Pictures Is she looking better... 5 months later

[be positive]

Ok, bugger it, this is me 🙈

She has a little more lift in this photo so going in the right direction, you could bend those elbows a bit more and it would make it easier for her to lighten up and move in front of you, no reason to be nervous about the photo it is looking very positive.

 

[tallyho!]

mahoganybay... are the two pics of same horse? Hope you don't mind me peering and commenting There's a lot to like in the photo you've chosen of you riding. She looks engaged and her whither lifted up between the shoulderblades and she's reaching over her topline into what looks like a soft contact from your hands (which could be a little higher and thumb on top - something we should all remind ourselves (me!)) so I can see what bepositive means there - would let her energy flow through more.
The one of your daughter riding is quite a different picture. If she too lifted her hands she would be able to use her whole shoulder/elbow better and create a more giving contact - again, a moment in time, I'm only saying what I see in the photo. Having said that, I do see many young riders riding with low hands these days, not something I can remember being taught. Just an observation on the saddle, it doesn't appear to be the same saddle but correct me if wrong... it's quite far forward on the shoulders which may be why in the photo the horse is tense in the neck. If i dropped a plumbline where your daughter is sitting, she is in the centre of balance, yet she sits on the cantle. If the saddle was an inch/two further back she would be in the middle of the saddle up to the pommel which would make a much better picture i think. Only my observations, I appreciate people see things differently and my comments are purely based on the photos

 

[Tarragon]

I must admit that I feel like I am learning a lot from posts like this where you get to see a picture and read the comments, especially ones on conformation, saddles and riding position

 

[Mahoganybay]

She has a little more lift in this photo so going in the right direction, you could bend those elbows a bit more and it would make it easier for her to lighten up and move in front of you, no reason to be nervous about the photo it is looking very positive.

Again, thank you so much for your comment, I can hear my instructors voice, ‘bend your elbows, thumbs on top’, ha ha. So I know my failings.

 

[Mahoganybay]

mahoganybay... are the two pics of same horse? Hope you don't mind me peering and commenting There's a lot to like in the photo you've chosen of you riding. She looks engaged and her whither lifted up between the shoulderblades and she's reaching over her topline into what looks like a soft contact from your hands (which could be a little higher and thumb on top - something we should all remind ourselves (me!)) so I can see what bepositive means there - would let her energy flow through more.
The one of your daughter riding is quite a different picture. If she too lifted her hands she would be able to use her whole shoulder/elbow better and create a more giving contact - again, a moment in time, I'm only saying what I see in the photo. Having said that, I do see many young riders riding with low hands these days, not something I can remember being taught. Just an observation on the saddle, it doesn't appear to be the same saddle but correct me if wrong... it's quite far forward on the shoulders which may be why in the photo the horse is tense in the neck. If i dropped a plumbline where your daughter is sitting, she is in the centre of balance, yet she sits on the cantle. If the saddle was an inch/two further back she would be in the middle of the saddle up to the pommel which would make a much better picture i think. Only my observations, I appreciate people see things differently and my comments are purely based on the photos

Hi Tallyho, yes it is the same horse and well spotted a different saddle.

The picture of me riding was when I went to view her, so the saddle is previous owners saddle which didn’t fit us both as well as the one I have now. Just need to be careful how I sit it, as I have been putting it too far forward by the look of things.

And yes, thumbs on top. I am told this often by my instructor 🙈

 

[Mahoganybay]

I must admit that I feel like I am learning a lot from posts like this where you get to see a picture and read the comments, especially ones on conformation, saddles and riding position

Me too 👍

 

[JFTDWS]

I largely agree with Tallyho! - your daughter needs to learn to carry her hands. It's quite a common fault - I've heard a lot of inventive instructors shouting at people to get their hands out of their crotch (and worse!). There's no way the contact can be correct when the hands are carried down and back - it's restrictive and breeds tension and resistance. The second photo is much more pleasing.

 

[flying_high]

Commenting on the daughter photo versus the mother photo. If you took the horse away the daughter would not land on her feet in balance, but tip backwards as she is in a chair seat. The mother looks more balanced and like might stay on feet.

 

[Tiddlypom]

There must be a school of instructors who are actively teaching low pinned hands with rigid elbows. It is so common to see riders doing it these days, but so incorrect. Have the trainers somehow come through the BHS system believing this is how their students should ride?

 

[MotherOfChickens]

There must be a school of instructors who are actively teaching low pinned hands with rigid elbows. It is so common to see riders doing it these days, but so incorrect. Have the trainers somehow come through the BHS system believing this is how their students should ride?

its been taught since the 80s by all sorts wanting to 'get the horse on the bit/in an outline' as far as I've seen. low hands is a problem I have myself although I could care less about out lines or horses on bits these days-I think I just have lazy arms!

 

[JFTDWS]

its been taught since the 80s by all sorts wanting to 'get the horse on the bit/in an outline' as far as I've seen. low hands is a problem I have myself although I could care less about out lines or horses on bits these days-I think I just have lazy arms!

I don't think low hands with a loose rein are the end of the world. I do most of my hacking that way because I too have very lazy arms When you take up a contact, however, it's a crime against humanity.

 

[MotherOfChickens]

I don't think low hands with a loose rein are the end of the world. I do most of my hacking that way because I too have very lazy arms When you take up a contact, however, it's a crime against humanity.

ha yes, if I hold two reins at the same time its a miracle, one is generally resting f

or me (when I used to do real riding) it was tension, and when I wasn't riding for hours every day I suspect it was down to tension +- lack of core fitness and a truly independent seat.

 

[tallyho!]

I know secretly all we really want is to be Ricky riding Champion through the mountains with Rebel running alongside us....

 

[splashgirl45]

I know secretly all we really want is to be Ricky riding Champion through the mountains with Rebel running alongside us....

me too, i loved champion but fury the black horse was my favourite.....lovely thinking back to my childhood!!!

 

[JFTDWS]

I feel like the last two posts have slipped into a parallel universe I'm not a part of... Who's Ricky?

 

[poiuytrewq]

A few things to add. Negative dap? I took to mean negative cap (typo?) as in people say “I’ve got my happy hat on today” or my concentration cap?
I may be totally wrong 😂
Secondly, this is why I hate riding in front of people! 😳

 

[Casey76]

A few things to add. Negative dap? I took to mean negative cap (typo?) as in people say “I’ve got my happy hat on today” or my concentration cap?
I may be totally wrong 😂
Secondly, this is why I hate riding in front of people! 😳

DAP is when the hind leg is moving in advance or behind the movement of the front legs, so in trot you end up with one foot on the ground and three in the air - which is incorrect in trot (you can see in the photo below that the inside hind is on the floor, while the others are in the air)

 

[poiuytrewq]

Oh! I didn’t even realise it was in relation to the horses way of moving! Maybe I need to go back and re-read that! I’m surprised no one else knew that either!

 

[poiuytrewq]

Ohh yep sorry!
Backing out of this one quietly whilst feeling v sorry for the poor op!!

 

[LegOn]

In fairness its a massive debate at the moment about correctness of gaits etc - sure Valegros canter wasnt correct & it a World/European/Olpymic champion!!!

http://www.centaurbiomechanics.co.u...co-uk/_img/Horse and Hound Canter Article.pdf

 

[MotherOfChickens]

I feel like the last two posts have slipped into a parallel universe I'm not a part of... Who's Ricky?

gods, you young people Champion The Wonder Horse, although a program made well before my time, was a staple of Saturday morning TV when I was wee. young kid called Ricky galloping everywhere bareback on Champion (his horse, a 'wild' mustang) and with Rebel, his GSD-having adventures, saving people etc etc. cracking good theme tune too

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Adventures_of_Champion_(TV_series)

 

[Cortez]

There must be a school of instructors who are actively teaching low pinned hands with rigid elbows. It is so common to see riders doing it these days, but so incorrect. Have the trainers somehow come through the BHS system believing this is how their students should ride?

Ha ha, yes - I call it the "English" riding style, and it is AWFUL and deeply incorrect. To recap: there should be a straight line from the bit to your elbow, and another straight line from your ear through your shoulder, hip and heel. Your hands should be at least 4" above and in front of the pommel. ALL the horses in the photos in this post are very on the forehand, all the riders are either slumped in a chair seat or pivoting forwards over their knee and riding with a broken line through their reins - effectively pulling down on their horse's mouths and jaws and making it impossible for the horses to use their bodies/legs/footfall properly.

What are the instructors doing???

 

[flying_high]

Ha ha, yes - I call it the "English" riding style, and it is AWFUL and deeply incorrect. To recap: there should be a straight line from the bit to your elbow, and another straight line from your ear through your shoulder, hip and heel. Your hands should be at least 4" above and in front of the pommel. ALL the horses in the photos in this post are very on the forehand, all the riders are either slumped in a chair seat or pivoting forwards over their knee and riding with a broken line through their reins - effectively pulling down on their horse's mouths and jaws and making it impossible for the horses to use their bodies/legs/footfall properly.

What are the instructors doing???

Are the hands four inches above the pommel in your profile picture?

 

[Cortez]

Yes, I would imagine so (I didn't have a ruler on me at the time...). I think there's a straight line from elbow to bit too...

 

[DiNozzo]

There must be a school of instructors who are actively teaching low pinned hands with rigid elbows. It is so common to see riders doing it these days, but so incorrect. Have the trainers somehow come through the BHS system believing this is how their students should ride?

I think part of it comes from children learning to rise and being allowed to let go of the saddle/neck strap too early and not having the balance or correct strength to keep their hands still, so they are encouraged to push their hands down towards the horses neck to save the ponies mouths.

 

[be positive]

I think part of it comes from children learning to rise and being allowed to let go of the saddle/neck strap too early and not having the balance or correct strength to keep their hands still, so they are encouraged to push their hands down towards the horses neck to save the ponies mouths.

I think it is that they are so often taught to ride in a group, sometimes without even a leader, holding the reins too early trying to "steer" when they cannot really manage it in walk let alone trot so have to keep hands down to help with balance, the same goes for adults not just children, not enough RS lunge or even do private lessons until the rider is established in all paces.

I am currently teaching two children who are struggling with the concept of carrying their hands because when they first learnt the instructor kept telling them to keep the hands down, we had a conversation about it this week and they now have a better understanding of why I keep telling them to lift the hands and bend the elbows but instinct is still keeping them lower that I want.
Looking up is another thing often missed out during the basics and hard to change once the rider has learnt to fixate on the neck in front of them.

 

[Cortez]

Just WHY do instructors keep telling riders to keep their hands down? I had my very first lessons in the UK (more than 50 years ago), and I can remember being told to keep my hands down constantly. Why? What's the purpose? It's just plain wrong!

 

[Leo Walker]

Just WHY do instructors keep telling riders to keep their hands down? I had my very first lessons in the UK (more than 50 years ago), and I can remember being told to keep my hands down constantly. Why? What's the purpose? It's just plain wrong!

Becuase beginners use the reins for balance and with that tends to come the excessive lifting of the hands.

 

[Tarragon]

What about the school of thought about holding hands high and wide?
https://goo.gl/images/Guqyvy
I tried to post the photo but it said it was too large so I am hoping this link works

 

[Tarragon]