hunt sabs, animal lovers?????????

[kirstyhen]

Can I come and eat at yours too!?
My dad struggles to hit a barn door, so I shouldnt think anything my mum cooks will be shot by him!
I never understand why antis come on this forum, what are they hoping to achieve, as far as im aware it is not ilegal to talk about hunting, so they cant use "monitoring" as an excuse! And who the hell do they think they are going to convert!?
No mice or rats! Can we have your secret? Despite rat-proof feed bins and clearing up spilt feed we still have no end of mice and rats!
Have you never heard that your never less than 40m away from a rat!?"?

 

[soggy]

Have you never heard that your never less than 40m away from a rat!?"?

Ah! But you forget Wrighty lives in Cloud Cuckoo Land. Where he walks , talks and eats with the animals.

 

[soggy]

I think this was a lie too far

I think the first lie came within his first 3 posts, and they haven't stopped since.

 

[Fairynuff]

Im an anti of the worst possible kind...my freezer is full of pheasant , partridge, hare and boar.I admit to being an anti,but with a taste for 'game'! At least I eat what is 'shot'

 

[soggy]

Im an anti of the worst possible kind...my freezer is full of pheasant , partridge, hare and boar.I admit to being an anti,but with a taste for 'game'! At least I eat what is 'shot'

Good for you.

How was your first day out "sock" hunting?

 

[Vicki1986]

I have never and will never need to put in the situation of putting down a pet as I don't believe in keeping an animal for our use and/or entertainment.
Animals that die naturally is nature, let them get on with it.

By being clean and protecting your house/farm/grain etc from them in the 1st place.
I live by a farm and there are no rats, mice running around the farm, the house or the place I live, the farmer spent a bit more money to protect his things.

you have no pets at all ?! not even a horse?? how sad.

A farm no matter how clean tidy or how good their storage facilites are WILL have a certain amount of mice / rats paying regular visits - just becuase you don't see them "running around" the farm does not mean they are not there !!
We store our feeds well, have a tidy yard and have cats/dogs which case mice but every now and then you always find a dead one in the horses water/feed buckets - fact of life. they also live in the straw beds/hay etc.

 

[JessDoesItBetter]

It is very ignorant of you to surgest that all Anti hunts are uninformed "townies" that don't have a clue about country life. This is another over generalisation that is quite often made by the Pro hunts. I am in no way a townie (not as though it would be such a horrific thing if i was!), i live amongst many farms in leicstershire (the heart of rural england) and i resent being told that i "don't understand" something just because i disagree with it. Do you accuse everyone of ignorance as soon as they offer a different point of view to your own? I acctualy know a lot about hunting, the majority of my family are pro hunt and hunt themselves, i have been hunting myself and since decided that it's a barbarric practice. So if you would please stop catogerising me under your made up steriotype of what you have told yourself is an anti hunt i would be most greatfull.

A lot of people do think hunting is wrong, although there are many figures showing different results, so as far as i can see none are reliable as i have seen figures ranging from 80% of people disagree with hunting to only 16% disagree with hunting, i personally don't believe either. I just know from the amount of people i have spoken to regarding the subject that a significant amount think it's cruel, and that is why it isn't controlling to protest against it, people can and should have the right to stand up for what the believe is right, regardless of whether this contradicts your views or not.

I appreciate that it is within the farmers interest to keep the fox population limited as they do undoubtedly cause a threat to chickens (free range ones in particular). The main problem i have with hunting with hounds is that the hunts claim to keep the population down, however don't kill nearly enough to make a significant difference to the fox population what so ever. People go hunting because they enjoy it - not because they are so very concerned about the fox population and the farmers welfare- and the result of their enjoyment results in the suffering of a living creature. I am not in any way inclined to believe that everyone that goes hunting is there to do the farmers a good deed.

 

[Nickijem]

I agree with you that it is ignorant to assume antis are townies. The thing is, townies are often less likely to know the actual facts about hunting. I grew up in rural leicestershire too but not with horsey or hunting family or friends and so I was unaware of the facts about hunting and was therefore quite anti-hunt.
However, as I have grown up, I have learnt more about the facts and now I am pro-hunting. My best friend is anti-hunt, I know I will never change her opinion as she also knows the facts but she knows she will never change my views.
Everyone is entitled to their opinion but it is important that they know the facts - not biased propaganda from either side of an argument.

 

[soggy]

i have been hunting myself and since decided that it's a practice.

and the result of their enjoyment results in the suffering of a living creature. I am not in any way inclined to believe that everyone that goes hunting is there to do the farmers a good deed.

Emotive words, and so, so familiar. Almost as if I was reading the LAC's pamphlets.

Pray do tell how/why is hunting "barbaric"?
How does a living creature suffer if I hunt it?
Perhaps not everyone goes hunting to do the farmers a favour. But I certainly do.

 

[Fairynuff]

How was your first day out "sock" hunting? [/quote]
Highly embarrassing..we dont talk bout it . I was sooo embarrassed by the whole thing that I swear I will never go again. It was so tame and so very badly done.The turn out of the field was dreadful-dirty horses with manes like 'my little pony', riders who were a danger to themselves and ME and the hounds.....!!!!!!!!!! Poor things, they were obviously as embarrassed as I was by the tootling of the horn.. :crazy:. Never again, well , here in Italy anyway!

 

[JessDoesItBetter]

and the result of their enjoyment results in the suffering of a living creature. I am not in any way inclined to believe that everyone that goes hunting is there to do the farmers a good deed.

Emotive words, and so, so familiar. Almost as if I was reading the LAC's pamphlets.

Actually the majority of the human race would agree that the dismembering of an animal is a pretty emotive subject and it's not me that is over sensetive it is you thats totally desensetised to justify the fact that you are doing something that isn't morally right.

 

[soggy]

Actually the majority of the human race would agree that the dismembering of an animal is a pretty emotive subject and it's not me that is over sensetive it is you thats totally desensetised to justify the fact that you are doing something that isn't morally right.

There you go again! Whats emotive about hound breaking up a dead fox. ? Thats what canines do when they hunt in packs. The fox is dead before it hits the floor.

Hunting is morally and ethically correct!

Where is the barbarism in hunting. You have failed to answer that simple question. Does that LAC's pamphlet not have the answer to that question?

 

[soggy]

Oh dear oh dear. LMAO

I can well imagine the scene.

I'm so disappointed for you.

I have to admit to be sat here giggling to myself. Must have been like one of the weird Italian art movies.

Perhaps one of the "girls" could arrange something for your next return trip to the UK, and then you can truely say you have been "unting`t' sock".

 

[Reginald]

You're quite right Jess. Foxhunting is completely self-serving. For example, foxes only exist on the Isle of Wight because several individuals shipped them in to hunt.

Several years ago the Masters of Fox Hounds Association wrote to 800 hunt masters and chairmen warning of a nationwide "shortage of foxes". It urged that landowners should be encouraged to breed more foxes to solve the "problem".

A prominent terrierman also advocated in one of his books a couple of years ago releasing large healthy foxes during digs so that they could further reproduce, ensuring a nice supply of foxes to be killed in future.

I also agree with your point Jess about how weird it is that people can enjoy an activity where the animals suffers. How can they enjoy chasing a stag for three hours until it's so exhausted it has to stop and wait for the bullet? How can they get gratification from this when a far simpler, more humane method of culling it is available?

 

[PaddyMonty]

It is very ignorant of you to surgest that all Anti hunts are uninformed "townies" that don't have a clue about country life.

Well said I'm another pro turned anti who does know the facts, probably more than most of the average field. Started hunting at 6yo (1966) with the eridge. Blooded etc and spent many days with the terrier men. Last hunted in 97.

I afraid taking enjoyment in killing just doesn't sit well with me these days. However, I certainly wouldn't attempt to stop others. It is up to the individual to decide what is acceptable and what is not (where hunting is concerned).

 

[u04elw2]

Sorry but it's not the saboteurs problem if the hound died in the trailer - if they had proper, air conditioned transport for them and the driver had thought to let them out for some fresh air then it wouldn't have happened. You cannot blame someone who holds up and hunt because they don't agree with a fox being torn limb from limb buy a bunch of arrogant snobs who give horse riders a bad name.

 

[u04elw2]

wrighty, I agree with you all the way. How can people who hunt or eat meat call themselves animal lovers and yet will happily kill one animal but not another? Why is there such a difference between murdering a fox and murdering a dog?

No animal should be subjected to a violent death.

 

[winterhorse]

air conditioned trailer? you saying one with air conditioning or windows/air vents?
if it the latter, what is the use if there is no breeze? can be stiffling hot with no air.
also you telling me they should have let a pack of hounds loose on a road?? are you insane that would cause more accidents. also if a group of thugs stopped you in your car and are being abbusive you tell me you would still get out, or stay where you are safe?
as a horserider i am neither arrogant or neglectful. i care for my horse better than some people who don't even hunt.

 

[u04elw2]

JessDoesItBetter, you put it into words much better than I could have!

 

[u04elw2]

I'm saying one with air conditioning - that's why I said "air conditioned"

Should the dogs not be easily enough controlled / put on leads on at a time and let out for a cool drink and a bit of air if the trailer had to stop? What would have happened if the car had broken down and they'd had to stop anyway? Do they not have a contingency plan for such things?

I'm not saying pro-hunt people don't look after their pets. I know lots of people who are pro-hunt and they have some amazingly spoiled horses. But I'm asking the same question I ask them - if you can shoot animals, hunt animals and yet own animals, where do you draw the line of what you will kill? Because as it has been proven, fox hunting really does not reduce the fox population by NEARLY enough to claim that it is in the best interests of the farmers. And if the farmers really need to kill a fox they would shoot it, not send a huge bunch of people chasing it through the countryside until it's exhausted and then rip it apart.

And Soggy, you need to allow other people to have their own opinions before you call anyone who doesn't agree with you stupid or a liar. I don't expect you to be a vegetarian like I am. I don't expect you to stop hunting. I really don't care what you do with your time. But please stop insulting people for their opinions. Everyone is entitled to what they believe in, be it fitting with your views or not.

By the way I also don't agree with the way in which saboteurs act, scaring horses and hurting dogs. That is not the way to help the situation. Sadly it seems that some feel the need to take such violent action in order for their views to be heard.

 

[winterhorse]

air conditioned trailer, do you know how much one of those is?
contrary to popular belief, many packs are not wealthy, we use a metal sheep trailer, our masters do not even put money in we are solely profit based.
the point of not getting hounds out was because there are people there protesting against you. yes most probably have a plan in the event of a break down but it shouldn't see them stranded for 4 hours. also hounds are exercised without leads, so how long would it take 1 maybe 2 people to get every hound out individually? are you aware how many hounds, packs hunt with?

 

[u04elw2]

Well I'm sorry, but it's not my problem, or the saboteurs problems, that there isn't enough money for air conditioning or that the dogs are not trained well enough to walk calmly in an emergency. And yes, I am well aware that a lot of hounds are used. But like I said, you can't go blaming other people for the conditions the hounds are transported in. That's nobody's fault but the people transporting them

 

[wurzel]

"Because as it has been proven, fox hunting really does not reduce the fox population by NEARLY enough to claim that it is in the best interests of the farmers."

I will be the judge of that.

 

[wurzel]

"Everyone is entitled to what they believe in, be it fitting with your views or not."

I am afraid they are not.

Try the Libertarian Alliance for the theory.

 

[u04elw2]

As will the countless farmers that I know...all of whom are anti hunt and agree that fox hunting (before it was banned here) was not a valid method of reducing pest numbers but just a blood-sport for people who enjoy killing things that can't defend themselves.

As one person on the BBC website put so eloquently:

"Surely if population control were the primary motivation it would be better to trap and shoot them? People in general tend to find the most efficient way of accomplishing a given task. So it seems unlikely to me that a mechanism that requires many people, horse and dogs, and that results in most of the foxes escaping anyway is a feasible method of population control. My conclusion? That it is primarily a form of entertainment. And that, for me, sums up the real barbarism of hunting with hounds."

Can't say I can fault his argument.

 

[u04elw2]

And actually, yes, everyone IS entitled to believe what they like. I'm not condoning their actions if they choose to act upon what they believe but you cannot STOP someone believing in something. Freedom of speech I'm afraid. God, if we were all the same what a boring world it would be

 

[winterhorse]

Well I'm sorry, but it's not my problem, or the saboteurs problems, that there isn't enough money for air conditioning or that the dogs are not trained well enough to walk calmly in an emergency. And yes, I am well aware that a lot of hounds are used. But like I said, you can't go blaming other people for the conditions the hounds are transported in. That's nobody's fault but the people transporting them

bollocks so you have a horse and you are stuck on the m25 in peak traffic i bet you wouldn't get it out and walk it up and down the road just to let it stretch it's legs..
as for a pack of hounds walking up and down the road then yes it's possible but the whole story is about the fact that the vehicle in question was surrounded by anti hunt supporters and would you get out in that enviroment (i think not)
most hunt lorries and trailers are better looked after than most vehicles so dont talk bollocks about air con in trailers.
but i would love to put you in a metal trailer in temperatures higher than expected and see how you cope with not being aloud out.and get a load of pro hunt supporters to frieghten the living daylight out of anyone who wanted to help and see how long it takes for your sorry arse to die in there !!!!!!

 

[Fairynuff]

I think you will find that since the "ban" more foxes have died than when they were hunted by hound The hunt isnt there to control the fox pop to the extent that they become a rarity but are there to keep the numbers down AND enjoy themselves while theyre at it. Im anti but would prefer to see hunting reinstated as it was (MINUS STOPPING AND DIGGING) than see the fox pop devastated by uncontrolled shooting. I see it as the lesser of two evils! I wont hunt again through choice but I admit to missing it :crazy:

 

[loobiloo]

How does a living creature suffer if I hunt it?

Sorry but is that really a serious question or have I missed something?

 

[kirstyhen]

How is it not the antis fault that a dog died in a trailer they were holding up? As they were the cause of the hold up, which caused the death of a hound then they are responsible.

Hunting kills the weak, old and injured, shooting in general causes more injuries than death, gassing is slow and painful as are most traps. Foxes will always be controlled in someone, in my opinion hunting is the lesser of evils.

Have all the opinions you want, however why come and preech to people who are unlikely to ever convert to being an anti?

As for stereotypes, I am often stereotyped as a heartless, blood-thirty toff, so why should I refrain from stereotyping the people who come uninvited to the hunt, just to throw abuse at us?