Re: Pirelli thread, are there any natural horsemanship techniques you rate?

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Kittykins

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We always did join-up with the riding school ponies I learnt on ("we" being myself and the other saturday girls). It seems to make sense, and it seems to work.

I know a lot of people don't seem to much like Kelly Marks herself, but her books seem well written and, again, make sense. I'd like to have a good relationship with my (new) horse, so I'm going to give some of the techniques a go. She is a horse that likes to be bossed about a little bit as she seems to feel safer that way, and I'd rather boss her about in her own language than just using the whip constantly.

Anyone else had good results from natural horsemanship?
 
I think the Join up technique if affective although I have never actually tried it or seen it live (ie. not on TV!), Monty Roberts talks a lot of sense but I wouldn't say I agree with all his methods.
 
I went & saw Monty Roberts many years ago, at a BHS demo at Stoneleigh. When i saw it i realised i had been doing join up for over 10 years already with out knowing what i was doing. To my mind there is nothing clever about it, it is just a case of being a good horseman & in tune with your animal.
I use the bits i like and work for me, i ignore the rest.
 
I take little bits from all the natural horsemanship demonstrations i have seen/heard of and watched...but i never apply them fully and rely on them!
I use the little bits i like and apply to me and my horse adapting them to suit if needs be...it is nice to watch other people and they way they do things...
Dont agree that they sometimes demonstrate like "we" are the ones doing it wrong...you must learn Parelli/join up etc
Rant over :0
 
The man i think did the most for horses is tom dorrance. He had such a great way with working his horses. Also ray hunt, who is dorrance's protege. Both amazing horsemen.
Also i like Mark Rashid, Buck Branaman, and especially Steve Halfpenny from silversand natural horsemanship in Australia. He did a cource last week with us and it was amazing. He also practically gives away his tools. Nothing like the parelli's, although he originally trained with them. He is much more an all round horseman, learning from all the greats.
 
DanielleAngel said:
It's weird. And confusing.
I spent 30mins trying to "join-up" with my horse and we both just ended up tired, sweaty, confussed and he had the "wtf" look on his face.
Then he walked off and stuffed his face on the grass.
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Could that be because you weren't doing it correctly?Or maybe like my mule your animal is fight not flight so join up doesn't work and you might do better with The Catching game/
 
Gary Witheford in Wiltshire really knows his stuff. Took my mum's morgan horse there a few years ago to be backed and the work he did with him in just two weeks was amazing.
 
Yeah, Ray Hunt is widely respected by most of the western trainers, who use natural horsemanship every day without calling it any fancy names.

So much of it is common sense, and good riding comes from good handling. Hence we had 80 horses competing at one of our WES shows last weekend, and on Sunday when gale force winds came in, not one of them batting an eyelid with barriers getting blown over, riders' hats flying off LOL

We're on a mixed yard with dressage and other competition horses, and the other riders are constantly amazed that our horse (although by no means perfect!) will stand and chill in the middle of the school with others hurtling about, will ground tie while we go off and move poles or find a hoof pick etc and will happily pick her way through a maze of poles without touching one, or walk over a wooden bridge on a loose rein.
Why wouldn't she...she knows it's the RIGHT thing to do and the NICE thing to do.
There's a good phrase used by our trainers....'Make the right thing easy, and the wrong thing difficult' that about sums it up.

And away from the cowboy stuff...I really rate Kelly Marks. Read her books, they're full of so much common sense...
 
Ok, that's interesting. From the way things were going in the Pirelli thread, it sounded like everyone here was very much against 'natural horsemanship' techniques. I assumed they must therefore be going for the old fashioned way of doing things.

I guess so much stuff gets lumped under the banner of 'natural horsemanship', that it sometimes gets difficult to separate one technique from the other (if you don't really know what they all involve)
 
Natural horsemanship i rate = common sense, patience and a willingness to learn horse behaviour. overall not being selfish and putting your own wants before your horses needs
 
I bought Monty Roberts books, and since doing the join up, my boy follows me around like a puppy - can get quite annoying when you're poo picking ;)

But it has really helped me with starting my boy, tho it has to be said, a lot of it is common sense. It's like I never understand why people go up to babies in prams and go gaga, and the baby is terrified.... same with every animal I know really.

Did I go off on a tangent - sorry.
 
Clinton Anderson - Everything is easy and clear without the need for expensive gadgets. Check him out on youtube.
 
Natural horsemanship to alot of people is a godsend!

I think it's just lovely there are lots of very clever people out there who have a natural way with horses, but sadly for many no one has taught them this.

I wouldn't say 'I do' natural horsemanship. Never been to a clinic or anything like that but I have learnt an awful lot about body language etc from reading articles and whatnot.

I do not know how many times I have been people smack, kick, swear and be horrid to there horses as they simply do not have a clue. Horses are called lazy and nasty when actually the handler has no clue what is going on and how to read the situation.

I am pleased natural horsemanship is 'big business' because for once people might learn a thing or two and think about what the horse is thinking for once rather than how the human/handler interprets it.


x
 
teddyt said:
Natural horsemanship i rate = common sense, patience and a willingness to learn horse behaviour. overall not being selfish and putting your own wants before your horses needs
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Its so easy to put a label on a method and believe that its the best thing since sliced bread, but common sense, patience and taking the time to understand your horse are such valuable commodities....
 
My horse driving instructor does a lotof what would come under the NH umberella.He calls it common sense and old fashioned horse man ship.I also have an NH instructor I use occasionally who I really rate.She mixes and matches according to the horses needs,doesn't blow her own trumpet and doesn't try and fix something that isn't broken in the first place.She also doesn't sell any equipment or DVDs.For what its worth, I think is it Jim? Parelli is a good horseman actually.Linda is the publicist.HATE the self publicising, the selling of overpriced gear and the parelli instructor who has been trained by someone who has been trained etc. and trys to make you feel inadequate if you don't like what they do.
 
I agree with members who are saying some of it is useful.

TBH, you have to learn from someone, somewhere. We can't all go off into the desert for years on end learning how to speak howrse.

What I don't agree with is the NH branding. Horses haven't changed since we started using them. Classical horsemanship taught respect between man and beast LOOOOOoooOOOOOoooooNG before Pat, Monty and his band came along plucking thier merry banjos.
 
"I know of two occasions when he rode a horse into the ground-once because the horse was tense and refused to rein back and once because the horse was getting its rider off. said horse was found out to have severe arthritis in its stifles and was later PTS."

When and where? I've seen this man work many times over years, and never seen him come even close to riding a horse into the ground. Let's have some facts please. I don't think anyone said the clinic was free, they said he was practically giving away his equipment, and yes, he and his wife do tend to press presents of gear on people who ride with him. I've seen and ridden with a lot of trainers that some would label "nh" (although the trainers often protest at the label). Prices vary, but I've noticed that the ones who come from places like... Australia, tend to have to charge a bit more.

You can pm me the facts if you like, I'm not against hearing some true information.

I suppose people would say I'm "nh", but I'm influenced by a lot of trainers. From the classical and western worlds as well as nh.
 
Tallyho, what do you mean by the NH branding? I know Monty claims to have invented something new (which he didn't...), but Parelli always acknowledges his teachers, and says "this is so old it's new".
 
Actually Kelly Marks doesn't call it natural horsemanship but intelligent horsemanship as she says there is nothing remotely natural in putting tack (even bitless and treeless) on horses at all.
 
Tinypony said:
"I know of two occasions when he rode a horse into the ground-once because the horse was tense and refused to rein back and once because the horse was getting its rider off. said horse was found out to have severe arthritis in its stifles and was later PTS."

When and where? I've seen this man work many times over years, and never seen him come even close to riding a horse into the ground. Let's have some facts please. I don't think anyone said the clinic was free, they said he was practically giving away his equipment, and yes, he and his wife do tend to press presents of gear on people who ride with him. I've seen and ridden with a lot of trainers that some would label "nh" (although the trainers often protest at the label). Prices vary, but I've noticed that the ones who come from places like... Australia, tend to have to charge a bit more.

.
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there's a limit as to what I can put on a public forum, I would PM you but I don't know you from adam. lets just say I have no agenda here-when NH is done well, like anything, it's great but IME of seeing a fair few of the top NH names, not enough take into consideration that pain is nearly always causing these behavioural problems. Both horses involved I know/knew personally.

somebody mentioned groundwork and working in hand-this isnt natural horsemanship. In fact most groundwork exercises that you see the likes of the Parelli's do is actually *******ized 'classical' training (for lack of a better term) and has been around for centuries. This in hand work and longreining is taught in Europe but sadly not so much in the UK. The trouble with the NH way of doing these exercises, is that nearly always remove any gymnasticising effect and engagement, to them it's just about getting the horse to go sideways, rather than getting them to go sideways correctly.
 
peteralfred said:
there's a limit as to what I can put on a public forum, I would PM you but I don't know you from adam. lets just say I have no agenda here-when NH is done well, like anything, it's great but IME of seeing a fair few of the top NH names, not enough take into consideration that pain is nearly always causing these behavioural problems. Both horses involved I know/knew personally.

somebody mentioned groundwork and working in hand-this isnt natural horsemanship. In fact most groundwork exercises that you see the likes of the Parelli's do is actually *******ized 'classical' training (for lack of a better term) and has been around for centuries. This in hand work and longreining is taught in Europe but sadly not so much in the UK. The trouble with the NH way of doing these exercises, is that nearly always remove any gymnasticising effect and engagement, to them it's just about getting the horse to go sideways, rather than getting them to go sideways correctly.
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That last statement is bull****. Of course correct movement is of utmost important, maybe the people you have learnt from were not very good, plus you cannot learn everything from doing a few clinics.
 
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