Needing some thoughts on youngster

tda said:
I haven't commented on this but please just don't forget this is a rising 5 native pony, they don't all just take it well at first. I would probably have someone just hacking him out a couple of times a week and see how he is in a few months time. Don't throw the baby out with the bathwater
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I was going to say similiar.

Natives are slower to mature mentally I found and my NF definitely needed a bit longer to settle into 'work'. He seems bold but he is sensitive, has his quirks and just needed time to come round to it all. I do think forest breds are a bit different to stud bred too.

The upside is, taking it slowly (we did a lot of groundwork) has meant we developed a fabulous relationship and he's still going strong at 21- he's now the most fun ridden partner and the hard work and doubts were totally worth it.

He sounds similiar to your guy and I will say, some of his most exaperating traits as a 5 year old have become his biggest strength over time.

Have you tried NLP to work on your mindset with him? That can be a game changer.
 
I really just don't know if I'm doing the right thing. I think it's because my emotions come into play and make me doubt things, it makes me feel sick at the thought of him going. But what if I'm always scared and what if he always feeds off it? What if we genuinely can't work through this?

I've had an enquiry for him, someone who has a child under 10 to do pony club with next year but the mother will bring him on before then and I just don't bloody know. They still want to see him after my full honest explanation.
 
Okay, I must admit, I did try him in a Kimblewick with a loose chain on a wim just to see how he went and long reined him around the school.

He went amazing, despite a couple of silly moments of being excited for a split second and wanting to shoot forwards before coming to the realisation that he couldn't go anywhere, he went so nicely. Did me some good running around too! 🤣 It is a small school but still! We did full laps in trot without any protests or issues and practiced some good stopping and standing.

He's so much more forward long reining than lunging so it's easier in that respect and he seems to enjoy it.

He wasn't chewing the bit constantly either or throwing his head about.

I do feel that I might actually stand a chance at controlling him if I face the spinning area with this bit but I'm enjoying doing stuff in a "safe zone".
 
GrassChop said:
Okay, I must admit, I did try him in a Kimblewick with a loose chain on a wim just to see how he went and long reined him around the school.

He went amazing, despite a couple of silly moments of being excited for a split second and wanting to shoot forwards before coming to the realisation that he couldn't go anywhere, he went so nicely. Did me some good running around too! 🤣 It is a small school but still! We did full laps in trot without any protests or issues and practiced some good stopping and standing.

He's so much more forward long reining than lunging so it's easier in that respect and he seems to enjoy it.

He wasn't chewing the bit constantly either or throwing his head about.

I do feel that I might actually stand a chance at controlling him if I face the spinning area with this bit but I'm enjoying doing stuff in a "safe zone".
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I would never hesitate to try a Pelham/kimblewick , not for power but lots of ponies actually prefer a straight bit
 
I can’t even tell you how difficult (and lame at one point) and just difficult with EVERYTHING my Boggle was. Actually he wasn’t that difficult I was just woefully underskilled for a horse as clever and hot as him. I got semi professional help, he got a job, and he became my absolute soulmate.

I too was not bonded to him for a year or so. I even had my instructor tell me he was not for me- he’d always be too sharp!
 
Michen said:
I can’t even tell you how difficult (and lame at one point) and just difficult with EVERYTHING my Boggle was. Actually he wasn’t that difficult I was just woefully underskilled for a horse as clever and hot as him. I got semi professional help, he got a job, and he became my absolute soulmate.

I too was not bonded to him for a year or so. I even had my instructor tell me he was not for me- he’d always be too sharp!
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I remember your early days! He was very hot - i still remembered the connies of my youth (chunky, cheeky but sane) & wondering what on earth you'd bought 😜
 
If you’re doubting yourself this much would it be worth sending him off to your trainer for backing and see what he’s like when he gets back? I know if you decide you do want to sell him it may feel like a waste but it would also make him more sellable if that’s what you wanted to do.
It may be that he just needs someone to get him past this sticky point and you might not see this side of him again. And you can always keep up with the pro coming a few times a week after until you know he is over it.

There’s no right or wrong answer but just putting that option out there as it sounds like you’re struggling with the decision to sell. But it’s only an option as long as it doesn’t put strain on you financially. If you still decided to sell afterwards you wouldn’t likely recoup that cost but it would set him up well for the future.
 
If he seemed to go well in the kimblewick why don't you try doing a small amount of groundwork with him in that bit every day in the arena? And then gradually move on to groundwork outside of the arena once he finds it super boring and there's no excitement? If he was so good to start with them it sounds like something happened that made you both lose confidence and then its just spiralled. It sounds like you don't really want to sell him, and although there's absolutely no shame in deciding a horse is not the one for you, your replies sound quite sad at the thought of him going! Hope it all works out for you
 
Just incase it needed saying - you don't have to sell him. Even if it's the most logical thing to do on paper, if your heart says otherwise then don't do it. There's nothing stopping you selling him in the future if you change your mind, but if you do sell him and regret it then there's not a lot you can do about it.

I think the overwhelming response to sell him on here is more around the fact you didn't seem to be getting much pleasure from owning him - and the reassurance that it's ok to give up and move on if you feel that's the right thing to do.

If you want to stick with it and are getting small glimmers of hope, there's no harm in giving it a bit longer. You're not the first person that's gone through absolute hell with a youngster. The horse that turned into my absolute horse of a lifetime was horrendous at 6, I put him up for sale 3 times but whenever anyone came to view him I felt that sick feeling in the pit of my stomach and couldn't bear the thought of watching him loaded up onto a lorry and driven off.
 
Michen said:
I can’t even tell you how difficult (and lame at one point) and just difficult with EVERYTHING my Boggle was. Actually he wasn’t that difficult I was just woefully underskilled for a horse as clever and hot as him. I got semi professional help, he got a job, and he became my absolute soulmate.

I too was not bonded to him for a year or so. I even had my instructor tell me he was not for me- he’d always be too sharp!
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That does give me a lot of hope and I know how much Bog meant to you. I'm usually quite a hopeful person in general but I worry that I blindside myself sometimes thinking something might work out when it really won't.
 
welshieseb said:
If he seemed to go well in the kimblewick why don't you try doing a small amount of groundwork with him in that bit every day in the arena? And then gradually move on to groundwork outside of the arena once he finds it super boring and there's no excitement? If he was so good to start with them it sounds like something happened that made you both lose confidence and then its just spiralled. It sounds like you don't really want to sell him, and although there's absolutely no shame in deciding a horse is not the one for you, your replies sound quite sad at the thought of him going! Hope it all works out for you
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Thinking back to the first time he span and took off, he had stopped to stare at something in the distance that seemingly wasn't visible to the human eye. I pulled him up after he'd taken off and got off him when it happened but I did turn him round to go the same way in hand so he didn't run away from it all together. He was really heightened though and it was a struggle to calm him down so I don't know if it was a combination of things. It also didn't help that I lost my nerve completely and practically had a meltdown because he was scaring me because he'd gotten so worked up. That might have been when things broke between us?
 
KikiDee said:
Just incase it needed saying - you don't have to sell him. Even if it's the most logical thing to do on paper, if your heart says otherwise then don't do it. There's nothing stopping you selling him in the future if you change your mind, but if you do sell him and regret it then there's not a lot you can do about it.

I think the overwhelming response to sell him on here is more around the fact you didn't seem to be getting much pleasure from owning him - and the reassurance that it's ok to give up and move on if you feel that's the right thing to do.

If you want to stick with it and are getting small glimmers of hope, there's no harm in giving it a bit longer. You're not the first person that's gone through absolute hell with a youngster. The horse that turned into my absolute horse of a lifetime was horrendous at 6, I put him up for sale 3 times but whenever anyone came to view him I felt that sick feeling in the pit of my stomach and couldn't bear the thought of watching him loaded up onto a lorry and driven off.
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That's exactly how I feel, the thought of potentially never seeing him again, I keep imagining myself running after the lorry begging them to stop and that I can't go through with it!

There will still be the question that he will still be too small for me but I am really hoping he will fill out more.
 
Okay so a little update...

I went up earlier and popped the kimblewick on with the long reins, same set up as yesterday in the school but I braved it and headed for the track and the "danger zone". It's a little windy so could have potentially been a stupid idea but I know wind doesn't usually bother him.

My god, he was SO good. He didn't nap, protest or strop once! The first section coming off the yard we normally have a little bit of a protest and a nap but nothing, headed on along the track and even though I was nervous when we got to that section, I made sure I didn't change how I was holding the long reins or how I was speaking and I approached it differently this time. I wasn't firm and telling him to get on like last time, I didn't apply any pressure, I just told him how much of a good boy he was and that it was okay. We had no hesitation at all 🥹 and to make it an extra good experience, I stopped to let him take a quick mouthful of grass before carrying on.

Then we did a loop somewhere around the end and headed back, he was jogging at points but not pulling and did go back to walk when asked. Got to that section again and just nothing at all happened. I was also making sure this time I was stood out to the side too, still at the back but so he could just about see me and I reassured him again telling him I was there and it was okay. We plodded back along the track, despite having horses running over and along the fence line trying to nip his bum, he did shoot off at one point for a split second but that was purely my fault for trying to wave them away but he didn't go anywhere and stopped instantly.

I finished it off with a lap on each rein in trot around the school which he seems to enjoy and a great big banana as a treat when we tied back up.

Not sure if it made any difference but I didn't tie him up with a haynet this time and gave him a handful of chaff in his bucket just in case maybe he was wanting to rush back for food or thinking the quicker we were done, the quicker he got fed. I thought maybe if he thinks he's been fed, he might be more content, who knows!

Not going to kid myself that we probably will have incidents again but I'm bloody proud of him and over the moon with how it went.

...

Also, is there any way I can attach the lunge lines to the Kimblewick better? The slots are too small so the clips sit rigid. It still works but just don't like how they sit.
 
Such a great update. I will admit that I have been quietly hoping for the last couple of pages that you would take the suggestion to get a behaviourist or similar out to work with you and him, because it seemed fairly clear that you were really still very emotionally invested in this pony.

As a side note, it is also worth remembering that horses use movement as a displacement activity a lot. When they get a knot in their brain it is quite normal for them to use some kind of spontaneous movement to deal with it. Particularly when they are young, lacking in resilience, and haven't developed any other coping strategies yet. In natives, the whip round or shoot forwards thing is a very common expression of that. It really isn't the end of the world as long as you can develop the confidence to see it for what it is and find ways of communicating with him to move him through it.
 
New Forests Rock said:
Delighted to read this update. Well done both of you 🎉
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Thank you! 🥰
DabDab said:
Such a great update. I will admit that I have been quietly hoping for the last couple of pages that you would take the suggestion to get a behaviourist or similar out to work with you and him, because it seemed fairly clear that you were really still very emotionally invested in this pony.

As a side note, it is also worth remembering that horses use movement as a displacement activity a lot. When they get a knot in their brain it is quite normal for them to use some kind of spontaneous movement to deal with it. Particularly when they are young, lacking in resilience, and haven't developed any other coping strategies yet. In natives, the whip round or shoot forwards thing is a very common expression of that. It really isn't the end of the world as long as you can develop the confidence to see it for what it is and find ways of communicating with him to move him through it.
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Oh thank you 🥹 I am, he was my first baby and was going to be my next forever horse. I just feel like I can't give up, I still have so much hope that we've got this.

That's a really nice way to put it actually and helps me because I can understand it better when it's put in that way.

I hugely appreciate people advising me on both sides because I can't deny that there definitely are some pretty good reasons to move him on but there are also good reasons to keep going. Everyone has made good points and I see it from both perspective. It's maybe a bit of a head over heart thing, my heart usually wins though!

He was giving me the proper strop face because I wouldn't let him go to the grass on the way back to his field and I just cuddled his whole head and told him to stop being a little grump. 🤣I need to understand him better and actually for the first time in a while, I'm enjoying the process the last three days has shown us. I know we will come across more teething issues but if I'm confident and it doesn't make me nervous, we will be okay and I hope that what we are doing will get me to that stage anyway. We are building our relationship, keeping things low key and just trying to have fun at the same time for now and it's been really nice just taking things down a notch.

When I think about it too, he is still only 4, albeit by a couple of months but that's still very young and he's only been doing this for a month.

Now to find his own little kimblewick, ideally cheaply!....
 
GrassChop said:
Also, is there any way I can attach the lunge lines to the Kimblewick better? The slots are too small so the clips sit rigid. It still works but just don't like how they sit.
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i have various types/sizes of carabiner around the place and they have lots of uses. There must be one that would do the job of connecting lunge line to bit.
 
GrassChop said:
Thank you! 🥰

Oh thank you 🥹 I am, he was my first baby and was going to be my next forever horse. I just feel like I can't give up, I still have so much hope that we've got this.

That's a really nice way to put it actually and helps me because I can understand it better when it's put in that way.

I hugely appreciate people advising me on both sides because I can't deny that there definitely are some pretty good reasons to move him on but there are also good reasons to keep going. Everyone has made good points and I see it from both perspective. It's maybe a bit of a head over heart thing, my heart usually wins though!

He was giving me the proper strop face because I wouldn't let him go to the grass on the way back to his field and I just cuddled his whole head and told him to stop being a little grump. 🤣I need to understand him better and actually for the first time in a while, I'm enjoying the process the last three days has shown us. I know we will come across more teething issues but if I'm confident and it doesn't make me nervous, we will be okay and I hope that what we are doing will get me to that stage anyway. We are building our relationship, keeping things low key and just trying to have fun at the same time for now and it's been really nice just taking things down a notch.

When I think about it too, he is still only 4, albeit by a couple of months but that's still very young and he's only been doing this for a month.

Now to find his own little kimblewick, ideally cheaply!....
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I'm selling a bunch of bits from the RDA if you're interested. There's at least two kimbkewicks
.... Can't remember sizes off the top of my head though

*Shameless plug* 😂😂😂
 
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