No winter turnout??

All of you who are quick to codemn the keeping of horses with no winter turnout, I wonder how many of you would actually put your money where you mouth was if you were suddenly unable to turnout and you couldn't find a yard that could provide winter turnout.
Would you decide to sell your horses?
I doubt it :mad:

It's really annoyed me how some of you have the nerve to codemn those of us who's horses don't have access to turnout 24/7.
I've been on yards with winter turnout, although they are few and far between in my area. The fields tended to become bare and very muddy in a short time. The horses looked wet and miserable a lot of the time, just hanging round the gate waiting to come in or squabbling amongst themselves.

The yard I'm on now has great facilities, but unfortunately no winter turnout into the fields. Over winter we can turnout in an outdoor arena daily, or an indoor one if it's not being used for riding..so our horses do get to socialise in small groups

One of my horses has just gone out after being on 6 months boxrest, perhaps I should just have had him PTS to save him from the trauma of an 'un-natural' environment! :mad:
 
I would never keep my horses at a yard with no turnout.

And yes, I have run a yard with awful clay soil and the fields were horrific every winter, but every spring, with harrowing and rolling the fields came back absolutely fine.

Mine are turfed out every day through rain, freezing conditions, snow etc and I wouldn't have it any other way.
 
Overdramatic, GingerCat.

I wouldn't have my horse PTS because there was no winter turnout, nobody is saying so, but I wouldn't ever be on your yard. Nor would I sell, I would move.
 
GingerCat said:
All of you who are quick to codemn the keeping of horses with no winter turnout, I wonder how many of you would actually put your money where you mouth was if you were suddenly unable to turnout and you couldn't find a yard that could provide winter turnout.
Would you decide to sell your horses?
I doubt it :mad:

It's really annoyed me how some of you have the nerve to codemn those of us who's horses don't have access to turnout 24/7.
I've been on yards with winter turnout, although they are few and far between in my area. The fields tended to become bare and very muddy in a short time. The horses looked wet and miserable a lot of the time, just hanging round the gate waiting to come in or squabbling amongst themselves.

The yard I'm on now has great facilities, but unfortunately no winter turnout into the fields. Over winter we can turnout in an outdoor arena daily, or an indoor one if it's not being used for riding..so our horses do get to socialise in small groups

One of my horses has just gone out after being on 6 months boxrest, perhaps I should just have had him PTS to save him from the trauma of an 'un-natural' environment! :mad:
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Crikey, very dramatic.

I certainly wasn't condeming anyone. For me, no winter turnout is unacceptable. If my yard were to stop winter turnout, I'd move. I wouldn't have to sell as there are plenty of yards around here that offer all year turnout.

If a horse is on boxrest, that is for a reason generally medical and in the best interests of the horse.

If your horses are happy and you are with no winter turnout, that's great. But for my mare, she would turn pyscho without turnout so it isn't an option I would consider.
 
9tails said:
I wouldn't ever be on your yard. Nor would I sell, I would move.
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But what if there wasn't a yard within a 30-40 mile radius with winter turnout. Would you do an 80 mile round trip to see your horse every day?

Not ideal I know, and I would LOVE winter turnout, but I have tried to find the best solution in that they have somewhere to go out in winter (a sand paddock or the indoor school). Other than that, I can't afford to travel that far every day. I already do a 30 mile round trip. Sometimes we just have to live with what we've got :(
 
I can understand wanting to keep the grazing good. Our fields cope well with the horses going out . We use the barrow for the fields instead of tractor to save churning it and gate ways fair up better than you would expect.

We turn out every day except xmas day ( to enable me to go to my parents for lunch in East Anglia )
New Years day so we can have an easy day.

Apart from that we keep them in a max of 3 other times ( last year was only the 2 main days ) . To enable rugs to dry and horses to get away from rain. And we choose a week where it rains 24 7 we choose say the Wed.

More often than not horses stay in a max of 4 days a year.

We do part livery and DIY assisted only . Our fields always gets rested to recover and are well maintained in spring to enable good recovery from the winter. Our fields cope with horses going out from 7am to 3pm turn out . I think that's fair enough.

That said sometimes I go to back yard and all horses hanging round the gate at 1pm ( if ****** weather) so I take feeds out and bring them in.



BorgRae said:
But what if there wasn't a yard within a 30-40 mile radius with winter turnout. Would you do an 80 mile round trip to see your horse every day?

:(
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I used to do over 50 miles round trip every day to see my horse . My friend did morning trip and I did eve so only had to do it 1 x a day.I lived in London horse was in Wexham as no facilities in London where I lived. I would rather travel further and have good Facilities, than have them on doorstep and nothing
 
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Enfys said:
If I had to Board my horses now I wouldn't even consider a yard where there was compulsory stabling,

.
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...and that would be because I cannot be bothered to muck out and clock watch anymore (my horses fit around my life, not me around theirs) not because I had to keep them in.

I know very many horses (and I have had a couple myself) that are complete couch potatoes and were perfectly content to stay in, one used to flatly refuse to leave his stall if it was raining.

I wouldn't ever condemn a yard that had turnout restrictions, at the end of the day, it is the horse owners choice whether to be there or not. If you aren't happy, and your horse isn't happy, then vote with your feet and go someplace else.

Sometimes, I read all sorts of complaints on here and feel like saying "Well, hey! How about you doing it then?" Moans about prices, forage, fencing, facilities blah, blah, blah really annoy me...what is sometimes forgotten is all the work that goes into maintaining a property, machinery (I have just paid $2000 for equipment that will benefit owners and horses) the sheer cost of fencing, power, rates, insurance etc. On the whole, the majority of YO's do care and try their best, very many Owners are lovely too, but life isn't perfect and compromises often have to be made.
 
GingerCat said:
So if you couldn't find a yard that didn't offer turnout, you wouldn't keep horses then?
Not dramatic...bloody annoyed! Some of you lot are so sanctimonius
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If I absolutely could not find a yard with winter turnout, then yes, I would not have horses.

However, I cannot imagine not being able to find a single place where your horse can have some field time in winter.

I have kept mine at yards 40 minutes from home, in the opposite direction to work... I have kept them at a farm with zero facilities and not been able to ride from November- March because there was no school or lights.

If there is a will, there is a way and if you want your horse to have winter turnout you can find it- but you may have to give up other advantages in it's place.

You may also have to look outside the box and ask around at farms etc instead of 'yards', you may have to widen your location criteria more than you want, but I think if you wanted it enough, you could find a place with winter turnout.

I don't think it makes me sanctimonious at all- just that I place turnout at the very top of my priority list when looking at yards.

I understand not everyone feels that strongly about winter turnout and that's fine- but the OP asked for opinions and I gave mine :)
 
I think no turnout at all is intolerable. However, I also think that muddy fields are not a healthy environment for horses, either in terms of them suffering mudfever and discomfort, or in terms of the danger these fields pose to horses. I have a special all weather turnout arena (separate to the riding arena) where horses go out whenever the fields are deemed unsafe. However, they only go out for around 4 hours a day in the middle of winter, with haylage nets. Both horses and owners seem very happy with this arrangement.
 
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It wasn't until I was looking to buy a horse and visiting lots of different yards that I realised how many people keep there horses in all winter. Unacceptable in my opinion.

I remember one yard (which was running a SJ competition when I arrived) that had about 20 wooden boxes round the back and no turnout. The horses were being deep littered on straw which was just gross and one poor pony couldn't even see over his door. Then there was another which had no turnout at all (even in summer) and the owners wondered why the horse was getting too hot to handle:rolleyes:

Any how - I bought my horse in spring and kept it at a lovely yard which had 24/7 summer turnout, then as soon as the clocks changed the all year turnout soon turned out to be..... as long as it wasn't raining, then as long as it wasn't raining and until 11 a.m only, then as long as my horse didn't run around! What a joke!

So I soon moved and we now have all year turnout, the only condition being that they have to come in overnight from end of Nov to beginning May - not the prettiest of yards but fab!
 
Yes rolling and harrowing does bring back a clay field - if you can rest that field all summer. Thats what we do now. Our 3 go out on one two acre field (mudrash permitting) or an area that is hardstanding grassed over in winter, and then that is rested all summer for the next winter and the horses go onto another field. When we had DIYs, we needed more winter turnout, and it took more recovering, plus the summer fields got wrecked too, as we had some very wet summers, so gradually the fields declined. That was with 6 horses on 20 acres. Our main hayfield that we had to sacrifice to livery grazing has only just come back to being good enough for hay two years after the liveries left.

It all costs money, which when you have to do it more often, overtakes what you make from any DIYs, so I can understand why people limit it.
 
Syrah said:
Why is it sanctimonius to state that no winter turnout is unacceptable?
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Merely because it's so easy to codemn this way of keeping horses when you have other options..not everyone has that choice.
Several posters have stated that they wouldn't accept this....So I ask again, would they then give up their horses if they couldn't have winter turnout? Moving yards not being an option.
 
I think round here the only ones who don't turn horses out are mega posh places where their horses are worth zillions and don't want injuries. counting from the top of my head 6 yards within 1 mile from me all do turnout how ever long I wouldn't know.

I guess our soil is good drainage and recovers well .

I haven't boarded since 1996 the only place where I have ever not seen any horses turned out is at ****** equestrian centre as they had no grazing due to their location. They did how ever in the end rent 2 acres from a house an a few horses from riding school had an odd week theri but 80% did not go their and liveries didn't.
 
In all honesty, I don't think people should open livery yards if they don't have enough space to enable horses to have access to turnout all year round. Surely it's about having enough space for the amount of horses you intend to have (ie not being greedy and taking on far too many horses because of the £££s you have coming in but actually don't have the turnout space for them!).

We have our own field which i know we are very lucky to have but we bought it many years ago (couldn't afford to buy it now!) but there are a couple of neighbouring livery yards, one small DIY and one much larger yard that is a mix of DIY and part/full livery. The larger yard is just run by a farmer and his wife (with the help of a few of the clients I guess) and they turnout ALL year round. The wife is up and stupid o'clock in the morning mucking out, feeding and turning out. I think the horses all go out from about 7am although they will come in before it's dark in the winter (so before 3pm). They seem to be able to do fine rotating the fields, putting various livestock on the paddocks as well and they also make their own hay and haylage etc. It's a big farm but not HUGE compared to some but it is very well managed.

The DIY yard is run by those who have their own horses their - I'd say a good 10 to 15 horses, possibly about 8 acres or so and yet they too get T/O all throughout the year and their paddocks are in a decent state.

I think it's very depressing to keep a horse in a 12 x 12 stable for months withit's only exercise being on a horsewalker, in an arena or being ridden. I just don't agree with it. Of course there are instances where a horse may NEED to be kept in a stable for a sustained period but I can't believe anyone thinks it's OK for this to be standard. A horse needs freedom, it needs to interact with other horses and well, be allowed to be a horse! God, i can't think of anything more mind-numbingly boring that going round and round in circles on a horsewalker. I would never put my horse on one of those - I'd get my lazy a*se in gear and take it for a blooming walk if that's all it could do!
 
GingerCat said:
Merely because it's so easy to codemn this way of keeping horses when you have other options..not everyone has that choice.
Several posters have stated that they wouldn't accept this....So I ask again, would they then give up their horses if they couldn't have winter turnout? Moving yards not being an option.
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Yes I would. I would make sure she went to a home capable of giving her the turnout she needs.

Also I wouldn't buy a horse if I couldn't have all year turnout.

I understand that some don't have a choice with turnout and it's their choice to accept that. It's my choice not to accept it.

I would consider limited winter turnout, a few hours a day, but no winter turnout is not acceptable.
 
Honey08 said:
I hate horses being in too, but its very easy to condemn yards for over population and bad management, and unless you have run a yard you can't really comment. Its also easy to say that fields wouldn't churn up when you are on good draining soil - if you are on clay, like us, you are basically living in the bottom of a big pond! Its also easy to say that gates and fields should have hardcore/concrete paths - try getting it past the planning dept round here...
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We have clay soils, you could make pots out of what we dig up in our garden but we still get winter turnout.
 
Syrah said:
Yes I would. I would make sure she went to a home capable of giving her the turnout she needs.

Also I wouldn't buy a horse if I couldn't have all year turnout.

I understand that some don't have a choice with turnout and it's their choice to accept that. It's my choice not to accept it..
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Gingercat, I thought we were having a reasoned conversation, obviously not.

It's what I would do, like it or not.

Your last reply was extremely childish.
 
Fortunately, this barbaric practice is not common place near me (East Kent). I own a yard and I insist all horses go out each day (I, infact asked someone to leave the yard because their horse only went out 'on a Monday'). The only time they may not go out in to their proper fields is if the land is completely water logged (it happened about 10 days in total last winter). Even then we have a 'trash paddock' and a school.

I am sorry, but speaking from a livery owners point of view, if you can't offer any form of winter turnout, then the land isn't being managed very well. I have turned away about 20 horses this year for grass livery, yes I could have taken them on in the spring/summer, but I know that come the winter, there won't be enough grazing and everyone will suffer. Yes, I had to say goodbye to the extra pennies, but IMO it is worth it to maintain good winter grazing.

I don't understand why the RSPCA/BHS etc. don't insist on some sort of turnout. One of the RSPCA's 'five freedoms' is freedoms to express natural behaviour. Well this isn't going to happen in a 12 x 12 (or smaller!) box...or with individual turnout (but that is for another rant!!).

If someone kept a dog in a cage 24/7, only letting it out every other day for 20 minutes, leaving it to stand in it's own excrement all day and all night long, i'm sure the RSPCA would have something to say. but it's ok for horses as they're in 'a stable'.... ahhh I see!
 
GingerCat said:
Merely because it's so easy to codemn this way of keeping horses when you have other options..not everyone has that choice.
Several posters have stated that they wouldn't accept this....So I ask again, would they then give up their horses if they couldn't have winter turnout? Moving yards not being an option.
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YES. I did seriously consider selling mine. I felt that if I couldn't provide an acceptable environment to keep them mentally well and healthy, I wouldn't keep them. I had a friend with grazing a 100 miles away and considered sending them there for the winter, but finally found them 5 acres and built stables, put in water and electric fencing. 3 months later, the owner thought it was so wonderful that she bought 2 horses and repeatedly left the field gates open, so we moved.
Back the next winter to very restricted turnout, I and other owners, would spend every available hour at the yard getting the horses out. We simply had no life.
So again, left great facilities to go to grass livery (with stables) but only a grass school for summer use.
Yes, I would love an all year school and all the facilities I left behind, but, for me, the freedom for mine to move, graze and socialise and breathe fresh air is a priority.
 
GingerCat said:
Merely because it's so easy to codemn this way of keeping horses when you have other options..not everyone has that choice.
Several posters have stated that they wouldn't accept this....So I ask again, would they then give up their horses if they couldn't have winter turnout? Moving yards not being an option.
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But surely, if you were considering buying a horse do you not look in to what yards are available in your area first and what facilities they had? Surely you would, it'd be very stupid to buy a horse and not know where you're intending on keeping it first?!

I wouldn't buy a horse if their was nowhere near me where I could keep it and it be allowed T/O. I'd look at other options if all livery yards were that cr*p - like approaching farmers and other landowners with the possibility of renting someland myself!

However, I still don't get why anyone would open a livery yard of that was going to be their policy. I don't see how anyone can feel it's acceptable. mind you, I guess some people just see a horse as a machine or commodity and don't see it as a living, breathing animal!
 
ladyt25 said:
In all honesty, I don't think people should open livery yards if they don't have enough space to enable horses to have access to turnout all year round. Surely it's about having enough space for the amount of horses you intend to have (ie not being greedy and taking on far too many horses because of the £££s you have coming in but actually don't have the turnout space for them!).
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I don't understand why the RSPCA/BHS etc. don't insist on some sort of turnout
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Well in that case what do you think of Kingston Riding Centre they are in London have no turn out but they have Richmond park on the door step!!
http://www.kingstonridingcentre.com/


What about Stag Lodge they also have No turn out
http://www.ridinginlondon.com/
I used to work there and no turn out but 15 steps you had the whole of Richmond Park.


What about Wimbledon Village

http://www.wvstables.com/ they have no turnout
What I am saying is sometimes its not about greed or too many horses when horses are cannot be turned out.


We actually stable more horses than the ground should cope with .

But we
a.) can get 250 bales of hay ( if we choose )
b) horses are turned out all but a max of 5 days a year. we spend £ 1000 on the land in the way of feeding it and caring for it , and the land repays us in feeding our horses.
 
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I looked at yards in my area when I got my boy, knowing full well he would go bonkers if kept in a stable for too long...so needed turnout. They all had restrictions in winter, or could not commit to letting me know the situation for tunout in winter or had lush ex-cow pastures...all totally un-suitable for my lad.
So I knocked on doors, begged and pleaded and managed to rent a field from a farmer down the road from me where I can do what I want with it, when I want.
I have absolutely no facilities other than a mobile stable I paid for myself...no mains water, no electricity, no riding area in winter as we are straight out onto roads, no lights, no drying area, no concrete yard...nothing. But my lad is out every single day of the year on well managed grazing with no mud at all and freedom to wander about and graze for 12 hours a day come rain, hail, 4 foot snow or anything else the weather throws at us. He is happy, I am happy and that suits us...even though I put more work and money of my own into the field in order to manage the lack of facilities.
No turnout at any time other than for injury just is not an option for my horse.
 
My horses rarely get turned out over winter through YO choice not mine. I have tried other yards and they are just not as happy there.

I will not be moving yards again because my horses are happy, healthy and fit were they are.

God you lot would hate the yard I used to work on were our broodies and babies were brought in our winter and kept in pens together and put on the horsewalker twice a day.
 
I am in Essex and we have horrible clay! We have 24/7 turnout all summer, and out for the day, in at night for the winter. Our fields are not rotated, but seem to cope really well. The gateways get a bit boggy in the winter, but as they start to dry out, are rolled and recover well.

We are not allowed to put hay in the fields, not sure if this has any impact or not.

Last winter, when we had weeks of constant rain, I did choose to only turn mine out every other day, but that is because the horses didn't want to be out in it.
 
Leviathan said:
Well in that case what do you think of Kingston Riding Centre they are in London have no turn out but they have Richmond park on the door step!!
http://www.kingstonridingcentre.com/


What about Stag Lodge they also have No turn out
http://www.ridinginlondon.com/
I used to work there and no turn out but 15 steps you had the whole of Richmond Park.


What about Wimbledon Village

http://www.wvstables.com/ they have no turnout
What I am saying is sometimes its not about greed or too many horses when horses are cannot be turned out.QUOTE]

That's all good and well but is it right? Should they keep horses in those sorts of environments where they don't get to have any freedom? I imagine a fair few police horse stables etc might not have T/O either - doesn't mean it's acceptable.
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Ours are on a day to day winter livery, depending on weather. They dont go out if its too wet, i.e, raining all day/night. They can go out for an hour in snow, hopefully mine can go out for an hour most days.

Mine would hate to be out allday in awful weather, as long as she goes out for an hour, she is more than happy & often is dragging me back to her stable. She gets ridden everyday & has turn out/play time in an indoor school
 
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