Irish breeders without warmblood?

[ycbm]

I've got a friend looking for a good young Irish Sports horse to event who wants traditional lines without continental warmblood in the mix.

I remember somebody writing about how to identify those, but I can't remember what they said, can anyone remind me?

Does anyone know a breeder to recommend?
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[Wheels]

Look for horses described as Traditional Irish Horse or TIH or those that are just described as TB x ID

There is an association that might be able to help

 

[ycbm]

Does anyone know the name of the association?
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[ycbm]

Found it!

https://www.traditionalirishhorse.com/about/what-is-a-traditional-irish-horse/

 

[Goldenstar]

There’s a fair few about the nice ones are very pricey .

 

[Mrs. Jingle]

I've got one (She said very smugly)? But he is not and never will be for sale, he was my 70th birthday present to myself.

 

[Rowreach]

There’s a fair few about the nice ones are very pricey .

Yup and there's also a big variation in type.

 

[Rowreach]

I've got one (She said very smugly)? But he is not and never will be for sale, he was my 70th birthday present to myself.

I want to be able to more than like this post!

 

[AdorableAlice]

Quality Irish Draught and Irish Sport Horses

The above facebook page has some very nice traditionally bred types on it.

 

[Hopelessly horsey]

White lodge stud Breed some lovely RID's

 

[Xmasha]

If you look up the Facebook group Irish Draught owners and breeders , the lady who runs the page has a beautiful colt for sale . Only a weanling but would be worth the wait .

 

[sport horse]

Yup and there's also a big variation in type.

The large variation in type produced by the straight ID x TB is why many breeders moved towards continental warmbloods. I crossed one mare and stallion seven times and had everything from a 15.1 cob to a 17.3 heavyweight hunter - not one of them a true sport horse!

 

[Rowreach]

The large variation in type produced by the straight ID x TB is why many breeders moved towards continental warmbloods. I crossed one mare and stallion seven times and had everything from a 15.1 cob to a 17.3 heavyweight hunter - not one of them a true sport horse!

Introducing warmbloods to Irish breeding has, imo, been pretty disastrous for the industry and the breed.

 

[sport horse]

Introducing warmbloods to Irish breeding has, imo, been pretty disastrous for the industry and the breed.[/QUOTE

Do you not think that the warmblood has improved the breeding of show jumpers? The ID x TB had rather fallen out of fashion with modern courses? Eventers, yes I would agree with your comment. Dressage horses? Not really bred in Ireland!

 

[ycbm]

Do you not think that the warmblood has improved the breeding of show jumpers? The ID x TB had rather fallen out of fashion with modern courses? Eventers, yes I would agree with your comment. Dressage horses? Not really bred in Ireland!

I don't want to speak for Rowreach, but I suspect she may mean the way my friend feels, and I do too.

The IDx imported from Ireland was the goto horse for everyone who wanted a hunter, good riding club horse or reliable eventer for the first 20 years of my horse owning career. Then they started using warmbloods, completely losing their USP, and in the eyes of many of us also losing their rideability, temperament and soundness. And also their mass market.

The friend who is looking is competing at BE Novice at the moment and is adamant she will not buy continental warmblood breeding lines. After 4/4 of my own going wrong, I wouldn't take another warmblood unless it was free.
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[ImmyS]

I believe who I bought Finn from has TIH’s, RID’s and connies. Would certainly recommend!

 

[Rowreach]

Do you not think that the warmblood has improved the breeding of show jumpers? The ID x TB had rather fallen out of fashion with modern courses? Eventers, yes I would agree with your comment. Dressage horses? Not really bred in Ireland!

ycbm more or less answered this for me but I’d add, most of us aren’t looking for the sort of horse sought by a pro show jumper, and imo the mix of ID with continental warm blood rather highlighted the less than desirable traits of each breed.

There’s a reason why breeders of Irish horses are rowing back from using warm bloods and trying to get Irish breeding back on course.

 

[Ceifer]

I’ve got one too. Her breeder really wants me to breed from her as the lines are dying out. Just not sure I have the time for a youngster

 

[tallyho!]

Just watch out with the warmblood infusions... there are some lines with PSSM and I wouldn't want to handle a big horse with that condition.

 

[tallyho!]

I don't want to speak for Rowreach, but I suspect she may mean the way my friend feels, and I do too.

The IDx imported from Ireland was the goto horse for everyone who wanted a hunter, good riding club horse or reliable eventer for the first 20 years of my horse owning career. Then they started using warmbloods, completely losing their USP, and in the eyes of many of us also losing their rideability, temperament and soundness. And also their mass market.

The friend who is looking is competing at BE Novice at the moment and is adamant she will not buy continental warmblood breeding lines. After 4/4 of my own going wrong, I wouldn't take another warmblood unless it was free.
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Sorry I missed this post - agreed 100%.

I realise PSSM/spinal issues are still few and far between but it's out there and it's being bred from.

 

[Lyle]

I feel very fortunate to have secured two mares- to be future broodmares- who are both true RIDxTB. One is a 50%/50% and the other 75%RID/25%TB. Both beautiful examples of athletic workmanlike horses carrying substance with outstanding temperaments, excellent natural paces and wonderful jumping attitudes. Although, they are a 'look' now, compared to the WB (particularly what is seen in the dressage arena a lot now, horses pretty enough to be show hacks!) I honestly think they will be making a comeback amongst the amature market.

I think it's pretty cheeky that there are horses parading the ISH title who carry less than 12% irish blood and the rest is warmblood.

edit to fix my mathematical miscalculation

 

[GSD Woman]

Lyle, do you mean the other is 75%RID/25%TB?

 

[Lyle]

Lyle, do you mean the other is 75%RID/25%TB?

Yup, that's exactly what I meant

 

[Elno]

The friend who is looking is competing at BE Novice at the moment and is adamant she will not buy continental warmblood breeding lines. After 4/4 of my own going wrong, wouldn't take another warmblood unless it was free.
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Sorry you feel that way. A friend of mine bought an imported traditional ISH and then had to put her down at the age of 12 because of cartilage ossification. The mare was pretty, but extremely temperamental, enormous, definitely not a novice ride and had pretty bland gaites compared to a warmblood, I doubt that my friend would want another ISH.

To each his/her own I guess ?

 

[tallyho!]

I’ve seen some ISH with fab gaits the thing is they’re not all bred the same everywhere and adding wb does not guarantee good gaits either.

 

[ycbm]

Sorry you feel that way. A friend of mine bought an imported traditional ISH and then had to put her down at the age of 12 because of cartilage ossification. The mare was pretty, but extremely temperamental, enormous, definitely not a novice ride and had pretty bland gaites compared to a warmblood, I doubt that my friend would want another ISH.

To each his/her own I guess ?

Your friend is talking about one experience, all horses can go wrong. I'm talking about all 4 well bred warmbloods that I have owned and a lot more I know of owned by others, compared with a lot of IDx I have owned or known owned by others.

In the amateur market I think most people will happily lose out on the pretty paces in favour of soundness and rideability. I predict a resurgence of the "does what it says on the tin" horse market if people will breed them again.
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[Elno]

Your friend is talking about one experience, all horses can go wrong. I'm talking about all 4 well bred warmbloods that I have owned and a lot more I know of owned by others, compared with a lot of IDx I have owned or known owned by others.

In the amateur market I think most people will happily lose out on the pretty paces in favour of soundness and rideability. I predict a resurgence of the "does what it says on the tin" horse market if people will breed them again.
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Certainly. Only I'm a bit surprised since warmbloods are said to be specifically bred for high rideability and good gaits. Although I have only experience from KWPN's and SWB's because that is what we mostly have up here. Most of them I've encountered have been pretty sound, with mild temperament and high rideability. Were yours dutch perhaps? I've heard they keep and train them differently there.

 

[ycbm]

My experience is mixed of Dutch and German. If your friends' experience with her IDx was anything recent it doesn't reflect the days that people are talking about here, when the IDx was the goto amateur purchase in the UK, with a range of TB% blood depending on just how sporty you wanted the horse to be.
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[Xmasha]

I’ve been contemplating breeding my ID mare ( class one ) with a TB stallion . The problem is finding a nice Tb stallion for the amateur market . There’s plenty of choice for breeding eventers , but I’m struggling to find one that has the right brain .

the TIH from my understanding can also be an IDx Connie . I’m thinking this could be a great mix for the amateur / RC types . So it will be interesting to see how our weanling turns out . The difference between her and my homebred IDx is huge . She has more bone , shorter , and at the moment shows a greater interest in jumping . Why walk past something when you can jump it ?

 

[HopefulHorse1971]

I just looked my horse up on the Irish Sports Horse Register and she is 36.5 % thoroughbred, the rest Irish Draught and is registered under The Traditional Irish Sports Horse Category. Is she the sort described at the start of this thread. She was bred by J J O'Connor from Cork