

I do think yards need to start catering more for lami/metabolic types. Chucking horses out in rested, fertilised fields come spring, with no options for anything else (track/individual etc) seems to be the norm and causes countless problems for a lot of people. When I was a kid, everyone had TBs and TB crosses that came out of winter poor and could cope with being chucked on good grass... but as yards are now mostly filled with natives and chunky cobs, this is a practice that really does need to be addressed.

 

[Caol Ila]

I think it would depend on the yard and the quirk.
Mine for example is extremely pleasant to handle and cuddly to people.
however he cannot be turned out with other horses, he WILL try and kill them. That said he will also fence walk if disturbed at all.
My YO has taken to turning him out next to one of her retirees in a quiet paddock away from the rest of the horses so he isn’t disturbed when people get theirs in or out.

it doesnt always work and he does have a huge track that he has worn in his field but it is the best we can do as we have yet to find what else is triggering him.

I could have written this very thing about my horse. Every single word. It totally sucks. But strangely, at the yard I've now been at for a year, she has become a reformed citizen, both in her fencewalking ways and horse-attacking attitude. She hasn't been triggered into walking at all, and back in July, the YO wanted to try turning her out with a buddy (because a horse had left and the buddy needed a new buddy). I was reluctant, but agreed to give it a go. And my horse loved having a buddy. Hasn't tried to eat her once. They are even led in and out together, like ladies (unless mum is standing in front of you, taking a photo).

When the buddy had to spend a week on box rest earlier this month, I was worried my horse would be triggered, because disturbances like that can set her off, but she wasn't bothered. She still had her two friends in the adjacent paddock.

I remain pleasantly astounded.