Rescue Roulette: Dogs from Abroad

Abi90 said:
I think she should know better being a vet, but as they are ethical vegans they strongly believe in rescuing only and would never entertain buying from somewhere like Pets4Homes and they are fully bought into the plight of animals abroad.

I did not at the time as I did not know much about the risks of foreign imported dogs at the time as I had never looked at them or done any research into getting a dog from abroad until I briefly entertained the idea if looking at one.

I’ll say again, I don’t disagree that foreign dogs are risky and that we should be looking to rehome UK dogs either via rescues or buying them. I was merely offering up the reasons as to why people naively get foreign rescue dogs, not agreeing with them.
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Hang on a minute, this would be ethical veganism as in the ‘protected philosophical belief’, from the Casanitjina case?
That circle’s definitely going to take some squaring :
EVs oppose all forms of commercialisation and exploitation of animals, subscribe to doing no harm to humans, other sentient beings or the environment, and entirely disapprove of pets - “pets” being a speciesist insult.
So, paying rescue fees to pseudo-charitable, Romanian dog dealers; transporting the mutt right across Europe; complete with numerous possible diseases with which to infect domestic dogs - no harm? No compromised principles?
And once here, with the probable behavioural issues of street-bred dogs, treating it a a “life-sharing companion animal of equal respect”, doesn’t inspire much confidence.
How does the vet reconcile her views and profession, what does she work with? EVs don’t agree with buying or keeping any pets at all; they don’t agree with wild animals / exotics in captivity, zoos or circuses; and completely disagree with commercial livestock.
I could understand an EV vet working with WWF / similar agencies, to treat and protect endangered species around the globe, altho what to do then with the Romanian rescue, or what to do if it proves a committed carnivore??
Sorry, but this is the most muddled, fudged, irresponsible set of explanations and excuses imaginable.
 
AlinFaolan said:
That’s interesting, my neighbour has a lovely little dog from the Dog Trust got a few months ago and she’s over 70 🤷🏻‍♀️
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Dogs trust had a few dogs that would have been suitable for me but they were all to be a single dog, even a 4 month old.. so after 3 months I gave up and bought a puppy, and have done the same ever since as I always have a dog at home and that seems to be the big problem, although I think I have enough dog experience to be able to keep both dogs safe until they had got used to each other , especially in the case of the 4 month old..there doesn’t seem to be any wiggle room with their rules..
 
Exasperated said:
Hang on a minute, this would be ethical veganism as in the ‘protected philosophical belief’, from the Casanitjina case?
That circle’s definitely going to take some squaring :
EVs oppose all forms of commercialisation and exploitation of animals, subscribe to doing no harm to humans, other sentient beings or the environment, and entirely disapprove of pets - “pets” being a speciesist insult.
So, paying rescue fees to pseudo-charitable, Romanian dog dealers; transporting the mutt right across Europe; complete with numerous possible diseases with which to infect domestic dogs - no harm? No compromised principles?
And once here, with the probable behavioural issues of street-bred dogs, treating it a a “life-sharing companion animal of equal respect”, doesn’t inspire much confidence.
How does the vet reconcile her views and profession, what does she work with? EVs don’t agree with buying or keeping any pets at all; they don’t agree with wild animals / exotics in captivity, zoos or circuses; and completely disagree with commercial livestock.
I could understand an EV vet working with WWF / similar agencies, to treat and protect endangered species around the globe, altho what to do then with the Romanian rescue, or what to do if it proves a committed carnivore??
Sorry, but this is the most muddled, fudged, irresponsible set of explanations and excuses imaginable.
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I’m not sure why you’re being so hostile towards me. I am not excusing anything. As I keep repeating, I don’t agree with rescuing foreign dogs, I have simply been trying to offer explanations as to why people might do this. I also can’t deep dive into the reasoning of why people who label themselves ethical vegans also want pets, that is on them not me. I am not them, merely relaying what they have said. Nor is it my responsibility to vet everything they do. They describe themselves as ethical vegans and have pets. I don’t agree with a lot of things they do but I cannot police them.

I’d kindly ask you to stop speaking to me in such a tone, I am not even in disagreement with you, yet you have responded to every one of my posts with judgement and sarcasm. I will not be responding to you again if you continue.

I will say again, I do not agree with bringing foreign rescues into the country.
 
splashgirl45 said:
Dogs trust had a few dogs that would have been suitable for me but they were all to be a single dog, even a 4 month old.. so after 3 months I gave up and bought a puppy, and have done the same ever since as I always have a dog at home and that seems to be the big problem, although I think I have enough dog experience to be able to keep both dogs safe until they had got used to each other , especially in the case of the 4 month old..there doesn’t seem to be any wiggle room with their rules..
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I mean, for me, three months is no time at all, really, unless you are in a a big hurry to have a dog.
 
Here in Switzerland, peoples get foreign rescued dogs because it's very difficult to adopt if you are working, have no garden, kids
and a normal life style.

A Rescue i know, turned down a nice couple the other day, they already had a border and were experienced dogs owner, they looked into
a young 4 months old Bernese Mountain cross Border.

When they named the village they lived in, the Rescue told them that it was located too close to where the dog come from....WTH ?????....

Would the dog remember ? Or the people giving him up would be upset ? No idea but they left the Center disapointed, that's for sure...

At some point, i looked into a Roumanian dog but after a few days reflexion, i decided not to do it, i wasn't ready to put the time and effort,
what stopped me was when they told me that the dog would probably hide 3 days under a bed before coming out....

At the end, i took a 7 years old ex breeding bitch needed a good home from a breeder and i haven't looked back since then.
 
CorvusCorax said:
If people did their research, waited, asked around and made contacts, they'd probably find someone like me. Then they might have to wait a bit more, but they might find a better fit for their situation.
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You’re right they would. Looking back to when I first got a dog (I went down the KC breeder with health tests route), I’m not sure I would have known where to start to find someone with the experience you have, however in the age of social media and with a bit of patience (which people don’t have) yes I’d agree they would find a better fit.
 
CorvusCorax said:
Possibly, yes, or it might have been legally seized/previous owner might try and take it back.
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Ok, you are probably right, although, he was farm dog and was probably given up because they couldn't sell him.

The nice couple are now buying a young Bernese from a farmer next to me, the bitch Praline had 10 puppies,
he breeds two liters a years and isn't looking after them that well.

So instead of rescuing a dog, they are now encouraging a not so caring farmer to breed even more...
 
splashgirl45 said:
My other dog was not happy being an only dog so I thought 3 months was long enough to wait…
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Then one has to take one's chances! Like I say for me it's not a long enough and for a lot of people (not you) rushing into things because they want a dog NOW is how they end up with dogs that are mentally or physically unhealthy.
 
Lady Jane said:
I am soon to take delivery of my Greek rescue dog. Why an imported dog when we have so many in the UK? I wanted a dog that was actually living with cats now (not just cat tested and not a puppy) - and I wanted to meet the dog first. I have some neurological weakness and whilst I love big dogs I know I couldn't manage one so wanted a medium size. All the dogs I found in foster living with cats were imported, I just couldn't find an original born in the UK dog.
I am friends with people in Greece who manage a rescue rehoming dogs to both Greece and Europe, we visit them every year. So this year I was able to actually meet our prospective dog and spend some time with her. The rescue tests for BC close to travel and if possible will do 2 tests 3 months apart (this is the case with the dog I am adopting). In normal adoptions the rehoming assesment is a fairly lengthy telephone call and video tour of your home, but they do discuss BC and its issues, and provide information upfront. We had the full assesment despite the fact our friend has known us for 20 years and been to our house.

Obviously some rescues are more diligent than others but a good start would be legislation insisting on a BC test as near to travel to the UK as possible(with a negative result), and making sure potential adopters are fully informed.

I hadn't even heard of BC prior to my interest in this dog but I do feel comfortable with my decision to adopt this dog - and I'm very excited 🥰
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and now of course you have your wish or at least for Romania, no doubt the rest will have to follow idc. Unfortunately sadly a little too near to travel but still I'm sure that problem will have to be overcome. :)



lizziebell said:
It makes it very difficult for genuine uk charities that rescue dogs abroad not to be tarnished with the same brush. I know a couple of breed specific uk registered charities that rescue abroad and they offer full uk backup support and far more stringent checks and policies than many uk only rescues.
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this. It is unfair to regard all the same.

what I really find totally amazing is the people adopting. They are a good part of the problem. If I wanted a poodle and knew nothing about poodles I would do some research, find out what diseases and problems poodles had, check out a breeder and make sure they tested my poodle as appropriate. Why are people adopting from abroad so thick that they don't do this. All the info is out there.

in addition to the adopters then Defra have also been a considerable part of the problem. If BC is so serious why didn't they do something sooner? they haven't solved the problem anyway. You can still bring BC in with your pets.
 
Lady Jane said:
@paddy555 I would not have wished this imposed in the way they have with no warning, so unfair on everyone
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I totally and beyond any sort of utterly agree with you. My own rescue, a very responsible one, already had dogs APHA neg tested who were just waiting for transport. Now they have all been retested already and have to wait. It will be interesting to see if the 2nd APHA test results are in line with the first lot. After only 20 or so days they should be. :D:D
There should have been a period of grace to let those already tested get out. Only talking about 20 days or so and they are neg. anyway.

Very very poor and imposing the 30 day limit is almost impossible. I did read one comment, perhaps a cynical one, that if APHA were on a go slow (terribly busy, understaffed etc) then 30 days would be technically impossible. It's not far off being technically impossible anyway.
Furious that the good rescues who have always done this properly now have to face the cost of retesting neg. dogs just for the sake of it.
 
Lady Jane said:
@paddy555 I would not have wished this imposed in the way they have with no warning, so unfair on everyone
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paddy555 said:
. My own rescue, a very responsible one, already had dogs APHA neg tested who were just waiting for transport. Now they have all been retested already and have to wait. It will be interesting to see if the 2nd APHA test results are in line with the first lot. After only 20 or so days they should be. :D:D


Very very poor and imposing the 30 day limit is almost impossible. I did read one comment, perhaps a cynical one, that if APHA were on a go slow (terribly busy, understaffed etc) then 30 days would be technically impossible. It's not far off being technically impossible anyway.
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Lady Jane thought I would just update in case it interested you re the APHA. 2nd test on about 8 dogs, all neg on first and all neg on the 2nd 5 weeks later. The test seem to give pretty consistent results. And despite my cynicism about APHA they were not on a go slow, good service in fact and 30 day time limit is doable just needs good organisation.
 
paddy555 said:
Lady Jane thought I would just update in case it interested you re the APHA. 2nd test on about 8 dogs, all neg on first and all neg on the 2nd 5 weeks later. The test seem to give pretty consistent results. And despite my cynicism about APHA they were not on a go slow, good service in fact and 30 day time limit is doable just needs good organisation.
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That's good to hear. I believe that dogs should have a negative test pre-entry to UK, but that maybe 3 months notice should have been given. And APHA need to ensure they can test in prompt timescales. My rescue was tested 2 weeks before travel but I doubt it was APHA. I didn't know anything about BC until the rescue briefed me before we paid anything as they wanted to make sure I understood the risks.Whislt it appears the risk of BC transmission is minimal in most cases, it feels we need to know more. Unless you test a large enough sample in countries where it is prevalent, and test people, and good samples of healthy dogs and people not just those with issues, you'll never know - and I can't see this happening.
Its like Covid, the percentages were based on tests of people mostly who showed symptoms, although some people had to test weekly for their jobs. And did people who tested negative always submit their report? Don't get me wrong, I believe Covid was a serious problem but all data can be manipulated if you choose to. Its a bit like the data which shows most car accidents happen within 5 miles of a person's home - well you drive those roads more than any roads as you have to to get anywhere!
 
skinnydipper said:
starts at 10.30 min

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I'm not sure what point you are making. I watched it once but cannot get it to play again. If it is about foreign rescues then I cannot relate it to my experience. However as with everything concerning animals there is good and bad for eg, breeders, puppy farms, UK rescues, foreign rescues and everything else. I don't think it is possible to made a judgment about foreign rescues from that footage.




.
 
skinnydipper said:
I started the thread to share a link about rescue dogs from abroad. I shared another link on the same subject 🤷‍♀️.

It is good that you haven't experienced any problems with your dogs but it is clear that some people do.
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I will try and read the OP later having now had a lot of experience of this. My dogs are within a few minutes going to cross from Germany into France. All I can say ATM about the transport is WOW.
 
I watched the OP video. So sad that only the negative side of overseas dogs are portrayed. The first thing that jumped out is if B Canis is such a problem and worry why are DEFRA not doing more. The current ruling from 7 Oct only affects Romania and only charity and commercial dogs. What about the rest of the countries, what about dogs brought in as pets even from Romania. I agree they should be APHA tested and mine were before it even became a ruling. Then they got tested a 2nd time to comply with the time limit. However why not pets that could bring BC in? A show dog pet could come in from Romania to crufts, be in contact with very many dogs, possibly if male and successful mate here with females, maybe even be sold into the UK. All without testing. Seems totally crazy to me.. Mine are tested for many other diseases. I know this as the charity sends me the documentation even without me asking. There is plenty of info available online of any potential disease concerns and what they should be tested for. Doesn't take very long to search for it.

Having spent 2 months being very involved learning about Romanian rescues then there is a very different side of very successful rehomes. The most amazing amount of info and help online from owners. So much info about training them and the training is different. If you don't learn at least the basics and probably more then I suspect you may well fail. However help is available.

Chatting today to the other new owners on my transport group the thing that immediately hit me was how much research they had done. Some already had Romanian rescues. Many people I noticed online who are helping others already had 2 or 3 Romanians. If they were such a disaster it is hard to see they would want a 2nd or 3rd. The thing that came across more than anything, especially from the Romanian shepherd people, was the pride in what they had achieved.

Of everything I have seen in the last couple of months it has been "newbies" (of which I was one) learning, reaching out with problems and getting help from others be they private owners or the rescues. Of the people in the OP video one chose the dog because it looked "sad". I think she had already set herself up to fail.

There are comments on here of people just wanting to rescue a dog so that they can say they have done. Not me. I chose a Rommie, he was my first choice. I was already approved and home checked for a GSD and offered one but turned it down for my Rommie. Then somehow one became two. They do arrive delivered to your home. I don't think it's "deliveroo" we live too far out in the sticks for deliveroo to deliver to us. We are also warned it can be in the middle of the night. Nothing sinister about that it simply gets them off the transport. Either or both of mine could go to the rescue in the case of problems. There is plenty of help and back up available.

I don't expect a single person to like this post or agree with any of it. People are simply too biased here. However I did want to point out that foreign rescues don't equal failure, there are many successes. As for lots of dogs in UK shelters then there certainly are. However it is simply freedom of choice. Some like UK breeds and some prefer others.
 
paddy555 said:
I watched the OP video. So sad that only the negative side of overseas dogs are portrayed. The first thing that jumped out is if B Canis is such a problem and worry why are DEFRA not doing more. The current ruling from 7 Oct only affects Romania and only charity and commercial dogs. What about the rest of the countries, what about dogs brought in as pets even from Romania. I agree they should be APHA tested and mine were before it even became a ruling. Then they got tested a 2nd time to comply with the time limit. However why not pets that could bring BC in? A show dog pet could come in from Romania to crufts, be in contact with very many dogs, possibly if male and successful mate here with females, maybe even be sold into the UK. All without testing. Seems totally crazy to me.. Mine are tested for many other diseases. I know this as the charity sends me the documentation even without me asking. There is plenty of info available online of any potential disease concerns and what they should be tested for. Doesn't take very long to search for it.

Having spent 2 months being very involved learning about Romanian rescues then there is a very different side of very successful rehomes. The most amazing amount of info and help online from owners. So much info about training them and the training is different. If you don't learn at least the basics and probably more then I suspect you may well fail. However help is available.

Chatting today to the other new owners on my transport group the thing that immediately hit me was how much research they had done. Some already had Romanian rescues. Many people I noticed online who are helping others already had 2 or 3 Romanians. If they were such a disaster it is hard to see they would want a 2nd or 3rd. The thing that came across more than anything, especially from the Romanian shepherd people, was the pride in what they had achieved.

Of everything I have seen in the last couple of months it has been "newbies" (of which I was one) learning, reaching out with problems and getting help from others be they private owners or the rescues. Of the people in the OP video one chose the dog because it looked "sad". I think she had already set herself up to fail.

There are comments on here of people just wanting to rescue a dog so that they can say they have done. Not me. I chose a Rommie, he was my first choice. I was already approved and home checked for a GSD and offered one but turned it down for my Rommie. Then somehow one became two. They do arrive delivered to your home. I don't think it's "deliveroo" we live too far out in the sticks for deliveroo to deliver to us. We are also warned it can be in the middle of the night. Nothing sinister about that it simply gets them off the transport. Either or both of mine could go to the rescue in the case of problems. There is plenty of help and back up available.

I don't expect a single person to like this post or agree with any of it. People are simply too biased here. However I did want to point out that foreign rescues don't equal failure, there are many successes. As for lots of dogs in UK shelters then there certainly are. However it is simply freedom of choice. Some like UK breeds and some prefer others.
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Good to read your positive post. I’ve got a wonderful Cyprus rescue who is settling beautifully into UK life, now four months in with our dogs, cat, horses, grandchildren. She has a terrible background but is the gentlest of girls. With all the above, no six foot fences as we live on a smallholding, and being aged over 70 it seems that we were not fit for UK rescues to rehome here. But our dogs have a wonderful life and are walked every day and we are retired so have lots of time and experience to offer. She comes from a wonderful rescue who do amazing work in Cyprus and was well researched even down to a zoom call with her. The transport over is very well organised. It may not always work out but a dog is a dog and they all deserve the right loving home wherever they come from, just like people in my opinion. Sensationalist tv programmes giving half a story and trying to stir up dissent are not helpful.
 
paddy555 said:
I watched the OP video. So sad that only the negative side of overseas dogs are portrayed. The first thing that jumped out is if B Canis is such a problem and worry why are DEFRA not doing more. The current ruling from 7 Oct only affects Romania and only charity and commercial dogs. What about the rest of the countries, what about dogs brought in as pets even from Romania. I agree they should be APHA tested and mine were before it even became a ruling. Then they got tested a 2nd time to comply with the time limit. However why not pets that could bring BC in? A show dog pet could come in from Romania to crufts, be in contact with very many dogs, possibly if male and successful mate here with females, maybe even be sold into the UK. All without testing. Seems totally crazy to me.. Mine are tested for many other diseases. I know this as the charity sends me the documentation even without me asking. There is plenty of info available online of any potential disease concerns and what they should be tested for. Doesn't take very long to search for it.

Having spent 2 months being very involved learning about Romanian rescues then there is a very different side of very successful rehomes. The most amazing amount of info and help online from owners. So much info about training them and the training is different. If you don't learn at least the basics and probably more then I suspect you may well fail. However help is available.

Chatting today to the other new owners on my transport group the thing that immediately hit me was how much research they had done. Some already had Romanian rescues. Many people I noticed online who are helping others already had 2 or 3 Romanians. If they were such a disaster it is hard to see they would want a 2nd or 3rd. The thing that came across more than anything, especially from the Romanian shepherd people, was the pride in what they had achieved.

Of everything I have seen in the last couple of months it has been "newbies" (of which I was one) learning, reaching out with problems and getting help from others be they private owners or the rescues. Of the people in the OP video one chose the dog because it looked "sad". I think she had already set herself up to fail.

There are comments on here of people just wanting to rescue a dog so that they can say they have done. Not me. I chose a Rommie, he was my first choice. I was already approved and home checked for a GSD and offered one but turned it down for my Rommie. Then somehow one became two. They do arrive delivered to your home. I don't think it's "deliveroo" we live too far out in the sticks for deliveroo to deliver to us. We are also warned it can be in the middle of the night. Nothing sinister about that it simply gets them off the transport. Either or both of mine could go to the rescue in the case of problems. There is plenty of help and back up available.

I don't expect a single person to like this post or agree with any of it. People are simply too biased here. However I did want to point out that foreign rescues don't equal failure, there are many successes. As for lots of dogs in UK shelters then there certainly are. However it is simply freedom of choice. Some like UK breeds and some prefer others.
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Why did you opt for a foreign rescue rather than rehoming something UK based?
 
DabDab said:
Why did you opt for a foreign rescue rather than rehoming something UK based?
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very simply because I wasn't intending to rehome anything at all. Then, purely by chance I saw a dog that I fell in love with. (video of him) I had no idea he came from Romania. I knew he wasn't pedigree on a breed site but thought he was merely a cross breed. Advised them I would like him and then it dawned on me he came from Romania (they didn't hide the fact) Went ahead with it, passed the home check etc etc (it was done in person and around our property)
I also checked out the rescue, got good responses about everything eg BC etc.
Then as I was going to get a Rommie (this was the beg. of Sept) decided I had better learn a bit about them so have spent the last 2 months getting educated. Then I read some of the stuff on here and realised the bias against Rommie rescues which is unfounded IMO. (and other foreign rescues)

If I hadn't seen him I wouldn't have got anything either UK or breeder. If I hadn't chosen him then there would have been any number of people who would have.. That UK based rescue has no problems in rehoming Rommies as well as UK dogs.

For the 2nd dog (which was never even under consideration) the rescue thanks to the defra fiasco ended up with a lot of incoming dogs all at once and needed fosters. I offered to take some for a few days (they have to stay where they arrive at for 48 hours for Defra to check) and they sent me a pic of a dog and asked if I would foster and assess her. OH and I took one look at her pic and she was going nowhere. We were supplied info about her, pics in her harness (she is lead trained) her temperament was known.
 
paddy555 said:
I also checked out the rescue, got good responses about everything eg BC etc.
Then as I was going to get a Rommie (this was the beg. of Sept) decided I had better learn a bit about them so have spent the last 2 months getting educated. Then I read some of the stuff on here and realised the bias against Rommie rescues which is unfounded IMO. (and other foreign rescues)
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Then redo your research because there is a "bias" for a damn good reason.
 
paddy555 said:
. I was already approved and home checked for a GSD and offered one but turned it down for my Rommie.
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Last night at 9.26 you had been considering a UK rescue I presume?

2.14 today… ‘If I hadn't seen him I wouldn't have got anything either UK or breeder’

Sorry I should have multi quoted but these comments are contradictory?
 
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