Eventing Pippa Funnels article on letting covid 'dumb down' eventing

[shortstuff99]

For people that haven't (or have) read Pippa's article in this weeks H and H she has posted the un-edited version on her facebook

https://www.facebook.com/100044640210104/posts/315536123277726

What are your thoughts? I agree with her that making levels too easy won't prepare combinations for harder events and could lead to accidents. I also worry that once lost from covid some of these events will never run again

 

[ycbm]

For people that haven't (or have) read Pippa's article in this weeks H and H she has posted the un-edited version on her facebook

https://www.facebook.com/100044640210104/posts/315536123277726

What are your thoughts? I agree with her that making levels too easy won't prepare combinations for harder events and could lead to accidents. I also worry that once lost from covid some of these events will never run again

This is a tough one, because eventing is offering what people want to compete at and will pay, in volume, to compete at. Covid has had an accelerating impact, much like on the high street, but my feeling is that the demise of eventing as a big spectacle sport began the first year I evented, when the first "pre novice", now known as BE 100, had just been introduced (but was running xc at Novice height). The predictions I remember reading at that time were that introducing a lower height than Novice to generate revenues for BE would result in lower and lower heights being added to get revenues up, the death of unaffiliated events, an increase in paid professionals riding only or predominantly at lower levels, the growth of the competition centre/agricultural college venues and the fading out of the country house and stately home venues. Over the last 30 years or so, we've seen exactly that happen.

I'm not sure what the future is for the big events, but I hope there is one, they are a great spectacle and sporting occasion. And the thrill of an amateur riding at the big country estates like Chatsworth, Sansaw, Catton, etc are beyond compare. They are the jewels in the crown of my eventing memories.
.

 

[DabDab]

Yeah, I agree with her and I really hope we can find ways to keep the big venues. Eventing is still a genuine spectator sport in a way that elite SJ and dressage just aren't and so I think it is pretty critical to the equine industry that the big events survive. I also feel quite strongly that the big xc courses are a part of and a fairly critical connection to our national equestrian heritage.

 

[teapot]

I think there are two issues here. Firstly the future of the sport as a sport and the level of competition. PF's thoughts on Gatcombe for example, undulating is being polite. It's tough enough to walk let alone ride, and you can't NOT do courses like that and expect to rock up at Burghley. Are we running the risk of eventing going artificial?

Secondly - the costs and infrastructure involved for running these events on private land. It's a privilege to gallop across a Capability Brown designed landscape, not a right, and as the world emerges post Covid, there are doing to be some hard decisions. It's all very well banging the crowdfunding drum for Burghley, you're talking millions to raise (plus fees) and even then still run the risk of it going tits up last minute. The bottom line is we have no national eventing site. Compared to Kentucky - an established site; Pau's a racecourse; believe Luhmulen is a permanent site too. We rely on grass, a load of string, and some good humoured humans. It is what makes the sport so good, but it's also what makes it so poor as an international Olympic sport.

I wouldn't mind 5* riders being so vocal if they knew a bit more about costs, risk assessments, and the day to day organising that goes into prepping these events. I believe Blenheim barely broke even let alone made a profit. Simply put on by BE for its riders and supporters. Tim Price being quoted as saying 'well we'd happily pay £4000 if it meant the event could run' just shows how out of touch they are. 80 riders at £4000 each barely covers the surface of a 5* event.

 

[Honey08]

I personally find it pretty distasteful when these top riders start banging on about their disappointment over events being cancelled. It’s sad, I’m gutted that I can’t go and watch them myself, but life is just like that at the moment. Lots of people have had major life changes thanks to Covid. Lost relatives, lost jobs, careers, houses. Times are tough. Things will come back, I can’t see these top events dying off personally. They just have to make money. If Burghley was to run this year I’d probably go, but I’d avoid the shopping village and crowds like the plague, which wouldn’t help the event. Possibly lots of people would do similar, so I can see why they didn’t run.

 

[TPO]

My scatter gun thoughts in no order at all are:

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I think it was a thread on here talking about how the estates can make money easier in other ways. I would hazard a guess that a lot of these other events don't cause the damage that a big event does. I'm not sure what the benefit is to the estates to continue with BE.​

​

BE as an affiliation doesn't seem to be working (as an outsider that listens to insiders ha ha). Some events seem to run at a loss and/or have little support (financial or other) from BE. As a competitor "it is what it is", you know that it's an expensive sport and that even if you win you might get a hoof pick. Compared to BE or even BD the chance to win your entry back is slim to none. That might not be an important factor to many but it clearly irks a fair few based on the numerous lengthy threads on social media.​

​

In the world of Health & Safety eventing is a high risk sport. I know that's part of the appeal to many but I do wonder if something may lead to eventing being categorised as "too dangerous" and either insurers don't want to touch it or the costs become far too high to be practicable. On the H&S soapbox I'm still surprised that things that have caused accidents previously are allowed to continue i.e. dogs at events. It's such an easy risk to eliminate and I'd be surprised if an insurer paid out given that there is previous of dog related accidents at events.​

​

Pippa's comments about competitors/young pros/producers actively choosing softer courses sort of surprises me. Its makes sense that if your livelihood depends on selling "good" horses then you want to have as good a record as possible. I don't know how you balance getting the right type of experience vs producing sellable horses to keep a roof over your head.​

​

I have zero idea about the dumbing down at higher levels not knowing anyone personally thats competed above intermediate. I do think it has majorly dumbed down as the lower levels have gotten lower and lower. I can understand why; if the demand is there and the money is there then why wouldn't all the association jump on it? Perhaps it's also a reflection of the demise of Riding Club standards/training/opportunities? Back in the day, you know the good old days(!), there was a sort of pathway/ladder where RC went up to a decent level so people progressed and attained a certain standard before affiliating. The old adage that you should be working consistently working at a level higher at home than you are competing was drilled into me but doesnt seem to be the norm these days. Perhaps competing is too accessible theses days, can that be a thing? I'm all for "having a go" but so many combinations seem to risking their necks heading towards fixed fences at speed with little to no control over pace, striding, direction and/or take offs. I'm a fairly brave rider but even so I want to be adequately prepared and have given the horse the answers before I set off asking potentially dangerous questions.​

​

Whilst the majority on here enjoy watching eventing I don't think the general public (Olympic viewers?) necessarily do. They might "wow" at the big fences but they cringe and gasp as the horrific "spills" that the BBC seem to always insist on showing as a montage. "We" might appreciate the partnership and work that it's taken to get to 5* but Joe Bloggs public won't have an awareness of that really.​

​

I do think that once events are gone it might be hard to get them back. You just have to look at how many events were lost pre covid (2019?). I do think it is a great shame that so many have been lost so far. Again as an outsider I do think that perhaps BE needs modernised/refreshed. The money spent on that blinking website certainly could have been managed better!​

​

ETA- forgot one of my random thoughts regarding public thoughts. I know that publically he had changed but there was a lot of upset about how Oli T rode those two horses at badminton. People like me who sorta understand high level eventing (as in can talk the talk but definitely don't walk it!!) weren't too impressed, Joe Bloggs watching it on the TV did not like seeing him "beat" the horses home. Eventing is (rightly?) perceived as an upper class sport for rich toffs. Its reverse snobbery but the majority(not all) of top eventers certainly speak like they come from money and that generally doesnt appeal to the hoi polli either. I'm not suggesting that all eventers start speaking like...hmm, now cant think of a non offensive jokey description...well like an average Joe rather than the whole silver spoon thing but it does highlight the gap between the public and Elite eventers. The public did seem to relate to the show jumpers of yesteryear like Harvey Smith because he seemed "common" and "one of us" in how he spoke and acted (✌)​

 

[milliepops]

I haven't the motivation to type at length on my phone this eve so thanks for that, TPO, lots of good points.

I've enjoyed riding and grooming at lots of different places that ran once a year and I did wonder at the time if it was really worth it for the owners/organisers. A fair few have packed up so guess not

 

[DabDab]

I actually think eventing has more of a universal appeal than people think - I know lots of non-horsey people who will watch a big event on TV. And the reason more aren't interested I am pretty sure is not reverse snobbery, more a lack of connection. Motor racing makes eventing look like a working man's sport, and yet has a massive fan base.

 

[Ample Prosecco]

I totally agree with the desire to see the iconic venues return but I think her reasoning in the rest of the article is a bit muddled. There are 2 concerns she raises: the financial viability of 5* events and the need for horse and rider to be properly prepared for those iconic venues.
But then she says 'please dont let covid ne the reason...' But Covid IS the reason. Lack of insurance coverage for late notice cancellation means huge financial risk for the estates. Yes there needs to be thought as to how to fund 5* but the idea of magic wands seems a bit naive. The kind of money needed is not really the kind of money that can be raised by fundraising efforts, I dont think.

Then she talks about 'dumbing down' presumably referring to lower levels and easier runs being introduced.

I remember similar arguments about triathlon when they introduced events shorter than the old 'sprint' distance and extended finishing times for ironman. It was 'dumbing down', the big events were losing prestige. In fact what happened is that it became far more accessible and developed a far broader base. So the UK went from 1 viable iron distance race in the 1990s (The Longest Day) to multiple ironman races taking place every year and a hugely popular super sprint series.

And the UK went from also rans to dominance at all distances with Chrissie Wellington and the Brownlee brothers and others.

If you look at BE, BE80 and BE90 classes are more popular. So to me, if the money is at the lower levels then embracing that means the ability to subsidise the higher levels, expanding the pool of eventers around who are happy to volunteer, making events more financially viable, providing a route into eventing for more people, giving pros a job as they compete for owners etc etc. Insistng all those people compete unaff just means the money and free labour goes elsewhere. Not sure how that would help.

As far as risk goes, you need MIRS to move up and 2 eliminations in a row or too many SJ faults gets you moved down again. They could easily add in additional safety measures. Within a level a few events could be classified as N* or N+ or whatever reflecting challenging terrain or technicality at that level and you need a run at a starred/plussed event before moving up. Some classification indicating a bridging event between 2 levels.

Maybr I'm missing her point but I don't understand what her solution to poor rider education and the precarious financial situation for the big estates actually is.

 

[ester]

Is eventing the only olympic sport which isn't actually the pinnacle/hardest test? For most sports the aim is to be successful at international champs but if you include eventing in that no one actually needs to be running at 5* to do so (and we often want different horses than the 5* specialists for champs). Just then that it looses the argument to have them so we can be internationally successful as a nation.

Re. financing, I know it wasn't anywhere near as much to put on but iirc kentucky was 1500 donors which didn't seem like many to me.

 

[Bernster]

What AE said ?

 

[milliepops]

I read it rather differently to that AE, I thought what she was possibly getting at was the big estates were possibly already contemplating how long they wanted to be in the horse trials game, with no permanent facilities or year-round use it's a huge undertaking to set up for an annual event compared to the purpose built places that can easily pop another date in the diary. but that the particular challenges that these events pose to horses and riders is becoming unusual but horses and riders need to be able to ride those courses in order to arrive at 5* properly prepped. and if those organisers/landowners were already thinking about stepping away from the sport, Covid may be the final nail in the coffin.

I think the lower levels convo is a separate one.

 

[zandp]

I only had a thought on her comment about the lower levels / riders doing simpler / safer courses and events and then turning up to harder/higher rated ones unprepared - and my thought was that matches the worries a friend in the USA has about the USA lower level eventing being too safe and not preparing riders / horses for harder events, which has led to some horrible accidents recently.

Nunney is going ahead this year apparently, moved there after a new MD started working at Longleat (he left quite quickly after upsetting an awful lot of people and communities around the estate), one of the first things he did was stop Longleat as it wasn't financially viable / returning enough money for the estate. The first year he was there he replaced it with a Red Bull acrobatics event that caused absolute traffic chaos locally, crowd control was non existent and it felt dangerous in the crowds at some points (I picked up my friend's daughter as we were getting squashed in the crowd), catering was non existent. Longleat Horse Trials by comparison was always well organised and a pleasurable event to spectate at.

 

[ownedbyaconnie]

I found her post less "throwing toys out of the pram"esque than the Price's post. But then I really like PF so maybe that is clouding my judgement.

I feel like it's all just a bit naïve? Or that really the main issue is how BE as a business doesn't really work and covid has just highlighted that. I can't even imagine the expense of running something like Badminton and Burghley and it's why I didn't quibble when the price seemed to jump up by 50% a few years ago. Of course they can't plough that kind of money into it with the very high chance that it couldn't go ahead or changes would need to be made. I completely get the disappointment (we as spectators are disappointed too!) but it all just feels a bit whiny. UK events are not comparable to US and the European ones mentioned above.

 

[Ample Prosecco]

I totally agree that horses and riders need to be properly prepared and threre should be no easy routes to 5*. Not sure how she is suggesting we achieve that though.
Also agree that Covid might be rthe final nail in the coffin for the big estates but not sure what her dolution to that is either.

Maybe if they did introduce qualifiers at each level on challenging courses then the big steats would get 'challenge' or 'starred' status which would generate income as everyone woulkd need to do those events to move up. Going back to triathklon again, everyone wants to go to Kona but you need to get there via Kona qualifying events which are held all over the world. The Kona qualifiers are massively popular as a result.

 

[milliepops]

I don't think she had a solution, i think what she was saying was that because riders and other figures within the sport were not told in advance that these events would not be running, no one who may have been able to help solve any of the challenges was able to come forward.

i think she was saying that pre covid the stretching, challenging events were already there to assist riders clear the gulf between 4 and 5*. and that it would be a negative outcome for the sport if they were permanently lost - seemed like she may think there were connections who may have ideas or fund to make these events viable but they will only come forward if they are made aware that there's a problem.

 

[ihatework]

I read it rather differently to that AE, I thought what she was possibly getting at was the big estates were possibly already contemplating how long they wanted to be in the horse trials game, with no permanent facilities or year-round use it's a huge undertaking to set up for an annual event compared to the purpose built places that can easily pop another date in the diary. but that the particular challenges that these events pose to horses and riders is becoming unusual but horses and riders need to be able to ride those courses in order to arrive at 5* properly prepped. and if those organisers/landowners were already thinking about stepping away from the sport, Covid may be the final nail in the coffin.

I think the lower levels convo is a separate one.

Thats exactly what she was meaning.
If the knock on of Covid means that the big estates rethink their participation in hosting horse trials, then that will cause real concern for riders preparing horses for Badminton/Burghley. You cannot prepare a horse for that around and advanced/4*S at the likes of Aston (however valuable those courses are in the Calendar for educating the greener ones, irrespective of level).

TBH the sport is changing anyway, with Olympic participation in the balance, estates looking at other revenue streams etc. I do think in the next decade we may be nearing a real shift in the sport. For the worst IMO.

 

[spacefaer]

@ihatework
Agree with your posts (as usual ) but don't you think that the new 5* being mooted for this season will be at Aston?

Where else has the infrastructure and pre-existing upgradeable course, and the financial backing behind it?

I'd be delighted to be wrong ?

 

[ihatework]

@ihatework
Agree with your posts (as usual ) but don't you think that the new 5* being mooted for this season will be at Aston?

Where else has the infrastructure and pre-existing upgradeable course, and the financial backing behind it?

I'd be delighted to be wrong ?

Oh gosh, I really hope not. I feel a bit bad for saying that given how much the team at Aston has invested in their facilities and the huge amount they offer to the sport but the inner snob in me would say it would be a tragedy for it to become a British 5* venue. Blair had my vote. How it’s funded is the problem and in all honesty I doubt we will get the 5* this year. Most are already entered up for Lehmeulen.

One that hasn’t been mentioned much is Hartpury. It’s not beyond the realms of possibility they could host.

 

[TheMule]

I totally agree with the desire to see the iconic venues return but I think her reasoning in the rest of the article is a bit muddled. There are 2 concerns she raises: the financial viability of 5* events and the need for horse and rider to be properly prepared for those iconic venues.
But then she says 'please dont let covid ne the reason...' But Covid IS the reason. Lack of insurance coverage for late notice cancellation means huge financial risk for the estates. Yes there needs to be thought as to how to fund 5* but the idea of magic wands seems a bit naive. The kind of money needed is not really the kind of money that can be raised by fundraising efforts, I dont think.

Then she talks about 'dumbing down' presumably referring to lower levels and easier runs being introduced.

I remember similar arguments about triathlon when they introduced events shorter than the old 'sprint' distance and extended finishing times for ironman. It was 'dumbing down', the big events were losing prestige. In fact what happened is that it became far more accessible and developed a far broader base. So the UK went from 1 viable iron distance race in the 1990s (The Longest Day) to multiple ironman races taking place every year and a hugely popular super sprint series.

And the UK went from also rans to dominance at all distances with Chrissie Wellington and the Brownlee brothers and others.

If you look at BE, BE80 and BE90 classes are more popular. So to me, if the money is at the lower levels then embracing that means the ability to subsidise the higher levels, expanding the pool of eventers around who are happy to volunteer, making events more financially viable, providing a route into eventing for more people, giving pros a job as they compete for owners etc etc. Insistng all those people compete unaff just means the money and free labour goes elsewhere. Not sure how that would help.

As far as risk goes, you need MIRS to move up and 2 eliminations in a row or too many SJ faults gets you moved down again. They could easily add in additional safety measures. Within a level a few events could be classified as N* or N+ or whatever reflecting challenging terrain or technicality at that level and you need a run at a starred/plussed event before moving up. Some classification indicating a bridging event between 2 levels.

Maybr I'm missing her point but I don't understand what her solution to poor rider education and the precarious financial situation for the big estates actually is.

I don’t think she was talking about the lower levels dumbing it down, I think she was talking about simpler tracks at the higher levels (because they're flat/ unvaried terrain/ the horses gets very used to running there several times per season)

It would be almost possible to qualify for a long format 4* having only ever run your horse at Aston ?

 

[RachelFerd]

I think there's a few points in Pippa's post, and mostly they seem valid. There is definitely a big risk with people taking the easiest options to get their MERs - and unfortunately there probably is an element of people voting with their feet and entering the easiest events at each level, rather than the toughest. If you're just moving up a level it is totally understandable - but it isn't giving horses (and riders) a rounded education. But, the biggest ballots usually come at places like Aston, where the XC clear rate is often close to 90% at each level, rather than somewhere like Weston where they're more likely to be 65-70%. People are scared of imperfections on their records. I do wonder if there is something that could be done to ensure that some MERs are coming from tougher tracks in the same way that in BD a certain amount of your points have to come from qualifer classes.

I think there's a longer term issue that isn't really addressed in the letter though; which is that the era of massive estates being run by individual wealthy families for their personal pleasure is in its absolute decline. This is a *good thing* if like me you believe that wealth inequality is a very bad thing. But it does make me feel torn, as I also love nothing better than galloping around immaculate parkland that has been preserved for hundreds of years. So we do need to move to a commercial model that is self-sustaining for the sport, and not just an expensive hobby for landowners.

Being in Cheshire we do have two interesting examples of big commercial event venues which are run as 365 days a year as training and competition venues, but also have the infrastructure to run international eventing across varied terrain with a parkland feel. Those being Kelsall and Somerford. Somerford fascinates me as it is *so* commercial it is like a theme park for horses - and their offering caters for everyone from the hobby rider trotting around the farm ride, to the 5* eventers using the 80 acres and winter arena xc to prep their top horses. But they still have enough land (inside of the farm ride route) to run events on ground that isn't used for anything else (other than haylage production) at any other time of year. They also have the international size and standard all weather arenas. It wouldn't be beyond the realms of possibility to run a 5* on that site (although completely understand that it would probably disrupt their commercial operations in a way that couldn't be justified)....

But we need more centres like Kelsall and Somerford to take over as the big country estate ultimately can't continue to exist in the same way that they do now...

 

[ester]

I thought that too RF, country estates owned by people who want eventing their because of their own connections to it are different to running events as a going concern.

It's noticeable for the driving events too, I think plenty did it to enjoy the equivalent to roads and tracks sections going round old carriage routes on country estates. Now it's shorter in format and set up as able to run more at the purpose built centres alongside eventing etc.

 

[teapot]

Is eventing the only olympic sport which isn't actually the pinnacle/hardest test? For most sports the aim is to be successful at international champs but if you include eventing in that no one actually needs to be running at 5* to do so (and we often want different horses than the 5* specialists for champs). Just then that it looses the argument to have them so we can be internationally successful as a nation.

Re. financing, I know it wasn't anywhere near as much to put on but iirc kentucky was 1500 donors which didn't seem like many to me.

Believe so E - but that's because you have allow the lesser nations to compete who may never ever get to the 5*s.

The donors were graded, I wonder whether the platinum ones were five figure sums minimum.

 

[humblepie]

Off piste slightly but it is rather like the change in "unaffiliated shows" - when I was a child lots of villages ran a village show. A horse and pony show with something for everyone, quite often a big open (I won one on my 13.2 pony and made the headlines in the "county" paper as beat all the adults over a huge course), sometimes run alongside the village produce show and a small scale fun fair. Very few of those seem to exist any longer probably because the demands of running them become onerous and a generation of organisers retiring. Funds can be raised much more simply by other events. Now I anticipate you would seldom fine a 4' open course at an unaffiliated show at a show centre. It was a huge step to go affiliated and quite a few of us had our toe in the lowest level of affiliated and mixed that with the bigger classes at the unaffiliated. Our horses jumped on whatever field the local show had managed to use - there was one local one where it was on a ridge and furrow field, can you imagine and another on the village green. It would indeed be very sad if the country estate events disappeared as it does make it so special but you can see that it needs a strong interest in it and it to be financial viable.

 

[LEC]

Believe so E - but that's because you have allow the lesser nations to compete who may never ever get to the 5*s.

The donors were graded, I wonder whether the platinum ones were five figure sums minimum.

No other Olympic events have been downgraded but the best of the best are not always at the Olympics due to country/Zone qualification. Australia could have 3 of the world leading swimmers at a distance but only 2 go. This will happen in horses as well with only 3 in a team.

 

[DabDab]

Is eventing the only olympic sport which isn't actually the pinnacle/hardest test? For most sports the aim is to be successful at international champs but if you include eventing in that no one actually needs to be running at 5* to do so (and we often want different horses than the 5* specialists for champs). Just then that it looses the argument to have them so we can be internationally successful as a nation.

Re. financing, I know it wasn't anywhere near as much to put on but iirc kentucky was 1500 donors which didn't seem like many to me.

Depends how you classify pinnacle/hardest test I suppose. In sports like football and tennis I don't believe the Olympics is seen as THE competition to win.

 

[LEC]

Depends how you classify pinnacle/hardest test I suppose. In sports like football and tennis I don't believe the Olympics is seen as THE competition to win.

actually golf is another one. Rugby is the shortened team version as well. Football is also amended as has younger players (U23) with a couple of older players included so you could not put out a full Brazil squad. I guess you could argue USA centric sports as well like Baseball and Basketball. I have googled this question and apparently: Road Cycling is another which also makes sense. Boxing is another as amateur.

 

[spacefaer]

Oh gosh, I really hope not. I feel a bit bad for saying that given how much the team at Aston has invested in their facilities and the huge amount they offer to the sport but the inner snob in me would say it would be a tragedy for it to become a British 5* venue. Blair had my vote. How it’s funded is the problem and in all honesty I doubt we will get the 5* this year. Most are already entered up for Lehmeulen.

One that hasn’t been mentioned much is Hartpury. It’s not beyond the realms of possibility they could host.

That was my thinking maybe I totally appreciate everything that Aston offers and the investment that has been made there, but it doesn't have the parkland setting and "specialness" of the traditional 5*. There'd be no novelty to running there again.

Hartpury could have done it - I believe it was Malcolm Wharton's aim when the whole event side of the enterprise started but they've lost a lot of ground to the rugby/sports facilities in recent years. I'm not entirely sure they've got enough space now.

 

[ycbm]

classes.

I think there's a longer term issue that isn't really addressed in the letter though; which is that the era of massive estates being run by individual wealthy families for their personal pleasure is in its absolute decline. This is a *good thing* if like me you believe that wealth inequality is a very bad thing. But it does make me feel torn, as I also love nothing better than galloping around immaculate parkland that has been preserved for hundreds of years. So we do need to move to a commercial model that is self-sustaining for the sport, and not just an expensive hobby for landowners.

Being in Cheshire we do have two interesting examples of big commercial event venues which are run as 365 days a year as training and competition venues, but also have the infrastructure to run international eventing across varied terrain with a parkland feel. Those being Kelsall and Somerford. Somerford fascinates me as it is *so* commercial it is like a theme park for horses - and their offering caters for everyone from the hobby rider trotting around the farm ride, to the 5* eventers using the 80 acres and winter arena xc to prep their top horses. But they still have enough land (inside of the farm ride route) to run events on ground that isn't used for anything else (other than haylage production) at any other time of year. They also have the international size and standard all weather arenas. It wouldn't be beyond the realms of possibility to run a 5* on that site (although completely understand that it would probably disrupt their commercial operations in a way that couldn't be justified)....

But we need more centres like Kelsall and Somerford to take over as the big country estate ultimately can't continue to exist in the same way that they do now...

I believe I was the first person ever to competitively ride the Somerford Novice course (20 faults, hesitation at the water) and it rides great, but it simply doesn't compare with completing Chatsworth at the same height. There is something so, so, special about the big country house venues. I'm glad I was in the sport when there were still so many, it was privilege.
.

 

[spacefaer]

@ycbm
I think there is a very long list of lost venues - I think a lot were National Trust.