Sale Livery Injury

[Sassenach_1234]

My horse is on sales livery and she got a very nasty cut on her back leg from the electric fencing in her field. 4 weeks box rest, stitches, sedation, antibiotics etc….

I’m interested to know what people think about who’s insurance this should come out of. Me as the owner, or the person I am paying to look after her and sell her?

I assume me as I’m the owner but lots of people have said absolutely not as I was paying someone to look after.

 

[Pearlsacarolsinger]

I would expect the livery to have insurance to cover the vet bills but not to cover any loss of value.

 

[ycbm]

Was there any negligence on the part of the livery, or was this just one of those things that horses do?

Unless there is negligence, the cost is down to you or your insurance, imo.

Damned bad luck and bad timing for you though!
.

 

[MiJodsR2BlinkinTite]

Personally I would expect the yard where your horse is at to cover this exigency in their insurance.

If the yard is charging you for their services AND is providing "Care Custody and Control" then THEY should be held liable for the injury to your horse.

They pay, or rather their insurance does. You shouldn't.

However I would contact your insurance company and inform them of what's happened as a way forward might be for your insurance Co & the sales livery insurance Co to get their heads together and talk..........

 

[ycbm]

I don't believe any yard insurance would pay out unless negligence can be proved. And we all know how good horses are at hurting themselves!

Horses hurt themselves all the time in livery. I've never had mine or heard of anyone else's livery stable or their insurance paying the bill without there having been negligence.
.

 

[bonny]

Do you have insurance on your horse ?

 

[Pearlsacarolsinger]

I don't believe any yard insurance would pay out unless negligence can be proved. And we all know how good horses are at hurting themselves!

Horses hurt themselves all the time in livery. I've never had mine or heard of anyone else's livery stable or their insurance paying the bill without there having been negligence.
.

Sales Livery is different from a normal livery yard, though. The yard made the decision to put the horse out in the electric fenced field, without the owner being involved. I expect there to be a contract between owner and yard which should clear up the question.

 

[honetpot]

It's a difficult one because I would want to pay the vets bills, so the vet records are mine, if they pay they are the client, and who instructed the vet? If you think they have been negligent, ask them to refund you the cost of the vet bills and any loss of value, but may depend on what it eventually sells for.
I was once asked to sign a full livery contract that said the LO, could not be sued for negligence even if they or their staff were negligent, I doubt it was enforceable in law, but I didn't send the horse there.

 

[ycbm]

Sales Livery is different from a normal livery yard, though. The yard made the decision to put the horse out in the electric fenced field, without the owner being involved. I expect there to be a contract between owner and yard which should clear up the question.

I think you still need to prove negligence to claim from insurance where that specific horse is not insured, but the business is. I'm not sure I would expect a livery yard to inform me that they were going to turn a horse out with electric fencing. That just seems routine to me IF the fencing was set up properly.
.

 

[AmyMay]

The yard.

 

[Sassenach_1234]

Was there any negligence on the part of the livery, or was this just one of those things that horses do?

Unless there is negligence, the cost is down to you or your insurance, imo.

Damned bad luck and bad timing for you though!
.

I don’t think there was negligence. Just an unfortunate thing

 

[honetpot]

The yard.

If they pay are they accepting liability, and if so will their insurance cover them. If it was me I would be contacting my insurance to inform them and find out what to do.

 

[Flowerofthefen]

I would say the yard as horse is under their care. Unfortunately some insurance companies won't pay out for electric fence injuries.

 

[Sassenach_1234]

If they pay are they accepting liability, and if so will their insurance cover them. If it was me I would be contacting my insurance to inform them and find out what to do.

they suggested asking the person looking after her.

 

[Sassenach_1234]

I would say the yard as horse is under their care. Unfortunately some insurance companies won't pay out for electric fence injuries.

She got her leg caught in it and it burned right through her skin! It’s was so deep. And about 6 inches long

 

[Flowerofthefen]

She got her leg caught in it and it burned right through her skin! It’s was so deep. And about 6 inches long[/QUOTE

Sounds awful. Hope she is healing well. I've got electric fencing and constantly worry about it .

 

[Upthecreek]

I don’t think the fact the horse was on sales livery makes any difference. My horses are on full livery and I would claim on my insurance for any field injuries. I can’t see how this is any different.

 

[Sassenach_1234]

It feels different as I’m not looking after her on a yard. She’s away on sales livery being looked after by them.

 

[Upthecreek]

It feels different as I’m not looking after her on a yard. She’s away on sales livery being looked after by them.

But my horses are looked after on full livery and I’m still responsible for their vet bills, that’s why I don’t see any difference. Did you sign a livery agreement?

 

[Red-1]

The only way I would ask them to pay would be if they expressly went against instructions I had left. Or, if they had done something ridiculously stupid that it would be negligent.

You say yourself that they weren't negligent.

Crikey, no wonder people don't want to have liveries.

 

[Rowreach]

I’m with ycbm and Upthrcreek on this one. Sales livery = full livery, and you would need to prove negligence. And with all insurances, none will want to pay, so I imagine if you claim on yours then your insurer may try to claim against the yard’s, but it wouldn’t be likely that the yard insurers would pay out unless it’s a clearly provable case of negligence.

 

[Goldenstar]

I don’t think it’s the yard unless you can prove negligence .

 

[PeterNatt]

What are the terms of the contract you have with them regarding injury of horses in their care?

 

[blitznbobs]

Liability includes negligence ie their actions have to be unreasonable and that has to have caused th injury. Essentially If the injury isnt their fault they don’t have to pay

 

[splashgirl45]

The only way that they should pay is if you told them your horse couldn’t go out in a field that had electric fence otherwise I would think it’s your responsibility to pay, sorry

 

[ihatework]

Unless there was clear and proveable negligence on the yards part then unfortunately this is the owners bill I’m afraid! Horses huh.

 

[Sossigpoker]

Same as if your horse was injured on full livery. The horse owner pays unless the yard has acted negligently or done something against the owner's wishes. If you had made it clear that you don't want the horse in a paddock with electric fencing and they did it , then I'd expect the yard to pay.
Otherwise it's one of those things , horses are good at hurting themselves.

 

[dominobrown]

Following because this is very similar what is happening to me. Almost exactly same situation, pony in for breaking in, cut leg in field. Owner had seen the field it was in. No idea how it was done. I am in insured though it is taking a while to process. Livery left horse here for 7 weeks after accident and hasn’t paid of dot of livery (about 9 weeks total, as livery before accident wasnt paid), I have paid for bandages etc and did all the bandage changes etc.
Owner wants immeadiate payout. Wants me to buy pony, cob X Trotter or swap pony for one of my horses which are all event horses/ sport horses. I get regular borderline slightly threatening Messages, I.e I am taking one of your horses, you must pay all these vet bills now, I need all the vet bill money and value of the pony etc now, it’s the tone of the messages and the face to face encounters are a bit „threatening“ if that makes sense.
This is why I had decided to sell most of my horses, give up on livery and training horses and I am looking for other jobs. Most of the yard will stand empty and more sheep will graze the land. I am hoping my insurance will cover it, though I don’t think I am negligent in anyway and owner was happy with how the horse was being kept (seen it in field when visiting etc). I am not sure what I could of done other than never turn the horse out.
Not sure how it will resolve, though for those who say the yard should pay how can anyone viably have livery? If a horse gets any injury/ illness and the yard had to pay for everything? Fair enough if I had done something stupid but what about racehorses that do tendon. Does the racing yard buy it/ swap it/ cover all fees?
I do feel for the OP, I don’t know what the answer. Just from the other point of view, all I can say it is very hard, not sure how much I can take tbh, not sure if the outcome is, if any of the „threats“ are carried through what I will do to be honest as mentally I cannot take much more before everything becomes to much and I just end it all.

 

[Old school]

Wow dominobrown, I am so sorry to read what you are experiencing. You hit the nail on the head re racehorse trainers. They dont take that type of rubbish from an owner if a horse gets injured. That awful threatening behaviour of aggressive texts, it's not acceptable. Have you any support?

 

[bonny]

I’m sorry to read that, what a horrible situation to be in. How is the pony now? I don’t really understand why you have become responsible for him.. if sellable could you not get some money for him and take your costs out of that ? I hope you are not dealing with all this on your own x