petition to make the Grand National safer

Status
Not open for further replies.
lassiesuca

lassiesuca

Well-Known Member
Joined
19 December 2010
Messages
279
Location
in the field!
Visit site
I've set up a petition in the aim to get lots of support and hopefully take it to the BRS and get them to just consider that the course perhaps needs some of it's safety aspects reconsider.

I'm not suggesting we ban the race, but if we can reduce the number of horses on the course, perhaps lower the fences and even reduce the length they have to run, you can still enjoy the race, and it will hopefully reduce the number of fatalities.

We do see it in eventing, however not as often, because safety is considered, obviously we can't prevent accidents entirely, but I believe we can reduce the risk.

In the past 11 years, 21 horses have been killed on GN, lets try and reduce that number. We're all horse lovers here! So let's just do the right thing :o


http://www.ipetitions.com/petition/grandnationalsafety/
Thanks for your support. I don't want to cause a fight, I just want to raise awareness

xx
 
Last edited:
I will not be signing sorry as I believe in making the jumps smaller and the course shorter the horses will go faster therefore causing more falls which is likely to result in more fatalities.
 
Reduce the length and reduce the size = horses go faster. Ever watched a 2m hurdle? If you're campaigning about that, you'll have to campaign about all racing - the GN is not the only race where horses are killed, and there are normal, everday races where 2 horses can die.

Safety is considered in racing too, believe it or not.
 
I believe the Jockey club and the racing authorities have the welfare and the safety of all - riders, horses, spectators and staff very well considered at ALL RACES not just the GN and do a fairly good job in a sport that is very high risk.

At every sport things can and do go wrong .... think of how many riders and horses have died through falls in eventing, team chasing, and point to pointing. Nobody wants their horse fatally injured and nobody wants to witness it either - and I'm sure the GN has a risk assesement that equals the bible in pages !
 
Last edited:
Not necessarily.
A friend of mine watches the Scottish National, and there are far less horses on the track, a shorter track, and smaller fences.

Far less, if any, fatalities... :)
 
Not for me either, fed up of 'cotton wool' attitude for almost everything these days. There is a risk in everything, those who take part, know the risks.
Keep The Grand National as it is, it doesn't need to be modified any more.
 
So you are basically proposing another Gold Cup? Fatalities can occur in ANY race - in the first year of your 'new Grand National' over normal chase fences over 3m, there could be 2 fatalities...
 
Wagtail said:
Thanks. Seems there is more of a movement now to making it safer. I hope so. I can't understand the ice queen attiutudes of some.
Click to expand...

And I can't stand the fluffy bunny attitudes of others, then being called a cow for 'not caring' - I keep saying, fatalities can occur in ANY RACE! 2 deaths can occur in ANY RACE, the Grand national is not the only race that horses die in, and they don't get killed every year!
 
Well, then perhaps we shouldn't just let them gallop so fast?

If this was an XC course, which okay understandably has more safety design, or if you saw people bombing at jumps aimlessly at a flat out gallop, I think many of us would be feeling perhaps a little uneasy, with striding etc. It must be a struggle to be running at those speeds and then try and collect yourself for a jump like that.
 
teagreen said:
And I can't stand the fluffy bunny attitudes of others, then being called a cow for 'not caring' - I keep saying, fatalities can occur in ANY RACE! 2 deaths can occur in ANY RACE, the Grand national is not the only race that horses die in, and they don't get killed every year!
Click to expand...

21 horses in 11 years. Perhaps I'm really bad at maths, but that would average out at least one horse a year.
No, but we hear most about the deaths of GN. I've not insulted your beliefs, I don't want an argument, all I'm saying is that perhaps we should consider the safety of it more. I'm not slamming people, I could easily post my real views on racing on here, but I'm not. I'm trying to reason and trying to compromise, I know it will never get banned, and I know that many horses would be out of work, and many would end up slaughtered...

Perhaps if we didn't wear them out at such a young age, then we wouldn't have so many ex-racers in rescue homes, or needing homes, and then the REAL rescue cases can be taken in and given the correct attention they need. Instead of taking a backseat with the influx of all these racers?
 
Chavhorse said:
Very interesting article today in the DM by Ginger Mcain (who I think knows what he is talking about) saying that reducing the drops to the fences has inadvertently made the course faster and it is the speed that kills.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...s-safety-row-jockey-lies-coma-horses-die.html
Click to expand...

I have to say that whenever the ground is hard I expect more fatalities. It's a combination of speed with no give in the ground. When conditions are muddy and slower, however, there are often more fallers but they slide and so the impact is not so great. So it's swings and roundabouts. But it is absolute rubbish to say that jumping smaller fences is more dangerous than jumping huge fences with drops. How could reducing the drops make the horses go faster? They don't know there's a drop until they are in the air! :p

And are there fewer fallers in eventing when the fences are smaller? I think not.

People will say anything to twist things the way that suits them.
 
lassiesuca said:
Well, then perhaps we shouldn't just let them gallop so fast?

If this was an XC course, which okay understandably has more safety design, or if you saw people bombing at jumps aimlessly at a flat out gallop, I think many of us would be feeling perhaps a little uneasy, with striding etc. It must be a struggle to be running at those speeds and then try and collect yourself for a jump like that.
Click to expand...

Jockeys are not stupid. They look for strides just like anyone jumping - you will see them taking a pull or pushing a horse a few strides out because they have seen a stride. They aren't just galloping straight at the fences and praying. Sam Waley-Cohen and a few others have spent a lot of time working with Yogi Breisner to improve their jumping and enable them to look for strides etc better, because jumping is the name of the game.

Eventers go slower, but their jumps are more varied - it would be completely crazy to gallop flat out at some of the drop fences I have seen, but you don't get them in racing, plus eventers have to navigate water/doubles/steps etc, so it's very different.

They are racehorses. Races are run at a gallop. They don't go flat out the whole way round because it is 4m, but the smaller you make the fences, the faster they will go. Same with making the course shorter.
 
lassiesuca said:
Well, then perhaps we shouldn't just let them gallop so fast?

If this was an XC course, which okay understandably has more safety design, or if you saw people bombing at jumps aimlessly at a flat out gallop, I think many of us would be feeling perhaps a little uneasy, with striding etc. It must be a struggle to be running at those speeds and then try and collect yourself for a jump like that.
Click to expand...

Its a race, the fastest to get to the finish line wins? How would jockeys know how fast they were going? And then think I'm going too fast I've got to slow down? The Grand National is what it is, don't like it? Don't watch.
 
lassiesuca said:
In the past 11 years, 21 horses have been killed on GN, lets try and reduce that number. We're all horse lovers here! So let's just do the right thing :o
Click to expand...

Are you trying to make yourself a laughing stock, Lassisuca??:rolleyes:

If you want to use statistics to set up a petition, do your homework. I cannot believe that you read something in a newspaper as inaccurate as the Mail, or a website as twisted as AA, and base a petition on their distortions.

From an earlier post -

National deaths last 12 years

2011 - 2 from heavy falls - attributed, IMO due to fast ground.
2010 - no deaths
2009 - 1 death - not from a fall, but 'I hear the Echo' collapsed and died on the run in.
2008 - 1 death - McKelvey got injured running loose after unseating
2007 - no deaths
2006 - 1 death - Tyneandtyneagain - fall
2005 - no deaths
2004 - no deaths
2003 - no deaths
2002 - 2 deaths - The Last Fling and Manx Magic - both falls on good ground
2001 - no deaths
2000 - no deaths

I can't be bothered going further back, but 480 horses ran over the last twelve years and there have been 5 deaths from falls. More significantly the ground was good on both the days 2 horses were lost. So I guess it's to do with the speed not the fences. But how could they have forseen this weather? Also, it is dangerous to water late to change the going as false ground can be very treacherous.

I am speechless at the utter stupidity of starting a petition based on hearsay........
 
3Beasties said:
Maybe we should just ban racing all together, after all 2 horses were killed in flat races over the weekend :rolleyes:
Click to expand...

Ah yes, but they don't seem to count...

I actually don't think I can argue about racing anymore. I never thought that day would come, but it's going round and round in circles, with people saying the same thing in more and more threads *head explodes*
 
Caledonia said:
Are you trying to make yourself a laughing stock, Lassisuca??:rolleyes:

If you want to use statistics to set up a petition, do your homework. I cannot believe that you read something in a newspaper as inaccurate as the Mail, or a website as twisted as AA, and base a petition on their distortions.

From an earlier post -

National deaths last 12 years

2011 - 2 from heavy falls - attributed, IMO due to fast ground.
2010 - no deaths
2009 - 1 death - not from a fall, but 'I hear the Echo' collapsed and died on the run in.
2008 - 1 death - McKelvey got injured running loose after unseating
2007 - no deaths
2006 - 1 death - Tyneandtyneagain - fall
2005 - no deaths
2004 - no deaths
2003 - no deaths
2002 - 2 deaths - The Last Fling and Manx Magic - both falls on good ground
2001 - no deaths
2000 - no deaths

I can't be bothered going further back, but 480 horses ran over the last twelve years and there have been 5 deaths from falls. More significantly the ground was good on both the days 2 horses were lost. So I guess it's to do with the speed not the fences. But how could they have forseen this weather? Also, it is dangerous to water late to change the going as false ground can be very treacherous.

I am speechless at the utter stupidity of starting a petition based on hearsay........
Click to expand...

Finally someone who is posting the FACTS!
 
Caledonia said:
Are you trying to make yourself a laughing stock, Lassisuca??:rolleyes:

If you want to use statistics to set up a petition, do your homework. I cannot believe that you read something in a newspaper as inaccurate as the Mail, or a website as twisted as AA, and base a petition on their distortions.

From an earlier post -

National deaths last 12 years

2011 - 2 from heavy falls - attributed, IMO due to fast ground.
2010 - no deaths
2009 - 1 death - not from a fall, but 'I hear the Echo' collapsed and died on the run in.
2008 - 1 death - McKelvey got injured running loose after unseating
2007 - no deaths
2006 - 1 death - Tyneandtyneagain - fall
2005 - no deaths
2004 - no deaths
2003 - no deaths
2002 - 2 deaths - The Last Fling and Manx Magic - both falls on good ground
2001 - no deaths
2000 - no deaths

I can't be bothered going further back, but 480 horses ran over the last twelve years and there have been 5 deaths from falls. More significantly the ground was good on both the days 2 horses were lost. So I guess it's to do with the speed not the fences. But how could they have forseen this weather? Also, it is dangerous to water late to change the going as false ground can be very treacherous.

I am speechless at the utter stupidity of starting a petition based on hearsay........
Click to expand...

That's fine. I don't care if I make a 'laughing' stock. Sorry I care :eek: I mean honestly
 
teagreen said:
And I can't stand the fluffy bunny attitudes of others, then being called a cow for 'not caring' - I keep saying, fatalities can occur in ANY RACE! 2 deaths can occur in ANY RACE, the Grand national is not the only race that horses die in, and they don't get killed every year!
Click to expand...

If being called a fluffy bunny means having normal human emotions and being a generally caring and sympathetic person, then I'm fine with that. :D

Yes, of course, the fatalities can occur in any race, but how many other races lose horses EVERY time they are run, except for very rare years? You know when the national starts that usually at least one horse will be running to its death. That's a fact. It does not occur in any other british race with such regularity. Accidents will happen all the time with horses, even (and especially in) the field. But where we can address specifics, then it would be cruel not to.
 
teagreen said:
Ah yes, but they don't seem to count...

I actually don't think I can argue about racing anymore. I never thought that day would come, but it's going round and round in circles, with people saying the same thing in more and more threads *head explodes*
Click to expand...

I agree!
 
Wagtail said:
If being called a fluffy bunny means having normal human emotions and being a generally caring and sympathetic person, then I'm fine with that. :D

Yes, of course, the fatalities can occur in any race, but how many other races lose horses EVERY time they are run, except for very rare years? You know when the national starts that usually at least one horse will be running to its death. That's a fact. It does not occur in any other british race with such regularity. Accidents will happen all the time with horses, even (and especially in) the field. But where we can address specifics, then it would be cruel not to.
Click to expand...

So, you deduce from this that I do not have normal human emotions, am not caring or sympathetic? This is where, no offence, you begin to sound silly. Everyone involved with racehorses loves them and cares about them deeply.

And it doesn't lose horses every time. Have a look at the posts above, Do you want to ban the Cheltenham Festival too? Good luck with that.. Horses dies team chasing every year. Maybe you also want to ban hacking on the roads, it seems to produce a lot of grizzly deaths.
 
Whilst I agree that there needs to be some radical changes in the GN - petitions of this sort will not help achieve that.

The racing authorities need to be petitioned to have a long hard look at the race, with more welfare reforms in mind.

I'm afraid petitions like yours are simply knee jerk reactions to issues that need to be addressed in the wider arena.
 
lassiesuca said:
That's fine. I don't care if I make a 'laughing' stock. Sorry I care :eek: I mean honestly
Click to expand...

How mind-numbingly ridiculous are you being - READ the post - you want to stop something based on figures which are WRONG.:rolleyes:

You 'care' about something which doesn't happen, so you start a petition to prevent something which isn't happening anyway?

Really, have a think about what you're doing.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top