Self preservation

[Storm20]

I bought a mare 4, a few weeks ago she had been broken in and riding away 12 weeks.
3/4th time I go to ride her she chucks me off, gets caught in tack bolts and runs through two fences, one solid and one wire and then into parked car.
Luckily I'm insured for public liability and 3000 vet fees.
She sustained one major wound and a few small scratches. The wound needs to be cleaned daily but she is so difficult it's more than one person can manage (She has been up at vet hospital), but that is not my main concern. A few others are very shocked that a horse would loose so much self preservation and damage itself like that. The car was not in a narrow lane or small driveway, but a wide open yard.
I'm now concerned for my safety, I've had a bolter before but he would never go into anything. I've already passed the insurance cover for vet fees a couple weeks after the incident. As hard as it is to admit but I don't have any bond with the mare. I'm considering pts because it's going to take several months of difficult cleaning and box rest to heal the mare, she's a pure tb as well, a couple of thousand more of vet fees. I spent a lot of money on her and don't have any savings left.
I don't feel that it's normal for a horse to run into a car and fence when it is avoidable. I'm worried she will blindly bolt from now on. She will definitely have to be re broken in the future, adding to costs.
Am I being unreasonable? Vets say to continue and give away but is this really best?

 

[shortstuff99]

I imagine the getting caught in tack and having a rider fall off when barely having been broken could be enough to scare a horse into blind bolting. For me personally I would treat the wounds send her away for professional training and then sell with full disclosure.

 

[ycbm]

I would not sell on any animal which has bolted through two fences and into a large stationary object when there was room to avoid it. If you don't want to get on her again, and I wouldn't either, then I would PTS.
.

 

[TPO]

If I've understood correctly it's a young horse that's been under saddle 12wks before OP bought/brought home.

How experienced a rider are you OP? Have you backed and/or ridden such green horses before? I'm presuming that this happened out hacking given the lane and cars?

This horse has possibly never had anyone fall off before so it would be scary for them. Then there is what caused you to fall off and if you were "chucked" how and why?

It's not hard to see how a young, green horse would get a fright when the rider fell and if that also lead to an incident with tack I can see how the horse could take off in a blind panic. I personally wouldn't call this bolting as there are obvious reasons for the horse's behaviour and I also wouldn't class a blind panic as a bolt; especially as the "bolt" happened after losing rider and getting caught in tack.

I dont have a problem.with pts, especially if there are behavioural issues but I don't think that's the case here from what has been written.

As suggested I'd leave horse with vets on insurance for wound management and once healed send to a professional to produce and sell.

I wouldn't say that she needs rebacking but I'd imagine she will need work to restore her confidence in tack/rider/hacking.

You're obviously done with her and that's fine in itself but made a lot trickier as she is not currently in a saleable condition. If you spread the word you might find someone suitable who would take her on and deal with the injuries; getting £1 for her is better "value" than £££ to pts.

 

[Equi]

getting £1 for her is better "value" than £££ to pts.

 

[Storm20]

Yes she was broken and sold.
Me and another were riding out of our lane, us in front, she stopped and I kicked her to go on and she bronced me, I managed to stay for a while but lost my side stirrup then fell. She then galloped into open field and put her head down and stood on reins. Yes I have ridden young horses especially nappers before.
The vet fees have already exceeded 3000.
My concern is she will do it again, I have never experienced a horse to go into avoidable objects before. I do not want her to end up in a bad home so I will not give away.

 

[ycbm]

getting £1 for her is better "value" than £££ to pts.

I'm shocked by this statement. It is complete lunacy on the part of a horse to run through two fences and into a stationary car when there is plenty of room to avoid it. Surely nobody in their right mind would ever sit on the back of such a horse again? And anyone who sold it for £1 would forever have it on their conscience if the next person it did it with was killed or maimed by it.

The responsible thing to do with this horse, imo, is to have it humanely destroyed.

 

[TPO]

Yeah I didn't word that right. I meant more that I've known people who are going to pts for X reason but when someone suitable (not just after a freebie and a good, experienced home) has shown any interest suddenly the owner, who was about to pay out for pts, wants proper money for the horse. So yeah apologies I really didnt word that correctly.

You dont have to check far back my previous posts to see I'm usually one of the first on a thread to advocate pts, there are a lot worse fates for any animal, but in this instance based on what has been written it all seems fairly explainable why the horse reacted how she did. I personally wouldn't class the mare as a bolter or as having behavioural issues.

If a more suitable home with an experienced and competent person could be found I'd take that option

 

[Equi]

I was shocked that you said it to be honest, as it is not the norm for you. So im glad you explained a little more. The OP sounds reasonably experienced from the second post so i trust they will know what is best. It may have been a single lifetime blip for the horse as its first ever real panic, and the horse may go on and be fine, but the point is it is now known that this is what the horse is capable of.

 

[Storm20]

This is not a decision I take lightly. I'm incredibly saddened by the whole event. My livery yard and professionals (vet and farrier) have both very different opinions. I don't like posting on the internet but I have a bad dilemma.

 

[TPO]

This is not a decision I take lightly. I'm incredibly saddened by the whole event. My livery yard and professionals (vet and farrier) have both very different opinions. I don't like posting on the internet but I have a bad dilemma.

The thing is no one on the internet can give you the "right" answer. People can speak from their POV, experience or just be posting a load of codswallop about something they have no experience of at all. You dont know them and they dont know you.

Do you have a regular trainer who's opinion you value? Is there someone who knows you and the horse and has seen you ride the mare?

Again there are vets and there are vets. Some are excellent at patching them up but not so much with training/horsemanship side of things. Only you know your vets and how much you value their opinion.

Are there any local pros that you know and could ask their opinion?

If you think pts is the best option then there are a lot worse fates.

Personally in this instance I'd want to give the horse a chance but I appreciate that you've only had her a short while, both had a traumatic experience, are now racking up bills and fearing the worst for the future.

So full circle, no one on an internet forum can give you a definite answer as any opinion we have it based on your take of a traumatic event. I'm NOT saying you're lying or omitting anything but it's hard to accurately relay things so there *might* have been a reason why she bucked and if the rider had been able to sit it and work through it then things might have been different. It's all what ifs and might have been with horses.

So yeah, my opinion (& it is just my opinion) based on what's been posted i would want to keep the horse. If I was scared or had lost confidence because of the fall I'd want to involve a trainer and/or send horse for schooling. If I didnt want to ride the horse again then I'd try to find a suitable home via word of mouth.

However if you decided to pts I can understand why and as already stated there are far worse fates for animals than to be pts peacefully at home.

 

[Henry02]

I would be erring in the side of PTS, although Tpo does make worthwhile comments about there may have been a reason for the behaviour.

however the issue you have is that you have a horse that is costing a fortune in vets bills. What will you do when she gets better... personally I’d be worried that the horse did it due to a vet issue, cue more vets bills on a full work up.

if you send to pro rider, I’d still be expecting to do a full work up to make sure she’s medically “safe” to ride. So that means forking out for vet work up and pro rider.

so unless you have a tonne of excess cash to chuck at this horse, I think the most sensible option is PTS

 

[Marigold4]

Have you tried contacting the person who backed this horse to see what they think?

 

[buddylove]

There are worse fates potentially awaiting this mare than PTS. She would need a full vet check up and all clear, probably treating for ulcers after an extended stay at the vets, and then probably some time off to fully recuperate. She would then need starting again from scratch, by someone you trusted fully to do every stage as thoroughly as possible, to give her a fighting chance of leading a useful life as a ridden horse.
You've already said you have no bond with her, so presumably no real inclination to go through all the potential months of struggle and cost (I don't blame you).
I personally would PTS, if I sold her/gave her away I would be always wondering where she ended up and whether she had done the same again, with a more disastrous outcome.

 

[scats]

In this situation I actually think the horse had a pretty decent reason for the bolt and it went into complete blind panic mode due to being newly backed, in a place perhaps not familiar, flailing tack, saddle on back, scare from loss of rider etc.
Saying that, I completely understand your reluctance to ride her again, particularly if you wanted to hack out and always have that concern in the back of your mind that if your part company, she might do it again.
Are there any local pros you can have a chat to? I had a horse once who had a massive fear of people falling off and would bolt and I discovered some videos online showing how to teach a horse to stand if a rider comes off (from memory, it involved the use of a dummy rider and a lot of regular sessions)
If you wanted to stick with the mare, it might be worth seeing if these are still around to look at.

If you don’t wish to proceed, which I would fully understand, then PTS certainly wouldn’t be an unreasonable decision given the circumstances.

 

[ycbm]

In this situation I actually think the horse had a pretty decent reason for the bolt and it went into complete blind panic mode due to being newly backed, in a place perhaps not familiar, flailing tack, saddle on back, scare from loss of rider etc.

I can see your reasoning, I just wouldn't be brave enough to be the person that got on it next. And I wouldn't dare sell it or give it away in case it hurt someone. What a horrible dilemma for the OP to end up with
.

 

[dorsetladette]

I have a random panicker and I will not be moving him on to another home. A few will have read my few recent threads on the subject.

He will run through fences, into shelters, bash into 5 bar gates etc. basically because he is looking at what is scaring him (tack, saddle, something caught in his tail) and not where he is going (at great speed). We decided after a failed attempt to break him (after 3 years of ground work) that he will not be a ridden horse and his life will end with us. weather that be a long life or not, we shall have to see. But ultimately at some point, for what ever reason he will be PTS at home.

OP, my boys breeder has been a rock for me. Are you still in touch with the people you bought her from or her breeder? If she is of good breeding they maybe interested in taking her back as a broodmare. Some research might have to be done to check that her behaviour isn't something hereditary. My boys breeder would have taken back for breeding in a heart beat had he been a mare as she still breeds from mum and a sister.

Some horses just aren't set up right to be ridden/driven horses. And I can tell you I honestly would never of said (excluding conformation issues etc) that before owning B2.

 

[twiggy2]

All horses will bolt in blind panic if the right set of circumstances arises.
One of the eventers I used to work with bolted (before I was there) when she was being clipped, she had never had an issue being clipped before, she broke free, ran through a post and rail fence, up a track, onto the road, fell onto her side, ran through traffic, fell over again and kept running, it was chance that she did not collide with traffic, she was found shaking in a terrible state in a field about three miles away, all cuts and bruises.
She had a few days off after a vet check to let things settle down, never did it again.
It was not until the next winter and someone got shock of the clippers that it was found why it had happened, it wasn't a huge shock-just enough to make you jump.
A horse should be taught to cope with stuff falling off it before any rider gets on, if that has not been done then I can see why the panic happened, newly backed, new place, new rider, stopped and then kicked on (panic starts here?), why did the horse stop?,worried-needs time to look and process?, bucks in response to the surprise of the kick-rider now unbalanced but still on board-fear increases?, rider falls-potential for big panic of not taught to deal with this?, reins get caught so pain in mouth- panic increases, doesn't see fence and goes through it, noise/pain, we're the reins still caught and pulling the head round reducing visibility.
I personally prefer a horse that stops when worried as it's first choice but potentially this horse tried that as an option but it was not allowed? It gives you time to reassure and see what they are focused on.
I don't think the horse is for you OP but I think you may need something more established, selling with this history is always a concern because maybe bolting will now be her go to so to speak, there are worse things than PTS and being passed from pillar to post by well meaning people who are repeatedly over horsing themselves is one of them.

 

[twiggy2]

I have a random panicker and I will not be moving him on to another home. A few will have read my few recent threads on the subject.

He will run through fences, into shelters, bash into 5 bar gates etc. basically because he is looking at what is scaring him (tack, saddle, something caught in his tail) and not where he is going (at great speed). We decided after a failed attempt to break him (after 3 years of ground work) that he will not be a ridden horse and his life will end with us. weather that be a long life or not, we shall have to see. But ultimately at some point, for what ever reason he will be PTS at home.

OP, my boys breeder has been a rock for me. Are you still in touch with the people you bought her from or her breeder? If she is of good breeding they maybe interested in taking her back as a broodmare. Some research might have to be done to check that her behaviour isn't something hereditary. My boys breeder would have taken back for breeding in a heart beat had he been a mare as she still breeds from mum and a sister.

Some horses just aren't set up right to be ridden/driven horses. And I can tell you I honestly would never of said (excluding conformation issues etc) that before owning B2.

I certainly would not breed from something that has been a blind panicker repeatedly for its lifetime. I would worry that for a foal being with its mother who blind panics would produce a foal that lives on its nerves and ends up exhibiting the same behaviour even if it was not hereditary.
Did yours not show the behaviour before you bought him?

 

[bubsqueaks]

OP so sorry to hear you have this dilemma.
I think you are still reeling from the incident & rightly so.
It will have undoubtably knocked your confidence as well as the mares.
The financial impact is reason enough to panic into a decision but I think you should give yourself time.
These days we are always in such a hurry to get things done & sometimes time will give you the answer you need.
4 weeks is no time at all to bond with a horse just as in any partnership this takes mutual trust & love which can have to be hard earnt.
I would strongly advise giving yourself time before you make any decision about her future - best wishes.

 

[dorsetladette]

I certainly would not breed from something that has been a blind panicker repeatedly for its lifetime. I would worry that for a foal being with its mother who blind panics would produce a foal that lives on its nerves and ends up exhibiting the same behaviour even if it was not hereditary.
Did yours not show the behaviour before you bought him?

So long story short.

A family member found him 'free to a good home' on homes for horses as a 4/5 year old. Family member thought she could break him (we grew up breaking and schooling usually difficult ponies in family business) for her children to ride. After 18 months it became apparent this was not going to be a straight forward job. So I took him as a project to work with. 18 months with me I got to the point where he would accept tack and let me lean over him from the mounting block. I then found a lovely trusted and recommended professional to continue his education. 3 weeks in he panicked blindly and lovely lady hit the deck and ended up on crutches for a couple of weeks.

No other animal in his blood lines have this behaviour and we are sure something happened just before he was 'rehomed' while being backed/broken in his previous home. His previous owner has not been very pleasant and has had to be blocked on social media and mobile phones- along with her followers.

a mare turned away with a foal and left to be a mum is a totally different kettle of fish to a mare panicking while wearing tack. IMHO

 

[TheMule]

The horse had a reason for panicking, therefore it is not what I would class as a dangerous blind bolter (yet), these tend to go with no known reason.
My event horse had a saddle slip round and galloped blind throuh some hedges and into a tree. He never displayed any similar behaviour and evented sucessfully for a number of years after. My sister's eventer ran through fences when his turnout hood slipped. Again, never did anything similar again.

Totally up to you though if you want to spend more money on the horse or PTS. I just dont agree that it's a clear cut decision in this instance

 

[Mule]

I have a random panicker and I will not be moving him on to another home. A few will have read my few recent threads on the subject.

He will run through fences, into shelters, bash into 5 bar gates etc. basically because he is looking at what is scaring him (tack, saddle, something caught in his tail) and not where he is going (at great speed). We decided after a failed attempt to break him (after 3 years of ground work) that he will not be a ridden horse and his life will end with us. weather that be a long life or not, we shall have to see. But ultimately at some point, for what ever reason he will be PTS at home.

OP, my boys breeder has been a rock for me. Are you still in touch with the people you bought her from or her breeder? If she is of good breeding they maybe interested in taking her back as a broodmare. Some research might have to be done to check that her behaviour isn't something hereditary. My boys breeder would have taken back for breeding in a heart beat had he been a mare as she still breeds from mum and a sister.

Some horses just aren't set up right to be ridden/driven horses. And I can tell you I honestly would never of said (excluding conformation issues etc) that before owning B2.

I agree about some of them not being set up right to be ridden.
I had a habitual bolter once. It was like a lightbulb switched and off she'd go. She would run in to things too. I had to do a couple of emergency dismounts before she got up to full speed and she could gallop with the best of them. She was incredibly highly strung and when she was brought away from home she would panic. She would shake with fear.

She was generally safe enough in an arena so she was rideable there. She couldn't get up the speed that she could in the field. She was definitely drugged when i got her but i was so attached to her i kept her until she died of cushings complications at 23. If i was sensible I would have pts after some of her worst episodes but i was too soft because, strangely i was fonder of her than any horse before or since.

To the OP, if you don't feel it's fixable or too expensive and people you trust agree then it may be best to pts before you get attached.

 

[AnShanDan]

I agree that a young horse, newly backed in a strange environment might well have a blind panic with a tack malfunction. Just the feeling of the tack moving around is scary and the faster they are going the more it moves around. They are flight animals esp. young TB types. I have a mare we backed ourselves, she is genuinely very well behaved and sensible. the only time I ever had her panic and run was when she was just backed and the saddle slipped slightly when jockey got on, she started broncing, rider came off and she went for it more and more as the saddle moved around. Luckily she was in an arena when it happened and she stopped but she was terrified.

 

[twiggy2]

So long story short.

A family member found him 'free to a good home' on homes for horses as a 4/5 year old. Family member thought she could break him (we grew up breaking and schooling usually difficult ponies in family business) for her children to ride. After 18 months it became apparent this was not going to be a straight forward job. So I took him as a project to work with. 18 months with me I got to the point where he would accept tack and let me lean over him from the mounting block. I then found a lovely trusted and recommended professional to continue his education. 3 weeks in he panicked blindly and lovely lady hit the deck and ended up on crutches for a couple of weeks.

No other animal in his blood lines have this behaviour and we are sure something happened just before he was 'rehomed' while being backed/broken in his previous home. His previous owner has not been very pleasant and has had to be blocked on social media and mobile phones- along with her followers.

a mare turned away with a foal and left to be a mum is a totally different kettle of fish to a mare panicking while wearing tack. IMHO

The 'something caught in his tail' and a few other bits in your original post made it read as though he just randomly panicked not that it was always linked to tack.

 

[dorsetladette]

The 'something caught in his tail' and a few other bits in your original post made it read as though he just randomly panicked not that it was always linked to tack.

He threw a curve ball one day when his tail got caught on a bramble bush - for 14h fat welsh cob he can't half shift!!!

 

[Storm20]

Just to clarify horse did not spook at rider falling off. She galloped to get to field buddy then put head down to eat.

 

[shortstuff99]

Just to clarify horse did not spook at rider falling off. She galloped to get to field buddy then put head down to eat.

The horse stopped to eat so wasn't blind bolting? This to me makes me more sure that this could be sorted.

 

[dorsetladette]

Just to clarify horse did not spook at rider falling off. She galloped to get to field buddy then put head down to eat.

that doesn't sound like a bolt to me

 

[Equi]

Well the story is now changing.