Tying a horse to a solid object

[pansymouse]

I used to do until about 20 years ago my horse pulled the gate post complete with a great big ball of concrete clean out of the ground. The headcollar and leadrope were still intact.

Recently I helped a friend rebuild her fence after the two horses she had tied to it shied, shot backwards and destroyed 50 metres of it.

Hitching with a panic snap or twine just makes sense to me now.

 

[fattylumpkin]

FfionWinnie is right, choosing to tie up to something solid doesn't mean tying up to just about anything. Common sense should be involved.

 

[Dry Rot]

Am I the only one who teaches a horse (well, pony) that it isn't stronger than I am?

Round pen, turning post, slippery nylon yachting rope, and rope head collar. Two turns of the rope around the post and that pony isn't going to be brought up sharp and can be allowed to back off at a controlled pace by varying the pressure on the end of the rope. I am now stronger than the horse.

About forty years ago I lived up the back of nowhere and was training my first real horse, an Anglo-Arab. As a 3yo with an opinion, he'd got into the way of planting when being led from the ground. I needed to get him into the stable and I knew he would be ready with his usual trick. I had no qualified advice available, let alone the Internet or even a decent phone so I had to work the problem out by myself.

So I prepared by setting up a block-and-tackle. The horse behaved exactly as predicted and planted at the stable door. The line from the block-and-tackle was attached to his head collar and I started hauling on the end rope. (And, yes, I had that penknife). When the horse's feet began to slide, he gave up and walked straight in.

When I finally sold the horse at 4, the purchaser asked if he'd ever travelled. I told him he'd never even seen a trailer. There was a deep sigh followed by, "OMG, we are going to have some fun!". I told him I didn't think so. When the trailer arrived, my horse walked straight on with no hesitation. I could lead him anywhere with a piece of string.

I'm not saying how I solved the problem was the right thing to do and I definitely wouldn't recommend it today (I was lucky!), but I think it gives an insight into the horse's mind ...and the mind of most animals....and some humans! If they once discover they can do something to their advantage, they will repeat it. And quite often if they try something and fail, that's the lesson learnt and it can be difficult to unlearn it.

 

[FfionWinnie]

I would aim never to allow the horse to realise it's stronger than me or the tie up post or whatever.

However, my Sec D came to me already well versed that she absolutely was stronger than me and anyone else. I was physically unable to stop her bogging off even wearing a bridle.

The first part of her learning this was no longer on, was tying her up and leaving her to work out that whatever she did, she wasn't getting free. She had a lot of big tantrums about this but I on the other hand coolly left her to get on with it, knowing she couldn't get free, and she couldn't be injured. It was very interesting to watch her working this out. Once that lesson was learned, leading her became a lot less of an issue. She has not got away from me or indeed tried to, this year. However, while away at stud, she got away from them all the time because they didn't listen to my warning that she would do it. She is now very very good to handle, polite and obedient so I expect they thought I was exaggerating. However she came home after this three week interlude of naughty behaviour (by my standards, they still thought she was a lovely mannered horse!) and she hasn't done it with me at all so she obviously has learned something from living here!

In my opinion for the horse's own safety, it needs to learn that trapped feeling can be alleviated by stepping forwards. We put horses in "trap" situations all the time (trapped by the rider, the bridle, the massive tractor coming towards them on a narrow road and so on). It is much better for the horse if it realises stepping into pressure is the way to release it.

For instance my cob got the clips of her rug attached to a (large bale) haynet. She was completely calm and just stood there waiting to be released and now on the occasion it has happened she knows to walk forward herself which lets it unhook. Her alternatives were to panic and throw herself around until it released or something broke.

All my horses stand tied for a period before work every day. I have noticed with youngsters that this period where there is no hay or distractions, settles their minds and if they don't have it, getting them to stand still under saddle in that session is much more work. I like to avoid work where possible and let the horse teach itself.

 

[zaminda]

I had a horse that was tied to string. She pulled back, the string didn't break, but the tie ring came out of the wall. I learnt that nothing is solid if they panic enough. I do however have horses I would and do tie to something solid.

 

[asterope]

I had a nasty incident once with a pony (not my own) that I was riding at a cross country course. I'd tied her to a ring on the side of the lorry with a loop of twine. Something spooked her and she tried to pull back. She ended up sat back on her haunches, thrashing from side to side to try and get away. I was so scared that she was going to go over backwards if the twine snapped, straight onto concrete. Fortunately I was able to grab the loose end of the lead rope and untie her, but it's an experience that's stayed with me.

 

[milliepops]

In the UK at the yards I have been to there are very few places to safely solidly tie your horse up. If my horse pulls back it needs to be tied to something unbreakable, or something that breaks very easily.
If the rope headcollar with a sturdy new rope- not a leadrope, is tied to something solid like a tree or truck the horse cant hurt itself. The injuries come from taking the wall or gate down with it, or the headcollar or leadrope snapping and the horse flipping over vertically onto concrete.

this is the problem. I've seen horses take off dragging pieces of timber buildings, lengths of fencing etc... there is usually precious little in the way of unbreakable stuff around your average livery yard.

With that in mind, mine tie to a piece of easily broken string, but they don't pull back. I can't remember the last time one of them broke a string. But I would prefer that to be the outcome rather than having a horse lobbing a lump of timber round at the end of the rope.

 

[Cortez]

I had a nasty incident once with a pony (not my own) that I was riding at a cross country course. I'd tied her to a ring on the side of the lorry with a loop of twine. Something spooked her and she tried to pull back. She ended up sat back on her haunches, thrashing from side to side to try and get away. I was so scared that she was going to go over backwards if the twine snapped, straight onto concrete. Fortunately I was able to grab the loose end of the lead rope and untie her, but it's an experience that's stayed with me.

The first reaction to this fairly common scenario would be to tap the horse on the bottom to make it go forward and thus removing the pressure. Foals will very often react like this at some point, and this is when you teach them how to avoid the scary sensation. It's practically the first thing I teach foals, and all my horses spend at least 30 mins tied every day, before and after riding.

 

[ester]

Yes I am wondering if it is just because we don't have access to unbreakable stuff? No proper rails to tie to etc? At home even our concreted in posts seem to be failing

 

[pennyturner]

I use twine around the yard for convenience, but don't hesitate to something solid if it's available. Only one of mine ever pulls back - one of the few I didn't break myself.
Cortez is right - it's lesson 1 when baby fluffball arrives. I like to bring the young ones in with the experienced ridden horses, and tie them alongside from time to time, just . Their instinct is to copy their older buddies, so there's rarely an issue.

Those of you who don't trust your horse to stand - how can you enjoy your pub lunch, not knowing if he'll still be in the car park when you're done?
(*tip - ponies like chips - popping out of the pub to donate the odd chip to the pony will ensure your equine chum will happily hang around outside pubs for as long as you'll let him.)

 

[oldie48]

I'm totally with Milliepops on this. Having witnessed a horrible accident when a horse was panicked by an air balloon, I always use just a few strands of twine tied to a ring in a wall, both in my stables and outside. None of my horses have had a problem standing but if they did pull back, there's nowhere for them to go as the outside area is secure. When I am out and about, they are either on the lorry or if tied to the lorry there is someone with them. I can't take credit for them being good to tie up, they came to me like that. I can't guarantee that something completely unexpected might happen but I can guarantee that they don't hang themselves, so to speak, however with horses they seem to find lots of ingenious ways of hurting themselves so I am writing this with fingers and toes crossed!

this is the problem. I've seen horses take off dragging pieces of timber buildings, lengths of fencing etc... there is usually precious little in the way of unbreakable stuff around your average livery yard.

With that in mind, mine tie to a piece of easily broken string, but they don't pull back. I can't remember the last time one of them broke a string. But I would prefer that to be the outcome rather than having a horse lobbing a lump of timber round at the end of the rope.

 

[FfionWinnie]

My definition of solid object is one which cannot be moved, broken or pulled out the wall by any horse under any circumstance.

Working with cattle soon teaches the consequences of having something that should not move, move!

 

[smja]

My experienced horse ties up to fraying baling twine, mainly for the comfort of other people - he stands where he's told to stand, and his lead rope chucked over his neck means 'wait there until I come and get you'. But then, he also enjoys untying his quick release knot to keep himself amused - doesn't go anywhere, just unties himself and waits for you to notice.

I tried tying up to one of those quick release things when a friend gave me a lift in her box, he soon found he could ping it off by jerking his head and much hilarity ensued - he'd chuck his head, tie would go flying off, I'd go hunting about for the blinking thing, he'd watch me (standing exactly where he was in the first place), I'd reattach it, he'd do it all over again.

 

[Dubsie]

To be honest, using baler twine of years ago made sense. These days its nylon and very tough, the very thick stuff from big bales is pretty much unbreakable.

I have to disagree. It's all down to technique on behalf of the pony/horse. Two of ours can break anything if they choose to - the mare is specialist at breaking the clip on lead ropes as this is the weakest bit, the technique with baler twine is to pull the rope to where it is tight, slacken very slightly then a sharp and very fast tug and it will break at the weakest point. The other one couldn't break it if he tried, but he could undo most knots.

 

[tankgirl1]

I have to disagree. It's all down to technique on behalf of the pony/horse. Two of ours can break anything if they choose to - the mare is specialist at breaking the clip on lead ropes as this is the weakest bit, the technique with baler twine is to pull the rope to where it is tight, slacken very slightly then a sharp and very fast tug and it will break at the weakest point. The other one couldn't break it if he tried, but he could undo most knots.

My mare is an expert at breaking leadrope clips too!

 

[Auslander]

I rarely tie up properly nowadays. Alf will stand all day with his rope thrown over a rail. He occasionally goes walkabout, but only as far as the nearest grass! If I do need to tie, I tie direct to the ring without putting the end through the loop, so that I can undo it quickly if I need to. I rarely leave a horse tied up while I'm not close enough to untie it - but I do have the benefit of pens, so they don't need to stand on the yard.

 

[furrycat]

I bought my horse directly from her breeder as a weanling foal. The stud halter broke her and taught her to tie up before I collected her by tying her to something immovable, I think it was a tree. To this day she is perfect to tie up and even if something startles her she has never pulled back. I do still tie up to string though mainly because it's always on the tie ring.

 

[LouisCat]

We had one of our's tied to baler twine. Something spooked him (never usually a problem) and he pulled back and ran off with the ring and 2 planks of wood from the stables attached to the end of his rope.
Apart from the damage to the stables the only other damage was to me when the wood swung round and hit me!!

 

[eggs]

We had one of our's tied to baler twine. Something spooked him (never usually a problem) and he pulled back and ran off with the ring and 2 planks of wood from the stables attached to the end of his rope.
Apart from the damage to the stables the only other damage was to me when the wood swung round and hit me!!

Something very similar happened to me some years ago. Horse panicked and disappeared across the yard pronto with the large plank of wood swinging around. Fortunately he jumped the gate into the field which caused the plank to somehow flick round and get caught in the gate and the momentum of the horse caused the leadrope to snap. Once he was no longer being chased by the plank he stopped and settled very quickly.

 

[conniegirl]

I've seen a horse tied directly to a lorry, it pulled back and took half the side of the lorry with it. result was a very dead horse.

 

[Tyssandi]

I am always amazed that in the USA they wrap the reins round the tying up post, they are so well trained that they rarely pull back despite that their bridle would be pull off and the bit out their mouth.

https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=a...ei=H97sV9UdjfWABpSjpIgE#imgrc=e3n6LHwR8xwPWM:


https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=a...=Rt7sV_zzGIuEgAatl7qoBw#imgrc=cE8KuDpsoPHhaM:

Maybe our fellow Americans could clear it up, I know they can be ground tied but why do we never see them pulling back from these wooden stands. Maybe this is one for Enfys???

 

[Exploding Chestnuts]

Only the cheap continental leather head-collars would be likely to break, and to be honest you don t want them to break anyway. So just use the velcro if you are worried, my boy used to know how to untie himself with a normal knot, and if thwarted with that he pulled back till the tie broke, no panic, just the thought of access to the feed bins.

 

[conniegirl]

My lad will tie up untill he gets bored, then he will undo his knot and dissapear to the nearest patch of grass.
I tried tying up with a trailer tie clip thing, he worked out how to undo that pronto as well, then I used a rope with a clip on either end, he pulled back, slowly and carefully untill the ring at the bottom of his head collar snappedl!
So now I just put a haynet up for him, seems to keep him put for the time I need.

 

[Damnation]

I've also noticed that the phenomenon of horses barging and charging off when being lead is much rarer here. Maybe linked?

*Snigger* (I actually agree!!!)

Totally agree. I'm Scottish but I'm with the Irish on this 100%!

I live in England (almost Scotland, does that count?) and I tie up to what happens to be on the wall at the time. If it is just a tie ring then I tie up to that, if there is twine on it I tie up to the twine.

Horse doesn't pull back, she stands where I tell her to, doesn't run off when led etc. She is incredibly well mannered and I ensure she stays that way. But I don't leave her unattended when tied up, she can also untie herself.

The yard I am on is completely enclosed so even if she ripped the ring out of the wall she can't go anywhere.

My pet hate is people tying up with too long a rope and letting their horse just wander about or even worse, feeding a tied up horse with a long rope. I have a paranoia of horses getting legs over rope so like to avoid that.

 

[MrsNorris]

I've seen a horse tied directly to a lorry, it pulled back and took half the side of the lorry with it. result was a very dead horse.

This happened to someone local to me too, would never risk not using a breakable tie. It's impossible to guarantee that a horse, however well trained and good normally, couldn't get such a fright that they do something extreme, so why risk it?
I also know someone who had both of her legs broken when her horse pulled back and panicked when tied direct to the ring. It was on a yard on concrete, horse was shod, and when the person rushed to try and release the frantic horse, he fell on her whilst struggling to free himself. Horse was fine, the fall released him, owner was in hospital for weeks.

 

[fburton]

Please can someone explain why if a horse has been trained to stand like a rock in any circumstances and not pull back it is safer to tie to something solid rather than something that breaks very easily. I'm not sure of the logic.

While horses can and should be taught to stand tied and yield to pressure, I don't believe that they can be taught not to pull back in any circumstances. So always tying to something that won't break or move risks the horse injuring itself in the unlikely event that it does pull back strongly. This has to set against the risk of the horse getting loose and injuring people, itself and/other horses. The difference between the US and Britain in usual tying practice is probably down to the relative perceptions of these two risks.

Of course, if the horse is trained to not pull (e.g. by previously being tied securely to an immovable and unbreakable object, and learning that pulling back is futile), the chances of it going anywhere when tied to something that is safely breakable will be miniscule anyway, no?

 

[Cortez]

The impression I'm getting is that an awful lot of horses are not TRAINED to tie, which means that they are likely to pull back, break stuff, run around with bits of buildings attached to themselves, etc.

The whole point is to take the time/learn how to train from the very first instance so that the horse is reliable and steady to tie. The only horse I have ever had that pulled back was one that had come from England and had learned that if he just pulled long enough and hard enough he could get loose, something that tying up to a breakable point will teach very well. We did cure the habit eventually, but it was downright dangerous for the horse and involved trees, chains and a bullhide headcollar with a loinrope.

In the cavalry manual the recommended cure for a horse which could not be tied was to be shot!

 

[Sleipnir]

I'm from a Northern European country and tying horses to something that's NOT solid is not really practiced around here. Most yards I know have a hitching rail somewhere on the premises and horses are being solidly tied to it routinely for cleaning and tacking up, to have their hooves trimmed, etc., and they are taught to accept it from an early age. The first time I encountered tying horses to breakable things was when I went to the UK as a working student.

 

[Mrs. Jingle]

I tie up to solid objects all the time. They are all trained to tie up and yield to pressure which means if a bomb dropped on their heads they still wouldn't think pulling away was an option. Which is a life saver, far more so than any piece of string would be.

Seriously - you really believe that do you? Ho hum.

 

[Dry Rot]

The 'if's and but's' arguments just don't convince me.

So the horse that's tied solid will, sooner or later, back off removing the end wall of a building? Or a strainer post? Or the side of a lorry? OK, that's possible.

As is the scenario of the horse that snaps the string and promptly runs in front of a double decker bus! That's possible too.

The aim should be to limit the risk and I'll continue to teach mine that backing up will cause pressure on the poll which is unpleasant and something to be avoided.

Before I became a fluffy bunny, I snared a lot of rabbits and foxes. I never ever found one with a broken neck, but that is the common objection to tieing solid or teaching a horse that humans are stronger. Forget the anecdotes, but has anyone actually seen a horse break it's neck like this?