London International horse show

daffy44 said:
I've never enjoyed watching it, even when I worked with sjers, I've never seen the appeal, and nothing has ever changed my mind on it.
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I guess it speaks volumes that the top riders don’t do it. It is just a novelty class, but that also means the general standard of riding is lower.
Most shows don’t run this kind of class, it’s probably a tradition that LIHS needs to break away from
 
Ive watched the Puissance live at HOYS multiple times and loved it. I don't remember seeing this level of stress - though to be fair it was mainly the Chestnut. But maybe I just didn't recognise stress? I would never let my kids enter Chase me Charlie because of the 'keep asking more and more till they fail' format. I guess I assumed thast Puissance horses are older, very experienced and can cope metnally. But perhaps I am kidding myself. I do think some Puissance horses really do take it in their stride though. Perhaps riders should be more choosy about what horses to enter. And having huge scope is not enough without the brain to go with it.
 
Ample Prosecco said:
Ive watched the Puissance live at HOYS multiple times and loved it. I don't remember seeing this level of stress - though to be fair it was mainly the Chestnut. But maybe I just didn't recognise stress? I would never let my kids enter Chase me Charlie because of the 'keep asking more and more till they fail' format. I guess I assumed thast Puissance horses are older, very experienced and can cope metnally. But perhaps I am kidding myself. I do think some Puissance horses really do take it in their stride though. Perhaps riders should be more choosy about what horses to enter. And having huge scope is not enough without the brain to go with it.
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I worke with sjers as a teenager, so a long time ago! And even then I thought almost all puissance horses were stressed out of their minds, people say only the crazy horses jump the puissance, well, thats wrong in itself. I think the puissance horse that copes mentally and physically is a rare one, Rachel's horse tonight is probably one of them.
 
Kadastorm said:
No it was the guy who slapped his horse on the neck 3 times that retired.

This chestnut is bonkers. Obviously a lot of talent but is he really enjoying it? But then saying that, Ladina B used to come down to the wall leaping and bucking and she was a brilliant puissance horse.

Rachel Proudley is a class though.
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I expect it wouldn't be quite so bonkers if it received some correct schooling...
 
AWinter said:
I've had to turn it off, I can't listen to the ridiculous justifications for clear stress behaviour in the horses. Horse napping is just "too excited about jumping the wall", the chestnut horse was really horrible to watch, hanging his entire upper body off his mouth the entire round. Then we're still calling smacking your horse repeatedly with a whip "a bit of encouragement", is this trying to keep their social license to operate? Do they think people are stupid?

I used to love watching Olympia so much at Christmas, but I just can't stomach all of this anymore.

Its interesting how our views change.
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Oh seriously it was a couple of taps to say up yr game and pick yr legs up.
Hardly a beating leaving marks. 🙄
 
Cragrat said:
I would really like to nkow why Rachel's horse objected so much to hind fetlock boots. I REALLY hope he wasn't expecting pinch boots, or even worse :(
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TBF, I can absolutely guarantee my homebred horse has never known any discomfort from hind boots, but when he’s pumped up on adrenaline it’s not that safe to put his on either. So I wouldn’t necessarily assume evil from action
 
Did anybody else think Oliver Fletcher's horse looked very uncomfortable? Trantering until they got going and then a very stuffy 4-beat canter.
 
TheMule said:
TBF, I can absolutely guarantee my homebred horse has never known any discomfort from hind boots, but when he’s pumped up on adrenaline it’s not that safe to put his on either. So I wouldn’t necessarily assume evil from action
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I have to say my daughters much missed little pony used to be similarly fired up at a show, even before she had jumped a fence. You had to full tack and boot her up in the trailer or you had no chance.
 
Caski said:
I'm intrigued by his comment about a 'nice big bridle', obviously a naff way of saying that the poor horse had a mouthful of metal and was strapped down .....
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I really miss,Stevens Hadley's commentary - he said interesting, informative stuff and he didn't waffle. The arena commentators last night were so desperate to fill air time they were talking utter rubbish and repeating word for word what the other said.
 
MurphysMinder said:
I have to say my daughters much missed little pony used to be similarly fired up at a show, even before she had jumped a fence. You had to full tack and boot her up in the trailer or you had no chance.
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I saw the part where someone was holding the horse's front leg while another person put on his hind boot and thought "I'm glad I don't have to go to such extremes to get my lot booted up at competitions". Though to TBF, none of mine (I'm including the ones I compete but don't own) wear hind boots unless going cross country. But all three girls are remarkably relaxed when out and about and will happily stand all day tied to the lorry munching hay. I still don't think I'd want anyone messing around with their hind legs while I was mounted in the warm up arena.
I know someone who nearly got kicked in the face removing hind boots at a competition, she later did get kicked in the face by the same horse (hers) while readjusting the straps on his rug at a competition and ended up in hospital having bits of bone removed from her brain. She is ok now, but it does highlight the dangers and I'm happy to put safety first in cases like the one shown last night. Even if ideally you would do your best to train calm even in such environments, it can't be easy to recreate a LIHS like environment for training purposes.
 
I used to love being allowed to stay up late and watch the Christmas show. I finally went about 7 years ago and found the whole thing a bit of a circus. I couldn’t really differentiate between the trick rider displays and the Grand Prix showjumping. ‘ Look what we can get our horses to do’’
I tried to watch last night. I already had a bitter taste in my mouth about CDJ return and the MASSIVE elephant in the room. I’ve never been able to enjoy dressage and I can’t stand how she’s right back up in high esteem as though nothing happened.

I switched off half way through the Puissance. Who cares whose horse can jump the highest. It was an uncomfortable watch.

I used to enjoy horse sport but now I’ve become enlightened. Was I naive to assume it was about the love of the animal, the partnership and an appreciation of what horses do for us. Now it feels like a lot of these horses are little more than sporting equipment and their treatment and training is just a means to an end. Cynical, I know
 
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My horse can be exactly like Andrew’s chestnut to jump, it literally could be him in a different colour! Yes it’s terrifying, no it’s not my ideal! In his defence mine had hunted and I think was just used to galloping at hedges and thinks all jumps should be approached that way. We’ve spent a long time training him out of it and to jump a calm round, I have no idea how he gets that horse round a course but maybe it’s not as bad as it was in the puissance, I might look up some of his rounds out of sheer curiosity.

I didn’t think he rode it too bad, it didn’t look to have a lot of metalwork in its mouth to be fair and seemed quirky as hell and one he’d learned to ‘manage’. The long reins may have just been what they found worked for that horse as he seemed to be using his weight and seat a lot rather than the traditional SJ way of having them on a tight rein and up and in front of you. Mine will just get stronger if you try and hold him like that and does the same ploughing down on his forehand a tanking. He also does the same pinning his head to his chest and gaping his mouth and I assure you I’m not ragging him by his mouth, he does it in a basic snaffle with a normal contact and is just his go-to for trying to tank off.

I don’t think the horse looked terribly happy though or wants to be doing the job, he reminds me so much of my boy, very talented but very anxious and running on adrenaline and people had overlooked that for a long time because he could jump impressive fences and go clear.
 
Just caught up on this thread. I recorded the RB last night as I have a habit of falling asleep in front of the TV in the evenings (!) and I intended to watch last night this afternoon (I don't mind spoilers).

Having read what went on last night I have no intention of watching my recording and will delete it later. I have no desire to watch/support horses stressed out of their minds, nor watch repeated replays of falls.

I agree with the posters above that think that the Puissance has had its day now and should be 'retired'. I also loved it back in the day when some riders used it as a warm up for later classes and retired after the first 2 rounds and riders who continued felt they had a horse that would be OK to continue.

The overall shame of what happened is that it must all be 'within the current SJ rules' and no rider is likely to be sanctioned for overfacing or poor riding. Alongside the recent modification to the 'blood rules' this is just the FEI closing its eyes and ears to social license issues.

As for the crowd cheering... That has happened since times long past (Roman gladiators for example). Humanity never ceases to disappoint.

I intend to watch the dressage just to see how the crowd reacts to CDJ's reappearance and to see BM. I doubt that even if there is some attempt at negative feedback to CDJ from some of the crowd that it will be shown.
 
reynold said:
Just caught up on this thread. I recorded the RB last night as I have a habit of falling asleep in front of the TV in the evenings (!) and I intended to watch last night this afternoon (I don't mind spoilers).

Having read what went on last night I have no intention of watching my recording and will delete it later. I have no desire to watch/support horses stressed out of their minds, nor watch repeated replays of falls.

I agree with the posters above that think that the Puissance has had its day now and should be 'retired'. I also loved it back in the day when some riders used it as a warm up for later classes and retired after the first 2 rounds and riders who continued felt they had a horse that would be OK to continue.

The overall shame of what happened is that it must all be 'within the current SJ rules' and no rider is likely to be sanctioned for overfacing or poor riding. Alongside the recent modification to the 'blood rules' this is just the FEI closing its eyes and ears to social license issues.

As for the crowd cheering... That has happened since times long past (Roman gladiators for example). Humanity never ceases to disappoint.

I intend to watch the dressage just to see how the crowd reacts to CDJ's reappearance and to see BM. I doubt that even if there is some attempt at negative feedback to CDJ from some of the crowd that it will be shown.
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What would sanctioning for over facing look like? I don’t think that really applied to any riders last night.

I wasn’t bothered by the hind boot assistance, I’d rather everyone be safe
 
Hardly any negative comments re the Puissance on Horse and Hound FB page. Instead much enjoyment of the thrilling spectacle from those who value thrills over equine welfare 🙄.

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Are they pulling the negative comments?

I’m not watching any of the LHIS coverage. I’ve long despised the SJ and I now also despise dressage which was my own discipline in my competing days.

Racing’s been off my view list for a long while after too many deaths on screen which only leaves me watching eventing, albeit with mixed feelings. I used to be glued to it all.
 
I've just watched a few of Shanaclough Luichew's other rounds and he actually jumps a very nice round over a normal course. Andrew always rides him on a long rein and actually usually has very little contact on his mouth, so I think he's one of those they have just learned doesn't like much contact. Andrew said in a H&H interview after LIHS that he always loses his mind a bit in puissance as they think the wall intimidates him and he knows what's coming. I think that's a bit sad, the horse is obviously anxious in that case and doesn't enjoy it. Nice horse though and very talented.
 
I did watch the Chestnut horse through my fingers last night I must admit but I do feel we're seeing a bit of overreaction from some posters.

I have mixed feelings about the Puissance myself but have nothing but admiration for the horses who take it on so bravel and enthusiastically.

I didn't see a horse fall so must have missed that one.

I really dislike the modern habit of condeming an entire discipline because of the actions of some individuals.
I'm not a particular fan of SJ personally but am happy to watch and can only dream of being able to see a stride with such pinpoint accuracy as the top riders.

I feel some people who own horses are going down the road of "all competition is bad" which I don't think is the way we should approach it. We compete/have competed horses and ponies, for many years, across a few disciplines and I can honestly say our competition animals are altogether happier horses when they are in full work and out competing than they are rin etirement.
 
KikiDee said:
I've just watched a few of Shanaclough Luichew's other rounds and he actually jumps a very nice round over a normal course. Andrew always rides him on a long rein and actually usually has very little contact on his mouth, so I think he's one of those they have just learned doesn't like much contact. Andrew said in a H&H interview after LIHS that he always loses his mind a bit in puissance as they think the wall intimidates him and he knows what's coming. I think that's a bit sad, the horse is obviously anxious in that case and doesn't enjoy it. Nice horse though and very talented.
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Thanks for finding and watching them
 
ester said:
Thanks for finding and watching them
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I was curious how one earth you ride that round a whole course! But they actually jump a very nice round. Horse appears to be in a snaffle and Andrew really rides off his seat and leg and stays off his mouth, it's actually nice to see a horse ridden from the leg and he rides it into most fences on a completely soft rein.
 
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