Parelli - yay or neigh?

[Cheval Gal]

So, a group of ladies at the yard are really into Parelli. Train their horses using a carrot stick and all sorts of other items. I will admit to knowing next to nothing about this method and am slightly bemused by it.

I'd love to hear other's thoughts, views and experiences. Is it worth doing? Does it make a huge difference in a positive way?

 

[doodle]

I have only seen it once. And very quickly decided if that is what it is I’m not interested! There was a huge amount of carrot stick waving in the round pen and a very distressed horse.

 

[ihatework]

It’s one of the worst forms/brands of natural horsemanship in my opinion.

Generally adopted by people lacking any sort of horsemanship!

Now, I expect there are elements of it that are good, or at least not bad, and if applied in the right situations have merit. But the whole commercial aspect of it is a pile of ???

Horses I’ve seen subjected to this look completely downtrodden.

 

[Gingerwitch]

Ask the one eyed horse whom Linda abused oh and the horses Pat killed on his ranch by depriving them of water.....

 

[Cheval Gal]

Ask the one eyed horse whom Linda abused oh and the horses Pat killed on his ranch by depriving them of water.....

Wait, what now???

 

[Cheval Gal]

I have only seen it once. And very quickly decided if that is what it is I’m not interested! There was a huge amount of carrot stick waving in the round pen and a very distressed horse.

This is how I felt.

 

[Equi]

I’ve only ever seen it be implemented for one horse who had massive issues (turned out to be pain of course) and the horses owner initially was singing its praises cause he was finally a little calmer but then after a few 100 quid on “only” parelli brand tools she finally realised he wasn’t becoming calmer he was just becoming despondent and depressed, loosing his personality. She stopped and went back to normal and he got the light back in his eyes.

 

[Cheval Gal]

I’ve only ever seen it be implemented for one horse who had massive issues (turned out to be pain of course) and the horses owner initially was singing its praises cause he was finally a little calmer but then after a few 100 quid on “only” parelli brand tools she finally realised he wasn’t becoming calmer he was just becoming despondent and depressed, loosing his personality. She stopped and went back to normal and he got the light back in his eyes.

This is so sad.

 

[Tiddlypom]

Is it still as popular as it was? It was everywhere a few years ago. Maybe it’s hyped out now, though maybe that‘s because I don’t move in those circles anymore (the ‘parelliteenies’ ).

 

[Blanche]

It is a no from me. Seen stuff done in the name of Parelli that are not right. Some people start acting a bit ’cultish’ if they are into it. All this pales when you consider the videos of the Parelli couple ( can’t remember their names). What goes on behind closed doors is always worse too, that doesn’t bare thinking about.

 

[Scotsbadboy]

It's a no from me. Im all about natural horsemanship but that stuff ... no chance!

 

[emilylou]

Its a no from me. Anyone who I have encountered who does it hugely lacks common sense and any basic horsemanship skills.
I find its often used as a smoke and mirrors to hide the owners inadequacies as its something to 'do' with their horse when they cant do anything else with it.

That said, there are some fantastic natural horsemanship trainers out there who have a fantastic understanding of horses but I've never seen any of them waving a bright orange stick around.

 

[9tails]

I watched the videos and looked at the games. It's a paint by numbers type of system for those with no feel or sense of timing. I've not personally seen a horse or pony improved, the incidences I've seen where the horse has done the right thing is where they've tried everything else then accidentally did the right move.

One person I know had feel and timing, he helped enormously to train my own horse to load onto a trailer using a carrot stick and she now loads and travels well. But that was because she was given time to make up her own mind, the trainer had the ability to read when to push and when to stand back and wait. I doubt he needed to call it Parelli, it was good horsemanship for that horse.

 

[canteron]

Oh god, I am shortly going to hide from HHO because I am going to (sort of) stand up for it. I think there is a BIG problem in this country because it is taught/practiced very poorly. However I worked with this, admittedly crazy, but American trained parelli person for a year and she really explained the concepts, why’s and reasonings well. By the end of our year, a nervous me and bolshy horsy had transformed so I could do a respectable intro test with no bridle or saddle (my instructor jumped 1m rounds on her thoroughbreds with no bridle and saddle ?).

I think a lot of the bad press is because people see it being done badly .... buts that’s a bit like hating show jumpers because you see a cruel person show jumping - fundamentally there is a lot of good in Parelli if you take the time to understand it.

Google David Leichman if you want examples of it done well.

 

[Tiddlypom]

Google David Leichman if you want examples of it done well.

And google Linda and Pat Parelli if you want examples of it being done badly...

 

[9tails]

There was an owner on my yard years ago that had a lovely big calm mare. Owner was nervous and decided that Parelli was the thing for her. This big calm mare didn't really react to the stick waving, so on the advice of another Parelli fan the nervous owner tied a plastic bag to the stick. The big calm mare panicked and ran straight through her to get away. The owner and Parelli fan blamed the mare and did more work with the plastic bag on a stick until the mare shut down and then became hard to catch. If that was their aim, they nailed it.

 

[9tails]

Catwalk is another one to watch, the video is pretty ropey but you get the idea of the abuse these horses receive.

 

[shortstuff99]

Oh god, I am shortly going to hide from HHO because I am going to (sort of) stand up for it. I think there is a BIG problem in this country because it is taught/practiced very poorly. However I worked with this, admittedly crazy, but American trained parelli person for a year and she really explained the concepts, why’s and reasonings well. By the end of our year, a nervous me and bolshy horsy had transformed so I could do a respectable intro test with no bridle or saddle (my instructor jumped 1m rounds on her thoroughbreds with no bridle and saddle ?).

I think a lot of the bad press is because people see it being done badly .... buts that’s a bit like hating show jumpers because you see a cruel person show jumping - fundamentally there is a lot of good in Parelli if you take the time to understand it.

Google David Leichman if you want examples of it done well.

You mean done badly by Pat Parelli himself?

 

[windand rain]

Big no from me too the games can be a bit of fun to try a couple of times but basically it is awful the people using it seem to be unable to commnicate with the horse, rarely ride it and even more rarely pick up on the depression and shut down horse it produces. Out of the public eye it is often very cruel too

 

[Cheval Gal]

This is heartbreaking to read. Thank you for your replies, everyone. I must say, it did not sit easily with me and thought the horses involved looked stressed and very unsure.

9tails, that bag incident sounds crazy.

 

[doodle]

Funnily enough this horse also got the plastic bag on the end of the stick routine. She got to the stage she refused to go to arena and every other horse in the yard (while in their stables) having a meltdown at the amount of carrot stick use to try and get her there.

 

[9tails]

This is the one eyed horse

 

[Cheval Gal]

You mean done badly by Pat Parelli himself?

Omg! Poor horse! 2 hours?!

 

[wiglet]

A couple of ladies practice it at my yard. One lady is a qualified parelli trainer and gives lessons to anyone who asks... sometimes those who don’t ask too ? Both their horses stand in the school and shut down while their owners wave all manner of objects above their heads. Thing is, when they get on to ride them, they’re both still really spooky? And of course, they’ve taught them to rear as well ?

Anyway, I think it’s a load of tosh but each to their own ?

 

[saalsk]

There is good and bad in all of the method-style training techniques, as there is in everything. The commercial side of it doesn't do them any favours, but the same could be said of Monty Roberts, and various others. Good and bad is always going to be there, that is life, and why we have youtube clips of *karens*, and bad driving, and people shouting about poor service when they wait 2 minutes for a big mac. No one uploads clips of someone politely waiting for a learner drive to move away from traffic lights - only the ones where there are horns, swearing and lost tempers ! Dressage and roll-kur, show jumping and pole rapping, racing of 2 year olds on hard dirt tracks, tying a horse to a strong pole to teach them to how to be tied up, severe trimming of feet to help with laminitis, using water-witholding as a training tool, long levered bits as a quick fix to poor ground work, twisted mouthpieces ditto, cribbing collars to prevent a behaviour caused by stress. There are good exponents, and poor ones, and usually the poor get more airtime. How many times have people been at shows/horse events, and seen someone trying to get a horse to load, using the broom-up-the-backside technique ? I watched a rider at Burghley, heading to the ( for those that know the course ) downhill, straight line, towards the end of the course "Train" fence - the horse was knackered, the rider was young and ambitious, and the horse took a crashing, horrific fall that could have ended its life. I saw another tired, young horse refuse the *up* part of Capabilitiy's Cutting, only to be pulled aside and then made to re-face it, ending up with the horse with its front legs over the front bar, wedged in the gap, as it tried hard to comply, and quite simply didn't have the energy to do so. The crowd made it clear, on both occasions, that the rider was at fault. I am sure it wasn't in either riders game plan to do what they did. Extremes of anything are rarely that good, be it positive or negative. If a horse is hard to catch, it is often (often, not always ) because the horse associates being caught with doing work - so why would they ? Too many treats, the horse can get nippy/mouthy/pushy. Natural horsemanship can teach, very quickly, methods to work a horse, but people underestimate how crucial the timing is, and can end up rewarding, or punishing, the wrong behaviour unintentionally. Then the horse is confused, and the rider/trainer doesn't recognise it, and so it goes on. Who remembers having lessons on riding school ponies who had mouths like iron, and sides like concrete ? Who has watched Supernanny, and seen a tantrum-throwing toddler who gets their own way, and laughs about who is training who ?! Going back to horses - one thing I think Parelli do well, is teaching a horse to yield/move to pressure. I often take mine out in the trailer, on my own. Teaching them to walk with me holding the lead rein, but standing at their quarters, not their head, is great for loading into the trailer by yourself !
In parelli's own words, carrot and stick, and too much of either is not good !

Find a training technique ( and mix'n'match from all the sources out there ) that suits you, and suits your horse, and don't be afraid to change what you do if it isn't working.

 

[Widgeon]

This is the one eyed horse

I don't understand - what is she trying to achieve? She seems to be whacking the horse when it gets near her. But why? I'm surprised it didn't react more than it does.

 

[Muddywellies]

There was a couple on my yard who were totally brainwashed by parelli. They wholly believed their way (Parelli) was the ONLY way and the number of arguments it caused is rediculous. Everyone else was wrong! Oh and they insisted all horses should be barefoot. They were extremely pushy with their views. The things they did with their horses was just plain weird, verging on dangerous at times, and guess which horses were the rudest on the yard (??).
But further to this, after relenting to peer pressure on another yard, I agreed to a half hour session with a Straightness Training instructor. On went the obligatory lunge cavasson with a chain in the noseband, and she chased after my horse with a plastic bag on a stick. As you can imagine, my horse took off and the only way she could stop her was to drive her into a corner. It was very distressing and tbh I was furious.
So its a great bit NEIGH (nay) from me.

 

[doodle]

I always take my horse out in trailer alone. No parelli needed!

 

[canteron]

And google Linda and Pat Parelli if you want examples of it being done badly...

If you are super confident well organised rider and amazingly knowledgeable with fantastic support then by all means mock - but actually for a lot of people there is very poor support around (there are appalling instructors around especially for the less confident) and people just want some structure and a pathway. It may not take you to the stratosphere but damning the whole thing on a few bad videos is harsh - the nature is riding - even for the Parellis - is you learn by your mistakes and I am sure you have a few things In your past horse life you are not 100% proud of and wish you have done differently.

 

[9tails]

I don't understand - what is she trying to achieve? She seems to be whacking the horse when it gets near her. But why? I'm surprised it didn't react more than it does.

Who knows? Even when the horse is standing a respectable distance away she's still whacking the horse.