it was only a matter of time..

I feel very sorry for all concerned. I particularly feel for Jessika who is obviously not very old, is absolutely devastated, didn't stop to think as carefully as a more wordly-wise person might have, is worried that her mare may have been responsible and even though she doesn't really know what happened feels as responsible as most of us would do in a similar situation, even though the pony's owner doesn't hold her responsible. YO is obviously more realistic/knowledgeable about horses than some posters on this thread.
This is the best reason for having horses 'barefoot' that I can think of. A shod hoof will do much more damage than one which is unshod. Horses do not weigh up the extra force delivered by a shod hoof when kicking.
Incidentally, I know someone whose horse was alone in her field when she broke her shoulder. No-one knows how it happened, there was certainly no other horse involved but the mare had to be pts. Accidents happen. I also know someone whose pony kicked out when a passerby was feeding over the gate, the fieldmate's leg was broken. IMO the one responsible was the passerby, because this is normal horse behaviour.
 
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If it was only a matter of time and you are having so many issues and it is genuinely evil then I would have it shot personally as no matter what if it is potentially putting other peoples horses in danger its not fair on them.


I would be screwing if it was my horse that had been kicked and would be taking legal action and using most of what you have written about her on here as evidence.
 
chrisritch said:
I would be screwing if it was my horse that had been kicked and would be taking legal action and using most of what you have written about her on here as evidence.
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And if it was your horse you would be the yard owner knowing the full history and putting it in a herd with your own. I'd be more wary of YOs judgement than JGs and try reading the thread.
 
chrisritch said:
If it was only a matter of time and you are having so many issues and it is genuinely evil then I would have it shot personally as no matter what if it is potentially putting other peoples horses in danger its not fair on them.
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Nothing the OP has ever written about this horse indicates a need to have it shot.


I would be screwing if it was my horse that had been kicked and would be taking legal action and using most of what you have written about her on here as evidence.
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You may want to read the whole thread.
 
JG, just quickly ficked back a few threads. Noted that she'd had worms when you got her, then foal after. If bad worms, could there have been damage done there? Any route worth considering with your vet.
Also if ulcers, which was suggested a lot in previous thread, and hay is chucked in field and it eases pain, it's no wonder she'd be agressive over it?

I'd be trying with her still, but no longer in a herd until diagnosed.
 
PandorasJar said:
Also if ulcers, which was suggested a lot in previous thread, and hay is chucked in field and it eases pain, it's no wonder she'd be aggressive over it?
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Yes, that would always cause a problem.

Basic rule of thumb is two more piles of hay than horses, and always well spread out.

I am beginning to wonder how much of a management problem this could be - rather than an issue with the mare herself???
 
amymay said:
I am beginning to wonder how much of a management problem this could be - rather than an issue with the mare herself???
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I was wondering this and spent some time yesterday going back through the posts, including plenty of photos, it makes interesting reading and viewing, the little mare has had many issues along the way. The OP has tried to the best of her probably limited experience to address them but there are a few incidents that will not have helped along the way, riding the mare with a young foal at foot would not have been helpful, she has had a lot of advice on here, scoping for ulcers, getting a pro to assess her ridden behaviour being just 2 suggestions which seem to have been ignored so far.

Most "problem" horses are man made and in order to find the root of those problems the owner needs to have a plan of attack, eliminate all possible physical reasons and get experienced advice with behavioural issues, a forum can only do so much.
 
Let me get this straight, there were more than 2 horses in that field? And because Ginger has a nasty streak, you all immediately assume it was her that dealt the fatal kick? No camera, no proof. Could have been the other horse, maybe high jinks lead to the accident?
I know a horse that met a similar fate, though the mare that dealt it, was a known kicker. She was left stood at the gate with a serious open fracture to the hock. Do I blame the mare? To an extent, yes, but that's not going to bring that horse back is it? In that case, there were witnesses, and in hindsight, from what people tell me, it could have been avoided, the horses were hungry, and stood at the gate.
But there are two sides to every story, and it's difficult to collaborate when nobody saw what happened. There's nothing worse than pointing the finger of blame without seeing the wider picture.
Ginger, might be better off on her own, it's not the end of the world, as long as she can have physical contact with another horse over a fence, then she's not really alone, and her 'friend' can choose whether they want contact with her or not.
Jessica, it's not your fault, the Yo knows this, hence why she's accepted this in this manner. Just don't let anyone dictate to you how you should manage your horse from here, you do what you feel is best for her, and if it means her going solo, and is happy with that, then at least you know you've done what you can. Only you can make 'that' decision.. and, if you still feel there is some hope of getting your gentle mare back, don't give up XX
 
This is so sad, I feel for the OP. What a horrible situation. If the YO had had any real concerns about the temperament of Ginger then I'm sure she would have raised them and not turned Ginger out with her own ponies. I know we don't know the YO personally but the YO knows Ginger far better than anyone on this forum and she knew of the behaviour but did not feel it was necessary to separate Ginger based on it.

I agree that if the horse was showing unpredictable behaviour beforehand she should maybe have been separated - hindsight is 20/20 and all that. But if someone came on here with a horse who was kept alone and showing the behaviour the OP described, whether the advice would have been to give her company or to continue to keep her alone.

Whether or not this could be avoided will never be known but as others have pointed out, even the most halfhearted kick, if well(?) placed, can do devastating damage and in all likelihood it was just a tragic accident.
 
Shadeyoak said:
Just don't let anyone dictate to you how you should manage your horse from here, you do what you feel is best for her, and if it means her going solo, and is happy with that, then at least you know you've done what you can. Only you can make 'that' decision.. and, if you still feel there is some hope of getting your gentle mare back, don't give up XX
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Actually it's not just down to JG. Insurance wise and morally, the owners of any future horse turned out with her also have a right to know her history. I have had mine out with ones which have kicked before, however there is one I'd not have out with in a million years. Owner claims horse is lovely... I beg to differ when a horse has taken out several gates and fences - anyone who has a horse out with another has the right to know of any previous behaviour which may endanger their horse, not have it swept under carpet
 
amymay said:
Yes, that would always cause a problem.

Basic rule of thumb is two more piles of hay than horses, and always well spread out.

I am beginning to wonder how much of a management problem this could be - rather than an issue with the mare herself???
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I do this for all... however if she is in pain, would an extra pile or two be enough? I should imagine however many piles she may guard it.

I've had one in the past who winter feeding with the others was a nightmare briefly as she'd spend a whole day chasing one off all the piles and never letting herself or the other eat - in her case it was hitting 3/4 and testing boundaries. Separating lowest in pecking order from highest and trying to boss the lowest about and generally being a pain. Thankfully herd leader got fed up pretty soon after it started!
 
I have asked twice whether this horse will now be turned out on her own, and the OP has not replied. So I take this to mean that she is still turned out with at least one other. I find this very concerning.
 
PandorasJar said:
I do this for all... however if she is in pain, would an extra pile or two be enough? I should imagine however many piles she may guard it.

I've had one in the past who winter feeding with the others was a nightmare briefly as she'd spend a whole day chasing one off all the piles and never letting herself or the other eat - in her case it was hitting 3/4 and testing boundaries. Separating lowest in pecking order from highest and trying to boss the lowest about and generally being a pain. Thankfully herd leader got fed up pretty soon after it started!
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Really valid points. And I suspect if a horse is that food aggressive, then you're absolutely right then it wouldn't matter how many piles of hay.
 
It might not be ginger or the other pony in the field, it's not unheard of for horses to break a leg themselves in the field and like someone has said it would have to be well aimed and with great force.
Individual turnout is probably a good idea as some horses to get anxious when turned out with others due to their own personal issues.
 
i really dont think this is fair really. It isnt the OP's fault and she said she feels really bad about the situation, some people on here just make things worse with whats been said. I really doubt she needs bashing over the head when this has just happened, cant people see she feels bad enough?
 
In the op it was made out to be that it was def the op horse that had made the fatal blow. It was only further on in the thread that another horse was also in the feild. It could of been either or none if it was not witnessed.
Even so the op had past threads stating her concern for other horses safety therefore the only option to prevent something like this ( not saying it was your horse this time) would be to turn out alone.
Not just for horses but for people entering the feild as op states in another post she has threatened to kick out at people.

I had one of my own old horses on individual turnout for the same reason I was lucky I had a good yard owner who accomadated it as its not always so easy.

I do hope you get your horse sorted op it's easy for us to judge and hindsight is a wonderful thing
 
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