Hunting and Equine flu

[Lammy]

Time will tell I guess, I think we are becoming a country that overreacts to events, interesting that we are the only country to stop racing. Maybe from here the authorities are going to say there is a problem on one yard for whatever reason or the situation won’t change and racing could stop for months. That would be a far bigger welfare problem in my opinion as well as costing millions and a lot of jobs.

It’s not a problem on one yard though is it? It’s in several yards and also showing in leisure horses vaccinated and un-vaccinated. Stop worrying about Cheltenham ffs it’s unbelievably selfish. And how on Earth you think postponing racing is a welfare problem is beyond me...there’s lots of people who would claim the opposite!

I have a young one (vaccinated with ProTeq) and an old mare who unfortunately can’t be vaccinated with any of the flu jabs as she’s had bad reactions to each one which had been getting worse each time she had a jab so vet and me decided to stop at 19. I’m relying on people to be sensible and to keep the yard as bio-secure as possible.

 

[AmyMay]

I’m going from the latest update from the BHA who have said they have 6 confirmed cases all from the same yard. They have tested 720 swabs

And the other yards - leisure horses and the one that has reportedly died?

 

[Pearlsasinger]

It absolutely amazes me that someone who usually joins threads to say ' Oh no don't pts your 17hh, 3-legged ancient horse, find it a home as a companion' is so cavalier about horse welfare in this context.

 

[Auslander]

It absolutely amazes me that someone who usually joins threads to say ' Oh no don't pts your 17hh, 3-legged ancient horse, find it a home as a companion' is so cavalier about horse welfare in this context.

I am beginning to suspect that said person just likes to argue...

 

[Rowreach]

... and still hasn't answered my question.

 

[Hormonal Filly]

Just saw this,
https://www.britishhorseracing.com/press_releases/daily-update-regarding-equine-influenza-situation/

Also just red this

“Anyone watch the racing line this morning and actual racing this afternoon? Interesting info on the flu. Interviews with an AHT/BHA vet and Alice Plunkett [wife of William Fox-Pitt].
This is a mutant strain hence it affecting vaccinated horses. Do all horses need to be on lockdown and should all events be cancelled? No and no. Over 2,000 horses tested but only the six already identified already have tested positive.
No deaths have been reported to the BHA or DEFRA which the vet would be required to do.”

Quick question.. you all seem like you know your stuff I’m just reading reports and asked my vet what he thought.
If a infected horse was travelled past your yard, windows open in the trailer, as we get regularly being by a busy main road. Will the flu easily be carried over as it’s airborne? Only I noticed quite a few travelling on the main road past our yard today, looked to be racers in racing ‘branded’ trailers and lorries. If they sneezed etc.

One yard local to me has confined them to outdoor stables but they have yards all around them, surely as it’s airborne they’re going to get it wether confined to stables or not if it’s in the area?

 

[bonny]

Just saw this,
https://www.britishhorseracing.com/press_releases/daily-update-regarding-equine-influenza-situation/

Also just red this

“Anyone watch the racing line this morning and actual racing this afternoon? Interesting info on the flu. Interviews with an AHT/BHA vet and Alice Plunkett [wife of William Fox-Pitt].
This is a mutant strain hence it affecting vaccinated horses. Do all horses need to be on lockdown and should all events be cancelled? No and no. Over 2,000 horses tested but only the six already identified already have tested positive.
No deaths have been reported to the BHA or DEFRA which the vet would be required to do.”

Quick question.. you all seem like you know your stuff I’m just reading reports and asked my vet what he thought.
If a infected horse was travelled past your yard, windows open in the trailer, as we get regularly being by a busy main road. Will the flu easily be carried over as it’s airborne? Only I noticed quite a few travelling on the main road past our yard today, looked to be racers in racing ‘branded’ trailers and lorries. If they sneezed etc.

One yard local to me has confined them to outdoor stables but they have yards all around them, surely as it’s airborne they’re going to get it wether confined to stables or not if it’s in the area?

It’s contagious in the same way that human flu is, would you worry about someone passing you in a car with the windows down as they passed? I doubt it, but you might try and avoid close contact with anyone displaying symptoms. If you have flu it’s prudent to stay away from people for the first few days but not everyone you come into contact with will get it.

 

[ester]

Yes if it’s coughed or snorted. Depends on which way the wind is growing.

There are several incorrect points in what was said which doesn’t help.

 

[ihatework]

Aimeetess ...easily transmitted? I’d say no. Potentially transmitted then yes. In the grand scheme of things I wouldn’t be loosing too much sleep at this stage about horses contained within horseboxes/trailers (other than their travelling companions)

 

[Pearlsasinger]

It’s contagious in the same way that human flu is, would you worry about someone passing you in a car with the windows down as they passed? I doubt it, but you might try and avoid close contact with anyone displaying symptoms. If you have flu it’s prudent to stay away from people for the first few days but not everyone you come into contact with will get it.

It's not actually contagious at all. It is infectious, it is airborne. Contagion is passed by touch.

 

[ester]

IHW good point I missed the easily!

 

[Ambers Echo]

If shutting everything down temporarily is the right thing to do, why is that not the current advice from the BEF? All NSEA, PC, BE, BS & BD events are following veterinary advice and allowing competition to continue as long as all competitors are vaccinated. Some venues are choosing to cancel but those are individual decisions made by the venues themselves and are not based on current veterinary advice. I am team manager of our NSEA school team and we went ahead today. I can't see that following the advice from the BEF that has been specifically issued about flu makes us selfish and irresponsible for competing.

 

[bonny]

It's not actually contagious at all. It is infectious, it is airborne. Contagion is passed by touch.

Pedantic ! Oxford dictionary definition “ in practice there is little or no difference in meaning between contagious and infectious when applied to disease “ guess I’m being pedantic too !

 

[ester]

Right now I think it still depends a lot on location, which the BEF advice also can’t really account for (and am not sure how frequently they are updating it. Everything stopped in somerset today and I don’t think many would have been out if it hadn’t.

 

[ihatework]

If shutting everything down temporarily is the right thing to do, why is that not the current advice from the BEF? All NSEA, PC, BE, BS & BD events are following veterinary advice and allowing competition to continue as long as all competitors are vaccinated. Some venues are choosing to cancel but those are individual decisions made by the venues themselves and are not based on current veterinary advice. I am team manager of our NSEA school team and we went ahead today. I can't see that following the advice from the BEF that has been specifically issued about flu makes us selfish and irresponsible for competing.

I’m with you.
I think that if the BEF advice is followed I.e non-symptomatic horses, vaccinated within 6 months using the 2 vaccines specified & within areas with no confirmed cases - I think this is not unreasonable. Venues would need to implement passport checks IMO.

 

[Ambers Echo]

I’m with you.
I think that if the BEF advice is followed I.e non-symptomatic horses, vaccinated within 6 months using the 2 vaccines specified & within areas with no confirmed cases - I think this is not unreasonable. Venues would need to implement passport checks IMO.

All passports were checked today.

 

[Shooting Star]

The AHT have updated their list for today and confirmed 2 new cases, Suffolk and Hertfordshire but the Hertfordshire one had recently been moved there from somewhere in the South East.

https://www.aht.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2019/02/Equiflunet-update-09-02-19-1.pdf

 

[Pearlsasinger]

Pedantic ! Oxford dictionary definition “ in practice there is little or no difference in meaning between contagious and infectious when applied to disease “ guess I’m being pedantic too !

In this context, I think it is important to know and understand the difference, because horses do not have to touch each other to pass the virus on.

 

[Tiddlypom]

I can't see that following the advice from the BEF that has been specifically issued about flu makes us selfish and irresponsible for competing.

But after reading this thread you must know that the decision to allow competition to continue this weekend is, at best, debatable?

It sure shows up the competition junkies. I would have looked at the same evidence and withdrawn from any competitions.

 

[tristar]

the bha clearly states they consider that the rapid action taken has helped contain the infection.

agree with pearl its highly infectious strictly speaking, horses warming up together one cough or sneezes and launches god only how many knows how many virus into the air

contagious needs physical contact, example, i had neighbours who breed trotters,they got strangles,they were 30 meters from my horses, we did not get strangles, had they got equine influenza my horse would have got it too

 

[Auslander]

Going off tangent a bit - I've seen a lot of people saying that the BHA has announced that there have been no new cases since their last announcement. Just need to remember that they are only concerned with racehorses, so their statements do not include confirmed cases in leisurehorses/non racehorses

 

[poiuytrewq]

The BHA have just said of over 700 test results back in already ONLY the original 6 from McCains yard have tested positive. This includes a couple of tests from Rebecca Menzies who had a couple of ill horses and fully expected the results to be flu. Thankfully it isn't it's just another bug that has been floating about.

I was told that at work this afternoon. Good news

 

[Tiddlypom]

Today's AHT update. It confirms the fatality in the non vaccinated horse, one of a group of infected non thoroughbreds in Suffolk.

https://www.aht.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2019/02/Equiflunet-update-09-02-19-1.pdf

 

[tristar]

no but racing has stopped, all the other non racing things are on or off randomly

 

[paddy555]

Don't you live on Dartmoor? Oh great, that's just what is needed, the hunt ploughing on through and scattering herds of unvaccinated wild ponies...

*I may have hunted with that pack in the distant past*

if things got bad, (and the situation will hopefully get under control pretty quickly) then if it got into the semi feral herds it would be a nightmare, not just Dartmoor but all over the country. Many horses and riders are near to semi ferals (Bodmin, Dartmoor, Exmoor, New Forest, Wales and I'm sure Scotland must have several) or to conservation grazing ponies. Lots of semi ferals walk past my gate every day within feet of domestic horses. Hopefully everyone will take care and restrict their activities and movements for a while.

 

[Mule]

And she would be one to get it - not known as Sick Note for nothing.....

Eye opening how many people don't vaccinate. Can't imagine why you wouldn't want to protect your horse against tetanus. Lots of weird science appearing in FB 😕

I agree. Tetanus causes an horrendous death. It's so easily preventable it's crazy to risk it.

 

[flying_high]

Today's AHT update. It confirms the fatality in the non vaccinated horse, one of a group of infected non thoroughbreds in Suffolk.

https://www.aht.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2019/02/Equiflunet-update-09-02-19-1.pdf

View attachment 29519

Thanks I am a bit confused. I have today seen posts by vet business Facebook posts stating confirmed cases of equine influenza in both Middlesex (by Chiltern vets) and North Kent (by Bell Equine).

These aren’t on the list yet. When a local equine vet says confirmed equine influenza is that after swab testing? After they have DNA sequence tested?
Presumably there are strains of non FC1 equine influenza currently spreading too?

The horses on AHT list that don’t say FC1 and say ongoing, could they be a different more normal strain?

 

[Pearlsasinger]

I agree. Tetanus causes an horrendous death. It's so easily preventable it's crazy to risk it.

The non vaccined horses have not be given the flu vaccine, there is nothing to say that they haven't been given the tetanus vaccine, the two don't have to be given together.

 

[Mule]

The non vaccined horses have not be given the flu vaccine, there is nothing to say that they haven't been given the tetanus vaccine, the two don't have to be given together.

I got a bit off topic (as I tend to do)
I was just talking about tetanus.

 

[Pearlsasinger]

I got a bit off topic (as I tend to do)
I was just talking about tetanus.

But no-one has said that horses haven't been vaccinated against tetanus - the non vaccinated horses that the AHT are listing just haven't been given the flu vaccine. What made you think that some horse owners don't vaccine against tet?