Parelli Demo on robert Whittakers stallion Stonleigh Friday 9th...Anybody else bside

snowmanbaby said:
I defy anybody on this whole thread, to watch the video of Barney, being abused, yanked about, confused and humiliated, to explain to me what the "person" abusing the one eyed and disadvantaged horse was "supposed" to get out of that session of abuse???

Please explain to me, so that I can understand, and gain some "S...avvy" ???
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As far as I understand it the horse had been running over the top of the handler because it was so interested in something off screen that it was paying no attention to the people in its vicinity and was in danger of injuring someone.
Throughout most of the clip the horse is still ignoring the person on the end of the rope so it obviously wasn't that bothered or it would have transfered its attention to that person, however it was at least no longer stepping on or pushing through that person.
As for the horse being humiliated I haven't ever noticed a horse displaying that emotion I don't think a horse would understand humiliation even if you could explain the concept to it.
The purpose of the actions as far as I understand it was to gain the horses attention and keep people safe.
Whether you would, I would or others would have used other methods in such a situation and how effective they would be is as far as I can see a far more relevant question and of more concern, than any imaginary emotion the horse may feel.
Also has the horse owner or anyone associated with it indicated that the horse suffered any harm of a minor or major kind because of what is shown on the video? Is the horse now terribly head shy? Was it cut damaged etc? Does anyone know? Whilst horses are herbivores thay are large and can present a danger to people just by being the size they are and discounting the people around them. Would it have been better to allow someone to be injured in that way?
If I had been in that situation I might have been content with getting the horse away from me and let it continue to stare until it got bored providing it didn't keep crowding in on top of me or anyone else but as I wasn't there; I don't know.
 
jahseh said:
As far as I understand it the horse had been running over the top of the handler because it was so interested in something off screen that it was paying no attention to the people in its vicinity and was in danger of injuring someone.
Throughout most of the clip the horse is still ignoring the person on the end of the rope so it obviously wasn't that bothered or it would have transfered its attention to that person, however it was at least no longer stepping on or pushing through that person.
As for the horse being humiliated I haven't ever noticed a horse displaying that emotion I don't think a horse would understand humiliation even if you could explain the concept to it.
The purpose of the actions as far as I understand it was to gain the horses attention and keep people safe.
Whether you would, I would or others would have used other methods in such a situation and how effective they would be is as far as I can see a far more relevant question and of more concern, than any imaginary emotion the horse may feel.
Also has the horse owner or anyone associated with it indicated that the horse suffered any harm of a minor or major kind because of what is shown on the video? Is the horse now terribly head shy? Was it cut damaged etc? Does anyone know? Whilst horses are herbivores thay are large and can present a danger to people just by being the size they are and discounting the people around them. Would it have been better to allow someone to be injured in that way?
If I had been in that situation I might have been content with getting the horse away from me and let it continue to stare until it got bored providing it didn't keep crowding in on top of me or anyone else but as I wasn't there; I don't know.
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EXCUSE ME??? quite a few of us didn't see a dangerous horse in that video??? Where was he? can you point him out to us please???
 
Jahseh.....if you had bothered to watch the clip of Barney just BEFORE LP took over from owner you would have seen that was NOT true! He was grazing on a slack line and became confused when owner started wiggling the line, then really worried looking with his one eye for a way out from the frantic shake'n'klunk of LP. She blamed the wind on her 'explanation'....there was NO wind, the spanish moss in the trees was barely waving.This was a hunt horse of many years' standing who saw the human as someone to stand beside quietly, as is normal in the rest of the humane horse world.
 
dRats said:
Jahseh.....if you had bothered to watch the clip of Barney just BEFORE LP took over from owner you would have seen that was NOT true! He was grazing on a slack line and became confused when owner started wiggling the line, then really worried looking with his one eye for a way out from the frantic shake'n'klunk of LP. She blamed the wind on her 'explanation'....there was NO wind, the spanish moss in the trees was barely waving.This was a hunt horse of many years' standing who saw the human as someone to stand beside quietly, as is normal in the rest of the humane horse world.
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Wind must have been bloody strong that day consering the waving around her arms were doing!!!
 
vandypip said:
Actually, you don't seem to know too much at all. You are a good example of idiotic brain washing!!! Nobody was doing the horse any favours!!! it was being abused!!! Only a parelletic person like you would comment otherwise!! ha, ha, ha!!!!!
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In reply

I didn't know there was another clip of the horse just before. I was going on what I saw and had been told. I never said this was a good thing just commented on what i had been told and my own perceptions and asked for more information. I also said what I would do in the circumstances as far as I understood them which wasn't what was done so why all the abuse? Or are only horses exempt from abuse and people fair game?
 
vandypip said:
You know what??? he'd have done us all a favour if he'd mown the abusive blond bitch down.
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Shame on you for such disgusting comment you really must have nothing to say when you start mocking and have to resort to insults, cursing and above all this shows what sort of person you really are:mad:
 
PapaFrita said:
You do realise the irony of this comment in view of what Vandypip said just before.....?
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No because I explained what I had been told and asked for additional information and again said I wouldn't have done that in the circumstances as far as i understood them.So explain how her comments even approach irony?
 
jahseh said:
No because I explained what I had been told and asked for additional information and again said I wouldn't have done that in the circumstances as far as i understood them.So explain how her comments even approach irony?
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Um, no, your comments are ironic. Do I seriously have to explain?
I would much rather get an answer to one of the several questions I've posted on this thread and not had a comprehensive reply to.
 
jahseh said:
In reply

I didn't know there was another clip of the horse just before. I was going on what I saw and had been told. I never said this was a good thing just commented on what i had been told and my own perceptions and asked for more information. I also said what I would do in the circumstances as far as I understood them which wasn't what was done so why all the abuse? Or are only horses exempt from abuse and people fair game?
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jahseh
The clip I think you have seen has been edited from a much longer video that probably none of these people here that are commenting on have ever seen.
You asked a few question like was the horse head shy after what did the owner think, well I can tell you that the owner is still a member of PNH and still has the horse , they have made a statement that they have complete faith in Linda and that the horse is fine, they describe that it was a difficult horse and it still has minor issues (not relating to the incidence in the clip), this video clip was circulated to try and discredit Linda Parelli and the PNH because the tape is taken out of context the viewer is unable to make a complete picture of what was really going on as the start and end were never shown.
 
PapaFrita said:
Um, no, your comments are ironic. Do I seriously have to explain?
I would much rather get an answer to one of the several questions I've posted on this thread and not had a comprehensive reply to.
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Sorry misread your response thought you were saying she was being ironic but again no as i explained the information i had been given and what actions I would probably have taken if those circumstances were as explained to me. I also requested more information which is only what someone who is resonable would do not rant and rave without full information. True ignorence is not not knowing it is refusal to take on board other information that may lead you to become better informed. At no point have I indicated any unwillingness to do so and as I had not read about a previous video I didn't know one exsisted. I never unlike some others have knowingly given the impression or said that I am omnipitent or all knowing
 
pippinpie said:
If you look at that part of PP quote it will tell you that he uses those techniques to 'diagnose' the true problem that Catwalk had, thats why it's reported 'that it started out OK' he then had to find out how deep that problem was, thats the bit were he finds out how far Catwalk is prepared to go to stop the bridle from being put on, passive and patiently trying to help him accept some head/ear touching. when it is obvious to PP that this problem is not merely a bridling problem but a deeper problem with trust and yielding leadership that have to be address first.
It is at that point he lost most of the viewing public and should have decided to continue the session in a more suitable environment.
But he didn't, if he continued he was damned and if he had stopped there he was damned so that his critics could say he was either beaten and his methods don't work or that he was going to continue behind closed doors so it must have been bad.
Can I ask if any of the media has picked up this backlash and reported it publicly? or is it just networking sites like this where hearsay and prejudice reign.
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Or that he was given signals by the horse he was ready to move on, which the horse then retracted? If he had stopped there, then maybe he would have lost so much ground the horse would have been doubly resistant to the idea of having a bridle on?

Old ground, keeps being trodden.
 
I have to say there is a startling disparity in the reasonableness or otherwise of lots of posts on this site are they all like this?
 
pippinpie said:
............It is at that point he lost most of the viewing public and should have decided to continue the session in a more suitable environment...........
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What I meant by that was ; at that point understanding of what was needed and what was happening was lost to the majority and this was made worst by him not have the mic on and being able to comunicate what he was doing and why.

brighteyes said:
Or that he was given signals by the horse he was ready to move on, which the horse then retracted? If he had stopped there, then maybe he would have lost so much ground the horse would have been doubly resistant to the idea of having a bridle on?

Old ground, keeps being trodden.
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Agreed we will never know what PP was seeing, but I do know it would have been a lot more than me and most of the people on this thread.
 
jahseh said:
I have to say there is a startling disparity in the reasonableness or otherwise of lots of posts on this site are they all like this?
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Some of us use manners and display decent debating skills others as you have found out don't know how to have a civil conversation and use school yard behavior to try and make their points but it is all lost when rudeness and abuse take over.
 
pippinpie said:
Some of us use manners and display decent debating skills others as you have found out don't know how to have a civil conversation and use school yard behavior to try and make their points but it is all lost when rudeness and abuse take over.
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thankyou for that and the previous info
 
Gingerwitch said:
Has there been any comment from the Whittakers on what went on and the associated allegations?
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The only public thing that I know about is the Robert Whitaker the owner of Catwalk has allowed the official vet report that was issued after the vet saw the horse at 11.00am on sat morning, to be used by PP in his statement regarding the demo a FOTH. To me that speaks volumes
 
pippinpie said:
Some of us use manners and display decent debating skills others as you have found out don't know how to have a civil conversation and use school yard behavior to try and make their points but it is all lost when rudeness and abuse take over.
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I appear to be talking to myself .... I continue to ask questions and get no response.
 
PapaFrita said:
I appear to be talking to myself .... I continue to ask questions and get no response.
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I responded to the remarks you addressed to me, so not ignoring you. Don't recall your previous questions so can't answer them or maybe (horror) I don't know the answer or thought the points had been answered elsewhere or any number of other things lol.
 
PapaFrita said:
Surely the horse's needs are foremost? Doesn't PP say this all the time? In which case the only thing to do would've been to stop and to hell with the critics.
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I can only find this one :)

I understand what and why PP did what he did (with the horse) but I do not understand why he did not realise that carrying on was not acceptable to the majority in the audience. Only he knows what he was feeling and what feedback he was getting back from the horse.
I wasn't there so this is just MY take on it.
PS reread your question I truly believe he was doing it in the best interest of the horse.
 
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pippinpie said:
The clip I think you have seen has been edited from a much longer video that probably none of these people here that are commenting on have ever seen.
You asked a few question like was the horse head shy after what did the owner think, well I can tell you that the owner is still a member of PNH and still has the horse , they have made a statement that they have complete faith in Linda and that the horse is fine, they describe that it was a difficult horse and it still has minor issues (not relating to the incidence in the clip), this video clip was circulated to try and discredit Linda Parelli and the PNH because the tape is taken out of context the viewer is unable to make a complete picture of what was really going on as the start and end were never shown.
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I have watched the DVD that includes the whole clip. Seeing the bits before and after the posted clip doesn't make one go "Ah, so that's what it was all about. I now see what a dangerous horse Barney was and understand what Linda was trying to do." No, the overall impression is still of an ugly, wrong-headed way to deal with a horse who wasn't trying to run over the top of anyone but whose "crime" was looking where he wasn't meant to. Actually, Barney was relatively quiet and untroubled at the beginning when he was being handled by his owner. It was Linda's intervention that upset and confused him - understandably, given the total lack of clarity of the signals he was given and the continual flurry of punishers inflicted on him. It is also true that things had settled down again towards the end - but no way does it excuse the shoddy way the horse was treated.
 
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