Immediate General Election

[Judgemental]

To your point of a february election Why? Winter elections are notoriously very unpredictable and the way people have recently voted around the world nothing is a certainty. At the moment The only Mandate we have for Brexit is the referendum and thats not binding all we need is an inconclusive election and the whole thing just sinks into a bigger mire. The media in some quarters are so biased i'm not sure they live in the same country. I used to listen to radio 5live all the time and now switch it off they are obsessed with staying in the single market and are so twisted in their reporting.

The point is a majority voted to leave the EU.

I emphasise a majority.

So far the Government have failed to 'get on with it' and I blame Mrs May who is dawdling through the whole process. She should have triggered Article 50 on the day she stepped into Downing Street.

As for a February election, if the time table is to be kept for triggering Article 50 then she has no choice. If it is not adhered to, Mrs May is going to face huge problems from all her backbench MP's who want to get on with BREXIT.

Also it is an effective way of scuppering all these court cases. If she calls an General Election now, any judgement by the Supreme Court is neutered.

Also in the circumstances, not having a personal mandate from the people, she needs to obtain that, otherwise she will end up like, Jim Callaghan, John Major and Gordon Brown, all cast out, because they did not go to the country when they inherited Downing Street, rather than winning it in a General Election.

Forget February 'fill dyke' the people will vote and vote in their millions, they don't like all these parasites interfering with the Referendum result and foreigners calling the tune.

Far far too many outsiders and non-British nationals are intruding on the British way of life, politics, economy and the generality of our genre.

As you say the media are biased and it is quite remarkable, the number of foreigners who seem to think they can pontificate as to our destiny.

At least we can take comfort in the fact that Horse and Hound is immune to these outside influences.

 

[Judgemental]

One does wonder exactly what is happening, especially when it is reported Mrs May will not discuss BREXIT even with Her Majesty The Queen.

Whatever one's opinion of Nigel Farage, he is extremely powerful and has Donald Trump solidly behind him.

Never let us forget everything we do and say via the Internet is governed via the servers and Internet 'Clearing Houses' that are all controlled by American companies based in California.

Are we really masters of our own destiny, one wonders.

http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/74...al-change-2020-General-Election-Brexit-latest

Nigel Farage gives Theresa May ultimatum - give us hard Brexit or we'll OUST you

NIGEL FARAGE predicted Theresa May and Philip Hammond could be ousted from their roles leading the United Kingdom if they cannot deliver a satisfactory Brexit for the country.

By JOE BARNES
PUBLISHED: 00:01, Tue, Dec 27, 2016 | UPDATED: 11:50, Tue, Dec 27, 2016

The outspoken politician warned that despite Britons voting to leave the European Union, business is still “not finished yet” as he urges voters to keep up pressure on the Government.

Mr Farage helped lead the momentous campaign which saw 17.4million voters choose to ditch Britain’s membership of the bloc, overcoming then Prime Minister David Cameron and his close ally former Chancellor of the Exchequer George Osborne.

In the wake of his stunning defeat, Mr Cameron stood down as leader of the country, leaving Conservative party members to opt for Theresa May to fill the void in No.10, she would go on to select fellow Remain campaigner Philip Hammond to lead the economy.

While discussing the Government and his belief in their ability to deliver Brexit, Nigel Farage cast doubt on the two politicians leading the apparent charge.

Nigel Farage, Philip Hammond and Theresa MayLBC•GETTY

Nigel Farage attacked Theresa May and Philip Hammond's ability to deliver Brexit
We’ve got a Prime Minister who, on the greatest political decision of our lifetime, was on the wrong side
Nigel Farage
He told LBC: “We’ve got a Prime Minister who, on the greatest political decision of our lifetime, was on the wrong side and gets rewarded with being Prime Minister – It’s a funny old game politics, isn’t it?”

Moving on to Chancellor Philip Hammond, the 52-year-old believed he is “exactly the same”, and went as far as to say “nobody has heard of him” in the scathing attack.

Mr Farage added: “We had a political revolution on June 23, the majority of the people that voted, the high turnout, voted against what they were told by the Bank of England, the International Monetary Fund – despite all of that we had this revolution.

“The problem is with the exception of Cameron and Osborne, all of the same people are still in charge – they’ve just been moved around the chess board a little bit.”

David Cameron and George OsborneGETTY

Mr Farage claims the Remain Government remains intact apart from David Cameron and George Osborne
The former Ukip leader then voiced his concern over the Government’s credentials, adding that Britons could vote for yet more “radical change” when they take to the ballot boxes during the next general election.

He continued: “I look at America, where the revolution is complete. Trump doesn’t just win, he now appoints people from outside the world of politics to get on with running the country.

“Perhaps this is unfinished business. Perhaps, we’ll come to a general election in 2020 with more radical change needed.”

The prominent Leave campaigner also accused Mrs May of being too indecisive with Brexit, which has allowed challenges from Remainers, attempting to hold up, or even, block Britain’s EU divorce altogether.


Mr Farage said: “My concern is this: She’s been Prime Minister for basically six months and we’re having to wait on a Supreme Court decision, that will come in the middle of January and we’ve got the French aristocrat, former European commissioner Michel Barnier now dictating timetables to us.

“None of this needed to happen if she’d been decisive and declared Article 50”.

Discussing the amount of time that Britain has wasted between the historic referendum in June and the proposed date of March 31 to start formal exit negations, he declared: “I think that is far too long.

Top 50 influencers on Brexit
Fri, December 2, 2016
Brexit: Independent experts have drawn up a list of the most influential people on Brexit
PLAY SLIDESHOW

1 of 51

Theresa May - British Prime Minister
Angela Merkel - German Chancellor
Nicola Sturgeon - Scottish First Minister
Michel Barnier - Chief Brexit negotiator for the European Commission
Donald Tusk - European Council President
Francois Hollande - French President
“I don’t expect her to put on the table her negotiating strategy but I would like to see some real clarity in terms of where we are going.

“I think, frankly, at the moment there is a lack of leadership and I think because of that we’ve got the Cabinet contradicting itself every single day.

“Let’s wait and see, but if she’s as successful as Prime Minister as she was as Home Secretary we’ve got a bit of a problem.”

 

[Judgemental]

Of course age NOW has a huge bearing on the whole matter of UK governance and global relations.

Mr Trump is 70 his Cabinet has an average age of about 65. One of whom is 80.

The average age of the House of Commons is only 50 and the average age of the Cabinet is 52.

Sir Winston Churchill (our greatest and best Prime Minister) was 66 when he first became Prime Minister in 1940 and in his second term 1951 he was 77.

The average age of the House of Lords is about 70 as are the Supreme Court Judges concerning the BREXIT litigation.

Age and maturity are very important and being able to relate with to the older seniors is a matter of professional courtesy. They do not want to be dealing with young, 'whippersnappers' with whom they have no kindred spirit.

The other very interesting feature, by way of example in Mr Trump's Cabinet, they are not just millionaires they are billionaires and it can be very difficult to relate to such people, unless one has the same bank balance.

It was of course so obviously embarrassing in the way Blair exhibited he did not have the Bush wealth, or the vast 1600 acres of Prairie Chapel Ranch in Texas. Although 1600 acres is neither here nor there in the States.

 

[Judgemental]

Of course age NOW has a huge bearing on the whole matter of UK governance and global relations.

Mr Trump is 70 his Cabinet has an average age of about 65. One of whom is 80.

The average age of the House of Commons is only 50 and the average age of the Cabinet is 52.

Sir Winston Churchill (our greatest and best Prime Minister) was 66 when he first became Prime Minister in 1940 and in his second term 1951 he was 77.

The average age of the House of Lords is about 70 as are the Supreme Court Judges concerning the BREXIT litigation.

Age and maturity are very important and being able to relate with to the older seniors is a matter of professional courtesy. They do not want to be dealing with young, 'whippersnappers' with whom they have no kindred spirit.

The other very interesting feature, by way of example in Mr Trump's Cabinet, they are not just millionaires they are billionaires and it can be very difficult to relate to such people, unless one has the same bank balance.

It was of course so obviously embarrassing in the way Blair exhibited he did not have the Bush wealth, or the vast 1600 acres of Prairie Chapel Ranch in Texas. Although 1600 acres is neither here nor there in the States.

Let us not forget that we cannot hunt because of the 2004 Hunting Act, which was enacted by Tony Blair.

If Mrs May and the Conservative Party wants or needs to be reelected, she will need the support of those who hunt and wish to see the 2004 Hunting Act repealed, amongst other things.

 

[fburton]

Nigel Farage gives Theresa May ultimatum - give us hard Brexit or we'll OUST you

All I can say is... Let the oust begin!

 

[Judgemental]

All I can say is... Let the oust begin!

Mrs May is completely out of touch.

All those who voted for BREXIT (the majority) are thoroughly fed up with the way in which Mrs May won't get on with the job. She should have triggered Article 50 the day she walked into No 10.

Have a look what folk are saying so far as her pathetic New Year address is concerned.

http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/ent...-grid7|main5|dl1|sec1_lnk1&pLid=-475562976_uk

 

[popsdosh]

Mrs May is completely out of touch.

All those who voted for BREXIT (the majority) are thoroughly fed up with the way in which Mrs May won't get on with the job. She should have triggered Article 50 the day she walked into No 10.

Have a look what folk are saying so far as her pathetic New Year address is concerned.

http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/ent...-grid7|main5|dl1|sec1_lnk1&pLid=-475562976_uk

I think I have said all along there is no push from government to Brexit not even BJ wanted it they are just waiting to find an excuse to stay in as we all know there is no acceptable middle way its all out or all in still. There is no point being in the single market with no say over where its going. However I really feel that all the remainers really have to little understanding of the power in our hands ,europe need a deal more than we do as they export so much more to us even they wont want that to change.

 

[Judgemental]

http://www.express.co.uk/news/polit...raffic.outbrain&utm_campaign=traffic.outbrain

Secret Tory team planning General Election for FEBRUARY to save Brexit

A SECRET group of MPs are pushing for an early General Election to secure Brexit.

By ALIX CULBERTSON
PUBLISHED: 12:45, Sun, Dec 11, 2016 | UPDATED: 17:29, Sun, Dec 11, 2016

Plans are being put together by a secret team of Tory advisors after a surge in support for the Conservative Party.

The move depends entirely on the outcome of the Supreme Court hearing held this week in which the Government appealed a High Court decision which ruled parliamentary approval needs to be given before Article 50 can be triggered to start the process of leaving the European Union (EU).

If the 11 Supreme Court judges rule next month the Government has lost the appeal then Mrs May will call a General Election.

Theresa May electiongetty
Theresa May could call a general election in February if the Government loses the High Court appeal
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The team, which has has even been kept secret from the Cabinet, is planning for a “mandate election” in which Mrs May would be put forward as the champion of “the people versus the judges”, sources told The Mail on Sunday.

Current sentiment points towards Mrs May gaining a strong Commons majority and give her the power to quash any opposition to Brexit from the House of Lords.

 

[Judgemental]

In my Judgement if the Government gets too much of a rough ride in the House of Commons, over BREXIT, Mrs May would be well within her rights to call a General Election.

Based upon who runs the country, the Government and Parliament or a collection of unelected Judges.

On that ticket she would have a 100 seat majority.

If the stupid little girl north of the border is smart, she will shut up and accept the status quo.

 

[Alec Swan]

If you're right Jm then the cynic in me would wonder that if a General Election were called after the Parliamentary vote on Brexit, then there would be many Tories who would lose their seats. Should there be a GE before the Brexit vote, then Mrs May will be likely to be guaranteed a further 4 years in office.

Am I being too simplistic?

Alec.

 

[Judgemental]

If you're right Jm then the cynic in me would wonder that if a General Election were called after the Parliamentary vote on Brexit, then there would be many Tories who would lose their seats. Should there be a GE before the Brexit vote, then Mrs May will be likely to be guaranteed a further 4 years in office.

Am I being too simplistic?

Alec.

Alec you are right and going right back to basics to add an overworked cliche, the British people are fed up with politicians constant talking about BREXIT and all jockeying for political positions and one up-man-womenship (no sexism here).

The old adage of 'what happens in America today happens here tomorrow' could not be more relevant, because folk are already saying, to their politicians stop thinking and behaving like one and think and behave like a businessman or women.

Donald Trump's cabinet is entirely made up of highly experienced extremely well heeled businessmen and women who are non-politicians, with an average age of about 70.

If an election were called here, could we see a whole host of mature well heeled businessmen and women standing for Parliament.

(Bring back Edwina Curry age 70 all is forgiven:wink3

Whoever stands and is elected in the current climate, it would be a landslide for Mrs May who is 60. Lady Thatcher was only 54 when she became Prime Minister.

Of course Sir Winston Churchill (1874-1965) was 77 when he became Prime Minister for the second time in 1951. Nice to see he is back in the Oval Office.


This age issue and maturity is going to a play a great part especially bearing in mind the complete hash that whipper snapper Cameron made of the show.

 

[Roasted Chestnuts]

Well seeing those south of the border are ignoring the fact that you dragged us into brexit and now your 'supreme' court are not giving us a say!

Devolved parliaments arent getting any voice in how we leave the EU, bring on the next Indy ref I say as I can't see us staying in this bully boy establishment any longer. Completely alienating the people who you begged to stay as part of the union. Beggars belief. Reneging on promises made then this?!

JM don't bother with your up yourself establishment guff as I won't be reading any further had my say and I won't be bandying words with your boorish persona.

 

[ROG]

I do not get the Scotland issue and the EU

Scotland had a free vote and decided to remain part of the UK - they could always have another vote if they wanted to on that issue within the next 2 years and if the vote went the other way then they could remain in the EU ..... would make for interesting border issues !

Being that Scotland is part of the UK then they should accept the free vote result where the majority of the UK decided to leave the EU

 

[Goldenstar]

Well seeing those south of the border are ignoring the fact that you dragged us into brexit and now your 'supreme' court are not giving us a say!

Devolved parliaments arent getting any voice in how we leave the EU, bring on the next Indy ref I say as I can't see us staying in this bully boy establishment any longer. Completely alienating the people who you begged to stay as part of the union. Beggars belief. Reneging on promises made then this?!

JM don't bother with your up yourself establishment guff as I won't be reading any further had my say and I won't be bandying words with your boorish persona.

Begged you to stay !
Many many of have no wish to remain yoked to Scotland and hear the constant whinging .
I at the start of Scottish referendum was strongly pro union at the end I would have been very very happy to see the back of Scotland and those within it who think that expressing anti English sentiments is ok .
It seems that everyone has the right to self detmination except the English .We have the biggest population , sorry can't do anything about it .
Is there any reason why England should stay in the EU just because Scotland wants to .

 

[popsdosh]

Begged you to stay !
Many many of have no wish to remain yoked to Scotland and hear the constant whinging .
I at the start of Scottish referendum was strongly pro union at the end I would have been very very happy to see the back of Scotland and those within it who think that expressing anti English sentiments is ok .
It seems that everyone has the right to self detmination except the English .We have the biggest population , sorry can't do anything about it .
Is there any reason why England should stay in the EU just because Scotland wants to .

Totally agree. What Scotland forgets although maybe NS knows is if they go for independence they will just by that move remove themselves from EU membership! It is not a question of them just staying in there but to state the obvious they have never been a member. They will find it difficult to be accepted as they will not be able to fulfill the financial criteria as the EU does not need anymore lame duck states at the moment. Like I say I think NS knows this as recently her tone has changed no end and she is just trying to maintain single market access which is certainly not an option if we have to pay for it. What I find interesting is that now the EU realises we really arent going to roll over to have our tummies tickled they are starting to give ground so much so the guy dealing with the EU side has been holding talks to guarantee that europe will have access to the London financial markets .
What I think will be great to see if Scotland does go for independence again and the rest leaves the EU if the people of Scotland will accept the same levels of foreign labour as we have south of the Border! Oh and perhaps Scotland would like Corby as an overseas dependency

 

[popsdosh]

Well seeing those south of the border are ignoring the fact that you dragged us into brexit and now your 'supreme' court are not giving us a say!

Devolved parliaments arent getting any voice in how we leave the EU, bring on the next Indy ref I say as I can't see us staying in this bully boy establishment any longer. Completely alienating the people who you begged to stay as part of the union. Beggars belief. Reneging on promises made then this?!

JM don't bother with your up yourself establishment guff as I won't be reading any further had my say and I won't be bandying words with your boorish persona.

I promise you BB let the English vote in your indepedence Referendum and you will get it without doubt. The politicians wanted you to stay because they knew what was best for you!

 

[Judgemental]

Well seeing those south of the border are ignoring the fact that you dragged us into brexit and now your 'supreme' court are not giving us a say!

Devolved parliaments arent getting any voice in how we leave the EU, bring on the next Indy ref I say as I can't see us staying in this bully boy establishment any longer. Completely alienating the people who you begged to stay as part of the union. Beggars belief. Reneging on promises made then this?!

JM don't bother with your up yourself establishment guff as I won't be reading any further had my say and I won't be bandying words with your boorish persona.

I must say I am rather surprised to receive a bol...king from you on this subject, what was wrong with my suggestions, perhaps it is because I harbour a dislike for the young lady with piscatorial attributes.

Far too young for the job north of the border and needs to mature.

But then I suspect you 'enjoy' giving me a bol...king at any opportunity. Any excuse is better than none. Especially mature men who speak their mind :wink3:.

Establishment, not really.

 

[Goldenstar]

I promise you BB let the English vote in your indepedence Referendum and you will get it without doubt. The politicians wanted you to stay because they knew what was best for you!

And many are attached to the union and genuinely see the Uk as one country although why the English put up with a system that can stuff imposed on them in parliament by the votes of people who would not impose the same on their own constituents I just don't know .
So we are leaving the EU the power of England will grow within the union as we are numerically bigger ( always good in a democracy) .
Soon a polictians will come along who can exploit that to their advantage .

 

[Alec Swan]

I promise you BB let the English vote in your indepedence Referendum and you will get it without doubt. ……..

The Referendum debate on here was interesting as was the post-debate. I'm quite sure that had there been an immediate and second chance to vote, the decision would have gone the other way. Which ever way the individual Scots voted, many seemed to have had an about turn immediately afterwards! As others I was fiercely pro-union. Now, if Scotland were to be given the chance to leave, I'd bid them farewell, being sick and tired of the minority having sway. That said though, should there be a snap GE and should it be a landslide victory for the Tories, as many seem to think, then I strongly suspect that the first head to fall will be Sturgeon's.

There's no question that there's a great deal of English resentment to the reversal of the Scottish assurance that they wouldn't interfere on matters which solely concerned England, only to have that assurance broken. I suppose that it was too powerful a weapon for that dreadful woman Sturgeon to abandon.

Alec.

 

[Lizzie66]

Personally I am not so sure that a snap election is the way to go. You only need to see what happened to Zac Goldsmith. We have voted out but if Liberals and SNP stood on a "remain in the EU" ticket they could grab 40%+ of the electorate. This would be enough to return an overall majority in Westminster and effectively keep us in the EU either literally or in all but name with a "soft" exit if article 50 is already triggered. It would fly in the face of the referendum but arguably it would be the democratic choice of the people to elect MPs that belong to parties declaring themselves as pro-EU.

We need Article 50 triggering and the trade deals signing. Once this is done then there can be GE. If the boundaries have been amended then unless Labour have managed to persuade JC to step down then the probability is that Tories would get back in with a similar majority to the present, who else is there ?

 

[Alec Swan]

……..

This age issue and maturity is going to a play a great part especially bearing in mind the complete hash that whipper snapper Cameron made of the show.

Pitt the Younger was a mere 24 years of age when he was PM. It seems unthinkable now, doesn't it?

Alec.

 

[Goldenstar]

Pitt the Younger was a mere 24 years of age when he was PM. It seems unthinkable now, doesn't it?

Alec.

I used to say that Cameron was a lucky polictian and he was an odd one sort of untouched by power after TB and GB both of whom were driven to near madness IMO I found him quite refreshing .
But the EU referendum campaign may go down in history as the disastrous miscalculation in this century .
So now it's down to TM to do the deal ,this deal that shapes our future I have watched her a long time and she's another interesting one about a quarter of the way into the referendum campaign I suddenly sussed what she was up to it showed a certain ruthlessness .

 

[ycbm]

I used to say that Cameron was a lucky polictian and he was an odd one sort of untouched by power after TB and GB both of whom were driven to near madness IMO I found him quite refreshing .
But the EU referendum campaign may go down in history as the disastrous miscalculation in this century .
So now it's down to TM to do the deal ,this deal that shapes our future I have watched her a long time and she's another interesting one about a quarter of the way into the referendum campaign I suddenly sussed what she was up to it showed a certain ruthlessness .

It was clever, wasn't it? She was going to be PM whichever way the vote went.

 

[Goldenstar]

It was clever, wasn't it? She was going to be PM whichever way the vote went.

Yup she let the posh boys hang themselves then walked quietly in .

Organised quiet ruthless not bad qualities for what's coming ,which I would wish on no one .

 

[Alec Swan]

……..
But the EU referendum campaign may go down in history as the disastrous miscalculation in this century .
…….. .

Miscalculation or a calculated deception?

Alec.

edit: The latter, I'd suggest.

 

[Goldenstar]

Miscalculation or a calculated deception?

Alec.

edit: The latter, I'd suggest.

You think Cameron wanted to leave the EU and give up being PM .

 

[Fidgety]

You think Cameron wanted to leave the EU and give up being PM .

No, that's why he fell on his sword/spat out his dummy (delete as applicable) when the public called his buff and revealed his game.

 

[Alec Swan]

You think Cameron wanted to leave the EU and give up being PM .

The problem that most have, those who live in an etherial world where they are far removed from reality, is that they have no possible comprehension of the common man, and Cameron was once such person.

Alec.

 

[popsdosh]

BJs miscalculation was the biggest one! Really did he think he was a creditable Brexiteer having always been pro europe. He never expected for one minute to win the vote hence the rabbit in the headlights reaction and leaving MG trying to save face lol. His calculation was to get a a very slim margin to stay in which could then be held over europe to achieve the changes to make it more palatable to the people . A bit like NS north of the border is trying to do on independence. Dont really want it but needs the power to achieve what they want.

I still dont think its going to happen a compromise will be sorted at the eleventh hour. Whatever is said TM and team have no conviction to conclude Brexit if there was article 50 would have been started straight away before there could have been any interference of any sort.

 

[Goldenstar]

BJs miscalculation was the biggest one! Really did he think he was a creditable Brexiteer having always been pro europe. He never expected for one minute to win the vote hence the rabbit in the headlights reaction and leaving MG trying to save face lol. His calculation was to get a a very slim margin to stay in which could then be held over europe to achieve the changes to make it more palatable to the people . A bit like NS north of the border is trying to do on independence. Dont really want it but needs the power to achieve what they want.

I still dont think its going to happen a compromise will be sorted at the eleventh hour. Whatever is said TM and team have no conviction to conclude Brexit if there was article 50 would have been started straight away before there could have been any interference of any sort.

I disagree .
They needed thetime to arrange their team and make some plans .