Loaner causing trouble!

[_GG_]

Thank you guys for the comments and reassuarance I did the right thing.

We do have a written contract, it is the BHS one. The notice is I think 30 days, but I think it's a case of moving him now.
I like to see the good in people and give them a second chance but I don't think it is worth it here.

Will be going to get him tomorrow to bring him home! I have the address that was given when we started the loan but heard through the grapevine that she has moved in with this boyfriend of hers so not sure where that is.

I think with the BHS contract you, as the owner have the right to remove the horse without notice if it's care is not being met. I did with Teasle many many years ago. The daughter was distraught but many clauses in the contract were being broken. They tried to take us to court....the court wouldn't hear it and they were told in no uncertain terms that I, as the owner, had every right to ensure my horses welfare.

If you are a BHS gold member, call the free helpline. Really though, I would get the horse home ASAP and then ask for the tack back. If it wasn't given back, I'd have a chat to the neighbourhood police officer and see if they could have a chat with her. Police have a tendency to think that tack is irrelevant but it is not...if it was a flatscreen tv or vehicle, they would be on it...it should be no different for other types of property xx

 

[Meowy Catkin]

What a close call. Wow. So glad that you've got him safely home.

Some people and their skewed sense of what's right and wrong are just shocking. Does anyone remember the case on AL where the loaner hid the horse from the owner and got other people to help hide him? IIRC he was finally found being hidden by an equine dentist. Lord knows what the loaner said to persuade others to hide the horse like that.

 

[ticobay831]

OMG thank god you've got him back, there are some horrible nasty people out there, hiope everything goes well for, its a night mare...

 

[Tiddlypom]

Blimey, OP, thank goodness you were all on the ball with this nutter. I would log this incident with the police asap, so that it is in the system. Hope you get all his tack etc back, too.

For general info for others reading this thread, here are two relevant parts of the BHS loan contract template. Using it can't prevent a nutter from loaning your horse, but it makes it easier to sort things out if it all goes wrong compared to having just a verbal agreement.

2 TERMINATION
2.1 The loan will terminate in the following circumstances:
2.1.1 either party giving [insert number] days notice in writing to the other; or
2.1.2 if either party is in breach of any of the terms of this agreement, unless the breach is remedied within [30] days of it taking place; or
2.1.3 at the end of the Period without the need for any further notice
2.1.4 If the Horse does not fit the description given by the Owner or is not fit for the purpose required by the Borrower as set out in clause 3.3 overleaf
2.1.5 On the death of the Horse
2.2 On termination the Borrower shall be responsible for returning the Horse to the Owner.


6 EQUIPMENT
6.1 The Horse is loaned with items of equipment as set out in Schedule 3 to this agreement.
6.2 Such tack and equipment is and remains the property of the Owner and will be returned to the Owner at the end of the Period, or earlier if terminated in the same condition so far as possible, subject to fair wear and tear.
6.3 In the event of loss, damage or the item wearing out then a replacement item of the same or similar quality and value if purchased new should be provided by the Borrower on return.
6.4 All items purchased by the Borrower during the period of the loan not by way of replacement shall remain the property of the Borrower.







.

 

[hotair]

wow really glad you managed to get him home before she managed to take him! it really is terrorfying some of the stories you read on loans going wrong

 

[mandwhy]

OMG how scary, glad you took action quickly and the staff were on hand to help, I think you gave her plenty of chances and when you are an owner you should remove the horse as soon as you start to feel uncomfortable, thank god you did!

Hope you get the tack back and don't hear from her again, what a weirdo.

 

[Dizzle]

I honestly don't understand people some times, what on earth did she think she was doing?!

Glad he's home safe and well and such a shame that once again people are giving loaning a bad name.

 

[Tnavas]

WEll done on getting out safe and sound - I hope you get your tack back too.

Do let us know

 

[TheEquineOak]

I have both loaned horses and loaned my pride and joy out - thankfully successfully!!!

I would not have been as polite as you or some of the other posters here.

The police cannot do anything until a crime has been commited and even then, equine theft/equipment theft has vertually fallen off their agenda!

If I had been on a yard when someone had tried to collect my horse in the manner she has she would not have been able to sit down for a week.

Grab some friends, knock on her door and get your stuff back.

Good luck

 

[misskk88]

I am so angry for you OP! My jaw drops once again at the cheek of some people!

I do not understand what makes loaners think they have a given right to the horse- it is your horse, and ultimately you can choose to terminate the contract at any point (regardless whether it is for a reason, or simply because you want the horse back).

If she doesn't hand over tack, remind her of the signed agreement (I assume you listed what tack was handed over in the contract?), if so, politely explain you will be taking it to a solicitor/the police to either 1, get your property back, or 2, claim the value of it.

Glad horse is safe and sound

 

[niagaraduval]

I can't believe what i've just read.. do people like that really exist ?

I think I would be arrested if I ever came face to face with someone who was trying to steal my horse.

I'm glad it all ended ok and I hope you get your tack back soon.

 

[AmieeT]

Good grief. Just read all of this, glad your boy is safe with you now!!!

I would never dream of doig anything like this to Reds owners!!!

Ax

 

[JulesRules]

Thank goodness you got him back okay..

If you do have to take her to court over the tack I don't think she will have a leg to stand on. She broke the terms of her contract and you took the horse back. End of...

 

[diamonddogs]

In the unlikely event of you getting your tack back, I'd get it all professionally checked over in case she's attacked it in some way which might not be obvious from a cursory glance, and if any damage IS found, get it in writing.

Then, if she's damaged any of your items, you've got her in breach of contract again.

Could prove an expensive scam for her in the long run!

 

[pip6]

Good for you. Also worth passing around word of mouth to owners you know in case she tries to take another one on loan. Keep your eyes on second hand sales sites to see if she tries to flog your tack.

 

[Luce85]

Thank you everyone.

I am so happy to have him home and he doesn't seem too stressed out bless him! Must of confused him but at least he came home, god knows where she would have taken him at that time at night?!

No sign of her so far with my tack, I have informed the police who weren't much good but noted it anyway, as I am wary of her turning up to the yard all guns blazing.

In the contract, all tack was accounted for and she signed with her mom as witness, so hopefully I can use that in my favour in getting it back! I wouldn't mind but when he has an albion jump and dressage saddle and a JW bridle, I'm not to keen on giving that up!

Diamonddogs - good idea on getting it checked once/if it is back, wouldn't have thought of her doing any damage!
It does give loaners a bad name, shame as I know so many lovely people who loan, but there are always a few who just don't seem to understand the commitment horses bring!

 

[southerncomfort]

I would send her a letter via Recorded Delivery giving her 7 days to return all the tack or you'll have not choice but to take it to Court.

Very glad you have your boy home. What a close call!

 

[pixie]

any luck with your tack?

 

[_GG_]

I would send her a letter via Recorded Delivery giving her 7 days to return all the tack or you'll have not choice but to take it to Court.

Very glad you have your boy home. What a close call!

This^^^ but with the addition that you have set side the funds to cover any recovery procedures...that will hopefully reiterate that it is not an empty threat.

I am so glad you have him back home now. Sounds like it was quite an eventful night. I'm rather glad she wasted the cost of trailer hire

 

[Honey08]

I would send her a letter via Recorded Delivery giving her 7 days to return all the tack or you'll have not choice but to take it to Court.

Very glad you have your boy home. What a close call!

I would be doing this, but it would be a solicitor's letter followed up with a trip to the small claims court. No more giving her chances, she had one and hasn't arrived with the tack - chance over..

This girl abused your horse, abused your sister's business and made solid plans to steal your horse. GET CHASING HER! Start some legal procedures, scare her. Don't let the selfish, spoilt little madam continue with this game.

 

[milesjess]

Glad you have him back.

 

[EmmasMummy]

Glad you have him back...I dont get why she suddenly wanted him after not bothering with him!

Fingers crossed you get your tack back. Do they have security markings? I would keep an eye out locally and on EBAY to make sure she doesn't do something as underhand as try to sell them!

 

[Luce85]

Sorry to bring this back up, asking for advice.

No response in getting my tack back, been checking all sorts of websites to make sure she isnt trying to flog it!

What is the best way to get it back? Try the police again or just send her a recorded letter? Annoying me now! Also I want her to pay the outstanding livery to my sister, don't think it is fair I should pay it, sister isn't massively bothered but I don't want her and her grooms to be out of pocket.

 

[Honey08]

As I said before, I would spend the money on a solicitor's letter and threat of court, for both tack and unpaid livery. And go to the small claims court if not. I wouldn't let her get away with it, keep hassling her.

You said her mother signed something. Do you know her address?

 

[Loubidy]

We had an issue a year or so ago where my mum sold someone my old saddle for £300 but the woman never came with the money (small island community so felt could trust her to come with it) eventually after mum dropped note after note to her house she sent a letter by recorded delivery requesting payment or she would get solicitors involved if payment wasn't delivered by said date. Day after said date a cheque arrived.

 

[MagicMelon]

As I said before, I would spend the money on a solicitor's letter and threat of court, for both tack and unpaid livery. And go to the small claims court if not. I wouldn't let her get away with it, keep hassling her.

You said her mother signed something. Do you know her address?

This. If you don't have her address, I wonder if your solicitor is allowed to call her and basically say what he'd have said in a letter (threatening court action if she doesn't return it immediately since she has effectively stolen it). Or you could text her (since she wont answer the phone?) and tell her you'll report her as stealing the tack if she doesn't give it back in the next 2 days? Its unbelievable she thinks she can just keep it.

 

[Illusion100]

What a SCUMBAG!

Very relieved you got a happy ending and not the alternative one that disgraceful lowlife had planned.

Girl sounds vindictive and spiteful then things not going their way. I second getting a solicitor to write a letter or call her asap and threaten her with Court. If she doesn't hand tack etc back sharpish, Small Claims Court.

It's the least she deserves after neglecting your horse then trying to steal him.

 

[noodle_]

gawd scary - thank god you have him back


i personally had a good loaner - just a shame it ended how it did, BUT i will never loan out again - id rather sell- too stressful - there are good loaners out there but this obviously isnt one.... poor you OP


id send a letter recorded - ASAP threaten her with a solicitor if no tack appears in 7 days....

 

[MiJodsR2BlinkinTite]

OP I am SO glad you've got your horse back.......... that is the main thing anyway.

Tho' if I was in your situation I'd take a wee look at your yard security and update if necessary, just to be sure, and to set your own mind at rest. For e.g. you can get quite cheap-n-cheerful alarm systems at B & Q plus fake cameras that look like they're real, but aren't, ditto a "box" that you put up on the wall which looks like a proper alarm, but isn't in fact. They do a reasonable Bulls!t job of convincing the punters that you have security in place. Plus it might be worth bunging on a padlock & chain around the place.

Re. your tack. I'd straightaway report this to the police and get a crime number - and THEN write a stiff letter to the madam who's got your tack saying words to the effect that the matter has been reported to the police and a crime number issued and that she is committing a criminal offence for which she may be liable for a conviction of theft if she continues to keep your property in her possession; and that as well as reporting to the police you will pursue recovery of your property to the small claims court. You could also tell her that as she is in arrears of her livery at the yard in question you will also be asking the YO to provide her with an itemised receipt of ALL costs incurred by her at the yard and that if these fees are not paid for in full then you will add these on to your costs when you take the outstanding claim against her to small claims court.


Re. the livery fees, you have a complication in that a member of your family is involved; which creates an obvious difficulty.

I put my boy out on loan three years ago. The stooopid numpty girl that had him let his sweet itch get badly out of hand the first weekend he was there; plus only five weeks into the loan she decided she "couldn't afford it" and I was left in a similar position to OP with outstanding livery fees which the YO then expected me to cover! All very difficult, but I brought my boy home ASAP and we literally built a stable around him!!! But I'm so glad I did that, in retrospect.

The loan agreement I drew up, based on the BHS one but adapted: entitled me as owner to take back the horse "at any time with immediate effect" if there was any concern as to its welfare and/or the livery fees were not being paid, plus certain other conditions. Very necessary in any loan agreement - thank goodness OP that you've got your lovely horse back coz otherwise it could have ended up anywhere.

Lets hope you get your tack back: have you got any photos of your tack which you could use to ID it?? Is it security-marked???

 

[Luce85]

Tack is security marked, well both the saddles are I think.

Have drafted out a letter and rang BHS gold member thingy to see what they say. They've been very helpful actually! I'm sending it to the address on the contract, but not sure if she is living there or with her boyfriend, not sure if her mom would open the letter?

We have tried ringing a few times but no answer, but it rings on a withheld number, so I think she is avoiding the calls, but we have left a message warning her on the tack and outstanding livery payments.

I wish she would just give it back so we can all move on, Buzz is very happy to be home though, so that is the main thing!